If you are HONEST, you are AGNOSTIC

[ding]

Who said it’s going to survive?

Another meteor could wipe out humanity in a moment. Humanity vanishes if it exist only here

So what? Every living thing eventually dies.

Nothing that reproduces dies, it merely passes on to the next generation slight changes to continue the program

Yes there is a continuous chain of life. And every living thing still dies eventually.

Life is the program's purpose, not the individual life form, this is true because each individual is different or closer to the goal than the parent individual

The universe is an intelligence creating machine.

 

[ding]

Doesn’t matter. It’s not an act of God.

Everything that humanity achieves is an act of God, there is no free will, we execute our programming

Wrong. You have choices. Choose wisely.

You have no choice except to execute the program that determines your choice.

Who said it’s going to survive?

Another meteor could wipe out humanity in a moment. Humanity vanishes if it exist only here

So what? Every living thing eventually dies.

Nothing that reproduces dies, it merely passes on to the next generation slight changes to continue the program

That would be the literal definition of fatalism.

We all control our own destiny.

Destiny is an illusion, we continue to explore as did Magellan and Columbus and Eric the red. Once the earth is explored exploring really begins.

I’m not arguing destiny. You are. That’s the logical conclusion to your belief that everything is preprogrammed.

 

[ding]

No. God is beyond anything that we know because God exists outside of space and time.

God is consciousness without form. A mind without a body or any material aspect.

How do you arrive at that conclusion?

It’s simple really. Matter and energy cannot exist outside of space and time. The existence of matter and energy creates space and time.

How do you know consciousness isn't energy or require matter?

Because it is intangible.

The basis for that conclusion?

Thoughts are not tangible. You can’t touch them.

 

[ding]

Nothing you can post will describe how blank dead mud can form complicated life

That's right. Because ding only has magical proposals. People like ding dont like to admit they don't know. So, instead, they invent flowery, magical ideas that ,basically, are " I dont know, but is will try to distract from that with a magical word salad filled with sky spirits."

Nothing magical about anything I have discussed.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Nothing magical about anything I have discussed.

Shameless lie. Youre entire paradigm rests on magic. But you think your magic is "special", so you won't use that word.

 

[ding]

Nothing magical about anything I have discussed.

Shameless lie. Youre entire paradigm rests on magic. But you think your magic is "special", so you won't use that word.

Nope. That’s your narrative.

 

[ding]

What lies beyond space and time is not magical. It is perfectly natural. It’s just not natural to us but it is the source of our nature.

 

[diver52]

How do you arrive at that conclusion?

It’s simple really. Matter and energy cannot exist outside of space and time. The existence of matter and energy creates space and time.

How do you know consciousness isn't energy or require matter?

Because it is intangible.

The basis for that conclusion?

Thoughts are not tangible. You can’t touch them.

Thoughts are electrochemical in nature - matter and energy. As far as we are aware, so is consciousness. In fact, you haven't actually said what you mean by consciousness. If a computer becomes self-aware, will it be conscious?

 

[ding]

It’s simple really. Matter and energy cannot exist outside of space and time. The existence of matter and energy creates space and time.

How do you know consciousness isn't energy or require matter?

Because it is intangible.

The basis for that conclusion?

Thoughts are not tangible. You can’t touch them.

Thoughts are electrochemical in nature - matter and energy. As far as we are aware, so is consciousness. In fact, you haven't actually said what you mean by consciousness. If a computer becomes self-aware, will it be conscious?

Yes. But becoming self aware requires the senses of the whole being. I doubt machines will ever become self aware.

 

[Frannie]

You have no information available to come to that conclusion.

Fact if one believes that God brought life to the Earth and we take life to another dead planet why are we not God?

An interesting point. For that matter, most of the things early man considered to constitute a god can be done by humans now. Perhaps it is merely a matter of technology.

Furthermore if you read DNA it is clearly a base 4 computer program that both builds, modifies and operates the computers that are life

I wouldn't call it clear, but life certainly adapts to environment.

Life adapts to the environment because it is programmed to do that. This is the same goal that current computer programmers have which is the master program to react and adapt to the current operating environment by say reacting to viruses by change which can happen independently of the creating programmer

Life adapts. As to any creating programmer, that remains to be seen.

Are you aware that mud creates adaptive computer programming

 

[Frannie]

It’s simple really. Matter and energy cannot exist outside of space and time. The existence of matter and energy creates space and time.

How do you know consciousness isn't energy or require matter?

Because it is intangible.

The basis for that conclusion?

Thoughts are not tangible. You can’t touch them.

Thoughts are electrochemical in nature - matter and energy. As far as we are aware, so is consciousness. In fact, you haven't actually said what you mean by consciousness. If a computer becomes self-aware, will it be conscious?

Define consciousness? Is a leaf that turns to the sun conscious

 

[Frannie]

How do you know consciousness isn't energy or require matter?

Because it is intangible.

The basis for that conclusion?

Thoughts are not tangible. You can’t touch them.

Thoughts are electrochemical in nature - matter and energy. As far as we are aware, so is consciousness. In fact, you haven't actually said what you mean by consciousness. If a computer becomes self-aware, will it be conscious?

Yes. But becoming self aware requires the senses of the whole being. I doubt machines will ever become self aware.

Machines are already self aware

 

[ding]

Because it is intangible.

The basis for that conclusion?

Thoughts are not tangible. You can’t touch them.

Thoughts are electrochemical in nature - matter and energy. As far as we are aware, so is consciousness. In fact, you haven't actually said what you mean by consciousness. If a computer becomes self-aware, will it be conscious?

Yes. But becoming self aware requires the senses of the whole being. I doubt machines will ever become self aware.

Machines are already self aware

Maybe by your definition.

 

[Frannie]

The basis for that conclusion?

Thoughts are not tangible. You can’t touch them.

Thoughts are electrochemical in nature - matter and energy. As far as we are aware, so is consciousness. In fact, you haven't actually said what you mean by consciousness. If a computer becomes self-aware, will it be conscious?

Yes. But becoming self aware requires the senses of the whole being. I doubt machines will ever become self aware.

Machines are already self aware

Maybe by your definition.

Proof. Cotton is picked by

1. Combine
2. Cotton gin
3. Humans

All are machines that can do the same thing, therefor the human is a machine

 

[ding]

Thoughts are not tangible. You can’t touch them.

Thoughts are electrochemical in nature - matter and energy. As far as we are aware, so is consciousness. In fact, you haven't actually said what you mean by consciousness. If a computer becomes self-aware, will it be conscious?

Yes. But becoming self aware requires the senses of the whole being. I doubt machines will ever become self aware.

Machines are already self aware

Maybe by your definition.

Proof. Cotton is picked by

1. Combine
2. Cotton gin
3. Humans

All are machines that can do the same thing, therefor the human is a machine

A living machine. A computer is not a living machine.

 

[diver52]

How do you know consciousness isn't energy or require matter?

Because it is intangible.

The basis for that conclusion?

Thoughts are not tangible. You can’t touch them.

Thoughts are electrochemical in nature - matter and energy. As far as we are aware, so is consciousness. In fact, you haven't actually said what you mean by consciousness. If a computer becomes self-aware, will it be conscious?

Yes. But becoming self aware requires the senses of the whole being. I doubt machines will ever become self aware.

The whole being is made up of matter and energy.

 

[diver52]

How do you know consciousness isn't energy or require matter?

Because it is intangible.

The basis for that conclusion?

Thoughts are not tangible. You can’t touch them.

Thoughts are electrochemical in nature - matter and energy. As far as we are aware, so is consciousness. In fact, you haven't actually said what you mean by consciousness. If a computer becomes self-aware, will it be conscious?

Define consciousness? Is a leaf that turns to the sun conscious

I have no idea. I readily admit that I don't know what consciousness is. But until someone can convince me they do, I don't accept any claim they might make regarding it.

 

[ViewFromAbove]

Contraire! Faith in make belief religions is irrational.
Faith in the scientific methods is rational; it leads to technological & knowledge advancements.

Too much "faith-based" science like evolution these days. I studied both evolution and believed in that for several years until I compared it with creation science. The real science is creation science and is based on the scientific method.

Oh yeah. Agnostics are people who need a clue. I just lump them together with atheists.

The “real science is creation science”?
You obviously failed your evolutionary biology class and don’t understand scientific methods, which do NOT put the cart (creation conclusion) before the horse (data collection & objective pattern analysis).

Your post is a total fail. I got A's and B's in my science and chemistry classes and became a computer scientist. I learned evolution from Understanding Evolution and believed in it until around 2007 when articles started coming out questioning evolution. Obviously, you do not understand creation science is what was in place prior to the 1850s when atheist and secular scientists came into power and replaced creation science. Other than being an agnostic, what credentials do you have?

Eventually, I compared what creationists had and theirs is what is observable and is backed up by the scientific method. I would guess you are an unscientific idiot from the conclusions you jump to about me. I claimed "faith-based" science for evolution which leads to fake science. For example, they think the egg came before the chicken.

I highly doubt you understand the scientific method, which is agnostic in research studies. Creation “science” does NOT use scientific methods; it puts the cart (conclusions) before the horse (data analysis) in its cherry-picking activities.

 

[ding]

Because it is intangible.

The basis for that conclusion?

Thoughts are not tangible. You can’t touch them.

Thoughts are electrochemical in nature - matter and energy. As far as we are aware, so is consciousness. In fact, you haven't actually said what you mean by consciousness. If a computer becomes self-aware, will it be conscious?

Yes. But becoming self aware requires the senses of the whole being. I doubt machines will ever become self aware.

The whole being is made up of matter and energy.

Yes. But the thought isn’t. The thought isn’t bound by the physical laws of nature. The thought can be eternal. The thought is pure information.

 

[ding]

Because it is intangible.

The basis for that conclusion?

Thoughts are not tangible. You can’t touch them.

Thoughts are electrochemical in nature - matter and energy. As far as we are aware, so is consciousness. In fact, you haven't actually said what you mean by consciousness. If a computer becomes self-aware, will it be conscious?

Define consciousness? Is a leaf that turns to the sun conscious

I have no idea. I readily admit that I don't know what consciousness is. But until someone can convince me they do, I don't accept any claim they might make regarding it.

Here's what George Wald, Nobel Laureate in Physiology / Medicine and an atheist to boot, has to say about consciousness:

“In my life as scientist I have come upon two major problems which, though rooted in science, though they would occur in this form only to a scientist, project beyond science, and are I think ultimately insoluble as science. That is hardly to be wondered at, since one involves consciousness and the other, cosmology.

The consciousness problem was hardly avoidable by one who has spent most of his life studying mechanisms of vision. We have learned a lot, we hope to learn much more; but none of it touches or even points, however tentatively, in the direction of what it means to see. Our observations in human eyes and nervous systems and in those of frogs are basically much alike. I know that I see; but does a frog see? It reacts to light; so do cameras, garage doors, any number of photoelectric devices. But does it see? Is it aware that it is reacting? There is nothing I can do as a scientist to answer that question, no way that I can identify either the presence or absence of consciousness. I believe consciousness to be a permanent condition that involves all sensation and perception. Consciousness seems to me to be wholly impervious to science."

George Wald, 1984, “Life and Mind in the Universe”, International Journal of Quantum Chemistry: Quantum Biology Symposium 11, 1984: 1-15.​