It's OK To Betray The Kurds Because They Didn't Help Us With Normandy

[Lakhota]

TRUMP KICKS KURDS: THEY DIDN’T HELP US AT NORMANDY!

Neither did Germany - but now it's an ally.

Actually they did.

Did Germany help us at Normandy?

 

[cnm]

Didn't Trump just the other day say "in his unmatched wisdom" that he would punish Turkey if they did this?

What's he saying today?

This is obviously not 'off limits'.

 

[cnm]

We cannot continue to be the world's police force.

Police forces answer to courts. You are the world's capo.

 

[Lesh]

Didn't Trump just the other day say "in his unmatched wisdom" that he would punish Turkey if they did this?

What's he saying today?

This is obviously not 'off limits'.

If an invasion and attack on the Kurds isn't "off limits"...wtf was he talking about?

 

[lennypartiv]

Did Germany help us at Normandy?

As liberals as Merkle is, I would no longer call Germany an ally.

 

[cnm]

As I have stated strongly before, and just to reiterate, if Turkey does anything that I, in my great and unmatched wisdom, consider to be off limits, I will totally destroy and obliterate the Economy of Turkey (I’ve done before!). They must, with Europe and others, watch over...

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) October 7, 2019

If an invasion and attack on the Kurds isn't "off limits"...wtf was he talking about?

Obviously, damage to Trump hotels. Sheesh...

 

[Zorro!]

Congress never committed US forces before Obama entered us into a multi-layered war, featuring anti-American actors and shifting loyalties on both sides. In fact, so complex is the situation that President Obama’s initial goal was to oust Syria’s Assad regime; only later came the pivot to fighting terrorists, which helped Assad. That is Syria: Opposing one set of America’s enemies only empowers another. More clear than what intervention would accomplish was the likelihood of becoming enmeshed, inadvertently or otherwise, in vicious conflicts of which we wanted no part — such as the notorious and longstanding conflict between Turks and Kurds.

Barbaric jihadist groups such as ISIS (an offshoot of al-Qaeda) come into existence because of Islamic fundamentalism. But saying so remains de trop in Washington. Instead, we tell ourselves that terrorism emerges due to “vacuums” created in the absence of U.S. forces. On this logic, there should always and forever be U.S. forces and involvement in places where hostility to America vastly outweighs American interests.

ISIS formed in the sharia-supremacist culture of this area. Eventually, Obama decided that action needed to be taken. But invading with U.S. troops was not an option — it would have been deeply unpopular and undercut Obama’s tout that Islamic militarism was on the wane. Our government therefore sought proxy forces.

Most proved incompetent. The Kurds, however, are very capable. There was clamor on Capitol Hill to back them. We knew from the first, though, that supporting them was a time bomb. Turkey was never going to countenance a Kurdish autonomous zone, led by the YPG and PKK elements, on its Syrian border. Ankara was already adamant that the PKK was using the Kurdish autonomous zone in Iraq to encourage separatist uprisings in Turkey, where 20 percent of the population is Kurdish. Erdogan would never accept a similar arrangement in Syria; he would evict the YPG forcibly if it came to that.

Yes, we had humanitarian reasons for arming the Kurds. But doing so undermined our anti-terrorism laws while giving Erdogan incentive to align with Russia and mend fences with Iran. ISIS, meanwhile, has never been defeated — it lost its territorial “caliphate,” but it was always more lethal as an underground terrorist organization than as a quasi-sovereign struggling to hold territory. And al-Qaeda, though rarely spoken of in recent years, is ascendant — as threatening as it has been at any time since its pre-9/11 heyday.

Turkey & the Kurds: Defending Trump’s Decision to Remove Syria Troops | National Review

 

[justoffal]

And as somebody wrote in a very, very powerful article today, they didn’t help us in the Second World War, they didn’t help us with Normandy, as an example. They mentioned names of different battles. But they’re there to help us with their land. And that’s a different thing. In addition to that we have spent tremendous amounts of money on helping the Kurds in terms of ammunition, in terms of weapons, in terms of money, in terms of pay.”



Trump: It's okay to betray the Kurds because 'they didn't help us with Normandy'

Yeah

Sending United States military aid into that area is a fool's errand. The Kurds could very easily stop the Turks simply by agreeing to halt the guerrilla warfare in the southern part of the nation. Erdogan may not be a perfect leader but even political bullies like him have limits to how far they will let other nations perform military excursions deep into the border. It's been going on for a decade and he has not been quiet about it.....the Kurds have known this has been coming for quite a while and where one repeatedly that this is how it would end up if they did not stop.

The war over there is not Turkey versus Kurdistan.... It's Russia Syria and Iran on one side.... Versus the petroleum companies in Saudi Arabia, Turkey and the United States on the other. It is a 100% corporate-sponsored war.... With undertones of the 1500 year old struggle between the Sunnis and Shiites. There is not a single shred of red-white-and-blue interest in the entire affair.

Jo

 

[easyt65]

And as somebody wrote in a very, very powerful article today, they didn’t help us in the Second World War, they didn’t help us with Normandy, as an example. They mentioned names of different battles. But they’re there to help us with their land. And that’s a different thing. In addition to that we have spent tremendous amounts of money on helping the Kurds in terms of ammunition, in terms of weapons, in terms of money, in terms of pay.”



Trump: It's okay to betray the Kurds because 'they didn't help us with Normandy'

Yeah

Are snowflakes seriously surprised resident Trump is acting to keep his promise to end the Nobel Peace Prize Winner's war and bring troops home after Barry invaded Syria?

Snowflakes were livid when we invaded Iraq...for no reason...but was ok with Barry invading Syria....they were eager for us to get out of Iraq...but want us to stay in Syria...to protect the Kurds...for how long?

(*Note / Notice how I am NOT advocating / supporting the President's decision....just asking a few simple questions....)

 

[cnm]

Are snowflakes seriously surprised resident Trump is acting to keep his promise to end the Nobel Peace Prize Winner's war and bring troops home after Barry invaded Syria?

You mean, after Trump defeated ISIS?

 

[justoffal]

And as somebody wrote in a very, very powerful article today, they didn’t help us in the Second World War, they didn’t help us with Normandy, as an example. They mentioned names of different battles. But they’re there to help us with their land. And that’s a different thing. In addition to that we have spent tremendous amounts of money on helping the Kurds in terms of ammunition, in terms of weapons, in terms of money, in terms of pay.”



Trump: It's okay to betray the Kurds because 'they didn't help us with Normandy'

Yeah

Are snowflakes seriously surprised resident Trump is acting to keep his promise to end the Nobel Peace Prize Winner's war and bring troops home after Barry invaded Syria?

Snowflakes were livid when we invaded Iraq...for no reason...but was ok with Barry invading Syria....they were eager for us to get out of Iraq...but want us to stay in Syria...to protect the Kurds...for how long?

(*Note / Notice how I am NOT advocating / supporting the President's decision....just asking a few simple questions....)

Trump is a business man... If you look at the decision from that angle it's easier to digest what's happening.

Jo

 

[easyt65]

Are snowflakes seriously surprised resident Trump is acting to keep his promise to end the Nobel Peace Prize Winner's war and bring troops home after Barry invaded Syria?

You mean, after Trump defeated ISIS?

Terrorists are like 'Jello'. You can squeeze them, and they squeeze through your fingers.

Taking away ISIS' conquered territory, capturing a million ISIS fighters, destroying their control and ability to fight from Syria does not eliminate the ideology that IS really ISIS. An ISIS fighter is no more 'Islamic Extremism' than an American soldier IS 'Freedom', 'Democracy'. Soldiers are 'the limbs' - destroy ISIS in Syria, you cut off a limb.

ISIS is all but destroyed in Syria? Great; meanwhile, the FBI reported last week that they are experiencing more threats from more ISIS-converts/'wanna-be's in the US than in the last few years.

Completely wipe out ISIS in Syria...and it still exists...

Just saying.

 

[justoffal]

Are snowflakes seriously surprised resident Trump is acting to keep his promise to end the Nobel Peace Prize Winner's war and bring troops home after Barry invaded Syria?

You mean, after Trump defeated ISIS?

Terrorists are like 'Jello'. You can squeeze them, and they squeeze through your fingers.

Taking away ISIS' conquered territory, capturing a million ISIS fighters, destroying their control and ability to fight from Syria does not eliminate the ideology that IS really ISIS. An ISIS fighter is no more 'Islamic Extremism' than an American soldier IS 'Freedom', 'Democracy'. Soldiers are 'the limbs' - destroy ISIS in Syria, you cut off a limb.

ISIS is all but destroyed in Syria? Great; meanwhile, the FBI reported last week that they are experiencing more threats from more ISIS-converts/'wanna-be's in the US than in the last few years.

Completely wipe out ISIS in Syria...and it still exists...

Just saying.

Yep isis is definitely an ideology more than it is a physical movement. You are correct the only way to fight an ideology is with another ideology. To wipe it out physically you would have to practice totally unmitigated genocide. Even that might not work.

Jo

 

[easyt65]

Trump is a business man... If you look at the decision from that angle it's easier to digest what's happening. Jo

I'm looking at it as a Vet of 30 years still serving my country....

WHY did the Nobel Peace Prize Winner send us into Syria without the permission or request of their President or govt, which by U.N. definition, is an International War Crime?

WHY did Barry leave us in Syria as he walked out the door of the WH for good?

How long do you want me and my fellow soldiers to stay in Syria to protect the Kurds, to keep Turkey and the Kurds divided in Syria, which, again, is not our country?

After a decade or so people are demanding it is time for us to get out of Iraq and let them handle their own affairs, to stand on their own. Ok, let's say we do that....how many years do we try to stay in Syria to protect the Kurds before deciding it is time for them to stand on their own?

If we have to go against Turkey, a NATO ally, militarily to protect the Kurds what about the US bases and troops in Turkey? What will happen to NATO? Do we destroy the alliance that was formed to counter Soviet aggression, which Putin will be delirious to see?!

It is easy to say 'pulling troops out of Syria is an easy decision for a businessman because he does not understand the consequences of what he is doing....do YOU understand the complexity of the problem and understand the consequences of remaining in Syria, choosing to protect the Kurds from a NATO ally, and the potential ramifications of weakening / destroying NATO?

 

[zaangalewa]

And as somebody wrote in a very, very powerful article today, they didn’t help us in the Second World War, they didn’t help us with Normandy, as an example. They mentioned names of different battles. But they’re there to help us with their land. And that’s a different thing. In addition to that we have spent tremendous amounts of money on helping the Kurds in terms of ammunition, in terms of weapons, in terms of money, in terms of pay.”



Trump: It's okay to betray the Kurds because 'they didn't help us with Normandy'

Yeah

Soo....we should start bombing a NATO member?

Wrong question. A NATO-member starts a war. How is this possible against the will of the NATO? Because Trump destroyed it?

Because Turkey is a rogue terrorist nation and should be booted out of NATO, and we should close our base there.

Turkey is not a terrorist nation. Turkey is the second greatest NATO member. And it's under fire of a corrupt clan-structure since a very long row of years meanwhile. The problem is not only Erdogan - it's Trump too. I remember it was his idea that Turkey should invade Syria and fight against the Islamist. He cares not about whether Erdogan is an Islamist on his own or not - I guess he is - or whether the Turks are able to save the own democracy or not. He cares not about a civil war in Turkey (or the USA) or a racist war in the world of the Muslims. He cares about the profits of the US-American weapon industry. His problem is not how many Kurds or Syrians have to die or are able to flee. That's a problem of the Muslims and a problem of Europe. Who cares? He cares not about the plan of Erdogan to displace Kurds in Syria and to replace them with Arabs. Allies - enemies - democracy - tyranny - justice - injustice: What's the difference? Who cares? "Right or wrong"- the USA is his country - Trumps country - and he can do with this country whatever he likes to do with it. Turkey is Erdogans country - and Erdogan can do with his country, what he likes to do with it. Who cares about such strange annyoing things like populations ... A not noble billionaire like Trump? A not noble sultan like Erdogan?

In principle China, Russia, Turkey and the USA - perhaps Europe too - have all the same problem: Who governs? Only the rich elites with violent wars and superprofits? And what is a human being in their systems? A Borg drone? And what to do with the not assimilated?

 

[zaangalewa]

What does the OP want to do?....step in the middle of their conflict?...are you sure you aren't a Bush?....

Didn't Trump call President Obama the "founder of ISIS" because he withdrew from Iraq too early?

The "founder of ISIS" was made from George W. Bush with his war against the Iraq.

 

[cnm]

Completely wipe out ISIS in Syria...and it still exists...

Just saying.

But Trump's keeping his promise!

 

[zaangalewa]

Erdogan called Trump and basically ordered him to pull the US out of Northeast Syria, it just happened to be Vladimir Putin's birthday. This was most assuredly Trump's big birthday present for Putin.

Good grief - what idiots. Erdogan and Trump made this to a personal confrontation against the person Putin? What about the problem in Syria that from all over the world come Islamists and their enemies to Syria and murder Syrians - additionally to the murders of the own pseudo-government. And when someone tries to flee then the same idiots from all over the world argue against displaced people and refugees.

Okay. It needs a very fast solution now. Is the UNO able to make Syria to a protection zone of Russia? Solves this the problem of mass-murder in Syria? Is Russia able to send all soldiers from all nations home to their own countries? Is Russia able to replace the current Syrian government and to install a democracy in Syria again, so Syrian judges will be able to punish their own criminal politicians, soldiers and all others of the own violent criminals? Is Russia able to send all Islamists home to the countries, where they once came from - and are the judical systemes of this states able to judge every criminal and/or war criminal? ... Who else except Russia could be able really to solve the problems in and around Syria? China? The USA is obsiously not able to do anything what makes sense in this conflict. The USA is not even able to protect the own allies.

 

[zaangalewa]

And as somebody wrote in a very, very powerful article today, they didn’t help us in the Second World War, they didn’t help us with Normandy, as an example. They mentioned names of different battles. But they’re there to help us with their land. And that’s a different thing. In addition to that we have spent tremendous amounts of money on helping the Kurds in terms of ammunition, in terms of weapons, in terms of money, in terms of pay.”



Trump: It's okay to betray the Kurds because 'they didn't help us with Normandy'

Yeah

Were you able to think, you would have understood he was saying the only times the Kurds allied themselves with us was when they needed our help with their enemies. While the Kurds seem like sympathetic allies now, it is well to remember they partnered with the Turks to commit the Armenian genocide and they fought with the Turks in WWI and never aided the allies in WWII in the fighting in North Africa or the ME. It was only after the they were cast aside by the Arabs and Turks and Iranians that chose to ally themselves with us. In the ME everyone operates under the same principle: the enemy of my enemy is my friend. The Kurds are no exception, nor are we; after WWII Germany and Japan became our new best friends

A good one. You - the nation, which spies out the smart phones of our chancellor (and all computers and smart phones of all private persons, public institutions and all companies in Germany) - has every right to betray us, because we were not supporting you in the Normandy. By the way ... did we support William the conquerer in the Normandy? ... Could also be an interesting historical question. If so, then the Brexit and the manipulations of the USA in context Brexit could be understandable ... or not. More not.

as we confronted the USSR.

The Soviets are dead since decades. It was by the way the Soviet Nikita Sergeevič Chruščëv who donated the Russian territory "Krim" (since 1795) to the Ukraine (in 1954) - what was a totally senseless illegal act on reason of celebration of a Polish attack against the Kosaks - ahm, sorry: "cossacks" - and their defence by other Russians from the year 1654. Crazy! I guess all problems around the Krim are easily solveable with money - Russian money in this case. The very strange global gigantism of the USA in context with this very little problem is as stupid as the attack of the Polish against the Cossacks of the year 1654.

 

[zaangalewa]

What is called Turkish "safe zone" in this map means not only the death of many Kurds (including the danger of a genocide as it had happened once against the Armenians in the Osman empire) - it means also Erdogan likes to displace the Kurds, who live here since thousands of years and to replace them with Syrian Arabs (who are refugees from Syria in Turkey). A crime!!! And this crime will cause new problems for a long time of history.