Israel's Legal Right To Exist

[theliq]

Zionists are people who demand a country exclusively for Jews. Not all Jews believe this ....

Actually, I can't say as I've ever seen a single Jew believe this. It is certainly not practiced, witness the large Arab population of Israel.

So, essentially "Zionist" is a term you throw about as another demonization of Jews. You are on fire today.

WELL YOU ARE AN IDIOT ZIONIST......YOU CAN TRY TO DENY YOUR GUILT.....YOUR FILTH BUT WE KNOW BETTER ABOUT Zionist filTH,zionist DOES NOT MEAN DEMONIZING JEWS YOU FOOL,GOOD JEWS IN ISRAEL DETEST ZIONISTS.....so you fcuked on that erroneous comment

 

[Shusha]

translation: I am not demonizing Jews, you filthy Jew!


Good to see the high quality of discussion and the valid criticism of Israel. /sarcasm

 

[Phoenall]

My argument is, and has always been, that the Palestinian Arab Christians and Muslims due to their extreme length of residence in the land (you can't unbreak that egg) ALSO have rights to the land.​

Cool, then they should return to their homes.

There are practical considerations, of course, but I have always agreed that the Arab Christian and Muslim Palestinians have the right to return to their homeland.

These people are now refugees in Gaza. Do you have a good explanation why they cannot go back to their homes?

Najd, Gaza - Wikipedia

Very simple they are persona non gratis due to the fact they took up arms against Israel when the arab league invaded the mandate of palestine. This is covered by IHL and the Geneva conventions, and any people that take up arms lose all rights to claim the land as theirs.

Once again you deny the Jews their rights under International laws because you are so biased and have so much hate.

Load of Israeli crap.

They were attacked while in their own village before the 1948 war. They were not attacking anybody.

Is that all you have hearsay and maybe's The facts show the only arab muslims forcibly removed by the Jews were those that took up arms against Israel. The rest left willingly and of their own accord TO ANOTHER PART OF PALESTINE. They never left their "homeland" just their tents they pitched around wadi's and wells as the went looking for farm work.

Once again you deny the Jews their rights under International laws because you are so biased and have so much hate.

 

[Phoenall]

Nothing phony about the map. It's in the official UN archives. You can see it right on the UN's site. Looks like more than 90% of the land was owned by the native Christians and Muslims in 1945.

Palestine: Land ownership by sub-district (1945) - Map (1 August 1950)

And, thanks for linking the Haaretz article that confirms that the land was farmed by Palestinians before the Jews began invading.

You are a hoot Hollie.

So who where the Jews that were already there, you know the ones the Ottomans invited to migrate and close colonise alongside the Jews already there ?

Those who had Turkish citizenship became Palestinian citizens with the rest of the Palestinians.

Not according to the treaty you like to throw in here when this comes up. It says they will become citizens of the nation that take control, which was mandatory Britain. No treaty says that all factions have to agree collectively to set up a nation, which means that each individual faction could set up its own nation. Can you explain why the arab muslims thought that their very late submision would be accepted by the UN

 

[Phoenall]

These people are now refugees in Gaza. Do you have a good explanation why they cannot go back to their homes?

Najd, Gaza - Wikipedia

The primary one would be the risk of violence, of course.

From a bunch of farmers who have not attacked anyone for centuries?

Apart from the Jews, Christians, Egyptians, Syrians and themselves many times since they were invented in 627 C.E.

Unless you have a valid link that says they are a bunch of farmers ?

Do you have any evidence to the contrary?

Yes the recorded attacks on the Jews since 635 C.E. that shows the arab muslims were armed and violent

 

[Phoenall]

You say that most Jewish people want a state of their own is because they desire (i) "national self-determination". They also want (ii) "safety and security". You also claim that the Jewish people are (iii) "unique", And you assert a (iv) "right of return" to their ancestral homeland.
i) Jews are citizens of very many countries and so their nations have a claim on their aspiration for the self determination of these nations. Do you really want Polish Jews do not identify with the culture of Poland? Are Scottish Jews not really Scottish? Do you realize what message this gives to countries where Jews a citizens? Why would any Germans accept Jewish politicians, judges, teachers, and so forth, if their loyalty is to another nation? So be it.
ii) Are Jews in Israel safer and more secure than Jews in the USA? Seriously? If having a Jewish state in the middle of Arab Muslim countries while occupying Palestine and dealing with Arab native people with brutality is their idea of "safety and security then I would disagree.
iii) The Jews are no more unique than Catholics in Northern Ireland, Armenians in Turkey, or Roma in Spain. They have no claim on uniqueness than Basques in Spain and France or the Apache nation in the USA.
iv) The Holy Land is the mother of three religions, Judaism, Christianity, and Islam. No group has a claim on having an exclusive right to live there.


Palestinians do not claim a right to the land based on ancient history. Their homeland is where they were born and their claim is therefore stronger than Russian immigrants.

Please, learn the distinction between Zionists and Jews.

You are correct; the English wanted the Jews out of Europe before the Final Solution. But antisemitism and the Jewish Question was current in the beginning of the last century and even before that. The Zionists had their eye on Palestine which was in the hands of the English so it was a win-win when the English got the Jews out of Europe and let them have a "home" (not state) in Palestine. After the Final Solution, the destruction of the European Jews made a "home" for survivors seem sensible and it is no coincidence that Israel became a state in 1948 not 1928. The impact of the Final Solution should be noted.

It becomes a problem when the Zionists wanted a Jewish state rather than sharing the land with the native inhabitants. The influx of European Jews after the Final Solution inspired with the Zionist vision of a Jewish state was a huge problem. The history of Palestine could have been different.

No; the Palestinian Arabs did not want to be dispossessed and displaced.

You are ill-informed on the creation of the Jewish state.

Forgive me but the occupation of Palestinian land by the Israelis is the root cause of the current problem today.

Outstanding.... Informative,Accurate Post, Eloy

​

He's good Hoss.....Eloy makes you Zionnuts look Fcuking Stupid.........steve

He might be good to someone with your mind set, but any reasonable posters being on these forums for years and years realizes that it is not the Palestinians he really cares about. This is his big chance to demonize the Israelis (Jews) while other innocent people are dying in the thousands in the Middle East for whom he could care less.,

My cat could make this bozo look like a fool.

No freddy he makes you look like a complete moron when he laughs in your face

 

[Phoenall]

Egypt was part of the force that intervened to try to stop the ethnic cleansing of the Christians and Muslims of Palestine by the European Zionists. The British were well aware of this. You have been fed Zionist propaganda all your life, you can't accept the truth.

"Declassified UK reports document build-up of conflict, Jewish public's endorsement of their leaders' pro-terrorist stance and declare armies of Arab states were Palestinians' 'only hope'"

"The documents, which have a remarkable contemporary resonance, reveal how British officials looked on as Jewish settlers took over more and more Arab land.

"After an increase in violent attacks by the militant Zionists of the Stern group and Irgun, British officials reported later in 1946: "Arab leaders appear to be still disposed to defer active opposition so long as a chance of a political decision ...It is now obvious that the only hope of regaining their position lies in the regular armies of the Arab states."

British officials predicted war – and Arab defeat – in Palestine in 1948

So how does this show that the arab league didnt invaded the mandate of palestine with the stated intent of mass murdering the Jews and stealing the land that was granted under international laws to the Jews.



And your only source is the anti semitic failing rag the grauniad, that has never reported the truth in the last 5 years

 

[Phoenall]

Zionists are people who demand a country exclusively for Jews. Not all Jews believe this ....

Actually, I can't say as I've ever seen a single Jew believe this. It is certainly not practiced, witness the large Arab population of Israel.

So, essentially "Zionist" is a term you throw about as another demonization of Jews. You are on fire today.

Wishing Zionism to mean benign Jews who consider Palestinians as equals does not make it so.

Who says, apart from the hate sites that you get your information from. You are falling foul of the laws in many countries by using Zionist and Zionism in the context you do. In Europe you would be arrested for holocaust denial, and then find that no lawyer would defend you in court

 

[Phoenall]

Zionists are people who demand a country exclusively for Jews. Not all Jews believe this ....

Actually, I can't say as I've ever seen a single Jew believe this. It is certainly not practiced, witness the large Arab population of Israel.

So, essentially "Zionist" is a term you throw about as another demonization of Jews. You are on fire today.

WELL YOU ARE AN IDIOT ZIONIST......YOU CAN TRY TO DENY YOUR GUILT.....YOUR FILTH BUT WE KNOW BETTER ABOUT Zionist filTH,zionist DOES NOT MEAN DEMONIZING JEWS YOU FOOL,GOOD JEWS IN ISRAEL DETEST ZIONISTS.....so you fcuked on that erroneous comment

You mean N.K. Jews dont you, that have it as their end times that the likes of you would be killed first so they can build a stairway to heaven out of your bodies.

ANTI ZIONISM IS THE NEW ANTI SEMITISM AND THE NAZI'S WILL SOON FIND THEY FACE PRISON FOR IT

 

[MJB12741]

Zionists are people who demand a country exclusively for Jews. Not all Jews believe this ....

Actually, I can't say as I've ever seen a single Jew believe this. It is certainly not practiced, witness the large Arab population of Israel.

So, essentially "Zionist" is a term you throw about as another demonization of Jews. You are on fire today.

WELL YOU ARE AN IDIOT ZIONIST......YOU CAN TRY TO DENY YOUR GUILT.....YOUR FILTH BUT WE KNOW BETTER ABOUT Zionist filTH,zionist DOES NOT MEAN DEMONIZING JEWS YOU FOOL,GOOD JEWS IN ISRAEL DETEST ZIONISTS.....so you fcuked on that erroneous comment

Still hittin' on one too many amber fluids, eh drongo?

 

[P F Tinmore]

My argument is, and has always been, that the Palestinian Arab Christians and Muslims due to their extreme length of residence in the land (you can't unbreak that egg) ALSO have rights to the land.​

Cool, then they should return to their homes.

There are practical considerations, of course, but I have always agreed that the Arab Christian and Muslim Palestinians have the right to return to their homeland.

These people are now refugees in Gaza. Do you have a good explanation why they cannot go back to their homes?

Najd, Gaza - Wikipedia

Very simple they are persona non gratis due to the fact they took up arms against Israel when the arab league invaded the mandate of palestine. This is covered by IHL and the Geneva conventions, and any people that take up arms lose all rights to claim the land as theirs.

Once again you deny the Jews their rights under International laws because you are so biased and have so much hate.

Load of Israeli crap.

They were attacked while in their own village before the 1948 war. They were not attacking anybody.

Is that all you have hearsay and maybe's The facts show the only arab muslims forcibly removed by the Jews were those that took up arms against Israel. The rest left willingly and of their own accord TO ANOTHER PART OF PALESTINE. They never left their "homeland" just their tents they pitched around wadi's and wells as the went looking for farm work.

Once again you deny the Jews their rights under International laws because you are so biased and have so much hate.

You are just shoveling shit. Pure speculation.

 

[Eloy]

After the U.S. election and before a new president is sworn-in, watch for some shock and awe meted-out to the Palestinians in Gaza by the Israeli Defense Force (IDF).

 

[Hossfly]

After the U.S. election and before a new president is sworn-in, watch for some shock and awe meted-out to the Palestinians in Gaza by the Israeli Defense Force (IDF).

Shock and Awe plus Extreme Torture by the IDF.

​

​

Leading Helpless Old Men To The Gallows

​

IDF Soldier Stealing Old Woman's Last Food

​

IDF Soldiers Preparing Palestinian For Waterboarding

​

IDF Soldiers Administering Lethal Injection To Palestinian

 

[Hossfly]

After the U.S. election and before a new president is sworn-in, watch for some shock and awe meted-out to the Palestinians in Gaza by the Israeli Defense Force (IDF).

Does your crystal ball say that the radicals in Gaza are going to start shooting rockets into Israel, and the IDF will retaliate?

 

[Phoenall]

There are practical considerations, of course, but I have always agreed that the Arab Christian and Muslim Palestinians have the right to return to their homeland.

These people are now refugees in Gaza. Do you have a good explanation why they cannot go back to their homes?

Najd, Gaza - Wikipedia

Very simple they are persona non gratis due to the fact they took up arms against Israel when the arab league invaded the mandate of palestine. This is covered by IHL and the Geneva conventions, and any people that take up arms lose all rights to claim the land as theirs.

Once again you deny the Jews their rights under International laws because you are so biased and have so much hate.

Load of Israeli crap.

They were attacked while in their own village before the 1948 war. They were not attacking anybody.

Is that all you have hearsay and maybe's The facts show the only arab muslims forcibly removed by the Jews were those that took up arms against Israel. The rest left willingly and of their own accord TO ANOTHER PART OF PALESTINE. They never left their "homeland" just their tents they pitched around wadi's and wells as the went looking for farm work.

Once again you deny the Jews their rights under International laws because you are so biased and have so much hate.

You are just shoveling shit. Pure speculation.

No absolute facts that you have failed to prove are not valid. According to official documents how many arab muslims were forcibly removed by the Jews in 1948/1949 compared to Jews forcibly removed by arab muslims ?

 

[Phoenall]

After the U.S. election and before a new president is sworn-in, watch for some shock and awe meted-out to the Palestinians in Gaza by the Israeli Defense Force (IDF).

And in the lead up to the US elections watch how many illegal weapons are fired into Israel from gaza, deemed to be acts of war and war crimes by the Interntional community. These are answerable by force so that will be the reason that Israel will have taken action against the illegal weapons. The hamas terrorists hide the launchers in schools, hospitals, mosques and civilian areas even though 50% of gaza is open land with no civilian structures.

 

[Hollie]

After the U.S. election and before a new president is sworn-in, watch for some shock and awe meted-out to the Palestinians in Gaza by the Israeli Defense Force (IDF).

Since you brought it up, the most recent Hudna is probably due to end soon with resumption of dead Pal'istanians being paraded through the streets.

It's been a while since Abu bin al-Khaled Mashal (but you can call him Al )
or one of the other affiliates of Islamic terrorism Intl., Inc., provoked Israel into a shooting war and laughed all the way to the welfare collection office as their minions took one for the cause.... 'cause Abu's bank account needs more UNRWA welfare money.

 

[MJB12741]

After the U.S. election and before a new president is sworn-in, watch for some shock and awe meted-out to the Palestinians in Gaza by the Israeli Defense Force (IDF).

Shock and Awe plus Extreme Torture by the IDF.

​

Leading Helpless Old Men To The Gallows

​

IDF Soldier Stealing Old Woman's Last Food

​

IDF Soldiers Preparing Palestinian For Waterboarding

​

IDF Soldiers Administering Lethal Injection To Palestinian

Can you imagine the disaster to the Palestinians if Israel ever granted them self determination without Israel to provide for them any longer?

 

[montelatici]

More like Nazi stormtroopers, watch that IDF piece of shit push over the one legged man in a wheelchair



Israeli police officer knocks disabled Palestinian man out of his wheelchair

Israeli police officer knocks disabled Palestinian man out of his wheelchair

 

[Eloy]

After the U.S. election and before a new president is sworn-in, watch for some shock and awe meted-out to the Palestinians in Gaza by the Israeli Defense Force (IDF).

Does your crystal ball say that the radicals in Gaza are going to start shooting rockets into Israel, and the IDF will retaliate?

I also predict that this is what the Israelis will say is happening. We have seen it all before for the passed half century.