Immigration Reform

[RandallFlagg]

It is not "leftist" speak at all. It is right of center to left of center common sense speak. Go check the figures on immigration reform.

YOU, RF, are in the small minority on this. Since the great majority are staying, let's make them in the open and taxpayers.

Sorry, not buying it. And, if I'm in a "small minority" so be it. Right is right and you are wrong.

"let's make them in the open and taxpayers". Uh-huh. Let's let them pay 40 years of back taxes for the jobs that they have stolen from the American Taxpayer. Let them pay all the back monies they owe for ER visits that were charged off because they were "indigent", yet were working at a job site for cash - while "apparently" MILLIONS of Americans are walking around with no coverage.

Again. If we are a nation of laws (Like that clown in DC so aptly lectures us about daily) then enforce the laws. If you are here illegally - get out. Let them go back to whatever country they came from and "change" their country.

If they want to come here legally, I say welcome them with open arms!

 

[JakeStarkey]

OK. You have a plan in paragraph 2, so let your Rep and Senators know.

Paragraph 3: that plan of "everybody outta heah" won't happen. Ever.

 

[RoadVirus]

This is a question I continually ask. Why do we actually "need" this supposed "immigration reform" bill?

Because a bunch of overpaid dipshits who call themselves "representatives of the people" want to tap into the "growing hispanic voting bloc" to protect their cushy jobs, even at the expense of everyone else.

 

[tjvh]

The events in Boston today should make securing our borders the number one concern.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Tie tightening the borders to immigration reform and asskicking employer legislation to prevent hiring of illegals, and you are good to go, tjvh.

 

[RandallFlagg]

This is a question I continually ask. Why do we actually "need" this supposed "immigration reform" bill?

Because a bunch of overpaid dipshits who call themselves "representatives of the people" want to tap into the "growing hispanic voting bloc" to protect their cushy jobs, even at the expense of everyone else.

And, again, this was the impetus of my question. We, as a people, have had laws on the books that more than covered "illegal immigration" for the last 85 years (hell, even longer). So, why then, do we merely stick our heads into the sand, wave the white flag of surrender, and decide to "modify" laws to accommodate those who have broken our laws?

Or, is it as the limp wrested liberals claim - "too big" to do anything about? It is true. We, as a national entity, have refused to address this problem since the days of John F Kennedy; primarily because as an earlier poster stated (correctly), the vast majority of these illegals would cross the border, work for X amount of time and return to their country - generally in the fields of California.

However, as time went by, they began to assert themselves with impunity, knowing full well, that even IF apprehended, their newly found jobs at meat packing plants in Nebraska, Kansas, Iowa, etc would be there when they made their way back. And, without fear of actual prison time. As America slowly moved from a "nation of laws" to a "compassionate nation", We, as Americans began to listen to the propaganda, perpetrated by the left that "They only take jobs that Americans don't or won't do"

Now, there are 15-20 million Americans out of work and the illegals gladly go on doing "those jobs" that "americans" won't do - stuffing their pockets with cash from "under the table" and sending BILLIONS back to their "Home" countries every year.

I, for one, am in favor of a system of fines for businesses that are found to be employing these illegals. 1st offense - $50,000 fine for each illegal. 2nd offense - $100,000 per illegal. 3rd offense - the business is taken by the IRS.

 

[JakeStarkey]

"I, for one, am in favor of a system of fines for businesses that are found to be employing these illegals. 1st offense - $50,000 fine for each illegal. 2nd offense - $100,000 per illegal. 3rd offense - the business is taken by the IRS." Make that $50K per illegal knowingly hired by business.

 

[RandallFlagg]

"I, for one, am in favor of a system of fines for businesses that are found to be employing these illegals. 1st offense - $50,000 fine for each illegal. 2nd offense - $100,000 per illegal. 3rd offense - the business is taken by the IRS." Make that $50K per illegal knowingly hired by business.

Let me try to relate personal experience here. Apparently it is needed.

After retiring from the Army, I went to work for a company that had a large warehouse/distribution center in "middle america" as a traffic manager. Worked there for 25 years and retired. During that time (hell, truth be told, in about 6 years) I saw the warehouse workforce (average pay - $24.90 per hour) go from about 70/30 white/black personnel to nearly 95% Latino. Again, over the course of about 6-8 years. It never affected the transportation department as drivers were required to have and hold CDL licenses.

As the workforce was terminated/quit/retired/ they were replaced by latinos. We were raided by INS one year (obviously someone complained) and, and I swear this is the truth, HR had 38 employees with the SAME SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER. The penalty? Nothing was ever made public, but rumor was that the company paid a $10,000 fine and were subject to inspections (that never happened again).

Companies should be held to the same standard as a private citizen who would break the law for their personal benefit. My point in all of this is that I would guess that at LEAST 85% of the companies that hire illegals, do so with full knowledge that they are hiring illegals.



It is disgusting to me.

 

[Unkotare]

Why are they even discussing immigration reform when they already grant citizenship for over 1 million people a year?



With our current economy in such bad shape with so many that are citizens without work, it is stupid of our government to continue granting citizenship at this time. .

Wow, that is a remarkably stupid, short-sighted, and Un-American conclusion.

 

[JakeStarkey]

"I, for one, am in favor of a system of fines for businesses that are found to be employing these illegals. 1st offense - $50,000 fine for each illegal. 2nd offense - $100,000 per illegal. 3rd offense - the business is taken by the IRS." Make that $50K per illegal knowingly hired by business.

Let me try to relate personal experience here. Apparently it is needed.

After retiring from the Army, I went to work for a company that had a large warehouse/distribution center in "middle america" as a traffic manager. Worked there for 25 years and retired. During that time (hell, truth be told, in about 6 years) I saw the warehouse workforce (average pay - $24.90 per hour) go from about 70/30 white/black personnel to nearly 95% Latino. Again, over the course of about 6-8 years. It never affected the transportation department as drivers were required to have and hold CDL licenses.

As the workforce was terminated/quit/retired/ they were replaced by latinos. We were raided by INS one year (obviously someone complained) and, and I swear this is the truth, HR had 38 employees with the SAME SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER. The penalty? Nothing was ever made public, but rumor was that the company paid a $10,000 fine and were subject to inspections (that never happened again).

Companies should be held to the same standard as a private citizen who would break the law for their personal benefit. My point in all of this is that I would guess that at LEAST 85% of the companies that hire illegals, do so with full knowledge that they are hiring illegals.

It is disgusting to me.

So? Immigration reform is going to happen, so prepare for it.

 

[RandallFlagg]

"I, for one, am in favor of a system of fines for businesses that are found to be employing these illegals. 1st offense - $50,000 fine for each illegal. 2nd offense - $100,000 per illegal. 3rd offense - the business is taken by the IRS." Make that $50K per illegal knowingly hired by business.

Let me try to relate personal experience here. Apparently it is needed.

After retiring from the Army, I went to work for a company that had a large warehouse/distribution center in "middle america" as a traffic manager. Worked there for 25 years and retired. During that time (hell, truth be told, in about 6 years) I saw the warehouse workforce (average pay - $24.90 per hour) go from about 70/30 white/black personnel to nearly 95% Latino. Again, over the course of about 6-8 years. It never affected the transportation department as drivers were required to have and hold CDL licenses.

As the workforce was terminated/quit/retired/ they were replaced by latinos. We were raided by INS one year (obviously someone complained) and, and I swear this is the truth, HR had 38 employees with the SAME SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER. The penalty? Nothing was ever made public, but rumor was that the company paid a $10,000 fine and were subject to inspections (that never happened again).

Companies should be held to the same standard as a private citizen who would break the law for their personal benefit. My point in all of this is that I would guess that at LEAST 85% of the companies that hire illegals, do so with full knowledge that they are hiring illegals.

It is disgusting to me.

So? Immigration reform is going to happen, so prepare for it.

Again MY idea of "reform" is to punish illegals, for a change. YOUR idea of "reform" is wave a white flag and surrender to the hoard that has overtaken our country.

I prefer MY idea over yours.....

 

[JakeStarkey]

Prefer nestles to grape soda. I don't care. Immigration reform is going to happen this summer.

 

[Flopper]

Why are they even discussing immigration reform when they already grant citizenship for over 1 million people a year?

In 1925, people were concerned about the flood of immigrants entering this country that were taking their jobs which is why they had to pass the the immigration reform then to limit the number of people getting citizenship to 300,000 a year. In 1954 they deported over a million Mexicans in one year.

With our current economy in such bad shape with so many that are citizens without work, it is stupid of our government to continue granting citizenship at this time. They also are not limited the age group because Obama just added over 1 million seniors to the beneficiary list in 2009 and 2011 that did not have citizenship prior to 65 years of age.

This is a question I continually ask. Why do we actually "need" this supposed "immigration reform" bill?

What I mean is, we already have ample immigration laws (that apparently we have chosen NOT to enforce) so now what? We pass a law to circumvent OUR OWN LAWS!?!?!

I know this seems ridiculous, but is that not what we are doing?

You might try reading the bill before declaring we don't need it. There's plenty wrong with our current immigration laws and regulations. Here's a partial list of what's addressed in the bill.

It should be obvious that boarder security is not adequate.
Employment based visa are going to farm workers that should be reserve for professionals with advanced degrees in business, engineering and science.
There is no program for awarding vistas based on merit.
No requirement for and E-verify for working in the US.
No provision nor limits on families of workers entering the US.
Local labor shortages are not considered when issuing visas.

Also the bill contains provisions for provisional immigrant status for those that arrived before Dec. 31, 2011, pay a $500 fee, have not been convinced of a felony or 3 meanderings. After 10 years, they can apply for permanent residency if they can speak English and have permanent employment.

There is also 6.5 billion dollars allocated to increasing boarder security to achieve a goal of 90% effectiveness.

A new agricultural guest worker visa program would be created to ensure an adequate workforce.

Factbox: Major provisions of Senate immigration reform bill

 

[Flopper]

With our current economy in such bad shape with so many that are citizens without work, it is stupid of our government to continue granting citizenship at this time.

Growers are offering up to $150/day with few takers. In many areas the lack of pickers is reaching crises proportions. Farmers are blaming the labor shortage on stepped up deportation, increased boarder security and fear of E-verify. There is plenty of work for Americans at harvest time providing they are willing to do backbreaking work in 100 degree plus temperatures.

Shortage of pickers called a crisis - State & Federal Government - The Olympian - Olympia, Washington news, weather and sports
Peach harvest suffers from shortage of pickers | Video | news10.net
Valley farmers report labor shortage | abc30.com
California farmers cannot find crop pickers.

 

[RandallFlagg]

Why are they even discussing immigration reform when they already grant citizenship for over 1 million people a year?

In 1925, people were concerned about the flood of immigrants entering this country that were taking their jobs which is why they had to pass the the immigration reform then to limit the number of people getting citizenship to 300,000 a year. In 1954 they deported over a million Mexicans in one year.

With our current economy in such bad shape with so many that are citizens without work, it is stupid of our government to continue granting citizenship at this time. They also are not limited the age group because Obama just added over 1 million seniors to the beneficiary list in 2009 and 2011 that did not have citizenship prior to 65 years of age.

This is a question I continually ask. Why do we actually "need" this supposed "immigration reform" bill?

What I mean is, we already have ample immigration laws (that apparently we have chosen NOT to enforce) so now what? We pass a law to circumvent OUR OWN LAWS!?!?!

I know this seems ridiculous, but is that not what we are doing?

You might try reading the bill before declaring we don't need it. There's plenty wrong with our current immigration laws and regulations. Here's a partial list of what's addressed in the bill.

It should be obvious that boarder security is not adequate.
Employment based visa are going to farm workers that should be reserve for professionals with advanced degrees in business, engineering and science.
There is no program for awarding vistas based on merit.
No requirement for and E-verify for working in the US.
No provision nor limits on families of workers entering the US.
Local labor shortages are not considered when issuing visas.

Also the bill contains provisions for provisional immigrant status for those that arrived before Dec. 31, 2011, pay a $500 fee, have not been convinced of a felony or 3 meanderings. After 10 years, they can apply for permanent residency if they can speak English and have permanent employment.

There is also 6.5 billion dollars allocated to increasing boarder security to achieve a goal of 90% effectiveness.

A new agricultural guest worker visa program would be created to ensure an adequate workforce.

Factbox: Major provisions of Senate immigration reform bill

Quite frankly, I couldn't care less if these "politicians" pass 40 Immigration reform bills. The vast majority of people in the country understand one simple and painful truth: These Illegals DON'T WANT CITIZENSHIP!!!!

99.9% of the border hoppers come here for one reason and ONLY one reason. They come here to make money to send back to their families. I have personally heard illegals say it over and over again, "I don't give a damn about America - I come here to get money"

Do you honestly believe that these folks are going to join a "system" that requires them to "pay fees and penalties and back taxes" - because if you do, I have some ocean front property in Des Moines that I will sell you cheap.

 

[JakeStarkey]

RandallFlagg has no idea at all about this issue. Anyone who knows anything on this subject knows RF is blathering and slathering, nothing else.

 

[RandallFlagg]

RandallFlagg has no idea at all about this issue. Anyone who knows anything on this subject knows RF is blathering and slathering, nothing else.

Keep telling yourself that you limp-wristed liberal.

 

[JakeStarkey]

RandallFlagg has no idea at all about this issue. Anyone who knows anything on this subject knows RF is blathering and slathering, nothing else.

Keep telling yourself that you limp-wristed liberal.

And you love hardcore boyz.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pc4Q1fQFNPs]Limp Wrist - I Love Hardcore Boys / I Love Boys Hardcore - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Flopper]

This is a question I continually ask. Why do we actually "need" this supposed "immigration reform" bill?

What I mean is, we already have ample immigration laws (that apparently we have chosen NOT to enforce) so now what? We pass a law to circumvent OUR OWN LAWS!?!?!

I know this seems ridiculous, but is that not what we are doing?

You might try reading the bill before declaring we don't need it. There's plenty wrong with our current immigration laws and regulations. Here's a partial list of what's addressed in the bill.

It should be obvious that boarder security is not adequate.
Employment based visa are going to farm workers that should be reserve for professionals with advanced degrees in business, engineering and science.
There is no program for awarding vistas based on merit.
No requirement for and E-verify for working in the US.
No provision nor limits on families of workers entering the US.
Local labor shortages are not considered when issuing visas.

Also the bill contains provisions for provisional immigrant status for those that arrived before Dec. 31, 2011, pay a $500 fee, have not been convinced of a felony or 3 meanderings. After 10 years, they can apply for permanent residency if they can speak English and have permanent employment.

There is also 6.5 billion dollars allocated to increasing boarder security to achieve a goal of 90% effectiveness.

A new agricultural guest worker visa program would be created to ensure an adequate workforce.

Factbox: Major provisions of Senate immigration reform bill

Quite frankly, I couldn't care less if these "politicians" pass 40 Immigration reform bills. The vast majority of people in the country understand one simple and painful truth: These Illegals DON'T WANT CITIZENSHIP!!!!

99.9% of the border hoppers come here for one reason and ONLY one reason. They come here to make money to send back to their families. I have personally heard illegals say it over and over again, "I don't give a damn about America - I come here to get money"

Do you honestly believe that these folks are going to join a "system" that requires them to "pay fees and penalties and back taxes" - because if you do, I have some ocean front property in Des Moines that I will sell you cheap.

Since 99.99% of the boarder hoppers have no interest in citizenship, then there should be little opposition to the plan.

 

[LilOlLady]

NO REMORSE HEARD. I don't thinK the "gang of 8" know the meaning of "reform." Illegal aliens need to be rehabilitated before they can ask and be given anything and that begins back across the border. I do not hear any of them taken responsibility for their actions and asking for leniency? Leniency is they will be able to come back legally in 10 years.