If You Were Joyously Anticipating The Demise Of The Democrat Party........

[Robert W]

You are missing the point.

Don't dismiss the chill effect on free speech by doing what the administration is doing.....hiding behind ANTIFA.

What is your solution for the violence committed by antifa?

 

[iamwhatiseem]

I will say one thing to this PoliticalChic - as represented right in this thread - the right won't let it happen. Unlike the left - we do call out our own. This is something good.

However - the problem you bring up is valid. If Trump goes to far, then the independents might swing back to voting left - and everything goes to hell again.
Sad state of affairs. And, just sayin, why I wanted DeSantis.

 

[RhodyPatriot]

1. ......here is the danger the nation faces.
If we become the only party, watch out for the same from our side that we hated by them.

Online Library of Liberty
Online Library of Liberty › quotes › lord-acton-writes-to...
Power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely.



2. Sometimes what seems like a great idea gets out of hand.


3. "Donald Trump’s designation of “antifa” as a “domestic terrorist organization” last week....Trump signed a national security policy memorandum called “Countering Domestic Terrorism and Organized Political Violence,” known as NSPM-7.


4. ....NPSM-7 “directs a new national strategy to ‘disrupt’ any individual or groups ‘that foment political violence,’ including ‘before they result in violent political acts.’”



5. ....the “indicia” (indicators) of future political violence listed in the report are:

• anti-Americanism,
• anti-capitalism,
• anti-Christianity,
• support for the overthrow of the United States Government,
• extremism on migration,
• extremism on race,
• extremism on gender
• hostility towards those who hold traditional American views on family,
• hostility towards those who hold traditional American views on religion, and
• hostility towards those who hold traditional American views on morality."
• Trump Classifies “Anti-Capitalism” as a Political Pre-Crime

IS this really how far we, who voted for Trump, want to go????????????????

The Democrats will either be in the wilderness for a long time or evolve (devolve?) into something else.

I don't see them completely going away.

But, hey, stranger things have happened.

 

[RhodyPatriot]

What is your solution for the violence committed by antifa?

Bringing to heel the foreign NGOs that fund them.

Which I believe Trump is about to do.

 

[Robert W]

The OP is not restricted to ANTIFA.

It really focus is free speech.

Let's look at what Trump actually did.

Best to have the real thing to discuss.


DESIGNATING ANTIFA AS A DOMESTIC TERRORIST ORGANIZATION: Today, President Donald J. Trump signed an Order to designate Antifa as a domestic terrorist organization.

• The Order notes that Antifa is a militarist, anarchist enterprise that calls for the overthrow of the U.S. government, law enforcement authorities, and our system of law—using illegal means, including violence and terrorism, to accomplish these goals.
• The Order directs the Federal government to investigate, disrupt, and dismantle all illegal operations conducted by Antifa or any person claiming to act on behalf of Antifa. It also calls for investigating, disrupting, and dismantling the funding sources behind such operations.

DISMANTLING ANTIFA’S USE OF POLITICAL VIOLENCE: Antifa engages in coordinated efforts to obstruct enforcement of Federal laws, with the goal of achieving policy objectives by coercion and intimidation – this is domestic terrorism.

• Antifa has engaged in armed standoffs with law enforcement, organized riots, violently assaulted ICE and other law enforcement officers, and engages in routine doxing of political figures and activists, threatening public safety.
  • ICE officers are now facing a 1000% increase in assaults against them.
  • An Antifa-affiliated group in Portland, Oregon, doxed ICE officers, publishing their names, pictures, and personal addresses online.
  • A journalist was violently assaulted by Antifa protestors while reporting on a protest in Portland.
  • Using pepper spray, baseball bats, and tasers, Antifa members violently attacked Trump supporters during a Patriot March in Pacific Beach, California.
• The group recruits and radicalizes young Americans to engage in this violence and works to conceal identities of members and funding sources, frustrating law enforcement efforts.
• Antifa’s efforts to advance political violence and suppress lawful political speech must be stopped.

RESTORING LAW AND ORDER: Every American deserves to be safe, and President Trump is dedicated to restoring law and order in communities across the United States.

• President Trump: “I am pleased to inform our many U.S.A. Patriots that I am designating ANTIFA, A SICK, DANGEROUS, RADICAL LEFT DISASTER, AS A MAJOR TERRORIST ORGANIZATION. I will also be strongly recommending that those funding ANTIFA be thoroughly investigated in accordance with the highest legal standards and practices.”
• President Trump has been relentless in his efforts to combat terrorism, from designating cartels as foreign terrorist organizations to ordering military strikes on narcoterrorists.
• President Trump has deployed Federal resources to stop the violence in our cities, including sending the National Guard to Los Angeles, Washington, D.C., and Memphis.

 

[RhodyPatriot]

Let's look at what Trump actually did.

Best to have the real thing to discuss.


DESIGNATING ANTIFA AS A DOMESTIC TERRORIST ORGANIZATION: Today, President Donald J. Trump signed an Order to designate Antifa as a domestic terrorist organization.

• The Order notes that Antifa is a militarist, anarchist enterprise that calls for the overthrow of the U.S. government, law enforcement authorities, and our system of law—using illegal means, including violence and terrorism, to accomplish these goals.
• The Order directs the Federal government to investigate, disrupt, and dismantle all illegal operations conducted by Antifa or any person claiming to act on behalf of Antifa. It also calls for investigating, disrupting, and dismantling the funding sources behind such operations.

DISMANTLING ANTIFA’S USE OF POLITICAL VIOLENCE: Antifa engages in coordinated efforts to obstruct enforcement of Federal laws, with the goal of achieving policy objectives by coercion and intimidation – this is domestic terrorism.

• Antifa has engaged in armed standoffs with law enforcement, organized riots, violently assaulted ICE and other law enforcement officers, and engages in routine doxing of political figures and activists, threatening public safety.
  • ICE officers are now facing a 1000% increase in assaults against them.
  • An Antifa-affiliated group in Portland, Oregon, doxed ICE officers, publishing their names, pictures, and personal addresses online.
  • A journalist was violently assaulted by Antifa protestors while reporting on a protest in Portland.
  • Using pepper spray, baseball bats, and tasers, Antifa members violently attacked Trump supporters during a Patriot March in Pacific Beach, California.
• The group recruits and radicalizes young Americans to engage in this violence and works to conceal identities of members and funding sources, frustrating law enforcement efforts.
• Antifa’s efforts to advance political violence and suppress lawful political speech must be stopped.

RESTORING LAW AND ORDER: Every American deserves to be safe, and President Trump is dedicated to restoring law and order in communities across the United States.

• President Trump: “I am pleased to inform our many U.S.A. Patriots that I am designating ANTIFA, A SICK, DANGEROUS, RADICAL LEFT DISASTER, AS A MAJOR TERRORIST ORGANIZATION. I will also be strongly recommending that those funding ANTIFA be thoroughly investigated in accordance with the highest legal standards and practices.”
• President Trump has been relentless in his efforts to combat terrorism, from designating cartels as foreign terrorist organizations to ordering military strikes on narcoterrorists.
• President Trump has deployed Federal resources to stop the violence in our cities, including sending the National Guard to Los Angeles, Washington, D.C., and Memphis.

Presto bingo.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Where in the directive do you see any suggestion of suspension of habeas corpus?

Where in the directive do you see any suggestion of suspension or curtailment of free speech?

Where in the directive do you see any suggestion of absolute power?

Be specific with any quotes in accurate context.

I'm pretty darn sure there is absolutely nothing there that should alarm or be of concern for any honorable citizen, even those most worried about government overreach or inappropriate power.

 

[bdtex]

IS this really how far we, who voted for Trump, want to go????????????????

You really think it stops there and goes no farther?

 

[PoliticalChic]

Where in the directive do you see any suggestion of suspension of habeas corpus?

Where in the directive do you see any suggestion of suspension or curtailment of free speech?

Where in the directive do you see any suggestion of absolute power?

Be specific with any quotes in accurate context.

I'm pretty darn sure there is absolutely nothing there that should alarm or be of concern for any honorable citizen, even those most worried about government overreach or inappropriate power.

"Where in the directive do you see any suggestion of suspension of habeas corpus?"

Please quote me more carefully: I never claimed any such thing.

I compared suspension of one Constitutional protection to another.

I gave Lincoln's reason for suspending the first, to what this directive aims, or will inadvertently do to the second.



If it is publicized that the government is looking at certain viewpoints with a hostile intent, just what will folks do before they give their views?



What is the point of having debate, a chance to compare views, if the government is threatening views it does not approve of?

 

[PoliticalChic]

What is your solution for the violence committed by antifa?

Lock 'em up.

That violence is not related to viewpoints, opinions.....words.



The most bogus claim by the Left is that words equal violence.

 

[PoliticalChic]

I will say one thing to this PoliticalChic - as represented right in this thread - the right won't let it happen. Unlike the left - we do call out our own. This is something good.

However - the problem you bring up is valid. If Trump goes to far, then the independents might swing back to voting left - and everything goes to hell again.
Sad state of affairs. And, just sayin, why I wanted DeSantis.

Looks like you are on the same page with me.

 

[PoliticalChic]

The Democrats will either be in the wilderness for a long time or evolve (devolve?) into something else.

I don't see them completely going away.

But, hey, stranger things have happened.

The OP is about free speech.

Your view?

 

[Robert W]

Lock 'em up.

That violence is not related to viewpoints, opinions.....words.



The most bogus claim by the Left is that words equal violence.

Great. Now you are talking like Trump talks.

 

[Billiejeens]

To this?????????

IS this really how far we, who voted for Trump, want to go????????????????


You absolutely want Trump to restrict freedom as the Democrats did????????

No

Exponentially more

 

[PoliticalChic]

Let's look at what Trump actually did.

Best to have the real thing to discuss.


DESIGNATING ANTIFA AS A DOMESTIC TERRORIST ORGANIZATION: Today, President Donald J. Trump signed an Order to designate Antifa as a domestic terrorist organization.

• The Order notes that Antifa is a militarist, anarchist enterprise that calls for the overthrow of the U.S. government, law enforcement authorities, and our system of law—using illegal means, including violence and terrorism, to accomplish these goals.
• The Order directs the Federal government to investigate, disrupt, and dismantle all illegal operations conducted by Antifa or any person claiming to act on behalf of Antifa. It also calls for investigating, disrupting, and dismantling the funding sources behind such operations.

DISMANTLING ANTIFA’S USE OF POLITICAL VIOLENCE: Antifa engages in coordinated efforts to obstruct enforcement of Federal laws, with the goal of achieving policy objectives by coercion and intimidation – this is domestic terrorism.

• Antifa has engaged in armed standoffs with law enforcement, organized riots, violently assaulted ICE and other law enforcement officers, and engages in routine doxing of political figures and activists, threatening public safety.
  • ICE officers are now facing a 1000% increase in assaults against them.
  • An Antifa-affiliated group in Portland, Oregon, doxed ICE officers, publishing their names, pictures, and personal addresses online.
  • A journalist was violently assaulted by Antifa protestors while reporting on a protest in Portland.
  • Using pepper spray, baseball bats, and tasers, Antifa members violently attacked Trump supporters during a Patriot March in Pacific Beach, California.
• The group recruits and radicalizes young Americans to engage in this violence and works to conceal identities of members and funding sources, frustrating law enforcement efforts.
• Antifa’s efforts to advance political violence and suppress lawful political speech must be stopped.

RESTORING LAW AND ORDER: Every American deserves to be safe, and President Trump is dedicated to restoring law and order in communities across the United States.

• President Trump: “I am pleased to inform our many U.S.A. Patriots that I am designating ANTIFA, A SICK, DANGEROUS, RADICAL LEFT DISASTER, AS A MAJOR TERRORIST ORGANIZATION. I will also be strongly recommending that those funding ANTIFA be thoroughly investigated in accordance with the highest legal standards and practices.”
• President Trump has been relentless in his efforts to combat terrorism, from designating cartels as foreign terrorist organizations to ordering military strikes on narcoterrorists.
• President Trump has deployed Federal resources to stop the violence in our cities, including sending the National Guard to Los Angeles, Washington, D.C., and Memphis.

From the OP:


4. ....NPSM-7 “directs a new national strategy to ‘disrupt’ any individual or groups ‘that foment political violence,’ including ‘before they result in violent political acts.’”



5. ....the “indicia” (indicators) of future political violence listed in the report are:

• anti-Americanism,
• anti-capitalism,
• anti-Christianity,
• support for the overthrow of the United States Government,
• extremism on migration,
• extremism on race,
• extremism on gender
• hostility towards those who hold traditional American views on family,
• hostility towards those who hold traditional American views on religion, and
• hostility towards those who hold traditional American views on morality."
• Trump Classifies “Anti-Capitalism” as a Political Pre-Crime

 

[Billiejeens]

Both sides are so far off from my vision ATM I can't root for either

Not helpful

 

[PoliticalChic]

You really think it stops there and goes no farther?

It shouldn't go this far.
We conservatives, unlike Liberals/Progressives/Democrats/communists/Bolsheviks, believe in free speech and not government censorship or cancel culture.



All Leftist agendas end the careers or lives of any who do not toe the line.


Here's your history lesson:


1. The French Revolution, which gave rise to the Russian Revolution, and that of Mao. Rousseau believed private property was the cause of the corruption of the human character, and private property should be abolished, and ending it would purify humanity. He believed that any who disagreed with the general will should be treated like a wild beast (killed). Government used terror as a policy.

Every Leftist administration conforms to this view.


2. A half-century before Karl Marx published the Communist Manifesto, there was Gracchus Babeuf’s Plebeian Manifesto, which was later renamed the Manifesto of the Equals. Babeuf’s early (1796) work has been described as socialist, anarchist, and communist, and has had an enormous impact. He wrote: “The French Revolution was nothing but a precursor of another revolution, on which will be bigger, more solemn, and which will be the last…We reach for something more sublime and more just: the common good or the community of goods! Nor more individual property in land: the land belongs to no one. We demand, we want, the common enjoyment of the fruits of the land: the fruits belong to all.” Here, then, are the major themes of socialist theory. It takes very little interpolation to find that opponents profit at the expense of the environment, and conditions of inequality in society."


3. "Karl Marx<a href="Karl Marx - Wikipedia"><span>[</span>a<span>]</span></a> (German: [ˈkaʁl ˈmaʁks]; 5 May 1818 – 14 March 1883) was a German philosopher, political theorist, economist, journalist, and revolutionary socialist. He is best-known for the 1848 pamphlet The Communist Manifesto (written with Friedrich Engels), and his three-volume Das Kapital (1867–1894), a critique of classical political economy which employs his theory of historical materialism in an analysis of capitalism, in the culmination of his life's work." Wikipedia
Marx inspired both Hitler and Lenin

A year after Lenin's death, 1924, the NYTimes published a small article about a newly established party in Germany, the National Socialist Labor Party, which "...persists in believing that Lenin and Hitler can be compared or contrasted...Dr. Goebell's....assertion that Lenin was the greatest man second only to Hitler....and that the difference between communism and the Hitler faith was very slight...." November 27, 1925.(Article provided in the documentary "The Soviet Story")


4. Lenin, Hitler, Stallin, Mao, Pol Pot Castro, etc.



5. Democrat mayoralty candidate for NYC, Mamdani, supported and endorsed by major Democrat officials.
The Mamdani Democrat party stands for abolishing private property, socialist/communist, anti-Semitism, and racism.
And a Dem Senator said this should be the direction of the party.

 

[Robert W]

I gave Lincoln's reason for suspending the first, to what this directive aims, or will inadvertently do to the second.

I have talked a lot about Lincoln and his illegal invasion of VA. I never wished him dead over it but he was very wrong.

1. States are not stooges of the Feds.
2. States are sovereigns.
3. States joined in a group known as the Federal Government but not, so the States were later to be ruled.
4. States voters chose to leave his Federal Government yet kept the major parts of the constitution. Abe told the nation; he was not against slavery in his war. He violated rights of the South as well as the North and silenced the Supreme court. Trump has not silenced the supreme court.

Generally, my opponents are Democrats, yet they were who had slaves. Amazing.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Great. Now you are talking like Trump talks.

Not if Trump believes in stopping violence by restricting opposing views.


If you don't like someone's views, give yours.

Speech is not violence.

Have you read the first amendment to the Constitution?

Great. Now you are talking like Trump talks.

 

[beagle9]

1. ......here is the danger the nation faces.
If we become the only party, watch out for the same from our side that we hated by them.

Online Library of Liberty
Online Library of Liberty › quotes › lord-acton-writes-to...
Power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely.



2. Sometimes what seems like a great idea gets out of hand.


3. "Donald Trump’s designation of “antifa” as a “domestic terrorist organization” last week....Trump signed a national security policy memorandum called “Countering Domestic Terrorism and Organized Political Violence,” known as NSPM-7.


4. ....NPSM-7 “directs a new national strategy to ‘disrupt’ any individual or groups ‘that foment political violence,’ including ‘before they result in violent political acts.’”



5. ....the “indicia” (indicators) of future political violence listed in the report are:

• anti-Americanism,
• anti-capitalism,
• anti-Christianity,
• support for the overthrow of the United States Government,
• extremism on migration,
• extremism on race,
• extremism on gender
• hostility towards those who hold traditional American views on family,
• hostility towards those who hold traditional American views on religion, and
• hostility towards those who hold traditional American views on morality."
• Trump Classifies “Anti-Capitalism” as a Political Pre-Crime

IS this really how far we, who voted for Trump, want to go????????????????

What is the level set that determines "hostility" ????

Without that knowledge your thread is assuming that "hostility" can be determined by the most minimal of factors involved in the determination.

I think that the "hostility bar" is set high in order to avoid an abuse of the order. Freedom of speech and our liberties should have a high bar set, but as soon as it deteriorates into the tragic speak and actions that caused actual assassination attempts and worse an actual assassination, then Houston we have a major problem in this area. It is definitely a sign of abuse being carried out against our sacred rights as Americans by shockingly those Americans who are dead set on Destroying America from within.

We gotta trust someone to stop the madness, but what you might be feeling is can we trust Trump maybe ??????