Is Christmas a Christian (or Catholic) Holiday?

[Meriweather]

Funny how it ended up around the northern hemisphere winter solstice, the pagan festival celebrating the rebirth of the sun. Must be a coincidence.

Yes, kind of like the number of birthdays in the US on any given day is over 800,000. Pure coincidence. Speaking of birthdays...they weren't celebrated in Biblical times. That came later. When birthday celebrations became the custom, it was natural that Christians wanted to celebrate Jesus' birthday. Early on, Christians believed Jesus died on the same day he was conceived, and they marked that day as March 25. (Keep in mind, I am not saying Jesus died on March 25, I am merely reporting what early Christians believed). They were also celebrating the Feast of the Magi, who they believed arrived 12 days (note the number 12) after Jesus' birth. Nine months after March 25...December 25. Twelve days before the gift-bringing Magi...December 25.

As far as bringing fir trees and wreaths inside. Houses were small; no bathrooms; very little bathing in the winter, so trees, wreaths, and branches underfoot freshened things up during winter months.

I have forgotten exactly which pieces, but "copying" what was going on in other celebrations was a two-way street. In other words, what Christians were doing found the way into Pagan celebrations as well. We never have lived in a vacuum. Christmas is a great day for reflection. It reminds me that while I live in a sweet-smelling, temperature controlled house all year 'round, my ancestors did not. I am quite sure my family tree branches out to include Christians, atheists, pagans, etc. It appears we all come together, and I believe that is the wish of all down through the ages...that there is a time where all of mankind can simply come together. Even if it is for a very short while.

 

[GLASNOST]

As I have posted in this space before, "we"celebrate two separate holidays on December 25th, and unfortunately they both go by the same name: "Christmas."

One holiday is a secular one, dating back to Roman times, where we have decorated trees, gift-giving, a "jolly old elf" bringing gifts for the children, seasonal music, and so on. EVERYONE can celebrate that secular holiday, and the proof that it IS a secular holiday that government employees get paid not to work on that day.

The other holiday ("holy day") is a religious feast where Christians celebrate the Nativity - the supernatural virgin-birth of the God-man whom we refer to as "Jesus Christ." We symbolize this celebration with depictions of a baby laid in a manger in a stable or cave of some sort, and we say prayers and sing hymns celebrating this wondrous event and phenomenon. Only Christians celebrate this holiday/holy day. Christians who want to celebrate with gift-giving (should) do so on January 6th, the date when we celebrate the visitation of the three Magi (or "wise men") to the Christ child; they brought gifts of gold, frankincense, and myrrh.

But there is no good reason why everyone in the country should not celebrate a holiday on December 25th, and only a certified wanker would be offended by being wished a "Merry/Happy Christmas."

A very interesting response, and insightful too.

 

[Penelope]

As I have posted in this space before, "we"celebrate two separate holidays on December 25th, and unfortunately they both go by the same name: "Christmas."

One holiday is a secular one, dating back to Roman times, where we have decorated trees, gift-giving, a "jolly old elf" bringing gifts for the children, seasonal music, and so on. EVERYONE can celebrate that secular holiday, and the proof that it IS a secular holiday that government employees get paid not to work on that day.

The other holiday ("holy day") is a religious feast where Christians celebrate the Nativity - the supernatural virgin-birth of the God-man whom we refer to as "Jesus Christ." We symbolize this celebration with depictions of a baby laid in a manger in a stable or cave of some sort, and we say prayers and sing hymns celebrating this wondrous event and phenomenon. Only Christians celebrate this holiday/holy day. Christians who want to celebrate with gift-giving (should) do so on January 6th, the date when we celebrate the visitation of the three Magi (or "wise men") to the Christ child; they brought gifts of gold, frankincense, and myrrh.

But there is no good reason why everyone in the country should not celebrate a holiday on December 25th, and only a certified wanker would be offended by being wished a "Merry/Happy Christmas."

We do as the Romans do.

 

[GLASNOST]

We do as the Romans do.

You mean you nail prophets to the cross and blame it on the Jews? Is that an annual event or only periodic whenever you get the urge?

 

[Penelope]

We do as the Romans do.

You mean you nail prophets to the cross and blame it on the Jews? Is that an annual event or only periodic whenever you get the urge?

No the Jews did according to the scriptures. Judaism is a pagan religion.

 

[JLW]

Aren't all Catholics Christian but not all Christians Catholic?

 

[norwegen]

As I have posted in this space before, "we"celebrate two separate holidays on December 25th, and unfortunately they both go by the same name: "Christmas."

One holiday is a secular one, dating back to Roman times, where we have decorated trees, gift-giving, a "jolly old elf" bringing gifts for the children, seasonal music, and so on. EVERYONE can celebrate that secular holiday, and the proof that it IS a secular holiday that government employees get paid not to work on that day.

The other holiday ("holy day") is a religious feast where Christians celebrate the Nativity - the supernatural virgin-birth of the God-man whom we refer to as "Jesus Christ." We symbolize this celebration with depictions of a baby laid in a manger in a stable or cave of some sort, and we say prayers and sing hymns celebrating this wondrous event and phenomenon. Only Christians celebrate this holiday/holy day. Christians who want to celebrate with gift-giving (should) do so on January 6th, the date when we celebrate the visitation of the three Magi (or "wise men") to the Christ child; they brought gifts of gold, frankincense, and myrrh.

But there is no good reason why everyone in the country should not celebrate a holiday on December 25th, and only a certified wanker would be offended by being wished a "Merry/Happy Christmas."

True enough. Christianity is a pure faith, a faith unto itself. Christian holidays, on the other hand, came later and seem to have incorporated some elements of non-Christian observances partly for convenience and partly to displace those non-Christian observances. I think they chose to celebrate Christ's birth shortly after the winter solstice, for example, because Christianity was crowding out paganism, and to celebrate their holiday on a pagan holiday was to further prompt the pagans to choose between the two.

That's what I think, anyway. But in those days of pagan decline, I don't think Christmas was much a concern even for Christians.

 

[GLASNOST]

We do as the Romans do.

You mean you nail prophets to the cross and blame it on the Jews? Is that an annual event or only periodic whenever you get the urge?

No the Jews did according to the scriptures......

The Jews did what?

 

[Penelope]

We do as the Romans do.

You mean you nail prophets to the cross and blame it on the Jews? Is that an annual event or only periodic whenever you get the urge?

No the Jews did according to the scriptures......

The Jews did what?

Read the scriptures.

 

[irosie91]

We do as the Romans do.

You mean you nail prophets to the cross and blame it on the Jews? Is that an annual event or only periodic whenever you get the urge?

No the Jews did according to the scriptures......

The Jews did what?

Read the scriptures.

what scriptures? I read lots of scriptural writings.
The Ramayana is a scriptural writing-----which people educated in Sanskrit Literature can appreciate.
Even in translation it is lovely----but it does not prove that monkeys can fly

 

[irosie91]

We do as the Romans do.

You mean you nail prophets to the cross and blame it on the Jews? Is that an annual event or only periodic whenever you get the urge?

No the Jews did according to the scriptures. Judaism is a pagan religion.

what scriptures is that? I read lots of scriptures ----
from The Bhaghavad Gita to Beowulf----none of
them include anything about jews nailing people to
anything. There is lots on Greeks and Romans
engaging in that sort of barbarity

 

[GLASNOST]

We do as the Romans do.

You mean you nail prophets to the cross and blame it on the Jews? Is that an annual event or only periodic whenever you get the urge?

No the Jews did according to the scriptures......

The Jews did what?

Read the scriptures.

If you want to try defending your undefendable conviction against me then you'll have to tell me what is the Jews did that you think is so relevant to this dialogue. I will MOST DEFINITELY not "read the scriptures" to find some obscure, hocus-pocus, superstitious, most likely misunderstood passage. If you have something to say then say it otherwise forfeit whatever point you think you are going to make.

 

[irosie91]

As I have posted in this space before, "we"celebrate two separate holidays on December 25th, and unfortunately they both go by the same name: "Christmas."

One holiday is a secular one, dating back to Roman times, where we have decorated trees, gift-giving, a "jolly old elf" bringing gifts for the children, seasonal music, and so on. EVERYONE can celebrate that secular holiday, and the proof that it IS a secular holiday that government employees get paid not to work on that day.

The other holiday ("holy day") is a religious feast where Christians celebrate the Nativity - the supernatural virgin-birth of the God-man whom we refer to as "Jesus Christ." We symbolize this celebration with depictions of a baby laid in a manger in a stable or cave of some sort, and we say prayers and sing hymns celebrating this wondrous event and phenomenon. Only Christians celebrate this holiday/holy day. Christians who want to celebrate with gift-giving (should) do so on January 6th, the date when we celebrate the visitation of the three Magi (or "wise men") to the Christ child; they brought gifts of gold, frankincense, and myrrh.

But there is no good reason why everyone in the country should not celebrate a holiday on December 25th, and only a certified wanker would be offended by being wished a "Merry/Happy Christmas."

True enough. Christianity is a pure faith, a faith unto itself. Christian holidays, on the other hand, came later and seem to have incorporated some elements of non-Christian observances partly for convenience and partly to displace those non-Christian observances. I think they chose to celebrate Christ's birth shortly after the winter solstice, for example, because Christianity was crowding out paganism, and to celebrate their holiday on a pagan holiday was to further prompt the pagans to choose between the two.

That's what I think, anyway. But in those days of pagan decline, I don't think Christmas was much a concern even for Christians.

adaptation to roman and greek ethos was the purpose of the Nicean Council as was adulation of the
HOLY ROMAN EMPIRE

 

[Penelope]

We do as the Romans do.

You mean you nail prophets to the cross and blame it on the Jews? Is that an annual event or only periodic whenever you get the urge?

No the Jews did according to the scriptures......

The Jews did what?

Read the scriptures.

what scriptures? I read lots of scriptural writings.
The Ramayana is a scriptural writing-----which people educated in Sanskrit Literature can appreciate.
Even in translation it is lovely----but it does not prove that monkeys can fly

The gospels. Here in case you need a link:
Books of the Bible | USCCB

 

[Penelope]

We do as the Romans do.

You mean you nail prophets to the cross and blame it on the Jews? Is that an annual event or only periodic whenever you get the urge?

No the Jews did according to the scriptures......

The Jews did what?

Read the scriptures.

If you want to try defending your undefendable conviction against me then you'll have to tell me what is the Jews did that you think is so relevant to this dialogue. I will MOST DEFINITELY not "read the scriptures" to find some obscure, hocus-pocus, superstitious, most likely misunderstood passage. If you have something to say then say it otherwise forfeit whatever point you think you are going to make.

Read the gospels, it'll mean more to you if you actually read them.

 

[irosie91]

We do as the Romans do.

You mean you nail prophets to the cross and blame it on the Jews? Is that an annual event or only periodic whenever you get the urge?

No the Jews did according to the scriptures......

The Jews did what?

Read the scriptures.

If you want to try defending your undefendable conviction against me then you'll have to tell me what is the Jews did that you think is so relevant to this dialogue. I will MOST DEFINITELY not "read the scriptures" to find some obscure, hocus-pocus, superstitious, most likely misunderstood passage. If you have something to say then say it otherwise forfeit whatever point you think you are going to make.

Read the gospels, it'll mean more to you if you actually read them.

I read them all------if it REALLY any of those "books" really, credibly, claimed that JOOOOS DONE IT----
you could cite the actual passages for LOGICAL AND CREDIBLE DISCUSSION------or is the book still on the
INDEX?

 

[Penelope]

We do as the Romans do.

You mean you nail prophets to the cross and blame it on the Jews? Is that an annual event or only periodic whenever you get the urge?

No the Jews did according to the scriptures......

The Jews did what?

Read the scriptures.

If you want to try defending your undefendable conviction against me then you'll have to tell me what is the Jews did that you think is so relevant to this dialogue. I will MOST DEFINITELY not "read the scriptures" to find some obscure, hocus-pocus, superstitious, most likely misunderstood passage. If you have something to say then say it otherwise forfeit whatever point you think you are going to make.

Read the gospels, it'll mean more to you if you actually read them.

I read them all------if it REALLY any of those "books" really, credibly, claimed that JOOOOS DONE IT----
you could cite the actual passages for LOGICAL AND CREDIBLE DISCUSSION------or is the book still on the
INDEX?

Well the jews wrote every darn book in the OT and NT. They wanted for gentiles to worship and Jew and most of them do. Read the gospels.

 

[justinacolmena]

The word “Catholic” means “worldly” or “all-encompassing.” Nothing at all to do with Christ or Christianity.

 

[irosie91]

Aren't all Catholics Christian but not all Christians Catholic?

depends on whom you ask. I grew up in a part of the USA that harbored lots of christians-----but some of those I called Christians were <gasp> IRISH!!!!!
My very first experience with a theological dispute
took place between an IRISH CATHOLIC and---a kinda
waspish Protestant. We were all in kindergarten.
The Protestant said, derisively to the Catholic---
"YOU PRAY TO MARY" The Irish Catholic defended
herself with the statement "WE PRAY FOR MARY".
I was outta the loop

 

[Penelope]

The word “Catholic” means “worldly” or “all-encompassing.” Nothing at all to do with Christ or Christianity.

The Catholics are the real Christians.