In regard of holding Israel by double standards

[Challenger]

...So if I turned up in an IFV and all you had was a 1776 vintage musket, you'd "bravely" stand and fight to the death? (dying only once) with your friends or would you take the more sensible course and run away to save your life and the lives of your wives and children?...

But that is not what happened. Are you serious going to try to tell us that the Arabs were outnumbered and out-gunned by the Jews in 1948 during the War of Independence, once the Brits had left? Really? You can always try.

...Remember, "where there's life, there's hope". and you can always press the "re-set" button.

Yep... but it's a matter of where you are when you press that 'Reset' button... and Rump Palestine is not that "where".

See posts #169 and #170. The old worn out lie of "poor defenceless Zionist colonists being miraculously saved from the evil Arabs in 1948" has been long debunked. Even Zionist historians have been forced to re-write history to take into account all the information released in the 1980's. It's one reason much of the 1967 archive has been witheld from the public, on "security" grounds. The Arab armies had little chance in 1948 and the Palestinians none at all, against the Zionist steamroller.

All I see here are your opinions on the subject, Challenger. The Arabs got their asses kicked because - even though they outnumbered the Jews and even though they outgunned the Jews - they could not organize as well as the Jews and they could not strategize or perform on the tactical level as well as the Jews and because the Jews were better imaginers and visioners and improvisers, and because the Arabs were not facing an enemy sworn to drive them into the Mediterranean and because the Arabs had some else to go and to fall back on, if they lost. The Jews did not. That made them ten times tougher than their Arab adversaries, and the Arabs didn't understand that until it was too late.

The truth of the matter is that your beloved Arabs got their asses kicked - time and again - and all the excuse-making in the world can't cover that up, nor mask the stench of cowardice, even at a distance of several thousand miles and more than six decades.

Sorry.

If I gave you titles of books on the subject, would you bother reading them?

 

[Kondor3]

...If I gave you titles of books on the subject, would you bother reading them?

I've done my own fair share of reading on the subject, years ago, and that knowledge continues to hold-up under a vigorous scrutiny.

 

[fanger]

...So if I turned up in an IFV and all you had was a 1776 vintage musket, you'd "bravely" stand and fight to the death? (dying only once) with your friends or would you take the more sensible course and run away to save your life and the lives of your wives and children?...

But that is not what happened. Are you serious going to try to tell us that the Arabs were outnumbered and out-gunned by the Jews in 1948 during the War of Independence, once the Brits had left? Really? You can always try.

...Remember, "where there's life, there's hope". and you can always press the "re-set" button.

Yep... but it's a matter of where you are when you press that 'Reset' button... and Rump Palestine is not that "where".

"On nearly every front and in nearly every battle, the Jewish side had the advantage over the Arabs in terms of planning, organization, operation of equipment and also in the number of trained soldiers who participated in the battle,"

We? Just being rhetorical, but I have several friends of all shapes, sizes and beliefs.

So if I turned up in an IFV and all you had was a 1776 vintage musket, you'd "bravely" stand and fight to the death? (dying only once) with your friends or would you take the more sensible course and run away to save your life and the lives of your wives and children? Remember, "where there's life, there's hope". and you can always press the "re-set" button.

What a fantasist you are the Palestinians have modern semi automatics, just that they are cowards when they have to face an armed man one on one

The F16s kill the Palestinians before they can face the Jews man to man.

Even you have stated that the Palestinians will not rise up and take on Israel until they have the right numbers to do so. The IDF went in last year and the hamas cowards ran and hid behind women and children. Same thing with cast lead when they kicked the women and children out of the tunnels to be human shields

The usual Zionist propaganda spewed by Phoeny without any backup.

Fact:

"Israel-Gaza conflict: The myth of Hamas’s human shields

Israel-Gaza conflict The myth of Hamas s human shields - Middle East - World - The Independent

Want to explain these, and there are many thousand such images

Raphael Shore is a Canadian-Israeli film writer, producer, and rabbi. He is the founder of The Clarion Fund who present these photos

 

[Phoenall]

...So if I turned up in an IFV and all you had was a 1776 vintage musket, you'd "bravely" stand and fight to the death? (dying only once) with your friends or would you take the more sensible course and run away to save your life and the lives of your wives and children?...

But that is not what happened. Are you serious going to try to tell us that the Arabs were outnumbered and out-gunned by the Jews in 1948 during the War of Independence, once the Brits had left? Really? You can always try.

...Remember, "where there's life, there's hope". and you can always press the "re-set" button.

Yep... but it's a matter of where you are when you press that 'Reset' button... and Rump Palestine is not that "where".

See posts #169 and #170. The old worn out lie of "poor defenceless Zionist colonists being miraculously saved from the evil Arabs in 1948" has been long debunked. Even Zionist historians have been forced to re-write history to take into account all the information released in the 1980's. It's one reason much of the 1967 archive has been witheld from the public, on "security" grounds. The Arab armies had little chance in 1948 and the Palestinians none at all, against the Zionist steamroller.

All I see here are your opinions on the subject, Challenger. The Arabs got their asses kicked because - even though they outnumbered the Jews and even though they outgunned the Jews - they could not organize as well as the Jews and they could not strategize or perform on the tactical level as well as the Jews and because the Jews were better imaginers and visioners and improvisers, and because the Arabs were not facing an enemy sworn to drive them into the Mediterranean and because the Arabs had some else to go and to fall back on, if they lost. The Jews did not. That made them ten times tougher than their Arab adversaries, and the Arabs didn't understand that until it was too late.

The truth of the matter is that your beloved Arabs got their asses kicked - time and again - and all the excuse-making in the world can't cover that up, nor mask the stench of cowardice, even at a distance of several thousand miles and more than six decades.

Sorry.

If I gave you titles of books on the subject, would you bother reading them?

NO as they are not valid sources unless you include the words in a link. Giving titles means nothing as you know the majority wont

 

[Phoenall]

But that is not what happened. Are you serious going to try to tell us that the Arabs were outnumbered and out-gunned by the Jews in 1948 during the War of Independence, once the Brits had left? Really? You can always try.

Yep... but it's a matter of where you are when you press that 'Reset' button... and Rump Palestine is not that "where".

"On nearly every front and in nearly every battle, the Jewish side had the advantage over the Arabs in terms of planning, organization, operation of equipment and also in the number of trained soldiers who participated in the battle,"

What a fantasist you are the Palestinians have modern semi automatics, just that they are cowards when they have to face an armed man one on one

The F16s kill the Palestinians before they can face the Jews man to man.

Even you have stated that the Palestinians will not rise up and take on Israel until they have the right numbers to do so. The IDF went in last year and the hamas cowards ran and hid behind women and children. Same thing with cast lead when they kicked the women and children out of the tunnels to be human shields

The usual Zionist propaganda spewed by Phoeny without any backup.

Fact:

"Israel-Gaza conflict: The myth of Hamas’s human shields

Israel-Gaza conflict The myth of Hamas s human shields - Middle East - World - The Independent

Want to explain these, and there are many thousand such images

Raphael Shore is a Canadian-Israeli film writer, producer, and rabbi. He is the founder of The Clarion Fund who present these photos

And the reality shown destroys the claim that hamas does not employ human shields. You do know that these pictures come from many sources and that I posted them as evidence. Every one shows Palestinians acting as willing human shields, making them militia

 

[montelatici]

The only photos you posted are doctored photos from Hasbara sites. How about some facts from Western news organizations:




"Jerusalem Fund Director: Claim that Hamas Uses Human Shields Is a Racist Myth"

Read more at: Jerusalem Fund Director Claim that Hamas Uses Human Shields Is a Racist Myth National Review Online



Israel-Gaza conflict: The myth of Hamas’s human shields

Israel-Gaza conflict The myth of Hamas s human shields - Middle East - World - The Independent

"Israel-Gaza conflict: Myth of Hamas’s human shield. Gazans deny being put in line of fire"

Israel-Gaza conflict Myth of Hamas s human shield. Gazans deny being put in line of fire - BelfastTelegraph.co.uk

 

[montelatici]

Great piece on the Daily Kos, here is part of it:



During war the prefered spin given is the “human shield” one. This is great propaganda because it does two things at once. It excuses the criminal behavior of the perpetrator while at the same time demonizing the enemy. The spin that “we were receiving fire from that area,” is OK, but not as good. Then there is the more general spin that “we are sorry for civilian all deaths, but they are unavoidable in wars” or the similar “We do all we can do avoid all civilian deaths, but it’s impossible in war.”

The killers of civilians will further spin the crimes by claiming that the alleged “human shields” users are the only ones responsible. They may even threaten to bring up charges to the UN against the “human shield” abusers. Of course there is never a follow through on that propaganda--but it’s repeated by the media, and it works regardless of facts.

Just yesterday this spin was again used by the Israelis. Since no Hamas body were found among the 43 children and local residents killed at the UN school compound in Jabaliya, the original spin is now changed. The wanted investigation by the Israelis is quickly forgotten, and now they are refusing any international review of this massacre. In Tel Aviv, Mark Regev, spokesman for the Israeli prime minister, said Israel had already held an "initial investigation" which found that troops had returned fire from the UN building. Self investigations with no independent witnesses are an absurdity.

Why would the Israelis retract their threats to bring a complaint to the UN regarding Hamas using “human shields”? Obviously, no Hamas body found, means a revised spin and a self investigation to whitewash the killings. And the American media will again put on blinders and continue to blame the crude Hamas rockets for all civilian killings, without any regard whatever for the causes of this conflict.

With a biased media repeating the Israeli spin and blaming everything on Hamas, and showing a complete ignorance of the underlying reason for this conflict, it’s easy to see why Americans do not understand this new war. I do think, however, that most American do understand the basic laws of proportionality, and based on results of recent polls, I do have some hope that truth and justice in that conflict can lead to peace.

Debunking the I P human shield myth

 

[Phoenall]

The only photos you posted are doctored photos from Hasbara sites. How about some facts from Western news organizations:




"Jerusalem Fund Director: Claim that Hamas Uses Human Shields Is a Racist Myth"

Read more at: Jerusalem Fund Director Claim that Hamas Uses Human Shields Is a Racist Myth National Review Online



Israel-Gaza conflict: The myth of Hamas’s human shields

Israel-Gaza conflict The myth of Hamas s human shields - Middle East - World - The Independent

"Israel-Gaza conflict: Myth of Hamas’s human shield. Gazans deny being put in line of fire"

Israel-Gaza conflict Myth of Hamas s human shield. Gazans deny being put in line of fire - BelfastTelegraph.co.uk

Every time proof is shown all you do is claim they are hasbara, when the truth is they destroy your islamomoron propaganda and racist LIES

 

[Phoenall]

Great piece on the Daily Kos, here is part of it:



During war the prefered spin given is the “human shield” one. This is great propaganda because it does two things at once. It excuses the criminal behavior of the perpetrator while at the same time demonizing the enemy. The spin that “we were receiving fire from that area,” is OK, but not as good. Then there is the more general spin that “we are sorry for civilian all deaths, but they are unavoidable in wars” or the similar “We do all we can do avoid all civilian deaths, but it’s impossible in war.”

The killers of civilians will further spin the crimes by claiming that the alleged “human shields” users are the only ones responsible. They may even threaten to bring up charges to the UN against the “human shield” abusers. Of course there is never a follow through on that propaganda--but it’s repeated by the media, and it works regardless of facts.

Just yesterday this spin was again used by the Israelis. Since no Hamas body were found among the 43 children and local residents killed at the UN school compound in Jabaliya, the original spin is now changed. The wanted investigation by the Israelis is quickly forgotten, and now they are refusing any international review of this massacre. In Tel Aviv, Mark Regev, spokesman for the Israeli prime minister, said Israel had already held an "initial investigation" which found that troops had returned fire from the UN building. Self investigations with no independent witnesses are an absurdity.

Why would the Israelis retract their threats to bring a complaint to the UN regarding Hamas using “human shields”? Obviously, no Hamas body found, means a revised spin and a self investigation to whitewash the killings. And the American media will again put on blinders and continue to blame the crude Hamas rockets for all civilian killings, without any regard whatever for the causes of this conflict.

With a biased media repeating the Israeli spin and blaming everything on Hamas, and showing a complete ignorance of the underlying reason for this conflict, it’s easy to see why Americans do not understand this new war. I do think, however, that most American do understand the basic laws of proportionality, and based on results of recent polls, I do have some hope that truth and justice in that conflict can lead to peace.

Debunking the I P human shield myth

Video evidence from Galloway



France 24

France24 Exposes Hamas Using Human Shields - YouTube

Hamas spokesman

Hamas Spokersman admits in using Children as human Shields - YouTube

Christian cleric

HAMAS USES CHILDREN AS HUMAN SHIELDS ISRAEL S MORAL DEFENSE - YouTube

Not one Israeli source so not hasbara

 

[montelatici]

Not Hasbara? LOL

Published on Jul 25, 2014
SUPPORT ISRAEL!!! I STAND WITH ISRAEL!!! I PRAY FOR THE PEACE OF JERUSALEM!!! I BLESS ISRAEL!!!

Genesis 12:3
"I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse; and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you.""
-So promises WHWH to the descendants of Abraham through whom the Messiah would come...

Mirrored Video:
Israel's Moral Defense
AIPAC
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AWm5C...

I SAY TO THE DAUGHTER OF ISRAEL, "YOUR G-D REIGNS!"

 

[toastman]

It's not the exact definition of human shields, but Hamas constantly fires from civilian areas, therefore inviting return fire to there.

It's obvious to anyone who isn't a Palestinian propagandist like Monti that Hamas clearly wants Palestinian civilians to die for propaganda purposes.

 

[Penelope]

http://vho.org/aaargh/fran/livres4/giladi.pdf

Here's a freebee. (oh yes wrote by a Iraqi jew who joined the Zionist movement and went to Palestine)

 

[P F Tinmore]

Great piece on the Daily Kos, here is part of it:



During war the prefered spin given is the “human shield” one. This is great propaganda because it does two things at once. It excuses the criminal behavior of the perpetrator while at the same time demonizing the enemy. The spin that “we were receiving fire from that area,” is OK, but not as good. Then there is the more general spin that “we are sorry for civilian all deaths, but they are unavoidable in wars” or the similar “We do all we can do avoid all civilian deaths, but it’s impossible in war.”

The killers of civilians will further spin the crimes by claiming that the alleged “human shields” users are the only ones responsible. They may even threaten to bring up charges to the UN against the “human shield” abusers. Of course there is never a follow through on that propaganda--but it’s repeated by the media, and it works regardless of facts.

Just yesterday this spin was again used by the Israelis. Since no Hamas body were found among the 43 children and local residents killed at the UN school compound in Jabaliya, the original spin is now changed. The wanted investigation by the Israelis is quickly forgotten, and now they are refusing any international review of this massacre. In Tel Aviv, Mark Regev, spokesman for the Israeli prime minister, said Israel had already held an "initial investigation" which found that troops had returned fire from the UN building. Self investigations with no independent witnesses are an absurdity.

Why would the Israelis retract their threats to bring a complaint to the UN regarding Hamas using “human shields”? Obviously, no Hamas body found, means a revised spin and a self investigation to whitewash the killings. And the American media will again put on blinders and continue to blame the crude Hamas rockets for all civilian killings, without any regard whatever for the causes of this conflict.

With a biased media repeating the Israeli spin and blaming everything on Hamas, and showing a complete ignorance of the underlying reason for this conflict, it’s easy to see why Americans do not understand this new war. I do think, however, that most American do understand the basic laws of proportionality, and based on results of recent polls, I do have some hope that truth and justice in that conflict can lead to peace.

Debunking the I P human shield myth

You only need to hear the first question.

 

[Desperado]

Nobody is holding Israel to a double standard, Problem is Nobody is holding them to any standard.

 

[montelatici]

Goog point.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Nobody is holding Israel to a double standard, Problem is Nobody is holding them to any standard.

Indeed, Israel is still living in the "wild west" of global politics when the rest of the world wants to be more civilized.

 

[toastman]

Nobody is holding Israel to a double standard, Problem is Nobody is holding them to any standard.

Indeed, Israel is still living in the "wild west" of global politics when the rest of the world wants to be more civilized.

There is no country more civilized in the ME than Israel. It is some of the Muslim states that are living in the stone ages.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Nobody is holding Israel to a double standard, Problem is Nobody is holding them to any standard.

Indeed, Israel is still living in the "wild west" of global politics when the rest of the world wants to be more civilized.

There is no country more civilized in the ME than Israel. It is some of the Muslim states that are living in the stone ages.

Toast, you are a hoot.

 

[montelatici]

Nobody is holding Israel to a double standard, Problem is Nobody is holding them to any standard.

Indeed, Israel is still living in the "wild west" of global politics when the rest of the world wants to be more civilized.

There is no country more civilized in the ME than Israel. It is some of the Muslim states that are living in the stone ages.

Civilized countries do not collectively punish other populations by killing thousands of civilians in a few weeks. Civilized countries do not have occupation forces that oppress other people because of their religion.

 

[toastman]

3

Nobody is holding Israel to a double standard, Problem is Nobody is holding them to any standard.

Indeed, Israel is still living in the "wild west" of global politics when the rest of the world wants to be more civilized.

There is no country more civilized in the ME than Israel. It is some of the Muslim states that are living in the stone ages.

Civilized countries do not collectively punish other populations by killing thousands of civilians in a few weeks. Civilized countries do not have occupation forces that oppress other people because of their religion.

Israel bombs Gaza because Hamas keeps "poking the bear". What's so hard to understand about that? A civilized country would not allow its citizens to spend their days inside bomb shelters.

No rocket attacks = no Israeli retaliation.

Israel has made offers to give up virtually the entire West Bank. Arafat should have accepted the offer, but he said himself that if he did, that he would be "drinking tea with Rabin"

Also, when in history has a country given back land to another country in which they are currently in a state of war with?