If North Korea can make a Progressive Utopia, why can't we?

[Unkotare]

That sound ridiculous?

Well yeah..it is.

It sounds ridiculous because it's not true.

Oh really.

Yes really. South Korea spends 12% of its annual budget on its military. That's more than "not much." The point in question was not how much the US spends to support our military presence there (for our own interests, of course).

 

[Neotrotsky]

i see neo felt like trolling today..

We understand your concern

the truth can be quite unsettling for those with
left "rose colored" glasses on on

no goats for you.

as a true progressive
I am dedicated to Mother Earth
and a vegetarian

 

[Neotrotsky]

no goats for you.

as a true progressive
I am dedicated to Mother Earth
and a vegetarian

so what you trying to say? you only sleep with the goats?

I assumed goats as food

sleeping? never thought of that
must be the newest left thing

Well if we can have gay marriage
who is the gov't to say we can't have goat marriage?

But hey I won't judge you
to each his own

 

[editec]

Obama and the Dems want to cut our power so we too will live it pitch darkness at night

Well there's clearly one good thing about North Korean version of totalitarianism --

It makes the night sky every so much more interesting to look at (while you and your familiy are slowly starving to death)

 

[Patrick2]

Leftwingers in the US aren't communists, but they are their ideological cousins. Many of them have no faith in religion, in civil institutions, in democracy, in private charities, in people as individuals, not politically understood groups. Their faith is in one thing - the brute power of the state. They also share a certain arrogance with communist dictators - that they've got it all figured out, that they know what should be done and how society should be organized and what goals should be pursued, and they have no tolerance for what they view as distractive or obstructive things like the notion of freedom, of democracy, of the constitution, of the rule of written undistorted law. All that crap is for the gun and religion clingers.

 

[Neotrotsky]

Leftwingers in the US aren't communists, but they are their ideological cousins. Many of them have no faith in religion, in civil institutions, in democracy, in private charities, in people as individuals, not politically understood groups. Their faith is in one thing - the brute power of the state. They also share a certain arrogance with communist dictators - that they've got it all figured out, that they know what should be done and how society should be organized and what goals should be pursued, and they have no tolerance for what they view as distractive or obstructive things like the notion of freedom, of democracy, of the constitution, of the rule of written undistorted law. All that crap is for the gun and religion clingers.

Everything in the State, nothing against the State, nothing outside the State

----------------

As our system crumbles, and as the entitlement state kills off our economy, the
S&P downgrade marks extinction for 19th-20th century progressivism. Hard choices
will be have to be made that the socialists are not willing or able to ...


If we are to survive the looming catastrophe, we need to face the truth

The idea that a capitalist economy can support a socialist welfare state is collapsing before our eyes...

We have arrived at the endgame of what was an untenable doctrine: to pay for the kind of entitlements that populations have been led to expect by their politicians, the wealth-creating sector has to be taxed to a degree that makes it almost impossible for it to create the wealth that is needed to pay for the entitlements that populations have been led to expect, etc, etc.

The only way that state benefit programmes could be extended in the ways that are forecast for Europe’s ageing population would be by government seizing all the levers of the economy and producing as much (externally) worthless currency as was needed – in the manner of the old Soviet Union.

That is the problem. So profound is its challenge to the received wisdom of postwar Western democratic life that it is unutterable in the EU circles in which the crucial decisions are being made – or rather, not being made. …

We have been pretending – with ever more manic protestations – that this could go on for ever. Even when it became clear that European state pensions (and the US social security system) were gigantic Ponzi schemes in which the present beneficiaries were spending the money of the current generation of contributors, and that health provision was creating impossible demands on tax revenue, and that benefit dependency was becoming a substitute for wealth-creating employment, the lesson would not be learnt. We have been living on tick and wishful thinking.​

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Leftwingers in the US aren't communists, but they are their ideological cousins. Many of them have no faith in religion, in civil institutions, in democracy, in private charities, in people as individuals, not politically understood groups. Their faith is in one thing - the brute power of the state. They also share a certain arrogance with communist dictators - that they've got it all figured out, that they know what should be done and how society should be organized and what goals should be pursued, and they have no tolerance for what they view as distractive or obstructive things like the notion of freedom, of democracy, of the constitution, of the rule of written undistorted law. All that crap is for the gun and religion clingers.

Have you checked the Communist/Democrat Party Platform lately?

"URGENT: No to cuts that hurt working people!
Tea Party Republicans are attempting to hold the country hostage by refusing to allow a routine adjustment in the nation's debt ceiling...

New Tax the rich flier
Download the new Save the nation! Tax the rich! PDF in both Spanish and English

Become a DREAMer
Sign on as a citizen co-sponsor to the DREAM Act."

 

[daveman]

And why is that?

Aside from the adoption of "Communism", nothing North Korea has done is remotely leftist.

They don't provide food or shelter for most of the population..you have to work long hard hours, almost to the point of death, to get anywhere. And even then..many people maintain private gardens to eat. And there is a black market that people buy goods from because most government stores are bare.

Where does most of this wealth end up? In the hands of a small elite group. Many of them are the "Owners" of factories and corporations. They are friends of the family that have been appointed to run these places.

Sounds like a Monarchy to me.

And throughout history, leftist regimes always end up like that.

Yeah true.

So calling it a "Progressive Utopia" is a misnomer.

To the point of the ridiculous.

Eventually true Marxism eliminates government. Which at it's core is the reason why it would never ever work.

There never has been, nor will there ever be, a Progressive Utopia.

Why?

Because all leftist Utopian schemes are doomed to failure from the start.

Why?

Because they think they can control human thought and behavior by force of law.

And that's impossible. They simply don't understand human nature. And it always winds up being totalitarian -- "for the good of the workers".

 

[rdean]

If North Korea can make a Progressive Utopia, why can't we?

Comrades,

it does sadden me to see the socialist success of the People's Paradise of DPRK
when compared to ours. How do we know this to be true, because the people of
DPRK have told us so-

just watch the video to see the truth

Life in the People's Paradise of DPRK - YouTube

True compatriots in the Progressive cause

What do they owe to their success? They have gone the whole way into the progressive cause...

Everything in the State, nothing against the State, nothing outside the State


Where as we, have taken the failed path of legislative socialism. The process is too slow
and it is failing us.
The recent S&P downgrade marks extinction for 19th-20th century progressivism.

What tools do we have left?
- interest rates are low as they can go to go any good
- we can't tax anyone enough without crashing the economy
- how much can we debt spend since we are broke
- we can't not allow true reforms to entitlements which limit the state's role

Traditionally, the progressive movement following the advice of past Socialist Party leaders like Presidential candidate Eugene Debs,
has tried to legislate our way to it and thankfully, with the help of Democrats and RINOs,
we have moved the country in the direction of a socialist utopia, but it is too slow and it appears to be failing.

Now while the slow creeping attempts to legislate ourselves to a Progressive Utopia
served its purpose to "slowly boil the frog in hot water" to where they, the American voter, won't jump out, I say it is no longer necessary.

We are ready NOW to take the "revolutionary" logical next step and go full speed into
the arms of the state- A true and full socialist utopia just like North Korea.

The time is now! Everything is in place.

There is a Record Number of American Receiving Food Stamp Benefits

Papa Obama and the Democrats have gotten an early endorsement from the CPUSA


As Eugene V Debs said:

The issue is Socialism versus Capitalism. I am for Socialism because I am for humanity. We have been cursed with the reign of gold long enough.
Money constitutes no proper basis of civilization. The time has come to regenerate society — we are on the eve of universal change.

Only lying turds think North Korea is progressive. Are you a lying turd?

Only lying turds think North Korea is not socialist. Are you a lying turd?
and
Only lying turds try to cover up their socialism by calling it Progressivism. Are you a lying turd?

rhetorical questions
no need to answer on your part

Was Jesus a socialist?

 

[Neotrotsky]

Not sure
but Hitler was a community organizer

 

[NYcarbineer]

Really?

you do need to update your left talking points

Did you know that most of Sweden's gains have come from free market
reforms and they actually were worse off when they were more socialist
of course you don't

Did you know that due the liberalization of their markets
Today, the state's total tax take comes to 45% of GDP, DOWN from 56% ten years ago
of course you don't

Sweden Is a Role Model…but for Free Market Reforms, not Socialism

Sweden’s socialism lasted only for a couple of decades, roughly during the 1970s and 1980s. And as it happens, these decades mark the only break in the modern Swedish success story. …The Swedish tax burden was lower than the European average throughout these successful 60 years, and lower even than in the U.S. Only in 1950 did Sweden’s tax burden rise to 20% of GDP, though that remained comparatively low. …The 1970s were a decade of radical government intervention in society and in markets, during which Sweden doubled its overall tax burden, socialized a slew of industries, re-regulated its markets, expanded its public systems, and shuttered its borders. In 1970, Sweden had the world’s fourth-highest GDP per capita. By 1990, it had fallen 13 positions. In those 20 years, real wages in Sweden increased by only one percentage point. …By the late 1980s, though, Sweden had started de-regulating its markets once again, decreased its marginal tax rates, and opted for a sound-money, low-inflation policy. In the early 1990s, the pace quickened, and most markets except for labor and housing were liberalized. ​

Their biggest gains have come from free market reforms
funny how that works


Did you know
Sweden is actually slightly more free market than the United States on non-fiscal measures in the Economic Freedom of the World index.

Then you shouldn't object to us modeling the U.S. more towards Swedish socialism.

towards socialism? since we are less "free" then them
we should be moving ourselves towards free market reforms
and away from socialism, like they are doing

you have no problem with that ?

No problem. We can start by adopting their healthcare system.

 

[Neotrotsky]

That would be moving in the wrong direction

I'm sure since they are correcting for socialism's failures
it will only be a matter of time

 

[Doc7505]

Taxes are communist?

Straight up?

Yes or no.

~~~~~~
Taxes have always been burdensome for the payer.
Whether, paying Ceasar's due, or the Khalif in BCE Rome or Baghdad was hard then and hard today.
In our case today, we elect those who continue to raise our taxes each and eveytime our gov't needs a new toy.