Is Anthropogenic (Human-Caused) Global Warming/AGW Falsifiable?

[Robert W]

Water vapor is responsible for half the Earth's greenhouse warming. Prior to the Industrial Revolution, CO2 was responsible for one-third of Earth's greenhouse warming. Today, at a 50% higher atmospheric level, it is responsible for one half of our current warming.

That is not science. It is one person's opinion.
Check out the September temperatures at Death Valley.
Notice the days it gets hot followed by cooler days. The CO2 is not to blame since if anything per your theory the amount gains daily and does not fall.

https://www.accuweather.com/en/us/death-valley/92384/september-weather/2258469

 

[BackAgain]

Why do you think it is nonsense to claim that AGW could be falsified?

Because it cannot be falsified.

It is largely based on “models” but the models themselves are deficient.

I assume you know this. Check this out from 2008:

One moment, please...

Can you honestly point to anything that validates these models?

So, you believe the greenhouse effect is regional? Could you explain how that would work?

I said no such thing and suggested no such thing and implied no such thing. See a pattern there?

Water vapor is responsible for half the Earth's greenhouse warming. Prior to the Industrial Revolution, CO2 was responsible for one-third of Earth's greenhouse warming. Today, at a 50% higher atmospheric level, it is responsible for one half of our current warming.

Zzz. No links. No evidence. No offers of any proof.

 

[Grumblenuts]

That is not science. It is one person's opinion.

Science. NASA.

Steamy Relationships: How Atmospheric Water Vapor Amplifies Earth's Greenhouse Effect - NASA Science

Water vapor is Earth’s most abundant greenhouse gas. It’s responsible for about half of Earth’s greenhouse effect — the process that occurs when gases in

science.nasa.gov

 

[ding]

Science. NASA.

Steamy Relationships: How Atmospheric Water Vapor Amplifies Earth's Greenhouse Effect - NASA Science

Water vapor is Earth’s most abundant greenhouse gas. It’s responsible for about half of Earth’s greenhouse effect — the process that occurs when gases in

science.nasa.gov

Yes, water vapor is a GHG and water vapor does increase with temperature. What is being challenged is the source of the warming. And since there tons of evidence that show the oceans and atmosphere warm when the northern hemisphere is deglaciating and since that has been occurring since the last glacial maximum, and since this interglacial period is 2C colder than the peak temperature of previous interglacial periods, it's idiotic to assume all warming is from an incremental 120 ppm of atmospheric CO2. This is especially true given that the warming trend began 400 years ago.

Science and logic.

 

[Grumblenuts]

Yes, water vapor is a GHG and water vapor does increase with temperature. What is being challenged is the source of the warming. And since there tons of evidence that show the oceans and atmosphere warm when the northern hemisphere is deglaciating and since that has been occurring since the last glacial maximum, and since this interglacial period is 2C colder than the peak temperature of previous interglacial periods, it's idiotic to assume all warming is from an incremental 120 ppm of atmospheric CO2. This is especially true given that the warming trend began 400 years ago.

That is not science. It is one person's addled bwain pwoduct.

 

[ding]

That is not science. It is one person's addled bwain pwoduct.

The oceans/atmosphere cooling when the northern hemisphere glaciates and warming when the northern hemisphere deglaciates most certainly is science.

 

[Dagosa]

CLIMATE TRUTH = anti semitic hate
911 TRUTH = anti semitic hate
Covid TRUTH = anti semitic hate
Murderous FRAUD VAX TRUTH = anti semitic hate
10.7 TRUTH = anti semitic hate


anti semitic hate = telling the TRUTH about Zionist Fascism

Einstein Letter Warning Of Zionist Facism In Israel

CLIMATE TRUTH = anti semitic hate
911 TRUTH = anti semitic hate
Covid TRUTH = anti semitic hate
Murderous FRAUD VAX TRUTH = anti semitic hate
10.7 TRUTH = anti semitic hate


anti semitic hate = telling the TRUTH about Zionist Fascism

Einstein Letter Warning Of Zionist Facism In Israel

You forgot to finish with ‘ sieg heil”

 

[Grumblenuts]

Points of Agreement:
"water vapor is a GHG" -- ding
"water vapor does increase with temperature" -- ding
That's progress. What else might we agree upon?

Carbon dioxide is Earth’s most important greenhouse gas: a gas that absorbs and radiates heat.

Carbon dioxide levels today are higher than at any point in human history. In fact, the last time atmospheric carbon dioxide amounts were this high was roughly 3 million years ago, during the Mid-Pliocene Warm Period, when global surface temperature was 4.5–7.2 degrees Fahrenheit (2.5–4 degrees Celsius) warmer than during the pre-industrial era. Sea level was at least 16 feet higher than it was in 1900 and possibly as much as 82 feet higher.

 

[Grumblenuts]

Trends in CO2 - NOAA Global Monitoring Laboratory

GML conducts research on greenhouse gas and carbon cycle feedbacks, changes in aerosols, and surface radiation, and recovery of stratospheric ozone.

gml.noaa.gov

They ain't just whistlin' Dixie!

 

[Crick]

Because it cannot be falsified.

I just showed you several ways in which it could be falsified and there are lots more.

It is largely based on “models” but the models themselves are deficient.

It is NOT largely based on models and GCMs are not deficient.

I assume you know this. Check this out from 2008:

One moment, please...

Tim Ball is a very poor source. Almost everything he says here is demonstrably false.

Can you honestly point to anything that validates these models?

I have already done so, repeatedly, but if you'd like to see it once again...

I said no such thing and suggested no such thing and implied no such thing. See a pattern there?

We said:

My apologies if I've misinterpreted what you've said here, but you seem to be saying that you do not accept that the greenhouse effect is a global effect. The only other alternative I know of is that it be regional. If you meant something else, please explain.

No links. No evidence. No offers of any proof.*

* - that CO2 was responsible for 1/3rd of pre-industrial greenhouse warming and is now responsible for 1/2.

That is because I have posted it several times before.

Why carbon dioxide matters​

Carbon dioxide is Earth’s most important greenhouse gas: a gas that absorbs and radiates heat. Unlike oxygen or nitrogen (which make up most of our atmosphere), greenhouse gases absorb heat radiating from the Earth’s surface and re-release it in all directions—including back toward Earth’s surface. Without carbon dioxide, Earth’s natural greenhouse effect would be too weak to keep the average global surface temperature above freezing. By adding more carbon dioxide to the atmosphere, people are supercharging the natural greenhouse effect, causing global temperature to rise. According to observations by the NOAA Global Monitoring Lab, in 2021 carbon dioxide alone was responsible for about two-thirds of the total heating influence of all human-produced greenhouse gases.

Climate Change: Atmospheric Carbon Dioxide

In the past 60 years, carbon dioxide in the atmosphere has increased 100 times faster than it did during the end of the last ice age.

www.climate.gov

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Greenhouse Effect 101

By increasing the concentration of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere, we’re amplifying the planet’s natural greenhouse effect and turning up the dial on global warming.

www.nrdc.org

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From 1990 to 2019, the total warming effect from greenhouse gases added by humans to the Earth’s atmosphere increased by 45 percent. The warming effect associated with carbon dioxide alone increased by 36 percent.

Climate Change Indicators: Greenhouse Gases | US EPA

Greenhouse Gases

www.epa.gov

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AI Overview
Learn more…Opens in new tab

According to current scientific understanding, carbon dioxide (CO2) is responsible for roughly two-thirds of the total heating influence from human-produced greenhouse gases, meaning it contributes significantly to Earth's greenhouse warming; with estimates placing its contribution around 60-70%of the total human-caused warming.


Key points about CO2 and greenhouse warming:

• Dominant greenhouse gas:
  CO2 is considered the primary anthropogenic (human-caused) greenhouse gas, contributing the most to global warming.
  
  
  
• Long atmospheric lifetime:
  CO2 remains in the atmosphere for long periods, allowing its warming effects to accumulate over time.
  
  
  
• Impact on temperature:
  Increasing CO2 concentrations directly correlate with rising global temperatures.
  
  
  

 

[BackAgain]

I just showed you several ways in which it could be falsified and there are lots more.

Nope you showed nobody any such ruing.

It is NOT largely based on models and GCMs are not deficient

False.

Tim Ball is a very poor source.

Because he disagrees with your pablum puke? Sure, crack. Sure.

Almost everything he says here is demonstrably false.

So. It’s fully true. Check.

I have already done so, repeatedly, but if you'd like to see it once again...

Zzzz. *****, please! Don’t take up so much board space with your gibberish.

 

[EMH]

Impact on temperature:
Increasing CO2 concentrations directly correlate with rising global temperatures

Funny, the highly correlated satellite and balloon data showed NO WARMING for more than 3 decades of rising Co2...

Key claim against global warming evaporates

Satellite and weather balloon data used to argue that climate models were wrong and that global warming isn't really happening turns out to be based on faulty analyses, according to three new studies.

www.nbcnews.com

satellite and weather balloon data have actually suggested the opposite, that the atmosphere was cooling



Science says THEORY REJECTED

"The Science" "Climate Science" says FUDGE THE DATA and claim "warming" that DOES NOT EXIST

 

[EMH]

BackAgain ding​

​

Water Vapor, CO2, and Global Warming​

MYTH: Water vapor is the most important, abundant greenhouse gas. So if we’re going to control a greenhouse gas, why don’t we control it instead of carbon dioxide (CO2)?

This is a common Misconception in the debate over greenhouse gases and the causes of global warming. Both water vapor and carbon dioxide are important greenhouse gases that play a crucial role in atmospheric warming. A greenhouse gas is a gas that absorbs and re-emits infrared radiation in Earth’s atmosphere, thereby increasing temperatures. Which gas then is to blame for global warming and should be controlled?

Water vapor accounts for 60-70% of the greenhouse effect while CO2 accounts for 25% —a notable difference when numbers alone are compared. It would seem then that water vapor should be climatologists’ primary focus. However, water vapor cannot be controlled by human intervention; it is simply a Product of its environment.

The amount of water vapor the atmosphere can hold is dependent on temperature. Under normal conditions, most of the heat emitted from Earth’s surface in the form of long wave radiation goes into the atmosphere and out into space. However, the presence of increased greenhouse gases traps more long-wave radiation, which means there is more energy in the atmosphere to warm the Earth’s surface.

As the atmospheric temperature rises, more water is evaporated from ground storage, such as that found in our rivers, oceans, soils, and reservoirs. The released water vapor becomes a greenhouse gas where it then absorbs more energy radiated from the Earth and thus warms the atmosphere. The warmer atmosphere results in further water evaporation and the cycle continues. This mechanism is known as a Positive Feedback Loop.

Scientists then need to focus on what is causing air temperatures to rise in the first place. Heat from Other Greenhouse Gases is Causing atmospheric Warming, Leading to an increase in water evaporation and compounding the greenhouse effect.
Anthropogenic, or human-derived, CO2 serves as the Primary source of Warming with water vapor playing a Secondary role.
While CO2 occurs naturally in the atmosphere, human interference has interrupted the carbon cycle through activities, such as burning forests, mining, and burning coal. These activities artificially release more carbon from their solid storage to its gaseous state in the lower atmosphere. The rapid increase in CO2 volume has exceeded the amount oceans and vegetation are able to re-absorb. Furthermore, as deforestation continues around the world, there is less vegetation every year available to sequester the carbon. Thus, excess CO2 remains in the atmosphere where it traps heat and stimulates water evaporation."...."[/U]

Water Vapor, CO2, and Global Warming | IEDRO​

`

How did Greenland freeze at the same time North America thawed?

 

[EMH]

pick it

10k
20k
50k
1 million years

Greenland froze while North America thawed...

How old were the 2.5 mile thick glaciers covering Chicago in the past 20k-5 million years?

This is where the climate debate is now stuck. Every piece of land within 600 miles of a pole is in ice age, everything outside of that is not. Nobody has attempted to dispute that. It is the clear truth of Earth today. Milankovitch Cycles, which I call McBullshit Cycles, take a very...

www.usmessageboard.com

 

[abu afak]

BackAgain ding​

​

Water Vapor, CO2, and Global Warming​

MYTH: Water vapor is the most important, abundant greenhouse gas. So if we’re going to control a greenhouse gas, why don’t we control it instead of carbon dioxide (CO2)?

This is a common Misconception in the debate over greenhouse gases and the causes of global warming. Both water vapor and carbon dioxide are important greenhouse gases that play a crucial role in atmospheric warming. A greenhouse gas is a gas that absorbs and re-emits infrared radiation in Earth’s atmosphere, thereby increasing temperatures. Which gas then is to blame for global warming and should be controlled?

Water vapor accounts for 60-70% of the greenhouse effect while CO2 accounts for 25% —a notable difference when numbers alone are compared. It would seem then that water vapor should be climatologists’ primary focus. However, water vapor cannot be controlled by human intervention; it is simply a Product of its environment.

The amount of water vapor the atmosphere can hold is Dependent on temperature. Under normal conditions, most of the heat emitted from Earth’s surface in the form of long wave radiation goes into the atmosphere and out into space. However, the presence of increased greenhouse gases traps more long-wave radiation, which means there is more energy in the atmosphere to warm the Earth’s surface.

As the atmospheric temperature rises, more water is evaporated from ground storage, such as that found in our rivers, oceans, soils, and reservoirs. The released water vapor becomes a greenhouse gas where it then absorbs more energy radiated from the Earth and thus warms the atmosphere. The warmer atmosphere results in further water evaporation and the cycle continues. This mechanism is known as a Positive Feedback Loop.

Scientists then need to focus on what is Causing air temperatures to rise in the first place. Heat from Other Greenhouse Gases is Causing atmospheric Warming, Leading to an increase in water evaporation and compounding the greenhouse effect.
Anthropogenic, or human-derived, CO2 serves as the Primary source of Warming with water vapor playing a Secondary role.
While CO2 occurs naturally in the atmosphere, human interference has interrupted the carbon cycle through activities, such as burning forests, mining, and burning coal. These activities artificially release more carbon from their solid storage to its gaseous state in the lower atmosphere. The rapid increase in CO2 volume has exceeded the amount oceans and vegetation are able to re-absorb. Furthermore, as deforestation continues around the world, there is less vegetation every year available to sequester the carbon. Thus, excess CO2 remains in the atmosphere where it traps heat and stimulates water evaporation."...."

Water Vapor, CO2, and Global Warming | IEDRO​

`

 

[Crick]

Nope you showed nobody any such ruing.


False.


Because he disagrees with your pablum puke? Sure, crack. Sure.

So. It’s fully true. Check.


Zzzz. *****, please! Don’t take up so much board space with your gibberish.

Why do you bother to post here?

 

[EMH]

on what is Causing air temperatures to rise in the first place

FRAUD.

No evidence of atmospheric warming in the actual data. Only FUDGE....

 

[Grumblenuts]

Why do you bother to post here?

Like too many, he's just lonely and miserable. Misery loves company, crackpots, and losers like Tim Ball.

Michael Mann v. Timothy (“Tim”) Ball, The Frontier Centre for Public Policy, Inc. and John Doe - The Climate Litigation Database

CA-BC, CAN | Litigation | Libel claim filed by climate scientist falsely suggested to be guilty of criminal fraud in connection to alleged Climategate scandal

climatecasechart.com

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Like too many, he's just lonely and miserable. Misery loves company, crackpots, and losers like Tim Ball.

Michael Mann v. Timothy (“Tim”) Ball, The Frontier Centre for Public Policy, Inc. and John Doe - The Climate Litigation Database

CA-BC, CAN | Litigation | Libel claim filed by climate scientist falsely suggested to be guilty of criminal fraud in connection to alleged Climategate scandal

climatecasechart.com

Michael Mann couldn't beat Tim Ball.

 

[Pappadave1]

Why do you think it is nonsense to claim that AGW could be falsified?

So, you believe the greenhouse effect is regional? Could you explain how that would work?

Water vapor is responsible for half the Earth's greenhouse warming. Prior to the Industrial Revolution, CO2 was responsible for one-third of Earth's greenhouse warming. Today, at a 50% higher atmospheric level, it is responsible for one half of our current warming.

BS. Are you aware than 87% of all climate statistics are made up and bear no resemblance to reality?