If Universal Healthcare is a Bad Idea...

[dblack]

Yes, sure as hell, government and reliance on government can go too far. For example, Single Payer would be going too far in my estimation. And if your argument has to do with the "slippery slope", yeah, I can see that too. What I'm after, on this issue, is the best equilibrium between cost, access, choice and quality -- all within the context of where we are as a culture right now. I think this would give us the best outcome.

I sure don't see how. We need radically less insurance, not more. We can't have a functional health care market if consumers are always spending someone else's money.

 

[Mac1958]

Yes, sure as hell, government and reliance on government can go too far. For example, Single Payer would be going too far in my estimation. And if your argument has to do with the "slippery slope", yeah, I can see that too. What I'm after, on this issue, is the best equilibrium between cost, access, choice and quality -- all within the context of where we are as a culture right now. I think this would give us the best outcome.

I sure don't see how. We need radically less insurance, not more. We can't have a functional health care market if consumers are always spending someone else's money.

We're nowhere near a situation where we go in that direction, though. The costs of specialized treatments would certainly exclude a lot of people, and even mid-level services probably would as well. It's a politically untenable situation, and it became that way when Obama was elected. It was said at the time that, once people have an entitlement, good luck taking it away, and that's correct.

I hope the GOP is keeping one eye on the polling that is showing rising interest in Single Payer. Most Americans don't know how the Medicare / Medicare Advantage / Medicare Supplement system works, and if the GOP can't get its shit together, we could end up with pure Single Payer, instead of my approach.
.

 

[dblack]

Yes, sure as hell, government and reliance on government can go too far. For example, Single Payer would be going too far in my estimation. And if your argument has to do with the "slippery slope", yeah, I can see that too. What I'm after, on this issue, is the best equilibrium between cost, access, choice and quality -- all within the context of where we are as a culture right now. I think this would give us the best outcome.

I sure don't see how. We need radically less insurance, not more. We can't have a functional health care market if consumers are always spending someone else's money.

We're nowhere near a situation where we go in that direction, though. The costs of specialized treatments would certainly exclude a lot of people, and even mid-level services probably would as well. It's a politically untenable situation, and it became that way when Obama was elected. It was said at the time that, once people have an entitlement, good luck taking it away, and that's correct.

I hope the GOP is keeping one eye on the polling that is showing rising interest in Single Payer. Most Americans don't know how the Medicare / Medicare Advantage / Medicare Supplement system works, and if the GOP can't get its shit together, we could end up with pure Single Payer, instead of my approach.
.

I suspect most of them would be satisfied with either. The last thing Congress will do is voluntarily detach itself from a lucrative host, regardless of which party is involved. The Court was our only real shot, and Roberts sold us out there.

 

[danielpalos]

sure; when you start drafting those who have the most to gain under our form of Capitalism, first.

What are you talking about? We have an all volunteer military which is working out just fine.

With an Institutional, natural rate of unemployment?

 

[danielpalos]

Only lousy capitalists don't view a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage, as a rational choice.

Why should that not be left up to the states?

No supporter of an idiotic $15.00 minimum wage will tell me what the typical income is for a household where one worker earns the minimum wage. Why not?

How many households depend solely on one worker earning minimum wage?

Social services cost around fourteen dollars an hour.

 

[danielpalos]

I'm not for true Single Payer. What I'd like to see - and given what's been happening I may end up getting what I want - is to expand the already-functioning Medicare / Medicare Advantage / Medicare Supplement system to all. A blend of public and private, and a massive monkey off the backs of American employers.

Where will all the money come from? How is Medicare NOT single payer? I use my old HMO with Medicare Advantage, which I love and you pay, but the government pays everyone.

lol. Only the right wing asks that question. End the Drug War, right wingers.

You failed to answer who is going to pay for everyone to receive Medicare as it stands today. Where does the money come to pay for such coverage?

lol. reading comprehension challenged?

lol. Only the right wing asks that question. End the Drug War, right wingers.

 

[AsianTrumpSupporter]

If universal healthcare is so great, why not move to Canada, North Korea, Venezuela, Cuba, or Europe?

 

[danielpalos]

If universal healthcare is so great, why not move to Canada, North Korea, Venezuela, Cuba, or Europe?

Because we have a general welfare clause not a general warfare clause. Why doesn't the right wing move to "Mogadishu" if they like warfare so much.

 

[AsianTrumpSupporter]

If universal healthcare is so great, why not move to Canada, North Korea, Venezuela, Cuba, or Europe?

Because we have a general welfare clause not a general warfare clause. Why doesn't the right wing move to "Mogadishu" if they like warfare so much.

Why would I move to a Muslim country? Liberals are the ones who love Islam and sharia law.

 

[danielpalos]

If universal healthcare is so great, why not move to Canada, North Korea, Venezuela, Cuba, or Europe?

Because we have a general welfare clause not a general warfare clause. Why doesn't the right wing move to "Mogadishu" if they like warfare so much.

Why would I move to a Muslim country? Liberals are the ones who love Islam and sharia law.

No government regulations there for around a decade.

 

[AsianTrumpSupporter]

If universal healthcare is so great, why not move to Canada, North Korea, Venezuela, Cuba, or Europe?

Because we have a general welfare clause not a general warfare clause. Why doesn't the right wing move to "Mogadishu" if they like warfare so much.

Why would I move to a Muslim country? Liberals are the ones who love Islam and sharia law.

No government regulations there for around a decade.

It's still a Muslim hellhole. Also, I love President Trump, so why would I move anywhere?

 

[danielpalos]

If universal healthcare is so great, why not move to Canada, North Korea, Venezuela, Cuba, or Europe?

Because we have a general welfare clause not a general warfare clause. Why doesn't the right wing move to "Mogadishu" if they like warfare so much.

Why would I move to a Muslim country? Liberals are the ones who love Islam and sharia law.

No government regulations there for around a decade.

It's still a Muslim hellhole. Also, I love President Trump, so why would I move anywhere?

AnCaps don't work, apparently.

 

[AsianTrumpSupporter]

If universal healthcare is so great, why not move to Canada, North Korea, Venezuela, Cuba, or Europe?

Because we have a general welfare clause not a general warfare clause. Why doesn't the right wing move to "Mogadishu" if they like warfare so much.

Why would I move to a Muslim country? Liberals are the ones who love Islam and sharia law.

No government regulations there for around a decade.

It's still a Muslim hellhole. Also, I love President Trump, so why would I move anywhere?

AnCaps don't work, apparently.

I wouldn't know. You'd have to ask an anarcho-capitalist.

 

[danielpalos]

Because we have a general welfare clause not a general warfare clause. Why doesn't the right wing move to "Mogadishu" if they like warfare so much.

Why would I move to a Muslim country? Liberals are the ones who love Islam and sharia law.

No government regulations there for around a decade.

It's still a Muslim hellhole. Also, I love President Trump, so why would I move anywhere?

AnCaps don't work, apparently.

I wouldn't know. You'd have to ask an anarcho-capitalist.

Capitalism; the right wing prefers to be, clueless and Causeless.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Who should go without?

No one is ever denied MEDICAL care. Ever. So your question is moot.
Using your side's twisted logic, prior to the invention of health INSURANCE, no one could receive medical care...
Look, cut the crap.
Here is an inescapable fact. Universal health INSURANCE, single payer, or whatever name you wish to put on government operated , taxpyers funded system of medical care is a fiscal, economic, bureaucratic impossibility.
To insure 330 million people under a federal program is never going to happen,. There is not an available revenue stream short of jacking up EVERYONE's taxes to levels paid in Europe. And there would be no one immune.Everyone would have to pay. Even the poor. The sheer size of the bureaucracy would boggle the mind. Perhaps 500,000 new federal employees. This thing would cost trillions of dollars. We don't have it,. We cannot develop the infrastructure to implement it. And then there is the medical community that will never allow it because single payer would render most doctors and other medical professionals de facto federal employees.
Lastly, there is the political aspect. This is a fact. Taht while most Americans would support SOME federal involvement in regulation of the insurance industry ( of which there has been for some 30 years) that once informed of what would entail a single payer system, the vast majority of Americans are opposed. And that ties in the political aspect. The political will is not there. No one inside the beltway wants to be labeled as "the Senator or House member that tripled my taxes"...

 

[thereisnospoon]

Who should go without?

Republicans And when their health gets really bad do unto them as we do unto horses in pain

Jesus Christ. The straw man is strong in you

 

[thereisnospoon]

Who should go without?

People on social programs. Every time this subject comes up in the media, their first concern is what about the poor people? Well, what about the working people is my question?

Working people are the ones who are paying for the non-working, and some of us working people don't have coverage ourselves. In the meantime, the poor are popping out kids like a popcorn machine and the rest of us have to support them including their medical.

We don't matter. So it seems

 

[thereisnospoon]

Who should go without?

People on social programs. Every time this subject comes up in the media, their first concern is what about the poor people? Well, what about the working people is my question?

Working people are the ones who are paying for the non-working, and some of us working people don't have coverage ourselves. In the meantime, the poor are popping out kids like a popcorn machine and the rest of us have to support them including their medical.

So poor children and the elderly who are poor should go without?

Do you have a good argument as to why those groups should be punished for doing no wrong?

Stop the bullshit. The absence of health insurance is never a reason for one not receiving medical care.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Why would I move to a Muslim country? Liberals are the ones who love Islam and sharia law.

No government regulations there for around a decade.

It's still a Muslim hellhole. Also, I love President Trump, so why would I move anywhere?

AnCaps don't work, apparently.

I wouldn't know. You'd have to ask an anarcho-capitalist.

Capitalism; the right wing prefers to be, clueless and Causeless.

Libs do causes. We on the other hand, have no time for artificially created crises.....

 

[thereisnospoon]

The republican elected officials should be the ones who do without health care. Also, the religious Right (god will heal them).

But, seriously, NY, do you really want the RW people to reveal just how mean spirited they really are to the poor, elderly, and children? I find it downright depressing, myself.

hey, if you're so concerned about the poor , write a check.