IDF preps for ground strike

[Shusha]

They gave them what amounted to limited autonomy while retaining control of all the important functions of a state.

Yes. This is exactly what happened. Just as one would give limited autonomy to a teenager as they developed their independence. You see what they do with it and respond accordingly. If they do well, you give them more rope. If they fail miserably, or use that autonomy to attack you, then you rein it in.

And no, this is not comparing Gazans to children. Its comparing the potentially viable and independent State to a level of growth that is not fully yet developed.

 

[Boston1]

Gaza has no control over its own border, airspace or coastline. It is denied the ability to independently negotiate trade, for it's citizens to leave, control of off shore resources, imports, exports, water, energy. Why is this ignored in favor of a myth that Israel has "completely" disengaged" and "given them" a state? There was no altruism in even that limited "gift" because Gaza was simply too costly both economically and politically for them to continue to justify the expenditure for a few settlements.

None of this is ignored. Not in the least. What does Gaza want? What do the people of Gaza want? If it is Statehood and a viable economy with the health and well-being of the people at the forefront they would not be exerting their influence and spending their resources on taking pot shots at Israel.

Yes, I think it is ignored. Over and over the popular meme is that Israel gave the pal's a great gift but that is a bit distorted. They did not give them a state (omitting the fact that Gaza wasn't really theirs to give, it was under occupation). They gave them what amounted to limited autonomy while retaining control of all the important functions of a state. I think once we are honest about that then we can argue about whether or not the Gaza no squandered an opportunity and whether Gaza or Israel or both are responsible for the current situation.

Israel is not in the business of making nations and then giving them away (though maybe it should be given her success at it). Israel has no power over the nation-building of other groups seeking self-determination. That is their job. That is my point.

I agree, Israel is not responsible for nation building.

What Israel did was take the first step towards removing an influence which was detrimental to self-determination. It voluntarily and unilaterally withdrew its influence to allow the Gazan people to take responsibility for their own territory and people, in the hopes that they would use that opportunity to build something. Were there still restrictions in place? Sure. Its like letting your teenager gradually have more direct control over their own life while retaining some control over what comes into and goes out of the house.[\quote]

There was no altruism involved. Maintaining an occupation of Gaza for the sale of a few settlements was extremely costly.

With Israel maintaining punative control of key aspects of Gaza - trade, egress, ingress, natural resources ... it is difficult to establish a state. Could the Gaza no have done better? Sure. But Israel's actions of collective punishment have not helped either.

The teenager chooses to squander all his money on drugs and alcohol and then whines and complains that he doesn't have anything to eat and its his mom's fault because she doesn't give him enough. Then he decides to trash the house in protest and smack his sister around. And then he wonders why he isn't allowed into the rest of the house with the family anymore.

These are not children.

Why are Gazans building tunnels instead of repairing homes and water treatment plants and pipes and facilities? Why are their resources being squandered in that way? Why aren't they making trade agreements with Israel? Why aren't they using the funds they are given to build something?

Israel has repeatedly destroyed their infrastructure and prevents the importation of material to fix it.

Is Israel willing to make trade agreements with hamas?

Don't give me this crap from the teenager that says "I have every right to attack you until you give me everything I want". Taking responsibility and co-operating is the way through this.

I have never given you that crap. On the other hand don't give me that crap that Israel gave them a state.

As I recall it was the Egyptians who captured Gaza from the mandated area in 1948.

In which case it was the Egyptians illegally occupying the area up to the time they backed out and left it to Israeli control up until they left in what 199something.

Its NOT OCCUPIED. Had the gazans maintained a healthier relationship with its neighbors it wouldn't be under sanctions.

Israel has every right to NOT DO BUSINESS with any country it wants. Everything thats happening to Gaza is its own doing.

Don't be surprised when Israel goes in and this time finishes the war the Arab League started.

IMHO a significant number should be repatriated to Jordan or Syria as combatants because Gaza has NOT declared statehood and as such is merely an undefined territory.

 

[Billo_Really]

Are you saying that there is a border dispute between Israel and Gaza? If so, please elaborate. If not, this is irrelevant.

It's extremely relevant. Israel has erected over 500 roadblocks and checkpoints in the West Bank to restrict the Pals freedom of movement. This is land that is not Israel's. These roadblocks and checkpoints are not along the border with Israel. These roadblocks and checkpoints make the Palestinian's daily life a living hell.

We agree. Now, what is the best way for Gaza to encourage a healthy economy and trade relationship with Israel?

For Israel to end its aggression.

The blockade is a preventative measure to curtain hostile attacks.

Bullshit. There is a video on YouTube at one of these checkpoints. Even when it was determined this one particular Palestinian was carrying no weapons, he was still refused passage.

So don't tell me this is a preventative measure.

Don't tell me there are no attacks. You do acknowledge that Gaza is attacking Israel. You label it as "defense" and "resistance", but you do acknowledge it.

Gaza is responding like anyone would, including you, to aggression by its neighbor.

Don't tell me Israel doesn't attack Gaza. It's attacked them over 700 times since the ceasefire, to only 29 rockets.

What bad behaviour would that be?

Your Honor, the prosecution rests.

Taking non-violent measures to prevent attacks which will save the lives of thousands of Gazans and Israeli civilians?

Operation Protective Edge was a "non-violent" measure?

Okay. Freedom to do what?

What do you do with your freedom?

Have a healthy national economy, trade with neighbors, a population which has adequate (or better) health care and water and longevity? Have thriving agricultural and tourist industries? What is the best way to achieve this? Why don't they do that instead of building tunnels?

Because Israel won't let them!

 

[Boston1]

The Gaza tunnel system will be a legitimate target because the Gazans have said themselves the tunnels are intended as an affront to Israeli sovereignty.

They intend to attack and they've even stated as much.

Its laughably obvious.

Why you Billo blither on about just about anything you can dream of is equally as obvious. You can't address the topic.

Art 51 of the UN charter allows Israel the right of self defense. Cross border incursions are an act of war. So whats your problem when Gaza gets its ass handed to it again ?

 

[Billo_Really]

Gaza is under an internationally agreed embargo, no different than the Iran or Libyan sanctions were.

Bullshit. There is no international agreement.

Major World Aid Groups & 150,000 people demand end to Israel’s Gaza blockade​

But I don't see how the sanctions Gaza has brought on itself are an excuse to continue attacks against Israel. One must keep the cart behind the horse.

You don't see, because you're too ***** to look.

 

[Shusha]

Israel has erected over 500 roadblocks and checkpoints in the West Bank to restrict the Pals freedom of movement. This is land that is not Israel's. These roadblocks and checkpoints are not along the border with Israel. These roadblocks and checkpoints make the Palestinian's daily life a living hell.

Knock it off with the bullshit. There are NO checkpoints in Gaza. None. Zero. Nada. There are checkpoints between Gaza and Israel. Every country in the world has a border and checkpoints along that border. There is no border dispute between Gaza and Israel. The border is agreed upon.

Second, though it is irrelevant to this topic, there are not 500 checkpoints in the West Bank. There are 26. Every one of them a border between the West Bank and Israel. Again, every nation in the world has a border and checkpoints along that border. Further, the checkpoints do not make daily life a "living hell". The only people who have to go through the checkpoints are those who want to get into Israel.

Regardless, whatever checkpoints may exist between Israel and her wanna-be State neighbors are not valid excuses for killing innocent civilians nor for making war by attacking Israel.

We agree. Now, what is the best way for Gaza to encourage a healthy economy and trade relationship with Israel?

For Israel to end its aggression.

Not what I asked. I asked what does Gaza need to do to foster a healthy economy and to create a trade relationship with Israel. What can they do to further their own goals?

Bullshit. There is a video on YouTube at one of these checkpoints. Even when it was determined this one particular Palestinian was carrying no weapons, he was still refused passage. So don't tell me this is a preventative measure.

You can not expect an open and unmanaged border between any country and any other country. Let alone between Israel and Gaza. Checkpoints between nations (or quasi-nations) are NOT aggression.

Don't tell me Israel doesn't attack Gaza. It's attacked them over 700 times since the ceasefire, to only 29 rockets.

Israel has responded to all violations (attacks) by Gazans. 700 violations, 700 responses. No violations, no responses. End of story. Stop attacking.

Operation Protective Edge was a "non-violent" measure?

We were discussing the blockade, which most certainly is a non-violent measure. Operation Protective Edge was a military action in response to continuous attacks by Gaza. No attacks, no response.

Because Israel won't let them!

Israel won't let them do what? Build houses? Build schools? Build water treatment facilities. Bullshit.

 

[Boston1]

yeah the lies don't exactly contribute to the conversation

There is most certainly an international agreement.

Its between two nations, the definition of an INTERnational agreement

Egypt and Israel have AGREED to cooperate in preventing the Gazans from acquiring arms with an embargo.

Meanwhile back at the ranch, the IDF is preparing to swat the flea one more time. And this time they are saying it will be a decisive victory, instead of the usual spanking.

 

[Billo_Really]

Knock it off with the bullshit. There are NO checkpoints in Gaza. None. Zero. Nada. There are checkpoints between Gaza and Israel. Every country in the world has a border and checkpoints along that border. There is no border dispute between Gaza and Israel. The border is agreed upon.

Gaza is just a prison from which there is no escape.

Second, though it is irrelevant to this topic, there are not 500 checkpoints in the West Bank. There are 26. Every one of them a border between the West Bank and Israel. Again, every nation in the world has a border and checkpoints along that border. Further, the checkpoints do not make daily life a "living hell". The only people who have to go through the checkpoints are those who want to get into Israel.

I'm sorry, you are incorrect.

By late last year, according to the United Nations Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs, 528 checkpoints and roadblocks were recorded in the West Bank, choking its roads every few miles. Israel’s daily Haaretz newspaper puts the figure even higher: in January there were 75 permanently manned checkpoints, some 150 mobile checkpoints, and more than 400 places where roads have been blocked by obstacles.​

528 in the West Bank!

528 in the West Bank!

528 in the West Bank!

You do realize the West Bank is not Israel?

Regardless, whatever checkpoints may exist between Israel and her wanna-be State neighbors are not valid excuses for killing innocent civilians nor for making war by attacking Israel.

You're ridiculous! Only 28 Israeli's have died because of rocket fire since 2001. In contrast, the IDF kills 8 Gazans a day.

….An average of eight Palestinians die daily in the Israeli attacks on the Strip. Most of them are children. Hundreds are maimed, wounded and paralyzed. (It’s become) a daily business. The chief culprits are the Israeli pilots who have a field day,” like shooting fish in a barrel.​

Not what I asked. I asked what does Gaza need to do to foster a healthy economy and to create a trade relationship with Israel. What can they do to further their own goals?

They can't do anything until Israel ends its aggression!

You can not expect an open and unmanaged border between any country and any other country. Let alone between Israel and Gaza. Checkpoints between nations (or quasi-nations) are NOT aggression.

It's not a border. And Gaza is a prison.

In January 2006.. after Hamas won a resounding democratic majority in the Palestinian Legislative Council (PLC)...Israel, America and the West ended all outside aid, imposed a crippling economic embargo and sanctions, and politically isolated the ruling Hamas government. An intensive crackdown followed that continues to this day – regular interventions, attacks, ruthless repression, and the imposition of a medieval siege on Gaza, now intensified.​

Israel has responded to all violations (attacks) by Gazans. 700 violations, 700 responses. No violations, no responses. End of story. Stop attacking.

You're a fuckin' liar! I asked you earlier to prove the 700 violations were in response to the rockets and you've yet to pony up any evidence. You're like Dorothy in the Wizard of Oz.

We were discussing the blockade, which most certainly is a non-violent measure. Operation Protective Edge was a military action in response to continuous attacks by Gaza. No attacks, no response.

The blockade is so non-violent, 8 Gazans die a day because of it.

Israel won't let them do what? Build houses? Build schools? Build water treatment facilities. Bullshit.

You need raw materials to do that and Israel won't let them into the area. Israel will not let any international reporters into the area.

No wonder the IDF is planning another slaughter; there's no one there to see it.

 

[Phoenall]

Sure, unless it's an offense.

and it just so happens that you guys will never lay any blame at israel's feet, pretending that all the problems are caused bythe Palestinians.

it would have been more honest for you to say 'no'

It seems as if it is very difficult for you to follow, so I'll use less words:

If attacked, there is a right to defense.

Nothing else matters.

and they have been attacked. some would say they are under perpetual attack.

Poor breathless antisemite just can't win.

who is an antisemite?

so are you saying the palestinians have never been attacked by israel?
that blockades and funds withholding and mass arrests and military operations aren't attacks?

If they are in response to Palestinian actions then they are not attacks, they are the response to attacks.

 

[Phoenall]

So how is digging tunnels underneath Jewish schools and filling them with explosives defending themselves. In any ones eyes that is a war crime and a crime against humanity that should carry an instant on the spot execution for any one using them. All you Nazi scum can shout is the Palestinians have the right to defend themselves, they refuse to show how firing illegal rockets and targeting Israeli children is defence

 

[RoccoR]

Phoenall, Si modo, Billo_Really, et al,

Yes, this discussion is getting confusing.

Article 51 does not allow Israel to collectively punish 1.5 million people who have committed no crime.

It does if they attack Israel. It's called self defense.

Which could be done by just one rocket fired at Israel, or one knife attack in Jerusalem by a palestinian against a Jew.

(COMMENT)

Some how we are mixing apples and oranges.

• Article 51 applies to the issue of the "State of Palestine" threatening or using force against the "State of Israel" (which does not include the West Bank or Gaza Strip).

• Firing rockets into Israel, digging tunnels into Israel, or the Arab Palestinians conducting Jihadist, Fedayeen, Insurgent, Terrorist or any other asymmetric activities outside of the boundaries of the West Bank or Gaza, is the illegitimate use of force.

• The blockade is a legitimate counterterrorist and defensive countermeasure employed to stop the illicit shipments if small arms and light weapons (SALW) to the Islamic Resistance, Palestine Islamic Jihad, al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigade, Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine, Harakat al-Sabireen, and other asymmetric or irregular forces that have made threats against the peace and security of the Israeli people or the territorial integrity of the "State of Israel." It is not a "collective punishment" but a military necessity and an absolute prerequisite in the maintenance public order and safety as required by the Hague Regulation.

Relaxing the internal defense and security countermeasures, giving the unrestricted movement and freedom within the West Bank and Gaza Strip, the Hostile Arab Palestinians have vowed to rearm, and restore the threats --- opening hostile operations and armed struggle against the State of Israel.

Given the obvious implementation of the Khartoum Resolution (the 3 No's), and the latest explanation in Palestinians policy on the use of resistance and armed struggle as the choice of methods concerning Friendly Relations and Co-operation, the lack of potential (irreconcilable differences) for settling the disputes by peaceful means, there is no expectation of advancing any solution.
​

In some respects, these thing (issues) mentioned, need to be reduced and solved individually, before reassembling them into a coherent peace settlement.

HARVARD BUSINESS REVIEW: NEGOTIATIONS
Two Kinds of People You Should Never Negotiate With

• Judith White JUNE 18, 2014

§ Here are two types of counterparties you should negotiate with, even when it seems difficult.

1. Emotional counterparties. Emotion in and of itself shouldn’t preclude you from reaching a successful agreement – it’s natural for people to feel strong emotion in a conflict situation. Once the conflict is identified and addressed, and parties are allowed to vent, emotion usually dissipates. Keep in mind that some people (and cultures) simply express more feelings than others. Also, some negotiators use emotion strategically to influence the other party. Recognize the emotion, but don’t let it stop you from negotiating.

2. Unreasonable counterparties. We often think people are being unreasonable when they don’t agree with our logic and evidence. But more often, people who disagree with us are simply seeing different problems, and even different sets of facts, than we are. Even if you think the other party is being unreasonable, it’s still possible to bridge the gap and close a deal.
​

§ But here are two types of counterparties you should never negotiate with:

1. A counterparty who alternates between conciliation and provocation.

2. A counterparty who persists in seeing people in terms of absolute good and evil.​

Remember, it is fairly common knowledge that neither side is going to get everything they want as an outcome. Essentially, that outcome does not exist in this reality. What the arbitrators are working towards is the Best Alternative To a Negotiated Agreement (BATNA) within the Zone of Possible Agreement (ZOPA).

At the current time, both sides have adopted an "ALL or NOTHING" position. This leads to a stalemate. The stalemate leads to the status quo.

No peace with Israel,

No recognition of Israel, and

No negotiations with Israel.​

​

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Boston1]

I don't think the Israelis have an all or nothing mentality. They seem to think they will have to give something of the disputed territories up in order to find peace at least with some of the palis. I think its a bad idea to sacrifice one more inch of Israel but the Israeli's seem to want to give it a try.

The Gazans are hopeless and the embargo must continue indefinitely or until the inevitable next confrontation which Israel has promised will be decisive

 

[Billo_Really]

I don't think the Israelis have an all or nothing mentality. They seem to think they will have to give something of the disputed territories up in order to find peace at least with some of the palis. I think its a bad idea to sacrifice one more inch of Israel but the Israeli's seem to want to give it a try.

The Gazans are hopeless and the embargo must continue indefinitely or until the inevitable next confrontation which Israel has promised will be decisive

Originally posted by Boston1:
I don't think the Israelis have an all or nothing mentality.

The Gazans are hopeless and the embargo must continue indefinitely​

Originally posted by RoccoR:
2. A counterparty who persists in seeing people in terms of absolute good and evil.​

No shit!

 

[Boston1]

Again you have no idea what you are talking about Billo.

The Israeli's have offered deal after deal in the disputed territories, clearly they are willing to negotiate.

However the Arabs have taken on the attitude of

No peace
No recognition
No negotiations

Yet you insist on ignoring those simple facts and flaming out on other posters.

Meanwhile back on earth the IDF IS preparing for a ground assault as well as countermeasures that the Gazans are sure to regret, to the tunnel systems.

Its not very easy to grow crops on salted earth but if the Gazans insist, well so be it. The more dependent the Gazans are on hand outs the easier it is to force them to the negotiating table.

 

[ogibillm]

and it just so happens that you guys will never lay any blame at israel's feet, pretending that all the problems are caused bythe Palestinians.

it would have been more honest for you to say 'no'

It seems as if it is very difficult for you to follow, so I'll use less words:

If attacked, there is a right to defense.

Nothing else matters.

and they have been attacked. some would say they are under perpetual attack.

Poor breathless antisemite just can't win.

who is an antisemite?

so are you saying the palestinians have never been attacked by israel?
that blockades and funds withholding and mass arrests and military operations aren't attacks?

If they are in response to Palestinian actions then they are not attacks, they are the response to attacks.

and Palestinian actions exist in a vacuum?

 

[ogibillm]

So how is digging tunnels underneath Jewish schools and filling them with explosives defending themselves.

I'd like you to show that that happened.

 

[Billo_Really]

Some how we are mixing apples and oranges.

• Article 51 applies to the issue of the "State of Palestine" threatening or using force against the "State of Israel" (which does not include the West Bank or Gaza Strip).​

The Laws of Occupation apply. And the Pals have every right to resist.

• Firing rockets into Israel, digging tunnels into Israel, or the Arab Palestinians conducting Jihadist, Fedayeen, Insurgent, Terrorist or any other asymmetric activities outside of the boundaries of the West Bank or Gaza, is the illegitimate use of force.​

So is collectively punishing an entire population of people who've committed no crime.

• The blockade is a legitimate counterterrorist and defensive countermeasure employed to stop the illicit shipments if small arms and light weapons (SALW) to the Islamic Resistance, Palestine Islamic Jihad, al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigade, Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine, Harakat al-Sabireen, and other asymmetric or irregular forces that have made threats against the peace and security of the Israeli people or the territorial integrity of the "State of Israel." It is not a "collective punishment" but a military necessity and an absolute prerequisite in the maintenance public order and safety as required by the Hague Regulation.​

The blockade is punitive punishment that started immediately after Hamas won elections in 2006.

Israel is a serial human rights international law abuser. The UN Human Rights Commission affirms that it violates nearly all 149 articles of the Fourth Geneva Convention that governs the treatment of civilians in war and under occupation and is guilty of grievous war crimes. The Commission also determined that as an occupying power Israel has committed crimes against humanity as defined under the 1945 Nuremberg Charter.
​

Relaxing the internal defense and security countermeasures, giving the unrestricted movement and freedom within the West Bank and Gaza Strip, the Hostile Arab Palestinians have vowed to rearm, and restore the threats --- opening hostile operations and armed struggle against the State of Israel.​

It's none of your ******* business, what someone does on their own property!

​

Given the obvious implementation of the Khartoum Resolution (the 3 No's), and the latest explanation in Palestinians policy on the use of resistance and armed struggle as the choice of methods concerning Friendly Relations and Co-operation, the lack of potential (irreconcilable differences) for settling the disputes by peaceful means, there is no expectation of advancing any solution.​

Israel has rejected every peace offering Hamas has made.

After Ismail Haniyeh became Hamas prime minister in 2006, he offered the Bush administration peace and a long-term truce in return for an end to Israel’s (illegal) occupation. He was rebuffed the way he is from Israel for the same offer.

​

In some respects, these thing (issues) mentioned, need to be reduced and solved individually, before reassembling them into a coherent peace settlement.

Israel doesn't want peace. Israel deserves to be attacked and Hamas should build more tunnels.

HARVARD BUSINESS REVIEW: NEGOTIATIONS
Two Kinds of People You Should Never Negotiate With

• Judith White JUNE 18, 2014

§ Here are two types of counterparties you should negotiate with, even when it seems difficult.

1. Emotional counterparties. Emotion in and of itself shouldn’t preclude you from reaching a successful agreement – it’s natural for people to feel strong emotion in a conflict situation. Once the conflict is identified and addressed, and parties are allowed to vent, emotion usually dissipates. Keep in mind that some people (and cultures) simply express more feelings than others. Also, some negotiators use emotion strategically to influence the other party. Recognize the emotion, but don’t let it stop you from negotiating.

2. Unreasonable counterparties. We often think people are being unreasonable when they don’t agree with our logic and evidence. But more often, people who disagree with us are simply seeing different problems, and even different sets of facts, than we are. Even if you think the other party is being unreasonable, it’s still possible to bridge the gap and close a deal.
​

§ But here are two types of counterparties you should never negotiate with:

1. A counterparty who alternates between conciliation and provocation.

2. A counterparty who persists in seeing people in terms of absolute good and evil.​

There's a 3rd. The one Zionists are in.

3. A counterparty who is disingenuous.​

Remember, it is fairly common knowledge that neither side is going to get everything they want as an outcome. Essentially, that outcome does not exist in this reality. What the arbitrators are working towards is the Best Alternative To a Negotiated Agreement (BATNA) within the Zone of Possible Agreement (ZOPA).

At the current time, both sides have adopted an "ALL or NOTHING" position.

Wrong! Israel has adopted a "NOTHING" approach.

Hamas has made concessions (including recognizing Israel).

Israel has rejected every one of them.

 

[Billo_Really]

Again you have no idea what you are talking about Billo.

The Israeli's have offered deal after deal in the disputed territories, clearly they are willing to negotiate.

However the Arabs have taken on the attitude of

No peace
No recognition
No negotiations

Yet you insist on ignoring those simple facts and flaming out on other posters.

Meanwhile back on earth the IDF IS preparing for a ground assault as well as countermeasures that the Gazans are sure to regret, to the tunnel systems.

Its not very easy to grow crops on salted earth but if the Gazans insist, well so be it. The more dependent the Gazans are on hand outs the easier it is to force them to the negotiating table.

You've been trying to "force" them for 49 years and still no peace deal.

 

[RoccoR]

Billo_Really, et al,

Again you say this...

Some how we are mixing apples and oranges.

• Article 51 applies to the issue of the "State of Palestine" threatening or using force against the "State of Israel" (which does not include the West Bank or Gaza Strip).​

The Laws of Occupation apply. And the Pals have every right to resist.

(COMMENT)

Where is this written in law?

While the feel-good Resolution may say this, they are not Customary or International Humanitarian Law.

The Fourth Geneva Convention say otherwise. And Israeli domestic law has been applicable in the West Back since 31 July 1988; when Jordan cut all ties. The West Bank became a territory with no sovereign claim and the Israelis were already in effective control.

I'm citing Article 68 of the GCIV. What are you citing???

Once you understand that any attack against the Occupation Power is a prosecutable offense, you will understand how irrelevant your statement is.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Billo_Really]

Where is this written in law?

While the feel-good Resolution may say this, they are not Customary or International Humanitarian Law.

The Fourth Geneva Convention say otherwise. And Israeli domestic law has been applicable in the West Back since 31 July 1988; when Jordan cut all ties. The West Bank became a territory with no sovereign claim and the Israelis were already in effective control.

I'm citing Article 68 of the GCIV. What are you citing???

Once you understand that any attack against the Occupation Power is a prosecutable offense, you will understand how irrelevant your statement is.

Most Respectfully,
R

You need to walk your talk, skippy.

What am I citing? How about Article 33 of the GCIV?

Article 33:
No protected person may be punished for an offence he or she has not personally committed. Collective penalties and likewise all measures of intimidation or of terrorism are prohibited.
Pillage is prohibited.
Reprisals against protected persons and their property are prohibited.

​

Or Article 3.

Don't you dare point to the 4th GC, when Israel has violated almost all of its provisions.

The UN Human Rights Commission affirms that it violates nearly all 149 articles of the Fourth Geneva Convention that governs the treatment of civilians in war and under occupation and is guilty of grievous war crimes. The Commission also determined that as an occupying power Israel has committed crimes against humanity as defined under the 1945 Nuremberg Charter.


​