Is there secular redemption?

[Cougarbear]

that's a fine line -

not having to be an atheist to be a communist - and the desert religions being communist are not simultaneously the same.

the desert religions are based on servitude subliminally to monarchical rule without self determination ...

self determination they accuse communism of abandoning for the state when that is what they themselves require w/ zero tolerance for an indeterminant existance they base on publications and commandments written for them they force onto suceeding generations without the liest amount of verification for any of their beliefs.

Wrong! In both Judaism and Christianity. free will and free moral agency have always been the main tenant. Capitalism fits Christianity and Judaism much more than Communism. Communism cannot exist without top down authority. If you disobey, off with your head!

 

[Red Front]

Are you against alcohol consumption and fire because of all the damage they have caused down through the ages? Think of all the diabetes and health problems sugar has caused. Shall we ban that as well?

Banning certain things that might be harmful when misused can lead to more problems if that thing being banned is in high demand. It depends on what it is and what it does. Alcohol prohibition in America led to a lot more problems than it solved.

 

[Red Front]

Wrong! In both Judaism and Christianity. free will and free moral agency have always been the main tenant. Capitalism fits Christianity and Judaism much more than Communism. Communism cannot exist without top down authority. If you disobey, off with your head!

Capitalism can't exist without top-down authority either when you consider how dependent markets are upon authority. More, throughout the bible, we see God commanding people to feed, house, and clothe the poor, under threat of hell. The poor have rights according to the bible. The first Christians under the leadership of Jesus and his apostles were communists, not capitalists. God and His angels are communists, not capitalists according to the bible.

 

[Blackrook]

Christ died on the cross, redeeming all mankind from sin.

Anyone else claiming that he can redeem us is a false prophet.

 

[Cougarbear]

Capitalism can't exist without top-down authority either when you consider how dependent markets are upon authority. More, throughout the bible, we see God commanding people to feed, house, and clothe the poor, under threat of hell. The poor have rights according to the bible. The first Christians under the leadership of Jesus and his apostles were communists, not capitalists. God and His angels are communists, not capitalists according to the bible.

Nonsense! Capitalism can only exist in a small government concept. Same with "Whatever the market will bear." China moved to a free market capitalist system decades ago. But, of late, the government has gotten way more top down authority and China is struggling again. Same with Russia.
There is a common error in understanding the bible's quotes like feeding the hungry and the poor. Jesus said "Render unto Cesar that which is Cesar's and Render under God that which is God's. He clear separated the secular government with the Church of Jesus Christ. Individuals who are religious should GIVE FREELY to the poor, the widows, the hungry and homeless. Not by constraint or force. Socialism-Communism FORCES by it's subjects to pay up or be fined and thrown in jail. The Apostles of Jesus Christ preached and taught the Gospel to the people. But never forced anyone to give to anyone. They taught to give freely if they truly have faith in Christ, hope in Christ and Charity in Christ for Charity is the pure love of Christ. Evidence of the great Apostacy during the "Dark Ages" of about 1700 years is that the Apostate Church (The Roman Catholic Church) blurred the lines of Church and State and controlled many countries and still do to the point that people were forced to pay the Church to use as they see fit. Same with Protestant Churches in Europe. But, that isn't what the Bible taught. That isn't what Jesus Christ taught. That isn't what the original Apostles taught.

 

[DGS49]

Tangent alert: One of the greatest tales of "secular redemption" in modern cinema is the redemption of Phil Connor in Groundhog Day.

He started his "life" as a self-centered, egotistical, selfish, obnoxious jerk, and after living and reliving thousands and thousands of days in that personality, he gradually learned that that life and attitude were empty and led nowhere. He was redeemed by life itself and transformed himself into a kind, generous, compassionate, tolerant, talented human being. And who can do more than that?

May every atheist learn from his experience.

 

[Red Front]

Nonsense! Capitalism can only exist in a small government concept. Same with "Whatever the market will bear." China moved to a free market capitalist system decades ago. But, of late, the government has gotten way more top down authority and China is struggling again. Same with Russia.
There is a common error in understanding the bible's quotes like feeding the hungry and the poor. Jesus said "Render unto Cesar that which is Cesar's and Render under God that which is God's. He clear separated the secular government with the Church of Jesus Christ. Individuals who are religious should GIVE FREELY to the poor, the widows, the hungry and homeless. Not by constraint or force. Socialism-Communism FORCES by it's subjects to pay up or be fined and thrown in jail. The Apostles of Jesus Christ preached and taught the Gospel to the people. But never forced anyone to give to anyone. They taught to give freely if they truly have faith in Christ, hope in Christ and Charity in Christ for Charity is the pure love of Christ. Evidence of the great Apostacy during the "Dark Ages" of about 1700 years is that the Apostate Church (The Roman Catholic Church) blurred the lines of Church and State and controlled many countries and still do to the point that people were forced to pay the Church to use as they see fit. Same with Protestant Churches in Europe. But, that isn't what the Bible taught. That isn't what Jesus Christ taught. That isn't what the original Apostles taught.

Capitalism relies on the state's currency, infrastructure, laws, courts, police, military, and regulations. etc. The god of the bible orders his followers to give to the poor, it's not a suggestion but a command, under threat of punishment. The only chance anyone will ever have of having an indefinite lifespan is through science and technology. Religion can't save you and that includes Christianity with all of its ridiculous beliefs.

 

[BreezeWood]

Wrong! In both Judaism and Christianity. free will and free moral agency have always been the main tenant. Capitalism fits Christianity and Judaism much more than Communism. Communism cannot exist without top down authority. If you disobey, off with your head!

those are contrived, the desert religions and are statements of servitude disguised as religions for maximum entrapment ...

Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

the above is a forgery and similar throughout their text circumventing the very reasons for those religions existence to provide free will while in reality are deviously self enriching and autocratic pandering.

 

[Cougarbear]

Capitalism relies on the state's currency, infrastructure, laws, courts, police, military, and regulations. etc. The god of the bible orders his followers to give to the poor, it's not a suggestion but a command, under threat of punishment. The only chance anyone will ever have of having an indefinite lifespan is through science and technology. Religion can't save you and that includes Christianity with all of its ridiculous beliefs.

You truly have been corrupted by the left wing educational system in the colleges and universities. And, now in k-12. Capitalism relies solely on market wants and needs. The governments regulate the legalities of business and should do so with strong limits to create a free market system. Competition is the key with capitalism, not by constraints of government. Communism-socialism forces price controls and destroys free markets. It's top down, large and heavy-handed government forcing people to relinquish the money they earned.
The bible has no authority. The bible is a collection of words by prophets and apostles on what God has commanded and his laws. ordinances and covenants. No one is forced to pay tithing. If you don't, no one is going to come to your door and arrest you. No IRS agents with guns will arrest you and threaten you and your family. As with any law, there is reward and punishment. With Tithing, there are only rewards or blessings. If you don't, you simply won't receive your blessing, which are spiritual and pertain to the afterlife.
As for eternal life, this will only happen because of the atonement of Jesus Christ. Science cannot wipe away your sins and transgressions. And, science won't ever be able to keep you alive forever.

 

[Cougarbear]

those are contrived, the desert religions and are statements of servitude disguised as religions for maximum entrapment ...



the above is a forgery and similar throughout their text circumventing the very reasons for those religions existence to provide free will while in reality are deviously self enriching and autocratic pandering.