Zone1 Is Hell painful? How can God allow eternal pain?

[1miseryindex]

Well, God does not force anyone to sin and end up in Hell, does He?


In Mt 18:21, the "king" in Jesus's parable (who represents God) turns this "servant" over "to the torturers" until the once-forgiven debt is paid.

Some say this debt cannot be paid so this psg is a reference to Hell

Some say the word "until" means that it is Purgatory, since the person is released once the debt is paid.

I don't think theologians have concluded which it is.. Hell or Purgatory... but in any case

Why take a chance?

 

[Auld Phart]

Well, God does not force anyone to sin and end up in Hell, does He?


In Mt 18:21, the "king" in Jesus's parable (who represents God) turns this "servant" over "to the torturers" until the once-forgiven debt is paid.

Some say this debt cannot be paid so this psg is a reference to Hell

Some say the word "until" means that it is Purgatory, since the person is released once the debt is paid.

I don't think theologians have concluded which it is.. Hell or Purgatory... but in any case

Why take a chance?

I like the way they explained it in the Oh God movies:

• Jerry Landers: How can you permit all the suffering that goes on the world?
• God: Ah, how can I permit the suffering?
• Jerry Landers: Yeah!
• God: I don't permit the suffering. You do! Free will. All the choices are yours.
• Jerry Landers: Choices? What choices?
• God: You can love each other, cherish and nurture each other or you can kill each other. Incidentally, "kill" is the word. It's not "waste." If I meant "waste" I would have written "thou shalt not waste." You're doing some very funny things with words, here. You're also turning the sky into mud. I look down, I can't believe the filth. Using the rivers for toilets, poisoning my fishes. You want a miracle? You make a fish from scratch. You can't. You think only God can make a tree? Try coming up with a mackerel. And when the last one is gone, that'll be that. Eighty-six on the fishes, goodbye sky, so long world, over and out."

Oh God 2:

• God: [answering Tracy's question about why there is so much suffering in the world] I know this sounds like a cop-out, Tracy, but there's nothing I can do about pain and suffering. It's built into the system.
• Tracy Richards: Which You invented.
• God: Right. But my problem was I could never figure out how to build anything with just one side to it.
• Tracy Richards: One side?
• God: You ever see a front without a back?
• Tracy Richards: No.
• God: A top without a bottom?
• Tracy Richards: No.
• God: An up without a down?
• Tracy Richards: No.
• God: OK. Then there can't be good without bad, life without death, pleasure without pain. That's the way it is. If I take sad away, happy has to go with it.

 

[1miseryindex]

I like the way they explained it in the Oh God movies:

• Jerry Landers: How can you permit all the suffering that goes on the world?
• God: Ah, how can I permit the suffering?
• Jerry Landers: Yeah!
• God: I don't permit the suffering. You do! Free will. All the choices are yours.
• Jerry Landers: Choices? What choices?
• God: You can love each other, cherish and nurture each other or you can kill each other. Incidentally, "kill" is the word. It's not "waste." If I meant "waste" I would have written "thou shalt not waste." You're doing some very funny things with words, here. You're also turning the sky into mud. I look down, I can't believe the filth. Using the rivers for toilets, poisoning my fishes. You want a miracle? You make a fish from scratch. You can't. You think only God can make a tree? Try coming up with a mackerel. And when the last one is gone, that'll be that. Eighty-six on the fishes, goodbye sky, so long world, over and out."

Oh God 2:

• God: [answering Tracy's question about why there is so much suffering in the world] I know this sounds like a cop-out, Tracy, but there's nothing I can do about pain and suffering. It's built into the system.
• Tracy Richards: Which You invented.
• God: Right. But my problem was I could never figure out how to build anything with just one side to it.
• Tracy Richards: One side?
• God: You ever see a front without a back?
• Tracy Richards: No.
• God: A top without a bottom?
• Tracy Richards: No.
• God: An up without a down?
• Tracy Richards: No.
• God: OK. Then there can't be good without bad, life without death, pleasure without pain. That's the way it is. If I take sad away, happy has to go with it.

So you prefer the Hollywood "God"?

Otay... your choice

 

[rightwinger]

Only bodies feel pain

 

[1miseryindex]

Only bodies feel pain

I shouldn't laugh, though... In any case, you will find out after death, I'm sure

 

[jwoodie]

Well, God does not force anyone to sin and end up in Hell, does He?


In Mt 18:21, the "king" in Jesus's parable (who represents God) turns this "servant" over "to the torturers" until the once-forgiven debt is paid.

Some say this debt cannot be paid so this psg is a reference to Hell

Some say the word "until" means that it is Purgatory, since the person is released once the debt is paid.

I don't think theologians have concluded which it is.. Hell or Purgatory... but in any case

Why take a chance?

The wages of sin are death, not eternity inside a kettle barbecue.

 

[Moonglow]

I shouldn't laugh, though... In any case, you will find out after death, I'm sure

I have tickets to Nirvana myself.

 

[1miseryindex]

The wages of sin are death, not eternity inside a kettle barbecue.

The wages of sin unrepented of

is eternal death/dying

 

[1srelluc]

Whatever happens I expect it's directly related to how many favors you asked of God while living.

 

[1miseryindex]

Whatever happens I expect it's directly related to how many favors you asked of God while living.

Well, maybe YOU understand what you mean here??

 

[toobfreak]

Is Hell painful? How can God allow eternal pain?​

God doesn't allow anything but freedom of choice. Man makes his own choices and creates his own suffering and hell.

 

[Moonglow]

God doesn't allow anything but freedom of choice. Man makes his own choices and creates his own suffering and hell.

That is what Siddhartha Gautama said several hundred years before Jesus.

 

[1miseryindex]

God doesn't allow anything but freedom of choice. Man makes his own choices and creates his own suffering and hell.

and if not repented of, his sins will lead him into Hell, eternal separation from God and all that is good

 

[1srelluc]

Well, maybe YOU understand what you mean here??

Pretty simple agnostic concept.....

I don't mess with God by asking Him for a bunch of favors pertaining to earthy type stuff so hopefully He does not mess with me in the great hereafter.

It's like those Saints folks pray to....Here they mostly had a tough row to hoe in their time on earth, they die and go to their reward, and folks pester them no end.....Better hope they don't report them to the God "mod".

 

[1miseryindex]

Pretty simple agnostic concept.....

I don't mess with God by asking Him for a bunch of favors pertaining to earthy type stuff so hopefully He does not mess with me in the great hereafter.

It's like those Saints folks pray to....Here they mostly had a tough row to hoe in their time on earth, they die and go to their reward, and folks pester them no end.....Better hope they don't report them to the God "mod".

Now I don't understand the... let's see... 4th and 5th sentences

 

[toobfreak]

That is what Siddhartha Gautama said several hundred years before Jesus.

Suffering in its most basic essence is caused by desire. Not having what one wants. Do away with desire and you end suffering.

 

[toobfreak]

and if not repented of, his sins will lead him into Hell, eternal separation from God and all that is good

I don't believe anything is eternal. Even the worst action can be forgiven and repaid through one's actions and penance.

 

[1miseryindex]

Suffering in its most basic essence is caused by desire. Not having what one wants. Do away with desire and you end suffering.

right

All you have to do when you get a headache is stop desiring that it go away

and voila

no aspirin needed.

Tylenol makers will not want to hear this!

 

[toobfreak]

All you have to do when you get a headache is stop desiring that it go away

Casting pearls before swine. Another one right over your head.

Try again.

A holy life by definition is being at one with God.

There can be no suffering unless you identify with the YOU who is that which is suffering, which means you are NOT one with God.

Therefore, the cause of suffering is not God but man who lives separate from God.

 

[1miseryindex]

Casting pearls before swine. Another one right over your head.

Try again.

A holy life by definition is being at one with God.

There can be no suffering unless you identify with the YOU who is that which is suffering, which means you are NOT one with God.

Therefore, the cause of suffering is not God but man who lives separate from God.

I don't see where that answers my post

but ...

that figures