How We (The US) Can Still Win The War On Drugs

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

The Republican Party's ridiculous War on Drugs has been an excuse to jail young black and brown men in unprecedented numbers, while letting young white males off with wrist slaps.

Studies have routinely shown that while young white males use and sell drugs with the same frequency as non-whites, when caught, they are more likely to be let off with a warning than charged or jailed.

Before the war on drugs, there were 30,000 black men in federal prisons. Now, with the war on drugs and minimum sentencing, there are over 300,000.

It isn't Democratic policies that have destroyed black families. It's the War on Drugs.

If they are locked up, it makes it more difficult to sell drugs.

 

[WillMunny]

It's impossible to win the war on drugs because there has never in history been a 100% completely sober society with zero intoxication of any kind. It's the human condition that there will always be people seeking to artificially alter their emotional/sensory state. Hell, I'll bet the use of alcohol and weed predates written history. Even ancient American Indian tribes used to eat the hallucinogen peyote as part of their religious rituals.

 

[Silhouette]

It's impossible to win the war on drugs because there has never in history been a 100% completely sober society with zero intoxication of any kind. It's the human condition that there will always be people seeking to artificially alter their emotional/sensory state. Hell, I'll bet the use of alcohol and weed predates written history. Even ancient American Indian tribes used to eat the hallucinogen peyote as part of their religious rituals.

When I say "win", I mean "restore a modicum of a braking system". This push to legalize everything (eventually, mark my words) is an affront to the longevity of our society ultimately. Don't think the Russians & Chinese aren't drooling at the prospect of a heroin-epidemic America. Remember, this thread really isn't about pot, it's about heroin using pot's precedent in "law"...

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

Its a war that has cost billions, its a war that has not reduced drug use, so its a bad war. time to use a different metric when dealing with drug use.

The users are weakening America. Poison the drug supply and get rid of that self-indulgent scum.

 

[Dschrute3]

Americans love their wars. They can't get enough of em. The 'War on Drugs' should have been ended long ago. It should be an adult decision. The Government should stay out of it. If an adult wants to consume drugs, so be it. As long as they don't harm anyone else or break laws, it isn't a criminal act. It isn't a criminal act anymore than consuming alcohol is.

Time to stop throwing folks in cages with brutal murderers, rapists, and so on. They don't belong there. But so many have so much to gain conducting their 'War on Drugs.' So much money and control. I just don't see decriminalization anytime soon. I mean if they won't even decriminalize Marijuana, it's gonna be a long long uphill struggle. It's very sad, but it is what it is.

 

[SavannahMann]

It's impossible to win the war on drugs because there has never in history been a 100% completely sober society with zero intoxication of any kind. It's the human condition that there will always be people seeking to artificially alter their emotional/sensory state. Hell, I'll bet the use of alcohol and weed predates written history. Even ancient American Indian tribes used to eat the hallucinogen peyote as part of their religious rituals.

When I say "win", I mean "restore a modicum of a braking system". This push to legalize everything (eventually, mark my words) is an affront to the longevity of our society ultimately. Don't think the Russians & Chinese aren't drooling at the prospect of a heroin-epidemic America. Remember, this thread really isn't about pot, it's about heroin using pot's precedent in "law"...

All the drugs were all illegal in every state for decades. The numbers of users increased. Countless years were wasted by police as they pursued drug users and dealers. No sooner would they end one investigation after weeks, or months of work, and ten more dealers would step in to fill the vacuum left by the ring that had been arrested.

Federal task forces. State task forces, join investigations galore, and the use, availability, and number of sales increased. Going hard hasn’t done anything. We threw the constitution out the window and have cops spending entire days hunting for drug money traveling on the highways. We seize this money and call it Civil Forfeiture. We haven’t dented the earnings of the drug kingpins. The Mexican Army hunts down a drug lord like El Chapo, and the entire drug distribution network is simply absorbed by another.

We tried this for decades. We have accomplished zilch except that we need more prisons for these vile criminals. We’ve unleashed technology, and poured billions into this war, and by any standard we are worse off now than we were when we began it.

There is literally no standard you can point to and say that there is even a modicum of progress in the war on drugs. There is literally no metric you can use to say that the efforts have been successful. We have the Coast Guard spending more time hunting drug runners than safety inspections. We have the Military down there flying along the Gulf of Mexico looking for planes that are trying to fly under the radar. We have unprecedented numbers of Border Patrolmen using unimagined technology to search cars. But after all that, we are actually still importing more drugs now, than we were when this stuff was proposed.

So what example of a braking action can you point to as proof of your theory? Narcotics squads have existed in police departments for decades. Since the 1950’s in some cities. People who specialize in finding drug dealers. We’ve had the DEA running around and accomplishing jack shit for how long? Seriously, people have started working in the DEA since the War on Drugs began, fulfilled a career, and retired, and haven’t even dented the Drug import business. Oh they catch and lock up a few, but the drug distribution isn’t even slowed, much less interrupted.

That’s the honest assessment. All the money, all the effort, all the lives we have spent on this war, and we have more drugs available now, than we did fifty years ago.

So if that doesn’t work, what does? We’ve doubled down on the war so often as to be laughable anymore. Finally, some states and cities are throwing their hands up in disgust. They’ve spent hundreds of millions of dollars funding this war on drugs, and accomplished zilch. So you want to sue them to force them to keep throwing good money after bad or else. Bah.

Where has drug usage declined? Interestingly enough, in nations where it is legal. Portugal is one example. They decided to ignore the common user, and not arrest them. They decided to leave it alone, and offer treatment options instead. It was cheaper, and it has been successful.

But we’re Americans. And just because something doesn’t work, doesn’t mean we’re going to stop doing it. Why, we never give up. We are stupidly stubborn if nothing else. We have lots of examples. It was obvious that the war in Vietnam was lost in the late 1960’s. But we kept fighting there, refusing to admit defeat. We are no longer barbarded with ideas of what Victory in Afghanistan will look like. Now, our reason for fighting is that we can’t lose. We aren’t fighting to win, we’re fighting not to lose. That’s what the War on Drugs is. A hopeless cause we are too proud to admit we are losing. So instead of trying to find a way to accomplish the goal, a braking action you call it, we continue to flail ineffectually because anything else is a surrender, and we won’t do that.

All the technology in the world did not help us win in Vietnam. All the lives, all the money, and all the effort was wasted from day one. All the cutting edge tech in the world has not won Afghanistan. There is no shortage of money, or desire there. The only thing missing, is the ability to actually win.

The idea that you can sue California to force them to keep throwing money at a lost cause is a problem. Because their defense is two fold. First. If drugs are shipped across the state lines, that is the Federal Government’s problem, not California. There is nothing in the law preventing the DEA from arresting anyone they want to. The only caveat is that the State is hands off. It’s your problem, not mine.

By the time some twenty years had passed, and you got to the Supreme Court, the argument of the Tenth Amendment would be winning. It is California’s job to run California, not New York. It is the DEA’s job to stop interstate shipments of drugs, not California.

Worse for you, in the next two decades, the number of people who believe that the war on drugs was long ago lost, will be even higher. Because even though we are incredibly arrogant, an increasing number of us are starting to understand that this effort, the war on drugs, is a wasteful disaster of public policy.

 

[SavannahMann]

The Republican Party's ridiculous War on Drugs has been an excuse to jail young black and brown men in unprecedented numbers, while letting young white males off with wrist slaps.

Studies have routinely shown that while young white males use and sell drugs with the same frequency as non-whites, when caught, they are more likely to be let off with a warning than charged or jailed.

Before the war on drugs, there were 30,000 black men in federal prisons. Now, with the war on drugs and minimum sentencing, there are over 300,000.

It isn't Democratic policies that have destroyed black families. It's the War on Drugs.

If they are locked up, it makes it more difficult to sell drugs.

Not really. Drugs are available in prisons, which are among the most tightly controlled environments imaginable.

Prison drug use becoming harder and harder to control

 

[Votto]

The US war on drugs is like the US war in Afghanistan.

They do limited fighting with no resolve, much like Vietnam as well.

There is no real war on drugs and never has been. Just look at the revolving door on the prison system to see that and tax payer funded free narcan for abusers and no jail time and a border with no wall.

A war on drugs that works can be seen in countries like Singapore and be promptly ignored

In the interim, we will be convinced that a war on drugs is not plausible, therefore, we should legalize it and tax it.

Just put the state run crack house by the state run liquor stores and it'll all get better.

Politicians want as many people to get high as possible. After all, they want to stay in power.

 

[BlindBoo]

Its a war that has cost billions, its a war that has not reduced drug use, so its a bad war. time to use a different metric when dealing with drug use.

The users are weakening America. Poison the drug supply and get rid of that self-indulgent scum.

Yeah it's weakening us by turning some of us into little fascist who think nothing of murdering millions of their fellow citizens because they use non-government approved recreational substances.

 

[BlindBoo]

Americans love their wars. They can't get enough of em. The 'War on Drugs' should have been ended long ago. It should be an adult decision. The Government should stay out of it. If an adult wants to consume drugs, so be it. As long as they don't harm anyone else or break laws, it isn't a criminal act. It isn't a criminal act anymore than consuming alcohol is.

Time to stop throwing folks in cages with brutal murderers, rapists, and so on. They don't belong there. But so many have so much to gain conducting their 'War on Drugs.' So much money and control. I just don't see decriminalization anytime soon. I mean if they won't even decriminalize Marijuana, it's gonna be a long long uphill struggle. It's very sad, but it is what it is.

I hate to agree with you but on this I do.

 

[Silhouette]

A war on drugs that works can be seen in countries like Singapore and be promptly ignored

In the interim, we will be convinced that a war on drugs is not plausible, therefore, we should legalize it and tax it.

.

So legal heroin across the US then?

 

[Votto]

A war on drugs that works can be seen in countries like Singapore and be promptly ignored

In the interim, we will be convinced that a war on drugs is not plausible, therefore, we should legalize it and tax it.

.

So legal heroin across the US then?

Don't get too exited their son, start with some legalized pot first.

We need you good and high when they come for your guns and bank account.

 

[Silhouette]

Don't get too exited their son, start with some legalized pot first.

We need you good and high when they come for your guns and bank account.

I get your snark. But the point is where do we stop? If one Schedule I substance no longer can be regulated federally, then none of them can be. And, why are we spending billions in Mexico to keep pot coming across their borders when we allow states who have illegally "legalized" pot to export to other states where they abide by the federal prohibitions?

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

The Republican Party's ridiculous War on Drugs has been an excuse to jail young black and brown men in unprecedented numbers, while letting young white males off with wrist slaps.

Studies have routinely shown that while young white males use and sell drugs with the same frequency as non-whites, when caught, they are more likely to be let off with a warning than charged or jailed.

Before the war on drugs, there were 30,000 black men in federal prisons. Now, with the war on drugs and minimum sentencing, there are over 300,000.

It isn't Democratic policies that have destroyed black families. It's the War on Drugs.

If they are locked up, it makes it more difficult to sell drugs.

Not really. Drugs are available in prisons, which are among the most tightly controlled environments imaginable.

Prison drug use becoming harder and harder to control

Reading comprehension problems?

I said "If they are locked up, it makes it more difficult to sell drugs".

I don't see too many escapees down at the local schools selling drugs and then sneaking back into prison in time for roll call.

 

[Two Thumbs]

The Republican Party's ridiculous War on Drugs has been an excuse to jail young black and brown men in unprecedented numbers, while letting young white males off with wrist slaps.

Studies have routinely shown that while young white males use and sell drugs with the same frequency as non-whites, when caught, they are more likely to be let off with a warning than charged or jailed.

Before the war on drugs, there were 30,000 black men in federal prisons. Now, with the war on drugs and minimum sentencing, there are over 300,000.

It isn't Democratic policies that have destroyed black families. It's the War on Drugs.

no dem has made any real effort to get rid of the law.

but it's the gops fault b/c you can't think for yourself.

 

[Jarlaxle]

A war on drugs that works can be seen in countries like Singapore and be promptly ignored

In the interim, we will be convinced that a war on drugs is not plausible, therefore, we should legalize it and tax it.

.

So legal heroin across the US then?

Fine by me...it would probably be better than the status quo.

 

[initforme]

You dupes....the drug war is long list...tired of legalizing morality yet???? They will always find their way here because America wants their did and will pay for it. If there is a market then it will happen.

 

[SavannahMann]

The Republican Party's ridiculous War on Drugs has been an excuse to jail young black and brown men in unprecedented numbers, while letting young white males off with wrist slaps.

Studies have routinely shown that while young white males use and sell drugs with the same frequency as non-whites, when caught, they are more likely to be let off with a warning than charged or jailed.

Before the war on drugs, there were 30,000 black men in federal prisons. Now, with the war on drugs and minimum sentencing, there are over 300,000.

It isn't Democratic policies that have destroyed black families. It's the War on Drugs.

If they are locked up, it makes it more difficult to sell drugs.

Not really. Drugs are available in prisons, which are among the most tightly controlled environments imaginable.

Prison drug use becoming harder and harder to control

Reading comprehension problems?

I said "If they are locked up, it makes it more difficult to sell drugs".

I don't see too many escapees down at the local schools selling drugs and then sneaking back into prison in time for roll call.

You also don’t see a lot of adults hanging around selling drugs at schools. Adults that hang around near the schools tend to be rousted by the cops as sex predators. What you see is one kid selling to another generally speaking. When you see it. The biggest drug that kids use is tobacco. Illegal to be sure, but I guess we could stop their smoking if we locked them up, at least smoking around other kids. Alcohol is second, and then other drugs are third with Marijuana leading the pack.

You don’t see a lot of heroine using kids, but hey, run whatever fantasy you want.

 

[SavannahMann]

Don't get too exited their son, start with some legalized pot first.

We need you good and high when they come for your guns and bank account.

I get your snark. But the point is where do we stop? If one Schedule I substance no longer can be regulated federally, then none of them can be. And, why are we spending billions in Mexico to keep pot coming across their borders when we allow states who have illegally "legalized" pot to export to other states where they abide by the federal prohibitions?

Couple observations. First, why do the States have any responsibility in enforcing Federal Prohibitions? I thought that the tenth amendment covered things like that. I seem to remember the Conservatives making a damned fine case under the Tenth Amendment and arguing unfounded mandate over the Brady Law. It was one of those things that I as man who voted for Bill Clinton agreed with. There is nothing in the laws of Colorado or California or any other state that has decriminalized Marijuana that prevents the DEA from making all the arrests they want.

Second. If you want the states to enforce Federal Prohibitions, and federal law, don’t you have to pay for it from Federal Budgets? Are you suggesting that every narcotics squad or division in the Local Police should be sworn Federal Agents, or at least funded by the Federal Government?

 

[Dragonlady]

The Republican Party's ridiculous War on Drugs has been an excuse to jail young black and brown men in unprecedented numbers, while letting young white males off with wrist slaps.

Studies have routinely shown that while young white males use and sell drugs with the same frequency as non-whites, when caught, they are more likely to be let off with a warning than charged or jailed.

Before the war on drugs, there were 30,000 black men in federal prisons. Now, with the war on drugs and minimum sentencing, there are over 300,000.

It isn't Democratic policies that have destroyed black families. It's the War on Drugs.

no dem has made any real effort to get rid of the law.

but it's the gops fault b/c you can't think for yourself.

Your post doesn’t even make logical sense.

The Republican Party's ridiculous War on Drugs has been an excuse to jail young black and brown men in unprecedented numbers, while letting young white males off with wrist slaps.

Studies have routinely shown that while young white males use and sell drugs with the same frequency as non-whites, when caught, they are more likely to be let off with a warning than charged or jailed.

Before the war on drugs, there were 30,000 black men in federal prisons. Now, with the war on drugs and minimum sentencing, there are over 300,000.

It isn't Democratic policies that have destroyed black families. It's the War on Drugs.

If they are locked up, it makes it more difficult to sell drugs.

Not really. Drugs are available in prisons, which are among the most tightly controlled environments imaginable.

Prison drug use becoming harder and harder to control

Reading comprehension problems?

I said "If they are locked up, it makes it more difficult to sell drugs".

I don't see too many escapees down at the local schools selling drugs and then sneaking back into prison in time for roll call.

Many of the brown and black people locked up in federal prisons are locked up for possession, not trafficking. White kids caught with pot get fined. Blacks go to jail.