Is homeschooling a good solution?

[Dr.Traveler]

No, that's actually not why we form governments. The state is a means for a predatory class to plunder a serf class and harvest their production. Government has always been based on plunder and exploitation.

This deserves it's own post to address. Your comment there fails on so many levels. From the earliest periods of history folks have organized as groups specifically for trade, common defense, and to provide for common welfare. Civilizations that fail in those functions inevitably fail. It just may take a while.

What you're speaking of is greed, which is an inevitable part of human nature. It happens with or without government. It predates government. Capitalism, the US Constitutional form of government, etc, are all attempts to steer that impulse for greed away from destructive ends to positive ends. Sometimes they work, sometimes they don't.

In short, don't blame the need to plunder or steal from others on Government, or Religion, or Society. Blame if on people.

 

[koshergrl]

I don't believe liberal parents should be forced to make their children attend conservative public schools in red states and vice versa.

Home schooling is great if you want to raise a child with no exposure to any other ideas than your own,

Most people do not have the capability to home school because their own education is lacking or it is not feasible because of work schedules, etc.

If you can do it, great! If not, don't try to use it as a dodge for mandatory attendance laws or you will just be raising another idiot dependent on social services.

What horseshit. The homeschooled kids I know, and there are more and more of them every year as people become more and more disgusted with the tripe taught in regular public schools, are exposed to a lot more than the poor sots in traditional schools. They're smarter, they're more centered, they have a better work ethic. They participate fully in sports and other extra curricular activities. It's a thousand times preferable to what the idiots in the Dept. of Education have saddled us with.

 

[koshergrl]

Isolated weird kids that can't fit in.

That's an unfair generalization.

Nothing unfair about it. Not normal kids.

How the **** do you know? You know every home schooled student in the country, their families, what social activities they participate, etc.? Stop being an idiot.

I don't need to know them all to know they will be odd because of being raised oddly. Homeschoolers are mostly freaks themselves.

You seem like a freak to me. You believe anyone who doesn't have the exact same experiences as you is a freak. That's entirely unwarranted and idiotic.

Typical of the brainwashed, bigoted, narrow minded, government educated retards of the left.

 

[JoeNormal]

That's like saying if the government passed a law forcing you to shop at Walmart, you still have the choice of moving to where there's a Walmart you like.

Try again. There was no real thought put into that post.

Nope. That analogy is exact. With government schooling, everywhere you go, the same company is providing the service.

The batshit crazy crew have moved in...

So the RW tries there best to destroy and hamper public education. While causing a lot of damage they still didn't succeed. Now they want to homeschool...

Why does anyone listen to these crackpots when they talk about education...

In Germany/Finland/Israel/Ireland... they have well paid union member teachers who offer some of the best results in the world. They actually discuss with unions about curriculum and what is best way to deliver education. Teachers are respected and are at the top end of there class...

The problem with the RW is they have no respect for education and it shows it there states... They actually mock education...

RWs have no respect for government education.

BTW, you didn't even bother try to dispute my claim. Liberals are always talking about how bad monopolies are, but the government education system is the biggest monopoly on the planet. To defend it you have to talk out of both sides of your mouth.

Face it, you're a douche bag who doesn't give a damn about education. You're only concern is continuing the government monopoly so you can continue pumping our kids full of leftist propaganda.

You're the reason I have worries about homeschooling. You have close to mental problems with the paranoia you express on this board... I believe that you teaching a child would be very misguided.
You have very little grasp of actual science. Your views are extremist and I don't think child deserve to be exposed to that solely and a young.
You need help and be teaching a child... Life is tough enough without your views getting in their head.

NONUKE's reasons seem reasonable and I wish his daughter the best...

Don't worry, he's a hardcore libertarian. The odds of him having a kid (that he has anything to do with at least) are very slim.

 

[Unkotare]

troll

Guess you are one of them then? .

One of what, idiot troll?

A homeschooled freak of course.

Neither, you brainless troll.

What's normal,.......

What works for a given student and their family. A FREAK is some asshole who presumes to know the educational and social conditions of millions of people he has never met. A freak and a troll is what such a person would be.

 

[bripat9643]

Liberals are always talking about how bad monopolies are, but the government education system is the biggest monopoly on the planet. To defend it you have to talk out of both sides of your mouth.

Not everything is meant to be done via the free market. That's why we enter into pacts and form governments.

No, that's actually not why we form governments. The state is a means for a predatory class to plunder a serf class and harvest their production. Government has always been based on plunder and exploitation.

As far as education: If you are in a population dense area you can have a proper market for private schools. As long as there's a mechanism to make sure all children get a chance at a good private school (such as a voucher system and laws on the book overseeing admissions), Education that isn't necessarily run by the government can work. But in a rural sparsely populated area education is best left to local government. There just isn't a market large enough to engage in true competition.

Funny how people in rural areas manage to get groceries, but they can't get adequate schooling?

Actually, there's a lot of studies looking at the distance people have to travel to get to grocery stores in rural or very poor urban areas. It's shockingly bad. I can vouch for this as whenever I go visit family in Southern Illinois and/or Southern Indiana the distance to a grocery store is pretty rough.

That's one of the challenges you have to live with if you want to be a farmer. Schooling is another.

 

[Unkotare]

No, that's actually not why we form governments. The state is a means for a predatory class to plunder a serf class and harvest their production. Government has always been based on plunder and exploitation.

This deserves it's own post to address. Your comment there fails on so many levels. From the earliest periods of history folks have organized as groups specifically for trade, common defense, and to provide for common welfare. Civilizations that fail in those functions inevitably fail. It just may take a while.

What you're speaking of is greed, which is an inevitable part of human nature. It happens with or without government. It predates government. Capitalism, the US Constitutional form of government, etc, are all attempts to steer that impulse for greed away from destructive ends to positive ends. Sometimes they work, sometimes they don't.

In short, don't blame the need to plunder or steal from others on Government, or Religion, or Society. Blame if on people.

When it comes to political theory (and most other topics) he has absolutely no idea what he's talking about.

 

[bripat9643]

That's like saying if the government passed a law forcing you to shop at Walmart, you still have the choice of moving to where there's a Walmart you like.

Try again. There was no real thought put into that post.

Nope. That analogy is exact. With government schooling, everywhere you go, the same company is providing the service.

The batshit crazy crew have moved in...

So the RW tries there best to destroy and hamper public education. While causing a lot of damage they still didn't succeed. Now they want to homeschool...

Why does anyone listen to these crackpots when they talk about education...

In Germany/Finland/Israel/Ireland... they have well paid union member teachers who offer some of the best results in the world. They actually discuss with unions about curriculum and what is best way to deliver education. Teachers are respected and are at the top end of there class...

The problem with the RW is they have no respect for education and it shows it there states... They actually mock education...

RWs have no respect for government education.

BTW, you didn't even bother try to dispute my claim. Liberals are always talking about how bad monopolies are, but the government education system is the biggest monopoly on the planet. To defend it you have to talk out of both sides of your mouth.

Face it, you're a douche bag who doesn't give a damn about education. You're only concern is continuing the government monopoly so you can continue pumping our kids full of leftist propaganda.

You're the reason I have worries about homeschooling. You have close to mental problems with the paranoia you express on this board... I believe that you teaching a child would be very misguided.
You have very little grasp of actual science. Your views are extremist and I don't think child deserve to be exposed to that solely and a young.
You need help and be teaching a child... Life is tough enough without your views getting in their head.

NONUKE's reasons seem reasonable and I wish his daughter the best...

That's ironic coming from an extremist leftwing douche bag like you who knows absolutely nothing about science.

 

[Dr.Traveler]

It's a thousand times preferable to what the idiots in the Dept. of Education have saddled us with.

Again, if the parents can/will/are able to commit to making it work. That's a big if.

One of the things that gets lost in here is the idea that for a lot of families both parents will have to work in order to have a decent quality of life. Once the USA ended up in that position, the ability for parents to be as hands-on with their kids disappeared. Part of the whole debate we are having here is a side effect of that. If families are in a position where one parent can stay home and be active their child's life, then that child will THRIVE in public, private, or homeschooling scenarios. The problem is that isn't happening and can't happen for most people.

 

[Dr.Traveler]

Liberals are always talking about how bad monopolies are, but the government education system is the biggest monopoly on the planet. To defend it you have to talk out of both sides of your mouth.

Not everything is meant to be done via the free market. That's why we enter into pacts and form governments.

No, that's actually not why we form governments. The state is a means for a predatory class to plunder a serf class and harvest their production. Government has always been based on plunder and exploitation.

As far as education: If you are in a population dense area you can have a proper market for private schools. As long as there's a mechanism to make sure all children get a chance at a good private school (such as a voucher system and laws on the book overseeing admissions), Education that isn't necessarily run by the government can work. But in a rural sparsely populated area education is best left to local government. There just isn't a market large enough to engage in true competition.

Funny how people in rural areas manage to get groceries, but they can't get adequate schooling?

Actually, there's a lot of studies looking at the distance people have to travel to get to grocery stores in rural or very poor urban areas. It's shockingly bad. I can vouch for this as whenever I go visit family in Southern Illinois and/or Southern Indiana the distance to a grocery store is pretty rough.

That's one of the challenges you have to live with if you want to be a farmer. Schooling is another.

That's only acceptable if you're fine with creating a permanent serf class. Kids should have access to quality food and quality education regardless of location in the USA. Accepting anything less is accepting that America doesn't need to be exceptional and that "good enough" will do.

 

[Fair&Balanced]

I think part of the problem is , beyond the fact that some people see ALL issues in terms of political ideology, that a lot of people when they think of homeschooling they think of the way it used to be A somewhat uneducated parent who was just against the government in any form possible kept their child at home and wasn't even equipped to, or cared to actually educate their child, the homeschooling was only a protest against government

But today homeschooling parents have so many options. First of all, there is of course the option of tutors, but even more so, there is this invention called the internet. Any parent can instantly be equipped to teach their child math, reading, pyshics, chemistry, anything really. And most people live within a reasonable distant of organizations which provide sports music, art, and other social interaction opportunities for home school kids. So, unless a parent is just LAZY and disinterested in their child's education, the opportunities are there.


And obviously children in public school who have interested and involved parents are going to do better than those who do not. So, it's about the parent's level of involvement, not whether the child is at home or at public school

 

[bripat9643]

Liberals are always talking about how bad monopolies are, but the government education system is the biggest monopoly on the planet. To defend it you have to talk out of both sides of your mouth.

Not everything is meant to be done via the free market. That's why we enter into pacts and form governments.

No, that's actually not why we form governments. The state is a means for a predatory class to plunder a serf class and harvest their production. Government has always been based on plunder and exploitation.

As far as education: If you are in a population dense area you can have a proper market for private schools. As long as there's a mechanism to make sure all children get a chance at a good private school (such as a voucher system and laws on the book overseeing admissions), Education that isn't necessarily run by the government can work. But in a rural sparsely populated area education is best left to local government. There just isn't a market large enough to engage in true competition.

Funny how people in rural areas manage to get groceries, but they can't get adequate schooling?

Actually, there's a lot of studies looking at the distance people have to travel to get to grocery stores in rural or very poor urban areas. It's shockingly bad. I can vouch for this as whenever I go visit family in Southern Illinois and/or Southern Indiana the distance to a grocery store is pretty rough.

That's one of the challenges you have to live with if you want to be a farmer. Schooling is another.

That's only acceptable if you're fine with creating a permanent serf class. Kids should have access to quality food and quality education regardless of location in the USA. Accepting anything less is accepting that America doesn't need to be exceptional and that "good enough" will do.

Farmers are hardly a serf class. Most of them are quite wealthy. They own millions of dollars worth of real estate, millions of dollars of farm equipment. They live quite well. Living on a farm is a decision for parents to make. Why should the rest of us pay for their decision and their choice of lifestyle?

 

[koshergrl]

It's a thousand times preferable to what the idiots in the Dept. of Education have saddled us with.

Again, if the parents can/will/are able to commit to making it work. That's a big if.

One of the things that gets lost in here is the idea that for a lot of families both parents will have to work in order to have a decent quality of life. Once the USA ended up in that position, the ability for parents to be as hands-on with their kids disappeared. Part of the whole debate we are having here is a side effect of that. If families are in a position where one parent can stay home and be active their child's life, then that child will THRIVE in public, private, or homeschooling scenarios. The problem is that isn't happening and can't happen for most people.

The difference is that in many families, they opt to live on a lot less just so they can provide that to their kids.

And one of the reason they opt for a lower standard of living is that they care about their kids, and they DON'T want their education and their character fucked with by the government schools.

 

[koshergrl]

Liberals are always talking about how bad monopolies are, but the government education system is the biggest monopoly on the planet. To defend it you have to talk out of both sides of your mouth.

Not everything is meant to be done via the free market. That's why we enter into pacts and form governments.

No, that's actually not why we form governments. The state is a means for a predatory class to plunder a serf class and harvest their production. Government has always been based on plunder and exploitation.

As far as education: If you are in a population dense area you can have a proper market for private schools. As long as there's a mechanism to make sure all children get a chance at a good private school (such as a voucher system and laws on the book overseeing admissions), Education that isn't necessarily run by the government can work. But in a rural sparsely populated area education is best left to local government. There just isn't a market large enough to engage in true competition.

Funny how people in rural areas manage to get groceries, but they can't get adequate schooling?

Actually, there's a lot of studies looking at the distance people have to travel to get to grocery stores in rural or very poor urban areas. It's shockingly bad. I can vouch for this as whenever I go visit family in Southern Illinois and/or Southern Indiana the distance to a grocery store is pretty rough.

That's one of the challenges you have to live with if you want to be a farmer. Schooling is another.

That's only acceptable if you're fine with creating a permanent serf class. Kids should have access to quality food and quality education regardless of location in the USA. Accepting anything less is accepting that America doesn't need to be exceptional and that "good enough" will do.

Public schools aren't *quality*.

 

[Fair&Balanced]

Not everything is meant to be done via the free market. That's why we enter into pacts and form governments.

No, that's actually not why we form governments. The state is a means for a predatory class to plunder a serf class and harvest their production. Government has always been based on plunder and exploitation.

As far as education: If you are in a population dense area you can have a proper market for private schools. As long as there's a mechanism to make sure all children get a chance at a good private school (such as a voucher system and laws on the book overseeing admissions), Education that isn't necessarily run by the government can work. But in a rural sparsely populated area education is best left to local government. There just isn't a market large enough to engage in true competition.

Funny how people in rural areas manage to get groceries, but they can't get adequate schooling?

Actually, there's a lot of studies looking at the distance people have to travel to get to grocery stores in rural or very poor urban areas. It's shockingly bad. I can vouch for this as whenever I go visit family in Southern Illinois and/or Southern Indiana the distance to a grocery store is pretty rough.

That's one of the challenges you have to live with if you want to be a farmer. Schooling is another.

That's only acceptable if you're fine with creating a permanent serf class. Kids should have access to quality food and quality education regardless of location in the USA. Accepting anything less is accepting that America doesn't need to be exceptional and that "good enough" will do.

Public schools aren't *quality*.

That's a generalization. There are some good public schools.

 

[Dr.Traveler]

Public schools aren't *quality*.

It depends greatly on your zip code, which is the real problem here. There are quite a few quality public schools out there. On the other hand, if you're in a zip code where the schools are terrible then you're pretty much out of luck.

 

[hadit]

Home schooling is great if you want to raise a child with no exposure to any other ideas than your own,

Most people do not have the capability to home school because their own education is lacking or it is not feasible because of work schedules, etc.

If you can do it, great! If not, don't try to use it as a dodge for mandatory attendance laws or you will just be raising another idiot dependent on social services.

And yet somehow homeschooled kids kick ass on virtually every measure. For the record I homeschooled my older son. All the homeschooled kids I ever met, even where their parents were hardly intellects, were polite and could interact well with adults.

Great post Rabbi. All statistics show that homeschooled children excel far beyond public schooled children in every category (academics, social, religious, political, etc.)

“A recent study shows that homeschooled kids score almost twice as high on exams as public school students. Other studies show that homeschooled kids score 72 points higher than the national average on SAT exams.

Homeschoolers are more likely to attend college, are more likely to graduate, and have higher college GPAs (Grade Point Averages) than other students.
The old wives’ tale spread by the teachers’ unions (who are afraid of competition) is that homeschoolers are not “socialized.” Well, the facts are in. Homeschoolers are almost twice as involved in their local community or church as public school students, and almost three times as involved in politics.

Homeschooled children also have far fewer behavioral problems.”

Excerpt From: Wayne Allyn Root. “The Ultimate Obama Survival Guide.” Regnery Publishing, 2013-03-26. iBooks.
This material may be protected by copyright.

Check out this book on the iBooks Store: The Ultimate Obama Survival Guide by Wayne Allyn Root on iBooks

Somehow, those testing advantages seem to disappear when in college. I don't know if the testing at home is more lax or they just tend to fall apart outside of the secure, comforting environment of the home.

So, IOW, the best home schooled students are on par with the best government schooled students in college? Sounds like a validation of home schooling to me, that two parents can give their child an education on par with that provided by an entire education system.

No, they're not on a par. All of the scary-smart people I've ever known were publicly schooled.

Anecdotal evidence does not inform the totality of the equation.

 

[Fair&Balanced]

Public schools aren't *quality*.

It depends greatly on your zip code, which is the real problem here. There are quite a few quality public schools out there. On the other hand, if you're in a zip code where the schools are terrible then you're pretty much out of luck.

Why is that? Don't most states allow you to send your child to any public school if you're willing to transport them there? Again, it's all about parental involvement..

 

[Unkotare]

Not everything is meant to be done via the free market. That's why we enter into pacts and form governments.

No, that's actually not why we form governments. The state is a means for a predatory class to plunder a serf class and harvest their production. Government has always been based on plunder and exploitation.

As far as education: If you are in a population dense area you can have a proper market for private schools. As long as there's a mechanism to make sure all children get a chance at a good private school (such as a voucher system and laws on the book overseeing admissions), Education that isn't necessarily run by the government can work. But in a rural sparsely populated area education is best left to local government. There just isn't a market large enough to engage in true competition.

Funny how people in rural areas manage to get groceries, but they can't get adequate schooling?

Actually, there's a lot of studies looking at the distance people have to travel to get to grocery stores in rural or very poor urban areas. It's shockingly bad. I can vouch for this as whenever I go visit family in Southern Illinois and/or Southern Indiana the distance to a grocery store is pretty rough.

That's one of the challenges you have to live with if you want to be a farmer. Schooling is another.

That's only acceptable if you're fine with creating a permanent serf class. Kids should have access to quality food and quality education regardless of location in the USA. Accepting anything less is accepting that America doesn't need to be exceptional and that "good enough" will do.

Farmers are hardly a serf class. Most of them are quite wealthy. The own millions of dollars of real estate, millions of dollars of farm equipment. They live quite well. Living on a farm is a decision for parents to make. Why should the rest of us pay for their decision and their choice of lifestyle?

Because "the rest of us" eat, moron.

 

[Unkotare]

... Don't most states allow you to send your child to any public school if you're willing to transport them there? ....

No.