IPPC’s global sea level rise estimates from 30 years ago:

[Oddball]

Far less money than it will cost to simply react to it your ******* idiot.

STFU and show your math.

 

[EMH]

Far less money than it will cost to simply react to it your ******* idiot.

Having more trouble with the HEBREW to ENGLISH translation software again??


Crock claims to live in FLA, but she had never heard of the term CANES before...

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[DennisPTate]

Pretty accurate I say. Yet you believe that we don't understand the science and can't predict the future? lol

A pretty powerful case can be presented that the massive amount of H2O that cracked and slid off the LAND BASED Greenland Ice Sheet into the North Atlantic, plus all the melting that occurred on the world's glaciers ended up ON TOP OF the Antarctic Ice Sheet.

The people who financed Mr. Al Gore's film may not want you to know about that though because it can soon be seen that if this is true then a Carbon Tax will do essentially nothing to prevent ocean levels from rising, eventually.

"At a symposium of the Union of Geodesy and geophysics, Dr. Pyyotor Shoumsky reported that the south polar ice cap was growing at a minimum rate of 293 cubic miles of ice annually. To put that number in perspective, Lake Erie contains only 109 cubic miles of water. Thus, a volume of ice forms on top of the existing ice at Antarctica each year which is almost three times the volume of water in Lake Erie!" (Expanded Discussion of The HAB Theory, Gershom Gale, Expanded Discussion on the HAB Theory.)

I believe that the way to stabilize the climate is mega-scale desalination of sea water to turn deserts green and produce food even in deserts. Allan Savory Ph. D. also has a great idea about using herd animals to turn deserts green and thus stabilize the climate. The people who are obsessing over "cow farts" are seriously off in the wrong direction.


Can sheep save the planet? Yes! says Allan Savory

 

[EMH]

A pretty powerful case can be presented that the massive amount of H2O that cracked and slid off the LAND BASED Greenland Ice Sheet into the North Atlantic, plus all the melting that occurred on the world's glaciers ended up ON TOP OF the Antarctic Ice Sheet.

The people who financed Mr. Al Gore's film may not want you to know about that though because it can soon be seen that if this is true then a Carbon Tax will do essentially nothing to prevent ocean levels from rising, eventually.



I believe that the way to stabilize the climate is mega-scale desalination of sea water to turn deserts green and produce food even in deserts. Allan Savory Ph. D. also has a great idea about using herd animals to turn deserts green and thus stabilize the climate. The people who are obsessing over "cow farts" are seriously off in the wrong direction.


Can sheep save the planet? Yes! says Allan Savory

That Antarctica and Greenland have grown ice every year throughout CO2 FRAUD is proven by ice cores.

The amount of climate change on planet Earth over the past 100 years is not even measurable, essentially zero.

 

[DennisPTate]

That Antarctica and Greenland have grown ice every year throughout CO2 FRAUD is proven by ice cores.

The amount of climate change on planet Earth over the past 100 years is not even measurable, essentially zero.

I honestly do not know whether or not the Greenland Ice Sheets are growing or not. I have got to look into the data that is available on that. I am certain though that the Antarctic Ice Sheets are growing by serious numbers annually, [and have been growing and growing for decades and actually many centuries].

I am of the belief that the growth of the ice on top of Antarctica is the number one explanation as to why we have not had ocean level rise yet. The fact that there are 130 volcanoes under Antarctica though indicates that ocean level rise is probably coming. The fact that the West Antarctic Ice Sheet is anchored below sea level indicates to me that ocean levels will eventually rise.

I believe that mega-scale sea water desalination technology is great news for any of us who own real estate that is vulnerable to the threat of rising ocean levels. I do believe that a flip is happening in governments and I believe that the promotion of a Carbon Tax as being the best way to stabilize the climate is being given up on finally.

Chaim Henry Tejman M. D. who impresses me as a modern Dr. Albert Einstein believes that trees and plants hold the key to stabilization of the climate. I believe that he is correct.

 

[EMH]

I honestly do not know whether or not the Greenland Ice Sheets are growing or not.

The ice core tells you something. It tells you how an ice age grows. It grows one year at a time on the top. Every year Greenland and Antarctica add another layer of ice on top. The ice loss on Antarctica is all from icebergs, but it is still gaining ice 40 million years in ice age. Greenland has ice way south of Arctic Circle that melts during summer, plus icebergs from its west coast. But the truth of "Global Cooling" is still there, the Vikings were farming the southern tip until the 1400, and their farms are buried under 600 layers of ice now.

Thread 'Apparently we really need a "debate" over the term ICE AGE because y'all are all wrong...'

Jun 23, 2023

What is an ICE AGE?

Most apparently still believe it is a terrifying horror movie event where Earth all at once freezes up. The data has never supported such a scenario. Since 2010, there has been a massive effort to re-write Earth climate history into a series of rapid "glaciations" and ice retreats, as if "Day After Tomorrow" movie is accurate... LOL!!! What was North American Ice Age before 2010 is now spun into a series of rapid "ice ages" where it took a mere 75k years for the "ice age" to start in Northern Canada and put 2.5 mile thick glaicers on Chicago. This is "Milankovich"...

• EMH
• Replies: 338
• Forum: Environment

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I am of the belief that the growth of the ice on top of Antarctica is the number one explanation as to why we have not had ocean level rise yet.

There are two things pushing ocean levels higher, the burning of fossil fuels, which produces H2O that did not exist before, and every "tonnage displacement" of ocean water by man = cruise ships, cargo ships aircraft carriers, oil rigs, man made islands etc.

Those two cover for the fact that Earth is gaining ice, and hence it appears to be "no change."

 

[EMH]

Chaim Henry Tejman M. D. who impresses me as a modern Dr. Albert Einstein believes that trees and plants hold the key to stabilization of the climate. I believe that he is correct.

Earth climate change is 99% about land and tectonic plate movement. If Earth had two polar oceans, as it did during Jurassic, it would have no ice (instead of 9 million cubic miles today) and that produces

1. warming
2. higher ocean levels
3. higher surface air pressure
4. much higher humidity and exponentially more rain
5. more bigger stronger hurricanes


We are observing precisely none of that, because 97% of Earth ice on Antarctica and Greenland is growing, and will continue to grow until it moves more than 600 miles from the pole, as North America did "recently" = in the past few million years...


CO2 does absolutely nothing.

 

[DennisPTate]

The ice core tells you something. It tells you how an ice age grows. It grows one year at a time on the top. Every year Greenland and Antarctica add another layer of ice on top. The ice loss on Antarctica is all from icebergs, but it is still gaining ice 40 million years in ice age. Greenland has ice way south of Arctic Circle that melts during summer, plus icebergs from its west coast. But the truth of "Global Cooling" is still there, the Vikings were farming the southern tip until the 1400, and their farms are buried under 600 layers of ice now.

Thread 'Apparently we really need a "debate" over the term ICE AGE because y'all are all wrong...'

Jun 23, 2023

What is an ICE AGE?

Most apparently still believe it is a terrifying horror movie event where Earth all at once freezes up. The data has never supported such a scenario. Since 2010, there has been a massive effort to re-write Earth climate history into a series of rapid "glaciations" and ice retreats, as if "Day After Tomorrow" movie is accurate... LOL!!! What was North American Ice Age before 2010 is now spun into a series of rapid "ice ages" where it took a mere 75k years for the "ice age" to start in Northern Canada and put 2.5 mile thick glaicers on Chicago. This is "Milankovich"...

• EMH
• Replies: 338
• Forum: Environment

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• 

There are two things pushing ocean levels higher, the burning of fossil fuels, which produces H2O that did not exist before, and every "tonnage displacement" of ocean water by man = cruise ships, cargo ships aircraft carriers, oil rigs, man made islands etc.

Those two cover for the fact that Earth is gaining ice, and hence it appears to be "no change."

I thank you for letting me know that there is still a net gain of H2O being taken up by the Greenland Ice Sheets. The Arctic Ice that is melting causes zero rise in ocean levels due to the fact that it is floating in the Arctic Ocean or North Atlantic or North Pacific. But when the ice on the Land Based Greenland Ice Sheet does eventually begin to crack and slide into the ocean at even more rapid levels then surely we humans will begin to take the predictions about deserts being turned green much more seriously?

Soon the wisdom of what was shown to Isaiah will get more respect.

.. "The wilderness and the solitary place shall be glad for them; and the desert shall rejoice, and blossom as the rose.
It shall blossom abundantly, and rejoice even with joyand singing: the glory of Lebanon shall be given unto it, the
excellency of Carmel and Sharon, they shall see the glory of the LORD, and the excellency of our God.

....
Then shall the lame man leap as an hart, and the tongueof the dumb sing: for in the wilderness shall waters break out,
and streams in the desert.
And the parched ground shall become a pool, and the thirsty land springs of water: in the habitation of dragons,where
each lay, shall be grass with reeds and rushes." (Isaiah 35 : 1, 2, 6, 7 ).

If you happen to know anybody who is involved in the Trump administration there is even an ancient Islamic prediction that could become an important part of the second phases of "The Abraham Accords?"

Book 005, Number 2208:
"Abu Huraira reported Allah's Messenger (way peace be upon him) as saying: The Last Hour will not come before wealth becomes abundant and overflowing, so much so that a man takes Zakat out of his property and cannot find anyone to accept it from him and till the land of Arabia becomes meadows and rivers."
SAHIH MUSLIM, BOOK 25: The Book on General Behaviour (Kitab Al-Adab)

 

[DennisPTate]

Earth climate change is 99% about land and tectonic plate movement. If Earth had two polar oceans, as it did during Jurassic, it would have no ice (instead of 9 million cubic miles today) and that produces

1. warming
2. higher ocean levels
3. higher surface air pressure
4. much higher humidity and exponentially more rain
5. more bigger stronger hurricanes


We are observing precisely none of that, because 97% of Earth ice on Antarctica and Greenland is growing, and will continue to grow until it moves more than 600 miles from the pole, as North America did "recently" = in the past few million years...


CO2 does absolutely nothing.

Atmospheric CO2 seems to be resulting in a significant increase in vegetation as well as foliage on trees over these past thirty years. That is a net positive for the environment.

I am of the belief that atmospheric CO2 is even causing sea weed and vegetation in the oceans to have an over all increase.

 

[EMH]

The Arctic Ice that is melting causes zero rise in ocean levels due to the fact that it is floating in the Arctic Ocean or North Atlantic or North Pacific.

Ellesmere Island with 0.3% of Earth ice is moving away from North Pole and losing ice. As Arctic Ocean grows, it shrinks its sea ice and pushes land with ice further away from North Pole, causing melt. All of that doesn't add up to the net gain each year on Greenland (7% of Earth ice) so while the "acreage" is shrinking, the volume is not.

The tectonic direction of land is a good place to start. NA and Europe are moving away from North Pole, and hence losing ice. But that ice is statistically insignificant compared to AA and Greenland.

But when the ice on the Land Based Greenland Ice Sheet does eventually begin to crack and slide into the ocean at even more rapid levels then surely we humans will begin to take the predictions about deserts being turned green much more seriously?

To start melting, Greenland would have to move away from North Pole, and as of now it appears to still be moving WNW, pushed there by the angle of the fault at center bottom of Atlantic ocean. Greenland is where North America was roughly 40-50 million years ago, which is why NA just came out of ice age...

600 miles to the pole is the threshold - within 600 miles snow/ice ceases to fully melt during summer and starts to stack = continent specific ice age that ends when that land moves fully 600 miles away from the pole

 

[DennisPTate]

Ellesmere Island with 0.3% of Earth ice is moving away from North Pole and losing ice. As Arctic Ocean grows, it shrinks its sea ice and pushes land with ice further away from North Pole, causing melt. All of that doesn't add up to the net gain each year on Greenland (7% of Earth ice) so while the "acreage" is shrinking, the volume is not.

The tectonic direction of land is a good place to start. NA and Europe are moving away from North Pole, and hence losing ice. But that ice is statistically insignificant compared to AA and Greenland.







To start melting, Greenland would have to move away from North Pole, and as of now it appears to still be moving WNW, pushed there by the angle of the fault at center bottom of Atlantic ocean. Greenland is where North America was roughly 40-50 million years ago, which is why NA just came out of ice age...

600 miles to the pole is the threshold - within 600 miles snow/ice ceases to fully melt during summer and starts to stack = continent specific ice age that ends when that land moves fully 600 miles away from the pole

I deeply appreciate such amazingly detailed replies on this topic. Wow!


I thought of a question related to this that you might rather enjoy. I have heard that the magnetic north pole is moving toward Siberia.

Yes, the magnetic north pole is moving, and it has been drifting from Canada toward Siberia. This is a natural phenomenon caused by the movement of molten iron and nickel in the Earth's core, which generates the planet's magnetic field. While the speed of the pole's movement has fluctuated, it is crucial to regularly update navigation systems, like GPS, to account for this shift.

I have ran into a theory that the volume of H2O that has been added to Antarctica over many decades and even centuries, [and frankly even for millennia], may be getting to the place where a wobble may be set in motion in the earth's rotation.

For the life of me I cannot find a link directly to this article even in a rather extensive search so I guess this is probably an excerpt from a book.

Expanded Discussion of The HAB Theory
Gershom Gale gershon1
@netvision.net.il


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Geophysical science offers rather thin explanations for the periods of history during which great glaciers advanced and retreated from the polar regions, leaving a great deal of physical evidence.

The more one delves into the actual evidence, the more skeptical one becomes of the existing theories. The truth, according to the HAB Theory, is that periodically - at intervals ranging from 3,000 to 7000 years but averaging around 5,500 years apart - great global cataclysms have occurred which destroyed virtually all of whatever life forms or civilizations had developed on the Earth to that point.

The cataclysms occur when the Earth is thrown off balance due to a massive, unbalanced accumulation of ice at the polar regions. As these polar ice caps grow, their enormous weight, accumulating unevenly as it does, creates an imbalance, and a wobble begins to develop in the rotation of the Earth on its axis. Year by year, as the ice caps grow, this eccentricity increases until, with devastating suddenness, the polar masses are thrown toward the point of greatest spin, which is the equator. Quite abruptly, the areas which were polar now become equatorial, and vice versa.

The resultant cataclysm is, of course monumental across the entire face of the Earth, except at the two points which become pivotal when the capsizing effect occurs.


An Analogy:

Picture the Earth as a round ball spinning in place on a glass table top. Imagine then, that on the uppermost part of this spinning ball, you drop a tiny glob of molten metal, just slightly off center. The ball immediately begins to wobble...

Add more weight and that wobble becomes more pronounced. Add still more and the eccentricity becomes so great the centrifugal force of the spinning ball grips the weight and turns the entire ball so that the weighted portion is thrown to the imaginary line encircling the ball where the speed is greatest - which is coincident with the imaginary line on Earth known to us as the equator.

That is precisely what happens periodically to the Earth. The buildup of ice at the poles increases until its weight is suddenly thrown some 90 degrees from pole to equator. Yes, the Earth is 26 miles greater in diameter when measured around the equator than when measured around the poles, and one might argue that this bulge provides a stability that would make such a sudden tipping unlikely. But consider: such a variance, considering the size of the planet, is far less than the manufacturing tolerances of an ivory billiard ball.

As the sun evaporates the oceans, the moisture thus released precipitates as rain or snow all over the Earth. But the snows that fall on the polar caps do not melt or flow off at anything like the rate at which they evaporate elsewhere. Snow at the poles piles up and gradually turns into glacial ice. As this process continues, the ice caps increase in size.

At a symposium of the Union of Geodesy and geophysics, Dr. Pyyotor Shoumsky reported that the south polar ice cap was growing at a minimum rate of 293 cubic miles of ice annually. To put that number in perspective, Lake Erie contains only 109 cubic miles of water. Thus, a volume of ice forms on top of the existing ice at Antarctica each year which is almost three times the volume of water in Lake Erie! That's enough= ice to form a layer one mile wide and two miles high from New York to Chicago. And this is the buildup of only one year!

These figures were confirmed by Franz Loewe of France and Malcolm Mellors of Australia. There is no mistake.

The present ice mass is considerably over 5.5 million square miles. If the South Pole were over Chicago, that would make a two-mile thick slab of ice extending from Hudson's Bay to Key West, Florida.

Even this wouldn't be a threat if the ice were perfectly centered over the Earth's axis of spin, but it is not. The wobble was discovered by astronomers in 1885. It amounted to only a fraction over an inch. By the mid 1930s, this had increased to just over six feet. In 1970, the radial movement was close to 80 yards. And right now (197, the wobble is approaching a half-mile in radius.

There is no known means of calculating the point at which rollover will occur, though the summer equinox is the most dangerous time each year. It could conceivably happen with another fraction of an inch of added eccentricity. Or the system may remain more or less stable even if the wobble worsened by another mile or more.

Eventually, though, it'll reach the point of no return and the capsizing effect will occur, with essentially no warning. Overcoming the gyroscopic stabilizing effect of the Earth's equatorial bulge, and in obedience to the laws of centrifugal force, the weight of the ice will be thrown toward the equator. The Earth will continue spinning on it's axis as before, but with some dramatic differences: The ice caps will be riding on the equator, and practically all life - Man included - will have been extinguished.

This is not just a one-time occurrence; it has happened over and over again=! There have been thousands of such rollovers, perhaps even millions, during the 4.5-billion year history of the Earth.

How much time have we got before the next capsizing occurs?

The interval between each occurrence in the past has ranged between 3,000 and 7,000 years. The longest period between tilts was just about 7,000 years, give or take 50. The physical evidence indicates that our present epoch has lasted approximately 7,500 years; we've been living on borrowed time for quite a while." [Gershom Gale, Expanded Discussion of the HAB Theory].

 

[EMH]

I deeply appreciate such amazingly detailed replies on this topic. Wow!


I thought of a question related to this that you might rather enjoy. I have heard that the magnetic north pole is moving toward Siberia.





I have ran into a theory that the volume of H2O that has been added to Antarctica over many decades and even centuries, [and frankly even for millennia], may be getting to the place where a wobble may be set in motion in the earth's rotation.

For the life of me I cannot find a link directly to this article even in a rather extensive search so I guess this is probably an excerpt from a book.

The evidence from the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean floor is that the magnetic field of Earth "flips" every X number of years.

I don't think that will affect climate.


The amount of ice on Antarctica appears to have "hit the brakes" on AA's tectonic movement, ie the weight of AA with that ice is too much for the tectonic force to move, so after breaking off from South Africa 125 million years ago, getting to within 600 miles of South Pole roughly 40 million years ago (the age of AA's current ice age), breaking apart from South America roughly 20 million years ago, AA appears to no longer be moving tectonicallly.

 

[DennisPTate]

The evidence from the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean floor is that the magnetic field of Earth "flips" every X number of years.

I don't think that will affect climate.


The amount of ice on Antarctica appears to have "hit the brakes" on AA's tectonic movement, ie the weight of AA with that ice is too much for the tectonic force to move, so after breaking off from South Africa 125 million years ago, getting to within 600 miles of South Pole roughly 40 million years ago (the age of AA's current ice age), breaking apart from South America roughly 20 million years ago, AA appears to no longer be moving tectonicallly.

That is very interesting to me and somewhat encouraging because my concern was if a wobble in the north and south pole's could set in motion pretty rapid cracking and sliding of ice off the land based Greenland Ice Sheet or on the West Antarctic ice Sheet that is anchored below sea level?

The idea that was given to me over a decade ago was that we should plan for and invest in turning deserts green rapidly. That theory was put out there by New Mexico biologist and bicycling coach Mr. Carl Cantrell.

I personally thought that his theory made much more sense than the Al Gore Carbon Tax theory.

[Carl Cantrell] "So how is our problem of continental drying causing global warming? It all has to do with vegetation and sunlight. When sun light hits a plant, it causes a process which we call photosynthesis where the energy from the sun light creates oxygen for us to breath, water for us to drink, and is stored as sugar for plants and animals to use. When the same sun light hits the soil, all of its energy turns into heat and is radiated back into the atmosphere, carried away by running surface water such as rain fall, is carried away to other areas by our winds, and diffuses down into the soil towards the earth's crust. All of this warms our planet increasing its average temperature.

Therefore, the less vegetation you have on the planet, the more sunlight is being turned into heat and the warmer the planet becomes. This is very critical because warmer and dryer winds dry out other land areas faster decreasing the vegetation on those land areas. Less humidity in the air also reflects less sun light back out into space so that more sun light strikes the earth and more heat is generated.

The truth is that you can do more to decrease global warming by just reducing the average temperature for the Sahara Desert by one or two degrees than if we humans completely quit using fossil fuels and returned to the cave.

So, how would you start working to resolve this problem? Easy, cool the deserts and get some vegetation growing on them as soon as possible. But the method is much more complex than that. You have to use the prevailing trade winds in relation to the deserts to get the best results as quickly as possible and it will be extremely expensive.

Then we build desalination plants along the coast near these water sheds and pipe water to the tops or ridges of the water sheds

This will do a number of things. First, it will increase the moisture in the desert soil so that it will develop water tables and water will begin to run in the streams. This water will increase the amount of vegetation in the area and decrease the amount of heat being generated by sun light cooling the watered area and all areas down wind of the watered area. As more available water evaporates, it will cool the air and reflect more sun light back out into space cooling the area even more. Cooler and more humid air will have less of a heating effect on areas down wind and will reflect more sun light back into space in those areas cooling areas we won't be watering yet. Cooler and more humid air will also have less of a warming effect on our seas and oceans.

Rain water running off of cooler soil will decrease the heating effect on our oceans and our planet crusts which will decrease catastrophic storm activities for other areas and seismic activity for the entire planet. Also, returning more ocean water to the surface and aquifers of our continents will lower the sea levels providing more usable land for us to farm and build on.

With cooler desert areas and increasing vegetation, less water will evaporate from our deserts increasing the amount of surface water even more and increasing the amount of vegetation and animal life by huge amounts because deserts currently take up more than 20% of our land surface. Populations will be able to spread out and there will be less competition for existing land areas.

This strategy has to be done in steps with the first step being to begin slowing the rate at which our global warming is increasing. We need to focus on that until we have brought it to a point to where the temperature is not increasing any more and is reasonably stable. While we are doing this, we need to come to a global consensus of just how cool we want to cool our planet down to. If we cool it down too much, we will begin to have devastatingly harsh winters in large populated areas and even cause an ice age to set in.

Then we begin cooling the planet down to a point which will be most beneficial for all countries or the planet as a whole. We need to gradually bring the temperature down because there may be a lag effect in which the planet will continue cooling after we stop increasing our efforts to cool it off more. We may even want to stop cooling the planet once or twice before we reach our targeted temperatures to see if there is a lag effect


We need to start working on this as soon as possible because, if the planet reaches a point to where it is warming faster than our technology can possibly stop or reverse this warming trend, then our planet is lost and all life will cease to exist on this planet within a relatively short period of time. We will need to start with the largest and hottest deserts because cooling them will have the greatest benefit in the least time. (Global Warming II by biologist Carl Cantrell).

 

[EMH]

sliding of ice off the land based Greenland Ice Sheet of on the West Antarctic ice Sheet that is anchored below sea level?

"Day After Tomorrow" is actually not factual. Antarctica is mostly underwater now...

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[DennisPTate]

"Day After Tomorrow" is actually not factual. Antarctica is mostly underwater now...

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Could you please explain further? I am certain that I do not know what you mean by that?

 

[Sunsettommy]

Nice to see you here Dennis!

 

[DennisPTate]

Nice to see you here Dennis!

Thank you! I am truly enjoying the exceptionally positive and calm atmosphere here!

 

[EMH]

Could you please explain further? I am certain that I do not know what you mean by that?

Ice age glacier digs. If you took Antarctica's ice off it today, that image is what would be underwater. Most of the ice extends below sea level, and hence is never at risk of "sliding off" like the movie "Day After Tomorrow."

 

[DennisPTate]

Ice age glacier digs. If you took Antarctica's ice off it today, that image is what would be underwater. Most of the ice extends below sea level, and hence is never at risk of "sliding off" like the movie "Day After Tomorrow."

I admit that it is true that the West Antarctic Ice Sheet is anchored below sea level but I did not know that a high percentage of other areas of Antarctica are in a similar situation.

Or am I misunderstanding?

 

[BackAgain]

It rained so hard the day I left,
the weather it was dry.
The Sun so hot, I froze to death ….
​

These could be the lyrics of the theme song describing the AGW canard.

​