Israel races to head off UN settlement 'blacklist'

[RoccoR]

RE: Israel races to head off UN settlement 'blacklist'
※→ abi, et al,

I see.

I am convinced that you suffer from an extreme version of a cognitive bias known as the Dunning-Kruger effect. Have you ever been diagnosed?

The zionists are stealing land. It is wrong. It violates all international law and all basic morality.

(COMMENT)

Look who is talking about bias.

You are going to sit back and say the Palestinians are moral and don't violate international law::

• Of course, the 1972 Olympic Massacre
• The Palestinians never Hijacked Airlines.
• OH, Dalal Mughrabi wasn't Palestinian, and if she was, she certainly didn't machine gun 25 adults and 12 children.
• I must have misunderstood. I thought it was Palestinians that short and killed Leon Klinghoffer in his wheel chair then wheeled his body overboard.
• It wasn't Palestinians that kidnapped and murdered three teenagers.
• And it certainly wasn't Palestinians that launched rockets and mortars indiscriminately.
• No Palestinian ever conducted a suicide bombing in a restaurant or a crowded bus.
• And a Palestinian would never start a gun fight on the Temple Mount and kill to Arab-Israeli Police Officers.
• And these moral and upright Palestinians would never shoot-up light-rail stop outside East Jerusalem.​

I could keep writing, but I'm tired. But I wouldn't accuse the Israelis of violation international law and all basic morality. That simply doesn't wash. And we haven't even talked about how they put their own population at risk by hiding in densely populated area to launch their rockets and mortars, or carry-out summary executions in the street.

Well, my Maine Coon is telling me its time for me to rest.

Most Respectfully,
R[/QUOTE]

 

[abi]

RE: Israel races to head off UN settlement 'blacklist'
※→ abi, et al,

I see.

I am convinced that you suffer from an extreme version of a cognitive bias known as the Dunning-Kruger effect. Have you ever been diagnosed?

The zionists are stealing land. It is wrong. It violates all international law and all basic morality.

(COMMENT)

Look who is talking about bias.

You are going to sit back and say the Palestinians are moral and don't violate international law::

• Of course, the 1972 Olympic Massacre
• The Palestinians never Hijacked Airlines.
• OH, Dalal Mughrabi wasn't Palestinian, and if she was, she certainly didn't machine gun 25 adults and 12 children.
• I must have misunderstood. I thought it was Palestinians that short and killed Leon Klinghoffer in his wheel chair then wheeled his body overboard.
• It wasn't Palestinians that kidnapped and murdered three teenagers.
• And it certainly wasn't Palestinians that launched rockets and mortars indiscriminately.
• No Palestinian ever conducted a suicide bombing in a restaurant or a crowded bus.
• And a Palestinian would never start a gun fight on the Temple Mount and kill to Arab-Israeli Police Officers.
• And these moral and upright Palestinians would never shoot-up light-rail stop outside East Jerusalem.​

I could keep writing, but I'm tired. But I wouldn't accuse the Israelis of violation international law and all basic morality. That simply doesn't wash. And we haven't even talked about how they put their own population at risk by hiding in densely populated area to launch their rockets and mortars, or carry-out summary executions in the street.

Well, my Maine Coon is telling me its time for me to rest.

Most Respectfully,
R

I get it, you don't want top discuss THIS topic so you spam with what we see on every thread. But do the math; you are comparing apples to space ships.

 

[Shusha]

I would like to know which companies are producing goods in the occupied territories. I believe in choice in the marketplace. If I don't like the politics of occupation and subjugation, I should be able to know which companies are enabling both and the opportunity to avoid buying their goods and services.

Two questions. How do you know which territories are occupied?

Do you 'dislike' the politics of other territories, such as Morocco, China, Iraq and Turkey so as to avoid buying goods produced in the occupied territories there? What about First Nations peoples? Do you avoid buy goods from stores and companies in the US which are on First Nations land?

 

[Shusha]

I am convinced that you suffer from an extreme version of a cognitive bias known as the Dunning-Kruger effect. Have you ever been diagnosed?

That is bar none the funniest thing I have ever heard on this forum. Rocco. We are talking about Rocco.

Rocco consistently posts detailed, thoughtful, intelligent and nuanced responses to specific issues. Contrast that to abi's "stealing land is bad". And yet Rocco supposedly has a cognitive deficiency. Laughable.

 

[abi]

That is bar none the funniest thing I have ever heard on this forum. Rocco. We are talking about Rocco.

Rocco consistently posts detailed, thoughtful, intelligent and nuanced responses to specific issues. Contrast that to abi's "stealing land is bad". And yet Rocco supposedly has a cognitive deficiency. Laughable.

I have seen this same bias in both you and Rocco. It is known as the Dunning-Kruger effect. Have you ever been diagnosed?

Do you think the zionists should continue to meddle in UN affairs like this? Should this database not be made public for the world to see? Is that not the topic here?

 

[Shusha]

But annexing settlements which will inevitably be part of Isralenin the end??

I am convinced that you suffer from an extreme version of a cognitive bias known as the Dunning-Kruger effect. Have you ever been diagnosed?

"Inevitably be part of Israel" and you want peace?

Oh . Look who learned a new word. SO I have this condition too? Laughable.

I do want peace. I don't believe the Arab Palestinians and their useful idiots are capable of negotiating peace. There are -- fact on ground -- some areas in the disputed territories which are home to a large number of Jewish people. There are three choices as far as I can see.

1. The areas become part of Palestine and the citizens become Palestinian.
2. The areas become part of Israel and the citizens remain Israeli.
3. The areas become part of Palestine and are ethnically cleansed of their Jewish residents.

Any one of these options could lead to peace. The third option is somewhat ugly. But, frankly, Israel was willing to try it. It did in 2005 with Gaza. It did NOT lead to peace.

So, on the one hand, the Palestinian mentality is that ethnic cleansing of Jews will lead to peace (only way to peace) while on the other the ethnic cleansing of Jews and the handing over of territory to Arab sovereignty did NOT lead to peace, but actually an escalation of the conflict.

 

[abi]

There are -- fact on ground -- some areas in the disputed territories which are home to a large number of Jewish people

Too bad, wake up to the reality that peace won't come on stolen land at the end of a gun.

And comparing this to ethnic cleansing that the Palestinians have experienced ongoing for decades is gross. And it are those exact type of comments that lead me to believe that you perfectly illustrate this Dunning-Kruger effect.

 

[Shusha]

Should this database not be made public for the world to see? Is that not the topic here?

No database which targets a specific country should be made public unless it applies to all countries. If every country made a database of all businesses which operate under their sovereignty along with all possible objections to that country -- then I might consider it.

For example:

avoiding all countries that operate in Myanmar because of the persecution and genocide of the Rohingya
avoiding all countries that operate in Syria due to the treatment of the civilian population there
avoiding all countries that operate in Western Sahara as boycott to the occupation there
avoiding all countries that operate in Cyprus as boycott to the occupation there
avoiding all countries that operate in Tibet as boycott to the occupation there
avoiding all countries which have misogynistic laws
avoiding all countries which have laws against LGBTQ
avoiding all countries which support religious persecution
avoiding all countries where there is inadequate health care

I could go on and on and on and on.

The problem is not with the idea of providing a database. The problem is singling out Israel for this treatment. And it is especially problematic in Palestine because Palestine is not yet a State with fixed boundaries. So there is no way to determine WHERE, exactly, this database should apply.

 

[Shusha]

There are -- fact on ground -- some areas in the disputed territories which are home to a large number of Jewish people

Too bad, wake up to the reality that peace won't come on stolen land at the end of a gun.

And comparing this to ethnic cleansing that the Palestinians have experienced ongoing for decades is gross. And it are those exact type of comments that lead me to believe that you perfectly illustrate this Dunning-Kruger effect.

Demanding an ethnic cleansing in order to be peaceful is gross.

Why is ethnic cleansing the only option, in your mind? And if we are going to ethnically cleanse all the Jews out of Palestine are we going to ethnically cleanse the Arabs out of Israel?

 

[abi]

We are talking about businesses on stolen land. Spin away, but you are supporting a flagrant violation of international law.

 

[Shusha]

What land was stolen? Be specific.

 

[abi]

Stop pretending that if you steal land and then the world demands you leave that that equates to ethnic cleansing.

It is abhorrent that you even use that term knowing what the zionists have done in that respect. Oh yeah, the Dunning-Kruger effect.

 

[Shusha]

Stop pretending that if you steal land and then the world demands you leave that that equates to ethnic cleansing.

It is abhorrent that you even use that term knowing what the zionists have done in that respect. Oh yeah, the Dunning-Kruger effect.

Do you have a different definition of ethnic cleansing than I do? Forcing people to leave a territory due to their ethnicity is ethnic cleansing. Are you prepared to have Arabs abandon a territory because they are Arabs?

 

[abi]

What land was stolen? Be specific.

When Hitler's Nazis moved across Europe, were those areas occupied or disputed?

 

[Shusha]

What land was stolen? Be specific.

When Hitler's Nazis moved across Europe, were those areas occupied or disputed?

What land was stolen? Be specific.

 

[abi]

the disputed territories

When Hitler's Nazis moved across Europe, were those areas occupied or disputed?

What land was stolen? Be specific.

I am trying to answer, but am unsure of your definitions. If you believe that a group of men can give another group of men, yet another peoples' land, then I suppose you would consider the land given to the zionists in 1948 as Israel. Check out a map of what that should look like and I think you will have your answer.

 

[Shusha]

the disputed territories

When Hitler's Nazis moved across Europe, were those areas occupied or disputed?

What land was stolen? Be specific.

I am trying to answer, but am unsure of your definitions. If you believe that a group of men can give another group of men, yet another peoples' land, then I suppose you would consider the land given to the zionists in 1948 as Israel. Check out a map of what that should look like and I think you will have your answer.

I don't believe any of that. (But I also don't believe that is what happened).

I believe that the Jewish people are the indigenous peoples of that land. (And when I say 'I believe', I mean 'there is absolutely undeniable, accurate, indisputable proof that the Jewish people are at least AN indigenous peoples if not THE indigenous peoples').

The Jewish people were, through conquest, invasion and colonization, removed from the land, sent into a Diaspora and prevented from acting upon their rights to self-determination, sovereignty and independence over their traditional and historical lands.

I believe that the removal of a people from their territory does not dissolve their inherent rights.

I believe the Arab peoples in that territory have the full right to self-determination, sovereignty and independence. I believe they already achieved this with the formation of Jordan BUT I also believe that they have since formed a new and separate need for self-determination, sovereignty and independence and they should have it.

I believe their long-standing (not indigenous, but long-standing) residence in the place gives them those rights.

I believe in a negotiated, mutually agreeable, mutually recognized peace treaty for one or two more States to be developed in the territory.

The question is NOT that one State acted outside its sovereign borders and tried to impose its sovereignty on another's. It is a civil war between two parties within a State which each wish independence from the other. The border in the dispute can only be negotiated (preferred) or imposed by one on the other.

 

[Shusha]

The underlying Palestinian mentality is that there is no such thing as Jewish land. (Can be no such thing as Jewish land). Thus a business operating in Tel Aviv is just as illegal a 'settlement' as a a business in the Negev, as a business in Ramallah, as a business in Gaza City.

 

[cnm]

I'm honestly not sure how people believe that actions such as this serve the Palestinian people? What do they think will happen with sanctions like this? Just what is it that you think Israel will do?

How is publishing such a list a sanction? You seem to have a guilty conscience.

 

[cnm]

The underlying Palestinian mentality is that there is no such thing as Jewish land. (Can be no such thing as Jewish land). Thus a business operating in Tel Aviv is just as illegal a 'settlement' as a a business in the Negev, as a business in Ramallah, as a business in Gaza City.

Now that's what I call Hasbara.