if russia wins against ukraine ….

[Deadstick]

Russia only attacked its neighboring states in the post-Soviet era such as Chechnya, Georgia, and Ukraine, where Russia's vital interests were at stake. Nobody complained about Russia's aggression against these small and insignificant states until Ukraine was invaded to protect Crimea and Russian-speaking populations in the east.

Well that moron Sackashvili started the war in Georgia, even the EU said so, Chechnya had become a criminal gangster State with some Islamo terrorism thrown in they had to be dealt with and were, Crimea is as Russian as Scotland is in the UK, and Ukraine has centuries of history with Russia then the Bandera mentality took power with a coup and had to be dealt with.

 

[Kruska]

I agree with that but the chips were on the table regarding the Cuba Missile Crisis and no one was sure about “the other guy”. Krustjev had the advantage. First of all, he was in the right plus he was more likely to push the button than Kennedy. 2 – 0 to Nikita who had every right to strike first if he wanted to.

What most people are not aware of, is that the Russian intention to place nukes onto Cuba was in reaction to the USA having stationed nuke missiles in Turkey. Therefore Kennedy was forced to pull out those nukes in Turkey.

As such Kennedy didn't simply "prevent" a nuclear war - (as the Media keeps propagating), but he (the USA) had factually caused the pretext for one.

 

[Kruska]

It was not about being right or wrong. It was about the delivering all SS-5s they needed for their counterforce strike in addition to all those SS-4s. They delivered only four SS-5 (of 16 necessary) and when Kennedy suggested mutually acceptable treaty (Russia withdraw missiles from Cuba and the USA withdraw their missiles from Turkey and the rest of Europe) he preferred it, because attacking the USA with SS-4 only (and may be without bombers and submarines either) would be a real gamble.

Kennedy only pulled out those nuke missiles from Turkey - he never pulled out those e.g. Matadors from Germany and Britain. Turkey was the sole issue for the USSR/US/Cuba crisis - nothing else.

NATO are mostly useless parasites. They are decreasing our wealth and safety instead of increasing it. And I believe that American people should not be endangered because of a bunch of East European (including Baltic) nationalists, who failed to understood what does the words "democracy", "equal rights", "tolerance" or even "fair pay for the safety" mean.

Total garbage - from an obvious brainless Trump supporter.
The Cold-war is OVER since 1990 dude, - till then ALL NATO members paid their dues for a defense against the former USSR. (without ever having had a "guideline"). But annual meetings held by NATO members to "allocate and agree" upon defense spending's.

The 2% guide-line was solely invoked by the USA in 2014 under Obama, - due to the USA not having the $$ to go up against China. And keep messing up the world with their senseless US hegemonic wars - e.g. their ridiculous war against terror (US$ 7 trillion) So the USA aka Obama took Russia's Crimea annexation - as an "excuse" to increase NATO's ability to join and support US led wars.

And this 2014 "guideline" had already been brought forward, again solely by the USA in 2006 - due to NATO resources having been heavily drained thanks to Bush. jun "illegal" warmongering in Iraq, Syria and Afghanistan. Again the USA expecting Europe to pay for those US initiated wars.

The European NATO - e.g. Germany had to cough up US$ billions (never planed for in the defense budget) to "assist" the USA in this ridiculous Afghanistan war, we payed US$ billions for those US wars in Iraq. However Germany's commitment is solely restricted to NATO - are Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, NATO members? - have these countries been attacked by Russia??? How many military assets and/or US$ did the USA contribute towards NATO members attacking Libya?? - ZERO

The European NATO alone, has been spending around US$ 200 billion annually since 1991 - with Russia having spend less then US$ 30 billion annually since 1991 - therefore to claim that the European NATO members haven't spend enough in regards to Russia - is as ludicrous and false as it can get. Not to mention the mental retard Trumps polemic - as to the USA paying for Europe's defense.

Now go and take a walk, and get your facts straight.

 

[GLASNOST]

What most people are not aware of, is that the Russian intention to place nukes onto Cuba was in reaction to the USA having stationed nuke missiles in Turkey. Therefore Kennedy was forced to pull out those nukes in Turkey.

That is precisely correct.

As such Kennedy didn't simply "prevent" a nuclear war - (as the Media keeps propagating), but he (the USA) had factually caused the pretext for one.

Well said!
And I am equally irritated when people say "war broke out" as if war itself is plotting against humanity of its own accord.

 

[Kruska]

That is precisely correct.

Well said!
And I am equally irritated when people say "war broke out" as if war itself is plotting against humanity of its own accord.

Also of interest:
When the USSR was considered to be a threat by NATO, - the USA had stationed in e.g. 1989, approx. 320,000 troops in Europe

Now that Russia is considered to be a threat (even attacked the NATO neighbor&applicant Ukraine) - the USA has in 2024 around 65,000 troops stationed in Europe. Whilst the European NATO members in 2024, have increased their troop strength by approx. 280,000 since 2022. (mostly due to Sweden's and Finland's membership).

Obviously it is the USA that is not supporting the European NATO as they had done previously. But spreading bull about paying for Europe's defense.

 

[Kruska]

Crimea is as Russian as Scotland is in the UK, and Ukraine has centuries of history with Russia

Maybe - but Jelzin and the Russian Federation - accepted/acknowledged - a sovereign Ukraine that also beheld Crimea in 1990.

 

[GLASNOST]

Also of interest:
When the USSR was considered to be a threat by NATO, - the USA had stationed in e.g. 1989, approx. 320,000 troops in Europe

THIS I can understand and I have no serious criticism against the idea of buffering post-WW II concerns about the enormous gap between East and the West – Capitalism vs. Socialism. Stalin didn’t exactly put Communism’s best foot forward.

Now that Russia is considered to be a threat (even attacked the NATO neighbor&applicant Ukraine) - the USA has in 2024 around 65,000 troops stationed in Europe.

THAT I cannot understand. The Warsaw Pact and the USSR were dissolved. The imperialistic USA is not doing a good job of disguising its “the world is not enough” attitude.

Whilst the European NATO members in 2024, have increased their troop strength by approx. 280,000 since 2022. (mostly due to Sweden's and Finland's membership).

I think you are aware that I am Swedish, although I have traveled and resided in many nations around the world “on my own steam”. I lived 20 years in the US and I am a Vietnam War Veteran. None of that is important right now but the point is that I am Swedish. Now … I can sympathize with Finland leaning toward NATO membership due to the unresolved issue with Karelian. Finland has every right to be sour against Russia for that reason. But Sweden, that pisses me off. My country is ******* us and hasn’t even tried to make sense of the totally un-Democratic way it has ignored the population by joining the ranks of Satanic NATO.

Obviously it is the USA that is not supporting the European NATO as they had done previously. But spreading bull about paying for Europe's defense.

That is an interesting point, one I do not really understand. It looks that you are right … that Americans (both the government and its citizenry) are focused on paying NATO membership fees. What is that all about? It stinks of Mafia-like extortion in the form of “protection money”. Of course, that’s exactly what it is but I am bewildered by how openly Washington expresses itself. Do Americans not realize that NATO members are bent over, hands on their ankles with their buttocks bared for perpetual, American hip-thrust? Russia is no threat to Europe and allowing American troops and weaponry on European soil ought to be considered payment enough. I do not welcome NATO military inside of my country, particularly from the US.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

What most people are not aware of, is that the Russian intention to place nukes onto Cuba was in reaction to the USA having stationed nuke missiles in Turkey. Therefore Kennedy was forced to pull out those nukes in Turkey.

As such Kennedy didn't simply "prevent" a nuclear war - (as the Media keeps propagating), but he (the USA) had factually caused the pretext for one.

Indeed,war mongering traiter Ike put the missiles in Turkey and kennedy inherited the Cuban missile crisis thanks to that bastard who was a servant to the deep state.thank god kennedy was fir world peace because he agreed with kruchev to remove the missiles from Turkey in exchange for them to get theirs out of cuba,our history books never mention that it was traiter Ike who git us into the cuban missile crisis and because kennedy listened to his advisors instead of the military he got us out of the crisis,had war monger dick Nixon been potus,he would have done what the military wanted kennedy to do go in and bomb them which would have started ww3 so thank god Nixon was not elected.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

GLASNOST if you are Swedish and live in Finland hiw did you happen to become a Vietnam vet?

 

[LA RAM FAN]

It was not about being right or wrong. It was about the delivering all SS-5s they needed for their counterforce strike in addition to all those SS-4s. They delivered only four SS-5 (of 16 necessary) and when Kennedy suggested mutually acceptable treaty (Russia withdraw missiles from Cuba and the USA withdraw their missiles from Turkey and the rest of Europe) he preferred it, because attacking the USA with SS-4 only (and may be without bombers and submarines either) would be a real gamble.



You think wrong.



NATO are mostly useless parasites. They are decreasing our wealth and safety instead of increasing it. And I believe that American people should not be endangered because of a bunch of East European (including Baltic) nationalists, who failed to understood what does the words "democracy", "equal rights", "tolerance" or even "fair pay for the safety" mean.

NATO is indeed a bunch of useless parasites,they are an evil war mongering organization same as the CIA and FBI,all three need to be abolished.all three of them are the reason the world is in the mess it is.

 

[GLASNOST]

if you are Swedish .....

Yes ..... and?

and live in Finland

Who said I live in Finland? I could live in Finland (of course) but I don't.

hiw did you happen to become a Vietnam vet?

As I said, I lived 20 years in the US spanning the 1960s. I served 3 years in the American Army, one of which was in the Central Highlands of Vietnam.

 

[GLASNOST]

Indeed,war mongering traiter Ike put the missiles in Turkey and kennedy inherited the Cuban missile crisis thanks to that bastard

I always consider Eisenhower a sort of hero because of his warning about the Military-Industrial Complex but I suppose if you focus on how (and who) placed the missiles in Turkey then I guess I have to agree with at least part of your statement. To tell you the truth I never really thought about who and when those missles got there. I think I need to do some reading.

... thank god kennedy was fir world peace because he agreed with kruchev to remove the missiles from Turkey

I must disagree with you here. Krustjev "forced" Kennedy to remove those missiles by threat of nuclear war. Russia didn't implement the blockade on itself, you know?

... our history books never mention that ...

That's true, for sure. What about today? Are American pupils being taught the truth now?

.... had war monger dick Nixon been potus ....

Was it necessary for you to mention Nixon? I'm just now going to have my breakfast and I don't want to throw it up.

 

[Kruska]

THIS I can understand and I have no serious criticism against the idea of buffering post-WW II concerns about the enormous gap between East and the West – Capitalism vs. Socialism. Stalin didn’t exactly put Communism’s best foot forward.

Okay - great

THAT I cannot understand. The Warsaw Pact and the USSR were dissolved. The imperialistic USA is not doing a good job of disguising its “the world is not enough” attitude.

According to the latest Media and political hype in Europe and the USA - Russia (Russian Federation) is clearly being propagated as a threat towards NATO. Just as before the USSR. (or what am I missing?).

I think you are aware that I am Swedish, although I have traveled and resided in many nations around the world “on my own steam”. I lived 20 years in the US and I am a Vietnam War Veteran. None of that is important right now but the point is that I am Swedish. Now … I can sympathize with Finland leaning toward NATO membership due to the unresolved issue with Karelian. Finland has every right to be sour against Russia for that reason. But Sweden, that pisses me off. My country is ******* us and hasn’t even tried to make sense of the totally un-Democratic way it has ignored the population by joining the ranks of Satanic NATO.

I hadn't realized that you are Swedish - thought more of you being a former German, gone American.

As for Finland - I think they did not do themselves a favor - since their neutrality has always been respected by the USSR as well as Russia. However even Russia's ill equipped and led forces - could be capable to initially and partially occupy Finish territory. As such a NATO membership certainly adds to Finland's security and secure feeling.
As for Sweden; Sweden's defense doctrine/setup poses an "uncrackaple" nut towards Russia, and any other country getting funny ideas. Therefore in regards to "security issues" pertaining solely to Sweden, it doesn't gain anything IMO - only "ill-feelings" by Russia.

That is an interesting point, one I do not really understand. It looks that you are right … that Americans (both the government and its citizenry) are focused on paying NATO membership fees. What is that all about? It stinks of Mafia-like extortion in the form of “protection money”. Of course, that’s exactly what it is but I am bewildered by how openly Washington expresses itself. Do Americans not realize that NATO members are bent over, hands on their ankles with their buttocks bared for perpetual, American hip-thrust? Russia is no threat to Europe and allowing American troops and weaponry on European soil ought to be considered payment enough. I do not welcome NATO military inside of my country, particularly from the US.

AFAIK the US defense budget GDP% in e.g. 2022 was around 3%, and for 2024 it is projected at around 2.8% till 2033
Germany in 2023 was at 1.6% (solely for NATO issues) and is projected to be 2% in 2024 (most likely not achievable)

IMO it is correct to estimate the USA contribution towards NATO, is at maximum 1% - the other 1.8 to 2% are solely to upkeep US Global hegemonic interests outside of NATO "jurisdiction/territory". Therefore to place a European NATO member into the same defense budget spectrum as the USA, is IMO totally idiotic aka unrealistic. Since e.g. Germany has no geopolitical hegemonic policy that would "demand" an increase in our defense budget.

As I had stated already - the European NATO alone, since 1990 till today, has outspend Russia annually by a factor of minimum 6 to 1 for the past 34 years !!
And this "guideline" is solely directed towards the European NATO being able to support the USA in their wars, or wars solely pertaining to US GLOBAL hegemonic interests.

So when did the German government (never mind which one of our rubbish governments since lasted 1980) acquit or agree towards supporting US military interests outside of NATO territory? NEVER.
So why did they agree towards the guideline of 2%? - obviously since the German government has "unofficially" acknowledged to be the USA's serf, outside of NATO jurisdiction.

And now the USA is complaining that e.g. Germany is not able to support US military aspirations outside of NATO - right down to falsely claiming that the USA is paying more for Europe's defense, then the European NATO members themselves.

France and Britain have these "maintaining GLOBAL hegemonic interests" as well - which also explains as to why their respective defense budgets in regards to GDP% are logically higher then that of e.g. Germany.

The USA's factual problem is that they simply don't have the $$ to upkeep their Global hegemonic military superiority anymore. And they can't abandon Europe, because then the USA would inadvertently lose it's hegemonic control over Europe. So ask the Europeans to pay more to ensure US global superiority via this "guideline" - and Europe just as the USA simply doesn't have the $$ to fulfill the US aspirations towards Global supremacy.

 

[GLASNOST]

As for Finland - I think they did not do themselves a favor - since their neutrality has always been respected by the USSR as well as Russia. However even Russia's ill equipped and led forces - could be capable to initially and partially occupy Finish territory. As such a NATO membership certainly adds to Finland's security and secure feeling.
As for Sweden; Sweden's defense doctrine/setup poses an "uncrackaple" nut towards Russia, and any other country getting funny ideas. Therefore in regards to "security issues" pertaining solely to Sweden, it doesn't gain anything IMO - only "ill-feelings" by Russia.

You are probably confusing Sweden and Finland.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

You are probably confusing Sweden and Finland.

cant speak for him but that is what I was doing,my bad,i meant to say do you live in sweden? and looks l guess i missed the part where you mentioned you once lived in the states. you live in sweden correct am i right? if not,where DO you live?

 

[GLASNOST]

cant speak for him but that is what I was doing,my bad,i meant to say do you live in sweden? and looks l guess i missed the part where you mentioned you once lived in the states. you live in sweden correct am i right? if not,where DO you live?

Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Huh?

 

[Ringo]

 

[GLASNOST]

Ouch! You ask tough questions! That's not fair!

 

[otto105]

….. it will attack more other countries ….


i fear ……

Republic pols will claim credit for finally winning a war.

 

[GLASNOST]

Republic pols will claim credit for finally winning a war.

Which war are you talking about?