It's time to legalize drugs

[cbirch2]

It's an inappropriate analogy to say "X is legal therefore Y should be legal." There are dozens of differences between X and Y.
We could execute shoplifters but do shoplifters do more than cause some property loss? We don't execute people for causing property loss.

Ok... then why SHOULDN'T pot be legal... in your opinion, of course?

BEcause I dont support turning this country into a nation of potheads.
Of course for someone like you who would notice?

In every country that has legalized drugs use has gone down....

 

[dblack]

Facts mean nothing to fear mongered Pub Dupes....

Indeed. If we could only get the 'fear mongered Pub Dupes, and the fear mongered Dem Dupes, to wake up from their daze - perhaps we'd see some progress.

 

[The Rabbi]

I think that pot-use will increase a little bit, but not to the extent that it will make the USA a "nation of potheads". Besides, isn't it the republicans that call for personal responsibility and call for government to get off our backs? I also think that any societal damage that might occur from a possible increase in the number of addicts will be outweighed by such things as less tax money spent on drug-crime. It will reduce prison over-crowding. It may even reduce drug-related crime since the price for marijuana and the transport of marijuana will greatly decline.

So your answer is yes it will increase.
Do you think that's a good thing for this country?

In and of itself, No. (Is it good to have more drug addicts?) No

OK. SO we are in agreement here.
Thanks.

 

[The Rabbi]

People were making large careers, sneaking around the ban on alcoholic, committing illegal activities, and killing people. However, we don't see Al Capones running around now.

Try vacationing in Juarez, Mexico and tell us about it if you make it back.

Marijuana is also illegal in such places. It makes a poor comparison. There are other variables in Mexico.

It is not. Mexico decriminalized small amounts. We see how much it's done to cut drug violence.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Someone should tell Rabid Lie that alcohol is more addictive and dangerous to the body than cannabis ever was.

It's been proven repeatedly.

As soon as you get that dick out of your mouth go look up the benefits of alcohol and then find me a study that shows equal benefit to marijuana.

yea if you just use it for what it is good for......but show me a fact that says which drug kills more people yearly.......especially innocent people......and im sure Alcohol leads the pact hands down.....

 

[The Rabbi]

Someone should tell Rabid Lie that alcohol is more addictive and dangerous to the body than cannabis ever was.

It's been proven repeatedly.

As soon as you get that dick out of your mouth go look up the benefits of alcohol and then find me a study that shows equal benefit to marijuana.

yea if you just use it for what it is good for......but show me a fact that says which drug kills more people yearly.......especially innocent people......and im sure Alcohol leads the pact hands down.....

So your solution is to make the problem worse?

 

[Gadawg73]

Try vacationing in Juarez, Mexico and tell us about it if you make it back.

Marijuana is also illegal in such places. It makes a poor comparison. There are other variables in Mexico.

It is not. Mexico decriminalized small amounts. We see how much it's done to cut drug violence.

More drug violence here than most of the tourist areas of Mexico.
I travel to Mexico often and there is no drug related violence in most of Yucatan.
If you do not know, or admit as I believe you do know, that the violence in Mexico is 100% related to the prohibition here and their smuggling at the border then you are dumb as a box of rocks.
But I know you know. However, you are too stubborn to admit it.

 

[The Rabbi]

Marijuana is also illegal in such places. It makes a poor comparison. There are other variables in Mexico.

It is not. Mexico decriminalized small amounts. We see how much it's done to cut drug violence.

More drug violence here than most of the tourist areas of Mexico.
I travel to Mexico often and there is no drug related violence in most of Yucatan.
If you do not know, or admit as I believe you do know, that the violence in Mexico is 100% related to the prohibition here and their smuggling at the border then you are dumb as a box of rocks.
But I know you know. However, you are too stubborn to admit it.

Yeah, no drug related violence in Mexico. We know...

 

[dblack]

Yeah, no drug related violence in Mexico. We know...

Yeah.. drugs caused these deaths.

Someone got high and just decided to start shooting.

Of course, we all know that's bullshit. The 'war on drugs' is what has caused these deaths, not drugs.

 

[The Rabbi]

Yeah, no drug related violence in Mexico. We know...

Yeah.. drugs caused these deaths.

Someone got high and just decided to start shooting.

Of course, we all know that's bullshit. The 'war on drugs' is what has caused these deaths, not drugs.

You know that's the case, how?

 

[dblack]

Of course, we all know that's bullshit. The 'war on drugs' is what has caused these deaths, not drugs.

You know that's the case, how?

Let's call it a 'preponderance of the evidence'. Compare the claims. You're shoveling the idea that legalizing recreational drug use would create more violent crime. You seem to be making the claim that drug use itself creates violence, but there's very little evidence of that. There is, however, overwhelming evidence that drug prohibition supports lucrative criminal enterprises.

So, if minimizing violent crime is the goal, the question comes down to this: Will the presumed increase in violence caused by legalization of drugs replace the violence associated with the illegal drug trade? I don't think you can make a good argument that it would. Are you really saying that if drugs were legal the number of people who would get high and create mayhem would compare to the violence of the drug wars?

 

[The Rabbi]

Of course, we all know that's bullshit. The 'war on drugs' is what has caused these deaths, not drugs.

You know that's the case, how?

Let's call it a 'preponderance of the evidence'. Compare the claims. You're shoveling the idea that legalizing recreational drug use would create more violent crime. You seem to be making the claim that drug use itself creates violence, but there's very little evidence of that. There is, however, overwhelming evidence that drug prohibition supports lucrative criminal enterprises.

So, if minimizing violent crime is the goal, the question comes down to this: Will the presumed increase in violence caused by legalization of drugs replace the violence associated with the illegal drug trade? I don't think you can make a good argument that it would. Are you really saying that if drugs were legal the number of people who would get high and create mayhem would compare to the violence of the drug wars?

OK, so you have no proof. Glad we established that.
People kill other people all the time or steal their stuff to get drugs. This is undoubted. It has nothing to do with illegality. They also commit crimes they might not commit were it not for drug use. This is also undoubted.
If you increase the amount of drug usage in this country, which is undoubted if you legalize it, you will increase the number of judgment impaired and addicted people. Thus crime will increase beyond what it is now.
None of this is really disputable except by people with drug-addled minds.

 

[ABikerSailor]

Cannabis doesn't make a person violent.

Alcohol, however.....does.

 

[dblack]

OK, so you have no proof. Glad we established that.

All we've established is your ostrichism. You're stubbornly refusing to address the points being raised.

For the sake of argument, I'll take your claim as fact - that people who use drugs are more likely to commit crimes than people who don't use drugs. The question you're ignoring is, do these people represent more of a threat to society than the drug cartels and local gangs? In other words, who is more dangerous - a legal addict looking for a fix, or a underground gang protecting their turf? Who is more likely to have guns? Who is more likely to use them?

Until you address that question, you're simply ducking the debate.

 

[The Rabbi]

OK, so you have no proof. Glad we established that.

All we've established is your ostrichism. You're stubbornly refusing to address the points being raised.

For the sake of argument, I'll take your claim as fact - that people who use drugs are more likely to commit crimes than people who don't use drugs. The question you're ignoring is, do these people represent more of a threat to society than the drug cartels and local gangs? In other words, who is more dangerous - a legal addict looking for a fix, or a underground gang protecting their turf? Who is more likely to have guns? Who is more likely to use them?

Until you address that question, you're simply ducking the debate.

No, we've established that you're simply talking out of your ass based on libertarian website talking points.

Do drug cartels break into your house to steal your TV? Do they mug you on the street? Do they commit any petty property crime or mugging/robbery?
No, of course not.
However the crime the average person is worried about is tremendously influenced by drugs. As here
SpringerLink - Prevention Science, Volume 7, Number 4

 

[dblack]

Do drug cartels break into your house to steal your TV? Do they mug you on the street? Do they commit any petty property crime or mugging/robbery?

Try reading a newspaper. The local drug dealing gangs do all of these things. And they recruit kids to work for them. Pretty cool, huh?

Your fear of drugs is really clouding your reason.

 

[ABikerSailor]

OK, so you have no proof. Glad we established that.

All we've established is your ostrichism. You're stubbornly refusing to address the points being raised.

For the sake of argument, I'll take your claim as fact - that people who use drugs are more likely to commit crimes than people who don't use drugs. The question you're ignoring is, do these people represent more of a threat to society than the drug cartels and local gangs? In other words, who is more dangerous - a legal addict looking for a fix, or a underground gang protecting their turf? Who is more likely to have guns? Who is more likely to use them?

Until you address that question, you're simply ducking the debate.

No, we've established that you're simply talking out of your ass based on libertarian website talking points.

Do drug cartels break into your house to steal your TV? Do they mug you on the street? Do they commit any petty property crime or mugging/robbery?
No, of course not.
However the crime the average person is worried about is tremendously influenced by drugs. As here
SpringerLink - Prevention Science, Volume 7, Number 4

If a person smokes cannabis only, they generally do NOT commit crimes.

Try again.

 

[MikeK]

[So your answer is yes it will increase.
Do you think that's a good thing for this country?

The question of whether or not legalization increases use is best answered by examples:

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDt8NXLs1ws]‪Legalizing Drugs Decreases Use - Proof In Portugal, Netherlands‬‏ - YouTube[/ame]

 

[BlindBoo]

As soon as you get that dick out of your mouth go look up the benefits of alcohol and then find me a study that shows equal benefit to marijuana.

Cannabis is not addictive physically. Alcohol is.

Cannabis has no ill effects on any organ system. Alcohol affects ALL of them.

Cannabis has been proven to help with Alzheimer's, nausea due to chemotherapy, glaucoma, etc.

Alcohol hasn't been proven to do any of that.

I say this as a Navy Drug and Alcohol Program Advisor who did that for 8 years in the military.

So it has no health benefit for a healthy person.
Alcohol has health benefits for the average person, with increased life expectancy across the board.

It is no wonder our military suffers with health providers like you.

With the government suppressing all research into marijuan and its effects there is simply not enough information to say either way. But recent studies indicate moderte cannabis intake protects against Alzheimer's, and Cancer.

I don't think we should outlaw alcohol again either.

 

[The Rabbi]

Do drug cartels break into your house to steal your TV? Do they mug you on the street? Do they commit any petty property crime or mugging/robbery?

Try reading a newspaper. The local drug dealing gangs do all of these things. And they recruit kids to work for them. Pretty cool, huh?

Your fear of drugs is really clouding your reason.

Translation: I cannot refute this logic so I'll punt.
Thanks for playing.