India’s Promising Israel Defense Ties

[Vikrant]

I am glad to see India - Israel relations are back on track.

---

However, the CBI investigation was closed in December 2013, with the admission that there was no evidence against the accused, including the former defense minister, former Samata Party president Jaya Jaitly, a former navy chief, and others. This outcome has breathed new life into India-Israel defense ties, which are now an important pillar of overall bilateral ties. Criticisms notwithstanding, the two countries are working to enhance their defense cooperation, much of which involves boosting the arms trade (worth an estimated $10 billion over the last decade) and moving ahead with joint projects. The framework for the Barak missile deal was laid down by the previous Congress-led United Progressive Alliance government, although it fell short of giving the final nod to the acquisition. Last year ended on a positive note as the then government approved the procurement of up to 15 Heron Unmanned Aerial Vehicles (UAVs) from Israel, which will likely bolster the reconnaissance and surveillance capabilities of Indian armed forces along the borders with Pakistan and China.

India s Promising Israel Defense Ties The Diplomat

 

[Saigon]

An alliance between Israel and India makes sense, given India's current concerns over the Kashmir, but there is also an irony in seeing one pariah nation embrace another country that seems destined for pariah status.

Until India deals with its staggering corruption - and really, where else would a Prime Minister stand accused of organising ethnic riots and still maintain power - its simply staggering problems with rape, poverty and environmental degradation, how many countries will want to be be its best friend in the playground?

 

[irosie91]

Lots of places have leaders who organize political movements
that sometimes lead to a bit of civil unrest------and the leaders
stay in power. Indian nationalism is a political movement
in India

 

[Saigon]

Rosie -

I do not think prime ministers instigate riots that cost 2,000 lives in "lots of places".

The 2002 Gujarat riots, also known as 2002 Gujarat violence and the Gujarat pogrom,[1][2] was a three-day period of inter-communal violence in the western Indian state of Gujarat. Following the initial incident there were further outbreaks of violence in Ahmedabad for three weeks; statewide, there were further outbreaks of mass killings against the minority Muslim population for three months.[1][3] The burning of a train in Godhra on 27 February 2002, which caused the deaths of 58 Hindu pilgrims and religious workers returning from Ayodhya, is believed to have triggered the violence.[4][5] Some commentators, however, hold the view that the attacks had been pre-planned, were well orchestrated, and that the attack on the train was a "staged trigger" for what was actually premeditated violence
According to official figures, the riots resulted in the deaths of 790 Muslims and 254 Hindus; 2,500 people were injured non-fatally, and 223 more were reported missing.[8] Other sources estimate that up to 2,000 Muslims died.

2002 Gujarat riots - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

 

[irosie91]

Rosie -

I do not think prime ministers instigate riots that cost 2,000 lives in "lots of places".

The 2002 Gujarat riots, also known as 2002 Gujarat violence and the Gujarat pogrom,[1][2] was a three-day period of inter-communal violence in the western Indian state of Gujarat. Following the initial incident there were further outbreaks of violence in Ahmedabad for three weeks; statewide, there were further outbreaks of mass killings against the minority Muslim population for three months.[1][3] The burning of a train in Godhra on 27 February 2002, which caused the deaths of 58 Hindu pilgrims and religious workers returning from Ayodhya, is believed to have triggered the violence.[4][5] Some commentators, however, hold the view that the attacks had been pre-planned, were well orchestrated, and that the attack on the train was a "staged trigger" for what was actually premeditated violence
According to official figures, the riots resulted in the deaths of 790 Muslims and 254 Hindus; 2,500 people were injured non-fatally, and 223 more were reported missing.[8] Other sources estimate that up to 2,000 Muslims died.

2002 Gujarat riots - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

of course----I remember----after the muslims had murdered hindus by burning a train car------they decided it really did not happen-------kinda like the claims made about the world trade center 9-11-01------"DA JOOOS DONE IT" and somehow there have been MORE Islamic terrorist attacks in Gujurat since-----what a coincidence------gee---a nail bomb
for Divali

 

[Saigon]

Rosie -

Perhaps read a little more about the riots, particularly the evidence that they had been planned in advance by Hindu nationalists - including the current Prime Minister.

 

[Vikrant]

An alliance between Israel and India makes sense, given India's current concerns over the Kashmir, but there is also an irony in seeing one pariah nation embrace another country that seems destined for pariah status.

Until India deals with its staggering corruption - and really, where else would a Prime Minister stand accused of organising ethnic riots and still maintain power - its simply staggering problems with rape, poverty and environmental degradation, how many countries will want to be be its best friend in the playground?

You are not particularly a bright guy. Let me give it to you straight or else you might miss it being as inept as you are.

The President of the U.S. invited Indian P.M. when he was visiting U.S. on official UN business. All major U.S. officials met Indian PM when he was in the US. Not only that, quite a few CEOs of major US corporations met Indian PM for possible business deals. I have lost track of how many times Japanese Prime Minister visited India. David Cameron has made several trips to India just in last couple of years. Australian Prime Minister just visited India on a high profile visit. Canadian business delegates are visiting India as we speak. Indian company Antrix won the contract to launch Canadian satellites. Chinese president just visited India not even few weeks ago. Multi-billion-dollar deals were signed between India and China during Xi's visit. Israeli PM just visited India. Putin is due to visit India soon. Indian PM has pending invitation to visit UK. He will be the guest of honor during his stay in UK for the inauguration of Mahatma Gandhi's statue in front of UK's parliament.

Given these facts, only a pariah idiot with no access to credible news source will tag India as pariah.

 

[Vikrant]

Lots of places have leaders who organize political movements
that sometimes lead to a bit of civil unrest------and the leaders
stay in power. Indian nationalism is a political movement
in India

iRosie,

Modi had nothing to do with the Gujrat incident. Riots break out in every country and continent including Europe. Modi was cleared by supreme court of India. That is all that matters. Low IQ people like Saigon can whine all they want. Funny thing is this guy is talking about corruption in India while ignoring the fact that he fails from a country which does not even have a credible news source or else he would have know that Indian PM Modi held a string of high level visits with a number of heads of states just in past couple of months. These heads of states were from major countries such as U.S., Japan, Australia, Brazil, China, South Africa, etc.

 

[Saigon]

Modi had nothing to do with the Gujrat incident.

Many scholars and commentators have accused the state government of being complicit in the attacks, either in failing to exert any effort to quell the violence or for actively planning and executing the attacks themselves. The United States Department of State ultimately banned Narendra Modi from traveling to the United States due to his alleged role in the attacks.[citation needed]. These allegations center around several facts. First, the state did little to quell the violence, with attacks continuing well through the Spring. Further, some attackers used voter lists and other documents obtainable only with government assistance in order to target Muslim communities and households. Moreover, the Vishva Hindu Parishad (VHP), as well as many politicians, including Modi, made inflammatory remarks and endorsed strikes, further stoking tensions. Gyanendra Pandey described these attacks as state terrorism, and that they were not riots but "organized political massacres".[19] According to Paul Brass the only conclusion from the evidence which is available points to a methodical Anti-Muslim pogrom which was carried out with exceptional brutality and was highly coordinated.
2002 Gujarat riots - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

 

[Coyote]

Rosie -

I do not think prime ministers instigate riots that cost 2,000 lives in "lots of places".

The 2002 Gujarat riots, also known as 2002 Gujarat violence and the Gujarat pogrom,[1][2] was a three-day period of inter-communal violence in the western Indian state of Gujarat. Following the initial incident there were further outbreaks of violence in Ahmedabad for three weeks; statewide, there were further outbreaks of mass killings against the minority Muslim population for three months.[1][3] The burning of a train in Godhra on 27 February 2002, which caused the deaths of 58 Hindu pilgrims and religious workers returning from Ayodhya, is believed to have triggered the violence.[4][5] Some commentators, however, hold the view that the attacks had been pre-planned, were well orchestrated, and that the attack on the train was a "staged trigger" for what was actually premeditated violence
According to official figures, the riots resulted in the deaths of 790 Muslims and 254 Hindus; 2,500 people were injured non-fatally, and 223 more were reported missing.[8] Other sources estimate that up to 2,000 Muslims died.

2002 Gujarat riots - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

of course----I remember----after the muslims had murdered hindus by burning a train car------they decided it really did not happen-------kinda like the claims made about the world trade center 9-11-01------"DA JOOOS DONE IT" and somehow there have been MORE Islamic terrorist attacks in Gujurat since-----what a coincidence------gee---a nail bomb
for Divali

A government investigation proved the train car fire was accidental and had nothing to do with Muslims.

Kinda like the WTC...Conspiracy Theory.

 

[Vikrant]

Rosie -

I do not think prime ministers instigate riots that cost 2,000 lives in "lots of places".

The 2002 Gujarat riots, also known as 2002 Gujarat violence and the Gujarat pogrom,[1][2] was a three-day period of inter-communal violence in the western Indian state of Gujarat. Following the initial incident there were further outbreaks of violence in Ahmedabad for three weeks; statewide, there were further outbreaks of mass killings against the minority Muslim population for three months.[1][3] The burning of a train in Godhra on 27 February 2002, which caused the deaths of 58 Hindu pilgrims and religious workers returning from Ayodhya, is believed to have triggered the violence.[4][5] Some commentators, however, hold the view that the attacks had been pre-planned, were well orchestrated, and that the attack on the train was a "staged trigger" for what was actually premeditated violence
According to official figures, the riots resulted in the deaths of 790 Muslims and 254 Hindus; 2,500 people were injured non-fatally, and 223 more were reported missing.[8] Other sources estimate that up to 2,000 Muslims died.

2002 Gujarat riots - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

of course----I remember----after the muslims had murdered hindus by burning a train car------they decided it really did not happen-------kinda like the claims made about the world trade center 9-11-01------"DA JOOOS DONE IT" and somehow there have been MORE Islamic terrorist attacks in Gujurat since-----what a coincidence------gee---a nail bomb
for Divali

A government investigation proved the train car fire was accidental and had nothing to do with Muslims.

Kinda like the WTC...Conspiracy Theory.

As a moderator, you should not engage in blatant lies. This reflects poorly on the message board.

 

[Vikrant]

Modi had nothing to do with the Gujrat incident.

Many scholars and commentators have accused the state government of being complicit in the attacks, either in failing to exert any effort to quell the violence or for actively planning and executing the attacks themselves. The United States Department of State ultimately banned Narendra Modi from traveling to the United States due to his alleged role in the attacks.[citation needed]. These allegations center around several facts. First, the state did little to quell the violence, with attacks continuing well through the Spring. Further, some attackers used voter lists and other documents obtainable only with government assistance in order to target Muslim communities and households. Moreover, the Vishva Hindu Parishad (VHP), as well as many politicians, including Modi, made inflammatory remarks and endorsed strikes, further stoking tensions. Gyanendra Pandey described these attacks as state terrorism, and that they were not riots but "organized political massacres".[19] According to Paul Brass the only conclusion from the evidence which is available points to a methodical Anti-Muslim pogrom which was carried out with exceptional brutality and was highly coordinated.
2002 Gujarat riots - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

I as a scholar say that you need to lay off the internet.

 

[Coyote]

Rosie -

I do not think prime ministers instigate riots that cost 2,000 lives in "lots of places".

The 2002 Gujarat riots, also known as 2002 Gujarat violence and the Gujarat pogrom,[1][2] was a three-day period of inter-communal violence in the western Indian state of Gujarat. Following the initial incident there were further outbreaks of violence in Ahmedabad for three weeks; statewide, there were further outbreaks of mass killings against the minority Muslim population for three months.[1][3] The burning of a train in Godhra on 27 February 2002, which caused the deaths of 58 Hindu pilgrims and religious workers returning from Ayodhya, is believed to have triggered the violence.[4][5] Some commentators, however, hold the view that the attacks had been pre-planned, were well orchestrated, and that the attack on the train was a "staged trigger" for what was actually premeditated violence
According to official figures, the riots resulted in the deaths of 790 Muslims and 254 Hindus; 2,500 people were injured non-fatally, and 223 more were reported missing.[8] Other sources estimate that up to 2,000 Muslims died.

2002 Gujarat riots - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

of course----I remember----after the muslims had murdered hindus by burning a train car------they decided it really did not happen-------kinda like the claims made about the world trade center 9-11-01------"DA JOOOS DONE IT" and somehow there have been MORE Islamic terrorist attacks in Gujurat since-----what a coincidence------gee---a nail bomb
for Divali

A government investigation proved the train car fire was accidental and had nothing to do with Muslims.

Kinda like the WTC...Conspiracy Theory.

As a moderator, you should not engage in blatant lies. This reflects poorly on the message board.

2002 Gujarat riots - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

The union government lead by Congress party in 2005 also set up a committee to probe the incident, headed up by retired Supreme Court judge Umesh Chandra Banerjee. The committee concluded that the fire had begun inside the train and was most likely accidental.[34] However, the Gujarat High Court ruled in 2006 that the matter was outside the jurisdiction of the union government, and that the committee was therefore unconstitutional.[35]

In February 2011, the trial court convicted 31 people and acquitted 63 others based on the murder and conspiracy provisions of the Indian Penal Code, saying the incident was a "pre-planned conspiracy".[36] [37] The death penalty was awarded to 11 convicts; twenty others were sentenced to life imprisonment.[38][39] Maulvi Umarji, presented by the Nanavati-Shah commission as the prime conspirator, was acquitted along with 62 others accused for lack of evidence.[40][41]

The Concerned Citizens Tribunal(CCT), headed by Teesta Setalvad concluded that the fire had been an accident, stating that the attack by a mob was part of a government conspiracy to trigger riots across the state.[42][43] Several other independent commentators have also concluded that the fire itself was almost certainly an accident, saying that the initial cause of the conflagration has never been conclusively determined.[44][45] Historian Ainslie Thomas Embree stated that the official version of the attack on the train, that it was organized, carried out by people under orders from Pakistan, was entirely baseless.[46]

I post as a member. If you have problems with that Vikrant - address the arguments.

 

[irosie91]

ROFLMAO ----WIKKI

 

[Vikrant]

Rosie -

I do not think prime ministers instigate riots that cost 2,000 lives in "lots of places".

The 2002 Gujarat riots, also known as 2002 Gujarat violence and the Gujarat pogrom,[1][2] was a three-day period of inter-communal violence in the western Indian state of Gujarat. Following the initial incident there were further outbreaks of violence in Ahmedabad for three weeks; statewide, there were further outbreaks of mass killings against the minority Muslim population for three months.[1][3] The burning of a train in Godhra on 27 February 2002, which caused the deaths of 58 Hindu pilgrims and religious workers returning from Ayodhya, is believed to have triggered the violence.[4][5] Some commentators, however, hold the view that the attacks had been pre-planned, were well orchestrated, and that the attack on the train was a "staged trigger" for what was actually premeditated violence
According to official figures, the riots resulted in the deaths of 790 Muslims and 254 Hindus; 2,500 people were injured non-fatally, and 223 more were reported missing.[8] Other sources estimate that up to 2,000 Muslims died.

2002 Gujarat riots - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

of course----I remember----after the muslims had murdered hindus by burning a train car------they decided it really did not happen-------kinda like the claims made about the world trade center 9-11-01------"DA JOOOS DONE IT" and somehow there have been MORE Islamic terrorist attacks in Gujurat since-----what a coincidence------gee---a nail bomb
for Divali

A government investigation proved the train car fire was accidental and had nothing to do with Muslims.

Kinda like the WTC...Conspiracy Theory.

As a moderator, you should not engage in blatant lies. This reflects poorly on the message board.

2002 Gujarat riots - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

The union government lead by Congress party in 2005 also set up a committee to probe the incident, headed up by retired Supreme Court judge Umesh Chandra Banerjee. The committee concluded that the fire had begun inside the train and was most likely accidental.[34] However, the Gujarat High Court ruled in 2006 that the matter was outside the jurisdiction of the union government, and that the committee was therefore unconstitutional.[35]

In February 2011, the trial court convicted 31 people and acquitted 63 others based on the murder and conspiracy provisions of the Indian Penal Code, saying the incident was a "pre-planned conspiracy".[36] [37] The death penalty was awarded to 11 convicts; twenty others were sentenced to life imprisonment.[38][39] Maulvi Umarji, presented by the Nanavati-Shah commission as the prime conspirator, was acquitted along with 62 others accused for lack of evidence.[40][41]

The Concerned Citizens Tribunal(CCT), headed by Teesta Setalvad concluded that the fire had been an accident, stating that the attack by a mob was part of a government conspiracy to trigger riots across the state.[42][43] Several other independent commentators have also concluded that the fire itself was almost certainly an accident, saying that the initial cause of the conflagration has never been conclusively determined.[44][45] Historian Ainslie Thomas Embree stated that the official version of the attack on the train, that it was organized, carried out by people under orders from Pakistan, was entirely baseless.[46]

I post as a member. If you have problems with that Vikrant - address the arguments.

You have no argument. All you have is hatred of Hindus.

 

[Saigon]

Vikrant -

Pointing out that your Prime Minister was implicated in inciting racial violence does not imply hatred ofvHindi, India or the Indian people.

And shame on you for pretending it does.

 

[Coyote]

Rosie -

I do not think prime ministers instigate riots that cost 2,000 lives in "lots of places".

The 2002 Gujarat riots, also known as 2002 Gujarat violence and the Gujarat pogrom,[1][2] was a three-day period of inter-communal violence in the western Indian state of Gujarat. Following the initial incident there were further outbreaks of violence in Ahmedabad for three weeks; statewide, there were further outbreaks of mass killings against the minority Muslim population for three months.[1][3] The burning of a train in Godhra on 27 February 2002, which caused the deaths of 58 Hindu pilgrims and religious workers returning from Ayodhya, is believed to have triggered the violence.[4][5] Some commentators, however, hold the view that the attacks had been pre-planned, were well orchestrated, and that the attack on the train was a "staged trigger" for what was actually premeditated violence
According to official figures, the riots resulted in the deaths of 790 Muslims and 254 Hindus; 2,500 people were injured non-fatally, and 223 more were reported missing.[8] Other sources estimate that up to 2,000 Muslims died.

2002 Gujarat riots - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

of course----I remember----after the muslims had murdered hindus by burning a train car------they decided it really did not happen-------kinda like the claims made about the world trade center 9-11-01------"DA JOOOS DONE IT" and somehow there have been MORE Islamic terrorist attacks in Gujurat since-----what a coincidence------gee---a nail bomb
for Divali

A government investigation proved the train car fire was accidental and had nothing to do with Muslims.

Kinda like the WTC...Conspiracy Theory.

As a moderator, you should not engage in blatant lies. This reflects poorly on the message board.

2002 Gujarat riots - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

The union government lead by Congress party in 2005 also set up a committee to probe the incident, headed up by retired Supreme Court judge Umesh Chandra Banerjee. The committee concluded that the fire had begun inside the train and was most likely accidental.[34] However, the Gujarat High Court ruled in 2006 that the matter was outside the jurisdiction of the union government, and that the committee was therefore unconstitutional.[35]

In February 2011, the trial court convicted 31 people and acquitted 63 others based on the murder and conspiracy provisions of the Indian Penal Code, saying the incident was a "pre-planned conspiracy".[36] [37] The death penalty was awarded to 11 convicts; twenty others were sentenced to life imprisonment.[38][39] Maulvi Umarji, presented by the Nanavati-Shah commission as the prime conspirator, was acquitted along with 62 others accused for lack of evidence.[40][41]

The Concerned Citizens Tribunal(CCT), headed by Teesta Setalvad concluded that the fire had been an accident, stating that the attack by a mob was part of a government conspiracy to trigger riots across the state.[42][43] Several other independent commentators have also concluded that the fire itself was almost certainly an accident, saying that the initial cause of the conflagration has never been conclusively determined.[44][45] Historian Ainslie Thomas Embree stated that the official version of the attack on the train, that it was organized, carried out by people under orders from Pakistan, was entirely baseless.[46]

I post as a member. If you have problems with that Vikrant - address the arguments.

You have no argument. All you have is hatred of Hindus.

I have no hatred of Hindus. Being honest about religious intolerance and violence doesn't equal hatred. MOST Hindus are not extremists, just like MOST Muslims, Christians, and Jews aren't. But if you are going to make arguments about other religions and their violent extremism, then you need to be honest face the facts about each one.

A recent Pew Poll found religious hostilities around the world reached a 6-year high: Religious Hostilities Reach Six-Year High Pew Research Center s Religion Public Life Project - a very interesting and disturbing read that ended in 2012, before the current crisis brought on by ISIS in Syria and Iraq that have largely eclipsed what's going on elsewhere in the world.

You'll note in 2012, India is #3 in terms of social hostilities involving religion. Not surprisingly we have Pakistan at #1. This is not "hating Hindus" - this is being honest about the role of religion in India's societies and the level of religious tolerance. We all pretty familiar with what is going on in Muslim countries, because it's upfront in the news 24/7. But we like to ignore it elsewhere.

 

[Dogmaphobe]

As a moderator, you should not engage in blatant lies. This reflects poorly on the message board.

In another thread attempting to discuss various Islamists in India calling for the murder of innocent non-Muslims, all she contributed is some anti-Hindu crap she managed dredge up. She did not say one damn thing against the Islamists, yet lied through her teeth afterwards about what she had actually done.

I agree that this underhandedness and deceit reflects poorly on the site. There is such an obvious agenda at work here that anybody should be able to see it quite easily.

 

[irosie91]

As a moderator, you should not engage in blatant lies. This reflects poorly on the message board.

In another thread attempting to discuss various Islamists in India calling for the murder of innocent non-Muslims, all she contributed is some anti-Hindu crap she managed dredge up. She did not say one damn thing against the Islamists, yet lied through her teeth afterwards about what she had actually done.

I agree that this underhandedness and deceit reflects poorly on the site. There is such an obvious agenda at work here that anybody should be able to see it quite easily.

Long long ago---when I was a child----I read the islamo Nazi propaganda----it was ALL OVER TOWN----I lived in what had been---and to some extent still was----a Nazi enclave in the USA. The filth that coyote preaches Is not different from the filth I read back then------DENIAL she licks the shit of muslim filth the same way Nazis in the USA licked the filth of her hero Adolf Hitler Way back then I did not know that muslim slobs WORSHIP HITLER----I learned that fact from muslims later on in life------I was 19 years old when I encountered the filth that coyote preaches and 20 when I experienced her stink in a mosque-----in MANHATTAN, NEW YORK-----blocks from the site where the WTC would later be built and her heroes would MURDER FOR HER BELOVED LUMP OF SHIT IN THE SKY-------allah'

for the record----I am very far from 19 years old now

 

[Dogmaphobe]

Long long ago---when I was a child----I read the islamo Nazi propaganda----it was ALL OVER TOWN----I lived in what had been---and to some extent still was----a Nazi enclave in the USA. The filth that coyote preaches Is not different from the filth I read back then------DENIAL she licks the shit of muslim filth the same way Nazis in the USA licked the filth of her hero Adolf Hitler Way back then I did not know that muslim slobs WORSHIP HITLER----I learned that fact from muslims later on in life------I was 19 years old when I encountered the filth that coyote preaches and 20 when I experienced her stink in a mosque-----in MANHATTAN, NEW YORK-----blocks from the site where the WTC would later be built and her heroes would MURDER FOR HER BELOVED LUMP OF SHIT IN THE SKY-------allah'

for the record----I am very far from 19 years old now

Well, I don't think Coyote is an actual Nazi, because Nazis are much more direct. Coyote is really more insidious about it in that any time a thread talks about Islamism, she just starts attacking the same targets as the Islamists. It may be Jews in one thread, Christians in another or Hindus like we see here. She simply cannot control herself as it is her mission to attack any and all who resist Islamism, and the form it takes with her is the immediate alignment with the Islamists by attacking the same targets followed by the immediate denial that this is what she has done. It is a very familiar agitprop technique, and quite deliberate IMO. She perceives herself as a warrior for a cause, and it is all conducted in a very underhanded fashion. She always provides just enough plausible deniability to fool people who don't really pay attention and she makes many claims in a general sense that she always undermines when it comes to the specific, but there is a very clear pattern to it.

Now, the Nazis certainly influenced Islamists (Matthias Kuntzel has written extensively on this issue), and the strains of hatred from the Nazis are certainly filtered through an Islamic perspective, but Coyote is something else entirely. She is trying to play the game of good cop to, say, ISIS bad cop, much like the Muslim Brotherhood has tried to re-brand itself as a kinder, gentler fascism, but the agenda shared is the same. It's only the methods employed that are different.