How Many Vermont Residents Have Vacation Houses on Lake Champlain?

[OldLady]

What makes you think that all the doctors in place today are going to disappear overnight if universal health plans take effect? I know mine is going to be around until he retires, which I hope is after I kick. I've had him for years. The specialists, the ancillary services like PT, etc. Where do you think those people are going to go? It's ludicrous.

I had a job for years with the medical association, so I know how doctors in private practice think. They worked really hard and spent money up the wazoo to get a medical degree and training. They are going to charge as much as they can get away with and enjoy making millions--most doctors do--but the student loans, the astronomical malpractice insurance, overhead for their offices, red tape trying to collect from insurance companies.....it isn't a walk in the park, either.

The docs will still be here and they won't have lost their abilities because Uncle Sam is reimbursing them.

The government will be telling them who they have to provide services too as well.

Those who aren't of High Quality, will still be around, those who really know their shit, will be available only to well-connected political operatives. Right now, the Maha Rushdie is undergoing a health crisis. What chance would he have that he could get a quality doctor as a senior citizen and a dissident if Sanders was ruling?

those who really know their shit, will be available only to well-connected political operatives.
Utter horsehockey. Of course, there are doctors out there now in major metropolitan areas who don't accept the low paying plans, and they can find enough rich patients to keep them afloat. But in most areas of the country, if a doctor doesn't accept Medicare or some of the HMO's and insurance plans, they will not have any patients.

You don't get it. Once we have a fully socialized system, health care providers will be de facto employees of the State. The idea of private doctors offices and self employed physicians will be a thing of the past. If you are President Sanders or someone else of a favored social group, you will be treated by Harvey Cushing, Marcus Welby or Theodor Morrell. If you aren't, you'd get to see Vinnie Boombatz, Nick Riviera or Joe Mengele. And that's the key to cost savings in a socialist plan. The plan's overseers figure that a large number of the people will just stay home and not bother with medical treatment when they see who their provider will be.

Is that how Medicare works? No.

No it isn't.

But "Medicare for All" is just the name of the program, it actually isn't related to the current Medicare program at all.

The current Medicare program is divided in to section, Med A, B, C, D, and also makes it advisable that recipients have Medicare Supplemental plans. Further there are large exclusions and limitations to actual Medicare.

The Risky Sanders Scheme has little in common with Traditional Medicare , except for the fact that it borrows the program's name.

I think single payer is the only way to bring healthcare costs down. You do realize, don't you, that in our "free" capitalist society, those folks selling drugs, medical equipment, etc. are making money hand over fist? They are charging what the market will bear, and the market needs it so they pay it and pass the costs on to the consumers. Which is why our premiums are in the stratosphere. There is no need of it. A single payer that refuses to play the game will win or the medical community will go bankrupt.

It's too bad that's how they need to be reigned in, but capitalism sometimes does. Healthcare, saving lives, apparently can't be administered fairly via a capitalist system any longer. Obamacare came about because the premiums were rising so sharply. It wasn't Obamacare that pushed them up. So far, it sure as hell hasn't brought them down either, because private insurance companies are still feeding the greed.

Okay, maybe I'm wrong, but that's how I see it.

 

[rightwinger]

In a violent, droolingly triggered response to Mini-Mike proving CrAzY Bernie is a liar and hypocrite, CrAzY Bernie said it is very common for Vermont folks to have vacation houses on Lake Champlain. If you lived in Vermont and had the cash, your vacation house would be in Florida.

Take a peek at 'best known millionaire socialist' Bernie Sanders' three homes | Daily Mail Online



Folks, do your homework, the only reason CrAzY Bernie ever runs is to skim money from campaign funds into his bank accounts.

It makes perfect sense for him to have a little place in DC, since he has been working there for thirty years or so. Probably cheaper in the long run than a motel room or renting. He lives in Burlington, so why should he NOT have a home there?

How many people own vacation camps/cottages/homes? Millions.

There is absolutely no reason to accuse him of skimming campaign funds. He became a millionaire for the first time in 2016 from the proceeds from his book.

You jealous? Write a book. You make it sound like he's in the flippin' "One percent" he's always going on about. But that ain't the case. He's solidly middle class. Bloomberg wouldn't let him in their golf club.

I won't vote for Bernie, even if he's the alternative to Trump. But your stuff is petty, misleading horseshit.

Most people on the right are concerned about Bernie's past association with the Communist Party, and that he's disguising his real intentions with feel-good stuff. I could care less whether Bernie lived in a Federal housing complex or had 10 residences worldwide. The "Socialists" have targeted changes in the Constitution that would bankrupt what little we have left in Social Security. And we're tired of being blood-hated by Democrats. The Democrats are a national and an international disgrace for championing environmental lies thanks to Vice President Al Gore's speeches now unwanted in Europe, because they're based on false narratives, and House Democrats Pelosi Shiff and Nadler for perpetrating with attitude false narratives of President Trump's alleged ties with Russia that do not and never have existed. The Europeans also know all about Hillary and Barack's hatred for Allies and love for Axis powers that still hate Jewish heritage populations and individuals and still blather words "wiping them off the face of the map." What that Party really hate is people who do right and still win in the business world. It never occurs to Democrats that those who do well in this nation are hard workers who also make wise investments and scrimp to do so.

Socialism is merely a stepping stone to Bolsheviki murders of top opposition leaders, and later all farmers they were so willing to starve out for disagreeing with Bolsheviks. It was diabolical murders in Ukraine that caused the people there to flag down Stalin's war against farmers.

We never care to see that in this country.

Bernie is not going to murder anyone, B. This is not an authoritarian takeover if he is freely elected. But you don't have to warn me about Bernie. I'm smart enough to read between the lines. No, he's not Stalin or anything else, but he is a committed socialist and far too radical to get my vote.

As far as being afraid of authoritarian antics if Bernie wins, it's hard to believe from you, since Trump has been overstepping the line and abusing his power since he got in office and he does it with boldfaced lies and bravado, too.

So please don't preach about how bad the socialists are.

It's the second generation that concerns me, ma'am. And when a society has no religion other than the state, control for some reason becomes a matter of kill or be killed. IMHO, that is.

When people have no religion, they just have no religion
They don’t look for something to substitute for it

 

[rightwinger]

What makes you think that all the doctors in place today are going to disappear overnight if universal health plans take effect? I know mine is going to be around until he retires, which I hope is after I kick. I've had him for years. The specialists, the ancillary services like PT, etc. Where do you think those people are going to go? It's ludicrous.

I had a job for years with the medical association, so I know how doctors in private practice think. They worked really hard and spent money up the wazoo to get a medical degree and training. They are going to charge as much as they can get away with and enjoy making millions--most doctors do--but the student loans, the astronomical malpractice insurance, overhead for their offices, red tape trying to collect from insurance companies.....it isn't a walk in the park, either.

The docs will still be here and they won't have lost their abilities because Uncle Sam is reimbursing them.

The government will be telling them who they have to provide services too as well.

Those who aren't of High Quality, will still be around, those who really know their shit, will be available only to well-connected political operatives. Right now, the Maha Rushdie is undergoing a health crisis. What chance would he have that he could get a quality doctor as a senior citizen and a dissident if Sanders was ruling?

those who really know their shit, will be available only to well-connected political operatives.
Utter horsehockey. Of course, there are doctors out there now in major metropolitan areas who don't accept the low paying plans, and they can find enough rich patients to keep them afloat. But in most areas of the country, if a doctor doesn't accept Medicare or some of the HMO's and insurance plans, they will not have any patients.

You don't get it. Once we have a fully socialized system, health care providers will be de facto employees of the State. The idea of private doctors offices and self employed physicians will be a thing of the past. If you are President Sanders or someone else of a favored social group, you will be treated by Harvey Cushing, Marcus Welby or Theodor Morrell. If you aren't, you'd get to see Vinnie Boombatz, Nick Riviera or Joe Mengele. And that's the key to cost savings in a socialist plan. The plan's overseers figure that a large number of the people will just stay home and not bother with medical treatment when they see who their provider will be.

Is that how Medicare works? No.

No it isn't.

But "Medicare for All" is just the name of the program, it actually isn't related to the current Medicare program at all.

The current Medicare program is divided in to section, Med A, B, C, D, and also makes it advisable that recipients have Medicare Supplemental plans. Further there are large exclusions and limitations to actual Medicare.

The Risky Sanders Scheme has little in common with Traditional Medicare , except for the fact that it borrows the program's name.

Maybe that will be the model

You will have Medicare to cover the bulk of your needs and a supplemental to fill the gaps

 

[Nosmo King]

In a violent, droolingly triggered response to Mini-Mike proving CrAzY Bernie is a liar and hypocrite, CrAzY Bernie said it is very common for Vermont folks to have vacation houses on Lake Champlain. If you lived in Vermont and had the cash, your vacation house would be in Florida.

Take a peek at 'best known millionaire socialist' Bernie Sanders' three homes | Daily Mail Online



Folks, do your homework, the only reason CrAzY Bernie ever runs is to skim money from campaign funds into his bank accounts.

If you hate corruption so much, why do you support Trump?

 

[Polishprince]

The government will be telling them who they have to provide services too as well.

Those who aren't of High Quality, will still be around, those who really know their shit, will be available only to well-connected political operatives. Right now, the Maha Rushdie is undergoing a health crisis. What chance would he have that he could get a quality doctor as a senior citizen and a dissident if Sanders was ruling?

those who really know their shit, will be available only to well-connected political operatives.
Utter horsehockey. Of course, there are doctors out there now in major metropolitan areas who don't accept the low paying plans, and they can find enough rich patients to keep them afloat. But in most areas of the country, if a doctor doesn't accept Medicare or some of the HMO's and insurance plans, they will not have any patients.

You don't get it. Once we have a fully socialized system, health care providers will be de facto employees of the State. The idea of private doctors offices and self employed physicians will be a thing of the past. If you are President Sanders or someone else of a favored social group, you will be treated by Harvey Cushing, Marcus Welby or Theodor Morrell. If you aren't, you'd get to see Vinnie Boombatz, Nick Riviera or Joe Mengele. And that's the key to cost savings in a socialist plan. The plan's overseers figure that a large number of the people will just stay home and not bother with medical treatment when they see who their provider will be.

Is that how Medicare works? No.

No it isn't.

But "Medicare for All" is just the name of the program, it actually isn't related to the current Medicare program at all.

The current Medicare program is divided in to section, Med A, B, C, D, and also makes it advisable that recipients have Medicare Supplemental plans. Further there are large exclusions and limitations to actual Medicare.

The Risky Sanders Scheme has little in common with Traditional Medicare , except for the fact that it borrows the program's name.

I think single payer is the only way to bring healthcare costs down. You do realize, don't you, that in our "free" capitalist society, those folks selling drugs, medical equipment, etc. are making money hand over fist? They are charging what the market will bear, and the market needs it so they pay it and pass the costs on to the consumers. Which is why our premiums are in the stratosphere. There is no need of it. A single payer that refuses to play the game will win or the medical community will go bankrupt.

It's too bad that's how they need to be reigned in, but capitalism sometimes does. Healthcare, saving lives, apparently can't be administered fairly via a capitalist system any longer. Obamacare came about because the premiums were rising so sharply. It wasn't Obamacare that pushed them up. So far, it sure as hell hasn't brought them down either, because private insurance companies are still feeding the greed.

Okay, maybe I'm wrong, but that's how I see it.

I have no doubt that you are right, that a government monopsony in healthcare can bring down costs if there is government leadership committed to it. But there is the question of quality, and this is where this system fails. Will new drugs and treatments be introduced at the same rate under such a system? Or would the innovators who would be working on a new pill for male pattern baldness, ED or other plague inflicting mankind, figure to use their skills in innovation to develop a new, better version of "Grand Theft Auto" or "Space Invaders"?

 

[Polishprince]

The government will be telling them who they have to provide services too as well.

Those who aren't of High Quality, will still be around, those who really know their shit, will be available only to well-connected political operatives. Right now, the Maha Rushdie is undergoing a health crisis. What chance would he have that he could get a quality doctor as a senior citizen and a dissident if Sanders was ruling?

those who really know their shit, will be available only to well-connected political operatives.
Utter horsehockey. Of course, there are doctors out there now in major metropolitan areas who don't accept the low paying plans, and they can find enough rich patients to keep them afloat. But in most areas of the country, if a doctor doesn't accept Medicare or some of the HMO's and insurance plans, they will not have any patients.

You don't get it. Once we have a fully socialized system, health care providers will be de facto employees of the State. The idea of private doctors offices and self employed physicians will be a thing of the past. If you are President Sanders or someone else of a favored social group, you will be treated by Harvey Cushing, Marcus Welby or Theodor Morrell. If you aren't, you'd get to see Vinnie Boombatz, Nick Riviera or Joe Mengele. And that's the key to cost savings in a socialist plan. The plan's overseers figure that a large number of the people will just stay home and not bother with medical treatment when they see who their provider will be.

Is that how Medicare works? No.

No it isn't.

But "Medicare for All" is just the name of the program, it actually isn't related to the current Medicare program at all.

The current Medicare program is divided in to section, Med A, B, C, D, and also makes it advisable that recipients have Medicare Supplemental plans. Further there are large exclusions and limitations to actual Medicare.

The Risky Sanders Scheme has little in common with Traditional Medicare , except for the fact that it borrows the program's name.

Maybe that will be the model

You will have Medicare to cover the bulk of your needs and a supplemental to fill the gaps

That is not the way Crazy Bernie describes his dream for Socialized Medicine at all, RW.

Sanders and his Leftard cronies describe a system with no premiums, no deductibles and no copays

 

[rightwinger]

those who really know their shit, will be available only to well-connected political operatives.
Utter horsehockey. Of course, there are doctors out there now in major metropolitan areas who don't accept the low paying plans, and they can find enough rich patients to keep them afloat. But in most areas of the country, if a doctor doesn't accept Medicare or some of the HMO's and insurance plans, they will not have any patients.

You don't get it. Once we have a fully socialized system, health care providers will be de facto employees of the State. The idea of private doctors offices and self employed physicians will be a thing of the past. If you are President Sanders or someone else of a favored social group, you will be treated by Harvey Cushing, Marcus Welby or Theodor Morrell. If you aren't, you'd get to see Vinnie Boombatz, Nick Riviera or Joe Mengele. And that's the key to cost savings in a socialist plan. The plan's overseers figure that a large number of the people will just stay home and not bother with medical treatment when they see who their provider will be.

Is that how Medicare works? No.

No it isn't.

But "Medicare for All" is just the name of the program, it actually isn't related to the current Medicare program at all.

The current Medicare program is divided in to section, Med A, B, C, D, and also makes it advisable that recipients have Medicare Supplemental plans. Further there are large exclusions and limitations to actual Medicare.

The Risky Sanders Scheme has little in common with Traditional Medicare , except for the fact that it borrows the program's name.

Maybe that will be the model

You will have Medicare to cover the bulk of your needs and a supplemental to fill the gaps

That is not the way Crazy Bernie describes his dream for Socialized Medicine at all, RW.

Sanders and his Leftard cronies describe a system with no premiums, no deductibles and no copays

Of course Bernie wants universal healthcare
Medicare for all is the path to get there

 

[beautress]

In a violent, droolingly triggered response to Mini-Mike proving CrAzY Bernie is a liar and hypocrite, CrAzY Bernie said it is very common for Vermont folks to have vacation houses on Lake Champlain. If you lived in Vermont and had the cash, your vacation house would be in Florida.

Take a peek at 'best known millionaire socialist' Bernie Sanders' three homes | Daily Mail Online



Folks, do your homework, the only reason CrAzY Bernie ever runs is to skim money from campaign funds into his bank accounts.

It makes perfect sense for him to have a little place in DC, since he has been working there for thirty years or so. Probably cheaper in the long run than a motel room or renting. He lives in Burlington, so why should he NOT have a home there?

How many people own vacation camps/cottages/homes? Millions.

There is absolutely no reason to accuse him of skimming campaign funds. He became a millionaire for the first time in 2016 from the proceeds from his book.

You jealous? Write a book. You make it sound like he's in the flippin' "One percent" he's always going on about. But that ain't the case. He's solidly middle class. Bloomberg wouldn't let him in their golf club.

I won't vote for Bernie, even if he's the alternative to Trump. But your stuff is petty, misleading horseshit.

Most people on the right are concerned about Bernie's past association with the Communist Party, and that he's disguising his real intentions with feel-good stuff. I could care less whether Bernie lived in a Federal housing complex or had 10 residences worldwide. The "Socialists" have targeted changes in the Constitution that would bankrupt what little we have left in Social Security. And we're tired of being blood-hated by Democrats. The Democrats are a national and an international disgrace for championing environmental lies thanks to Vice President Al Gore's speeches now unwanted in Europe, because they're based on false narratives, and House Democrats Pelosi Shiff and Nadler for perpetrating with attitude false narratives of President Trump's alleged ties with Russia that do not and never have existed. The Europeans also know all about Hillary and Barack's hatred for Allies and love for Axis powers that still hate Jewish heritage populations and individuals and still blather words "wiping them off the face of the map." What that Party really hate is people who do right and still win in the business world. It never occurs to Democrats that those who do well in this nation are hard workers who also make wise investments and scrimp to do so.

Socialism is merely a stepping stone to Bolsheviki murders of top opposition leaders, and later all farmers they were so willing to starve out for disagreeing with Bolsheviks. It was diabolical murders in Ukraine that caused the people there to flag down Stalin's war against farmers.

We never care to see that in this country.

Bernie is not going to murder anyone, B. This is not an authoritarian takeover if he is freely elected. But you don't have to warn me about Bernie. I'm smart enough to read between the lines. No, he's not Stalin or anything else, but he is a committed socialist and far too radical to get my vote.

As far as being afraid of authoritarian antics if Bernie wins, it's hard to believe from you, since Trump has been overstepping the line and abusing his power since he got in office and he does it with boldfaced lies and bravado, too.

So please don't preach about how bad the socialists are.

It's the second generation that concerns me, ma'am. And when a society has no religion other than the state, control for some reason becomes a matter of kill or be killed. IMHO, that is.

When people have no religion, they just have no religion
They don’t look for something to substitute for it

"None are so blind as those who will not see."

 

[Polishprince]

You don't get it. Once we have a fully socialized system, health care providers will be de facto employees of the State. The idea of private doctors offices and self employed physicians will be a thing of the past. If you are President Sanders or someone else of a favored social group, you will be treated by Harvey Cushing, Marcus Welby or Theodor Morrell. If you aren't, you'd get to see Vinnie Boombatz, Nick Riviera or Joe Mengele. And that's the key to cost savings in a socialist plan. The plan's overseers figure that a large number of the people will just stay home and not bother with medical treatment when they see who their provider will be.

Is that how Medicare works? No.

No it isn't.

But "Medicare for All" is just the name of the program, it actually isn't related to the current Medicare program at all.

The current Medicare program is divided in to section, Med A, B, C, D, and also makes it advisable that recipients have Medicare Supplemental plans. Further there are large exclusions and limitations to actual Medicare.

The Risky Sanders Scheme has little in common with Traditional Medicare , except for the fact that it borrows the program's name.

Maybe that will be the model

You will have Medicare to cover the bulk of your needs and a supplemental to fill the gaps

That is not the way Crazy Bernie describes his dream for Socialized Medicine at all, RW.

Sanders and his Leftard cronies describe a system with no premiums, no deductibles and no copays

Of course Bernie wants universal healthcare
Medicare for all is the path to get there

So "Medicare for All" is a program that Sanders has designed to fail upon launching, so that people will be willing to accept an even more radical scheme?

 

[rightwinger]

Sanders lakefront resort...
Oh for the life of a multimillionaire

View attachment 307939

Nice place. Thanks for sharing. Everybody on the Eastern Board would like a house with a view of the Lake like that one. That Bernie has achieved the American Dream is impressive. That he has a past relationship with the Communist Party is what worries me, rightwinger.

My vacation house is bigger

Melania was born a Communist. That should worry you more

 

[beautress]

Sanders lakefront resort...
Oh for the life of a multimillionaire

View attachment 307939

Nice place. Thanks for sharing. Everybody on the Eastern Board would like a house with a view of the Lake like that one. That Bernie has achieved the American Dream is impressive. That he has a past relationship with the Communist Party is what worries me, rightwinger.

My vacation house is bigger

Melania was born a Communist. That should worry you more

Why? Mr. Trump changed her entire outlook on stuff.

 

[Polishprince]

Sanders lakefront resort...
Oh for the life of a multimillionaire

View attachment 307939

Nice place. Thanks for sharing. Everybody on the Eastern Board would like a house with a view of the Lake like that one. That Bernie has achieved the American Dream is impressive. That he has a past relationship with the Communist Party is what worries me, rightwinger.

My vacation house is bigger

Melania was born a Communist. That should worry you more

The first lady was born in a Communist country, not "born a communist".

 

[OldLady]

those who really know their shit, will be available only to well-connected political operatives.
Utter horsehockey. Of course, there are doctors out there now in major metropolitan areas who don't accept the low paying plans, and they can find enough rich patients to keep them afloat. But in most areas of the country, if a doctor doesn't accept Medicare or some of the HMO's and insurance plans, they will not have any patients.

You don't get it. Once we have a fully socialized system, health care providers will be de facto employees of the State. The idea of private doctors offices and self employed physicians will be a thing of the past. If you are President Sanders or someone else of a favored social group, you will be treated by Harvey Cushing, Marcus Welby or Theodor Morrell. If you aren't, you'd get to see Vinnie Boombatz, Nick Riviera or Joe Mengele. And that's the key to cost savings in a socialist plan. The plan's overseers figure that a large number of the people will just stay home and not bother with medical treatment when they see who their provider will be.

Is that how Medicare works? No.

No it isn't.

But "Medicare for All" is just the name of the program, it actually isn't related to the current Medicare program at all.

The current Medicare program is divided in to section, Med A, B, C, D, and also makes it advisable that recipients have Medicare Supplemental plans. Further there are large exclusions and limitations to actual Medicare.

The Risky Sanders Scheme has little in common with Traditional Medicare , except for the fact that it borrows the program's name.

I think single payer is the only way to bring healthcare costs down. You do realize, don't you, that in our "free" capitalist society, those folks selling drugs, medical equipment, etc. are making money hand over fist? They are charging what the market will bear, and the market needs it so they pay it and pass the costs on to the consumers. Which is why our premiums are in the stratosphere. There is no need of it. A single payer that refuses to play the game will win or the medical community will go bankrupt.

It's too bad that's how they need to be reigned in, but capitalism sometimes does. Healthcare, saving lives, apparently can't be administered fairly via a capitalist system any longer. Obamacare came about because the premiums were rising so sharply. It wasn't Obamacare that pushed them up. So far, it sure as hell hasn't brought them down either, because private insurance companies are still feeding the greed.

Okay, maybe I'm wrong, but that's how I see it.

I have no doubt that you are right, that a government monopsony in healthcare can bring down costs if there is government leadership committed to it. But there is the question of quality, and this is where this system fails. Will new drugs and treatments be introduced at the same rate under such a system? Or would the innovators who would be working on a new pill for male pattern baldness, ED or other plague inflicting mankind, figure to use their skills in innovation to develop a new, better version of "Grand Theft Auto" or "Space Invaders"?

Believe it or not, there are actually dedicated people who go into those areas to create new treatments and drugs because they want to save lives. Go figure.
I don't really buy the quality argument; I think it is an objection put up by big pharma so they can continue to make obscene profits.

 

[Maxdeath]

The government will be telling them who they have to provide services too as well.

Those who aren't of High Quality, will still be around, those who really know their shit, will be available only to well-connected political operatives. Right now, the Maha Rushdie is undergoing a health crisis. What chance would he have that he could get a quality doctor as a senior citizen and a dissident if Sanders was ruling?

those who really know their shit, will be available only to well-connected political operatives.
Utter horsehockey. Of course, there are doctors out there now in major metropolitan areas who don't accept the low paying plans, and they can find enough rich patients to keep them afloat. But in most areas of the country, if a doctor doesn't accept Medicare or some of the HMO's and insurance plans, they will not have any patients.

You don't get it. Once we have a fully socialized system, health care providers will be de facto employees of the State. The idea of private doctors offices and self employed physicians will be a thing of the past. If you are President Sanders or someone else of a favored social group, you will be treated by Harvey Cushing, Marcus Welby or Theodor Morrell. If you aren't, you'd get to see Vinnie Boombatz, Nick Riviera or Joe Mengele. And that's the key to cost savings in a socialist plan. The plan's overseers figure that a large number of the people will just stay home and not bother with medical treatment when they see who their provider will be.

Is that how Medicare works? No.

No it isn't.

But "Medicare for All" is just the name of the program, it actually isn't related to the current Medicare program at all.

The current Medicare program is divided in to section, Med A, B, C, D, and also makes it advisable that recipients have Medicare Supplemental plans. Further there are large exclusions and limitations to actual Medicare.

The Risky Sanders Scheme has little in common with Traditional Medicare , except for the fact that it borrows the program's name.

I think single payer is the only way to bring healthcare costs down. You do realize, don't you, that in our "free" capitalist society, those folks selling drugs, medical equipment, etc. are making money hand over fist? They are charging what the market will bear, and the market needs it so they pay it and pass the costs on to the consumers. Which is why our premiums are in the stratosphere. There is no need of it. A single payer that refuses to play the game will win or the medical community will go bankrupt.

It's too bad that's how they need to be reigned in, but capitalism sometimes does. Healthcare, saving lives, apparently can't be administered fairly via a capitalist system any longer. Obamacare came about because the premiums were rising so sharply. It wasn't Obamacare that pushed them up. So far, it sure as hell hasn't brought them down either, because private insurance companies are still feeding the greed.

Okay, maybe I'm wrong, but that's how I see it.

A large part of the costs for healthcare is testing to make sure that a doctor is not sued.
Part of the reason for pharmaceutical companies charging so much is a number of factors. One is you can't pay a researcher $10.00 and hour and expect any competence. Two you pay researchers for years without anything to show for it. Three the FDA requires years of testing before a drug can be approved for sale. Finally if you can prove that someone took a drug and it had adverse effects you can sue.
ACA came about not because of rising costs it came about as a pathway to single payer. It in fact raised healthcare costs.

 

[Polishprince]

those who really know their shit, will be available only to well-connected political operatives.
Utter horsehockey. Of course, there are doctors out there now in major metropolitan areas who don't accept the low paying plans, and they can find enough rich patients to keep them afloat. But in most areas of the country, if a doctor doesn't accept Medicare or some of the HMO's and insurance plans, they will not have any patients.

You don't get it. Once we have a fully socialized system, health care providers will be de facto employees of the State. The idea of private doctors offices and self employed physicians will be a thing of the past. If you are President Sanders or someone else of a favored social group, you will be treated by Harvey Cushing, Marcus Welby or Theodor Morrell. If you aren't, you'd get to see Vinnie Boombatz, Nick Riviera or Joe Mengele. And that's the key to cost savings in a socialist plan. The plan's overseers figure that a large number of the people will just stay home and not bother with medical treatment when they see who their provider will be.

Is that how Medicare works? No.

No it isn't.

But "Medicare for All" is just the name of the program, it actually isn't related to the current Medicare program at all.

The current Medicare program is divided in to section, Med A, B, C, D, and also makes it advisable that recipients have Medicare Supplemental plans. Further there are large exclusions and limitations to actual Medicare.

The Risky Sanders Scheme has little in common with Traditional Medicare , except for the fact that it borrows the program's name.

I think single payer is the only way to bring healthcare costs down. You do realize, don't you, that in our "free" capitalist society, those folks selling drugs, medical equipment, etc. are making money hand over fist? They are charging what the market will bear, and the market needs it so they pay it and pass the costs on to the consumers. Which is why our premiums are in the stratosphere. There is no need of it. A single payer that refuses to play the game will win or the medical community will go bankrupt.

It's too bad that's how they need to be reigned in, but capitalism sometimes does. Healthcare, saving lives, apparently can't be administered fairly via a capitalist system any longer. Obamacare came about because the premiums were rising so sharply. It wasn't Obamacare that pushed them up. So far, it sure as hell hasn't brought them down either, because private insurance companies are still feeding the greed.

Okay, maybe I'm wrong, but that's how I see it.

A large part of the costs for healthcare is testing to make sure that a doctor is not sued.
Part of the reason for pharmaceutical companies charging so much is a number of factors. One is you can't pay a researcher $10.00 and hour and expect any competence. Two you pay researchers for years without anything to show for it. Three the FDA requires years of testing before a drug can be approved for sale. Finally if you can prove that someone took a drug and it had adverse effects you can sue.
ACA came about not because of rising costs it came about as a pathway to single payer. It in fact raised healthcare costs.

A key aspect of Medical Research,or any research for that matter, is deciding which projects to pursue and which ones not to. A fully socialized system puts that aspect in the hands of bureaucrats and politicians. Our current system puts it in the hands of investors. The program "Shark Tank" be different if those with proposals were trying to convince politicians.

 

[imawhosure]

Healthcare is very much tied up in that now that medicine is more than leeches and potions made in the backroom from roots. Everyone should be able to walk into a doctor's office and receive care without worry about having enough left to buy groceries.

One point that Libs and other Marxists never bring into question is who will be able to see QUALITY health care providers and who will be stuck seeing mediocre physicians who don't know your ass from a hole in the ground. The liberal theorem is that all doctors are equal is absurd.

What makes you think that all the doctors in place today are going to disappear overnight if universal health plans take effect? I know mine is going to be around until he retires, which I hope is after I kick. I've had him for years. The specialists, the ancillary services like PT, etc. Where do you think those people are going to go? It's ludicrous.

I had a job for years with the medical association, so I know how doctors in private practice think. They worked really hard and spent money up the wazoo to get a medical degree and training. They are going to charge as much as they can get away with and enjoy making millions--most doctors do--but the student loans, the astronomical malpractice insurance, overhead for their offices, red tape trying to collect from insurance companies.....it isn't a walk in the park, either.

The docs will still be here and they won't have lost their abilities because Uncle Sam is reimbursing them.

The government will be telling them who they have to provide services too as well.

Those who aren't of High Quality, will still be around, those who really know their shit, will be available only to well-connected political operatives. Right now, the Maha Rushdie is undergoing a health crisis. What chance would he have that he could get a quality doctor as a senior citizen and a dissident if Sanders was ruling?

those who really know their shit, will be available only to well-connected political operatives.
Utter horsehockey. Of course, there are doctors out there now in major metropolitan areas who don't accept the low paying plans, and they can find enough rich patients to keep them afloat. But in most areas of the country, if a doctor doesn't accept Medicare or some of the HMO's and insurance plans, they will not have any patients.

See, this is the Socialists mantra, but here is what they leave out------------------->you can CHOOSE your patients if you wish, or you can CHOOSE to let the government provide them for you if you so desire.

Under the BERNARD plan, you have NO FREEDOM! You take what is given to you, at whatever they want to pay, and either like it or leave!

It is the same for every Democratic idea! You want an electric car today, who is stopping you? You want a fossil fueled base car, so be it. You want to take your voucher to another school, yes you can! Under their ideas, you are STUCK!

They are ANTI-choice on everything but abortion, plain and simple. The more choices available to you, the more free you are. That is how America works!

Their whole idea is to CONSTRICT your choices in one area at a time, that is how they always move the ball down the field. Before you know it, more and more choices are restricted by them, the ruling pointy-headed class who is going to guide your lives.

 

[depotoo]

In a violent, droolingly triggered response to Mini-Mike proving CrAzY Bernie is a liar and hypocrite, CrAzY Bernie said it is very common for Vermont folks to have vacation houses on Lake Champlain. If you lived in Vermont and had the cash, your vacation house would be in Florida.

Take a peek at 'best known millionaire socialist' Bernie Sanders' three homes | Daily Mail Online



Folks, do your homework, the only reason CrAzY Bernie ever runs is to skim money from campaign funds into his bank accounts.

It makes perfect sense for him to have a little place in DC, since he has been working there for thirty years or so. Probably cheaper in the long run than a motel room or renting. He lives in Burlington, so why should he NOT have a home there?

How many people own vacation camps/cottages/homes? Millions.

There is absolutely no reason to accuse him of skimming campaign funds. He became a millionaire for the first time in 2016 from the proceeds from his book.

You jealous? Write a book. You make it sound like he's in the flippin' "One percent" he's always going on about. But that ain't the case. He's solidly middle class. Bloomberg wouldn't let him in their golf club.

I won't vote for Bernie, even if he's the alternative to Trump. But your stuff is petty, misleading horseshit.

No, Sanders isn't "middle class" at all, he extremely wealthy,a multimillionaire. He isn't as wealthy as his fellow lib, Mini-Mike, but he isn't one of the common people. If he is able to ascend to the Presidency and implement his Risky Medical Scheme, he won't be one of the ones standing in line, he'll still be able to get quality care.

Crazy Bernie has made a bundle off of selling his books to weak minded people, he's a grifter.

What do you say about Art of the Deal? Is Trump a grifter too for writing books?

If it's the Universal Healthcare that's got you worked up, it's coming whether it's Bernie or someone else, and it's about fucking time. It won't be anywhere near as bad as your people are making it out to be, either. You make it sound as if average people now can afford good healthcare. Wake up and smell the coffee, buddy. I'm in the process of applying for Medicare right now. I've been uninsured for several years because of the mess Republicans turned Obamacare into. It should have been Universal Healthcare then, and the compromises have turned it into the biggest shit show ever. So keep your fat mouth shut and let a plan that works take effect. We are endowed with certain inalienable rights, and one of them is life. Healthcare is very much tied up in that now that medicine is more than leeches and potions made in the backroom from roots. Everyone should be able to walk into a doctor's office and receive care without worry about having enough left to buy groceries.

Trump did not write Art of the Deal he had a ghost writer.
The ghost writer said that when he gave Trump a draft of the book to approve, his only comment was that TRUMP on the cover needed to be bigger

Yet Trump makes over a million in royalties from it every year.

Has he ever claimed to hate capitalism like Bernie?

 

[OldLady]

those who really know their shit, will be available only to well-connected political operatives.
Utter horsehockey. Of course, there are doctors out there now in major metropolitan areas who don't accept the low paying plans, and they can find enough rich patients to keep them afloat. But in most areas of the country, if a doctor doesn't accept Medicare or some of the HMO's and insurance plans, they will not have any patients.

You don't get it. Once we have a fully socialized system, health care providers will be de facto employees of the State. The idea of private doctors offices and self employed physicians will be a thing of the past. If you are President Sanders or someone else of a favored social group, you will be treated by Harvey Cushing, Marcus Welby or Theodor Morrell. If you aren't, you'd get to see Vinnie Boombatz, Nick Riviera or Joe Mengele. And that's the key to cost savings in a socialist plan. The plan's overseers figure that a large number of the people will just stay home and not bother with medical treatment when they see who their provider will be.

Is that how Medicare works? No.

No it isn't.

But "Medicare for All" is just the name of the program, it actually isn't related to the current Medicare program at all.

The current Medicare program is divided in to section, Med A, B, C, D, and also makes it advisable that recipients have Medicare Supplemental plans. Further there are large exclusions and limitations to actual Medicare.

The Risky Sanders Scheme has little in common with Traditional Medicare , except for the fact that it borrows the program's name.

I think single payer is the only way to bring healthcare costs down. You do realize, don't you, that in our "free" capitalist society, those folks selling drugs, medical equipment, etc. are making money hand over fist? They are charging what the market will bear, and the market needs it so they pay it and pass the costs on to the consumers. Which is why our premiums are in the stratosphere. There is no need of it. A single payer that refuses to play the game will win or the medical community will go bankrupt.

It's too bad that's how they need to be reigned in, but capitalism sometimes does. Healthcare, saving lives, apparently can't be administered fairly via a capitalist system any longer. Obamacare came about because the premiums were rising so sharply. It wasn't Obamacare that pushed them up. So far, it sure as hell hasn't brought them down either, because private insurance companies are still feeding the greed.

Okay, maybe I'm wrong, but that's how I see it.

A large part of the costs for healthcare is testing to make sure that a doctor is not sued.
Part of the reason for pharmaceutical companies charging so much is a number of factors. One is you can't pay a researcher $10.00 and hour and expect any competence. Two you pay researchers for years without anything to show for it. Three the FDA requires years of testing before a drug can be approved for sale. Finally if you can prove that someone took a drug and it had adverse effects you can sue.
ACA came about not because of rising costs it came about as a pathway to single payer. It in fact raised healthcare costs.

Malpractice suits are certainly part of it, I agree. Billions in unnecessary testing to cover physicians' fannies.

Pharmaceutical research and development has always gone on and has saved countless lives. Yes, it costs money. Why does it suddenly cost so much more when all the factors you cited have been around for many decades?

Big Pharma is getting rich. Don't let them fool you. They get their pound of flesh by being able to charge for the patented brand name for a certain number of years before a generic can be manufactured which makes its cost within reach of the average American. Don't cry too hard for them. They ALL want to be the ones to develop the breakthrough drug to stop AIDS or what have you. It will make them plenty rich. They won't stop research and development under any circumstances.

 

[OldLady]

Healthcare is very much tied up in that now that medicine is more than leeches and potions made in the backroom from roots. Everyone should be able to walk into a doctor's office and receive care without worry about having enough left to buy groceries.

One point that Libs and other Marxists never bring into question is who will be able to see QUALITY health care providers and who will be stuck seeing mediocre physicians who don't know your ass from a hole in the ground. The liberal theorem is that all doctors are equal is absurd.

What makes you think that all the doctors in place today are going to disappear overnight if universal health plans take effect? I know mine is going to be around until he retires, which I hope is after I kick. I've had him for years. The specialists, the ancillary services like PT, etc. Where do you think those people are going to go? It's ludicrous.

I had a job for years with the medical association, so I know how doctors in private practice think. They worked really hard and spent money up the wazoo to get a medical degree and training. They are going to charge as much as they can get away with and enjoy making millions--most doctors do--but the student loans, the astronomical malpractice insurance, overhead for their offices, red tape trying to collect from insurance companies.....it isn't a walk in the park, either.

The docs will still be here and they won't have lost their abilities because Uncle Sam is reimbursing them.

The government will be telling them who they have to provide services too as well.

Those who aren't of High Quality, will still be around, those who really know their shit, will be available only to well-connected political operatives. Right now, the Maha Rushdie is undergoing a health crisis. What chance would he have that he could get a quality doctor as a senior citizen and a dissident if Sanders was ruling?

those who really know their shit, will be available only to well-connected political operatives.
Utter horsehockey. Of course, there are doctors out there now in major metropolitan areas who don't accept the low paying plans, and they can find enough rich patients to keep them afloat. But in most areas of the country, if a doctor doesn't accept Medicare or some of the HMO's and insurance plans, they will not have any patients.

See, this is the Socialists mantra, but here is what they leave out------------------->you can CHOOSE your patients if you wish, or you can CHOOSE to let the government provide them for you if you so desire.

Under the BERNARD plan, you have NO FREEDOM! You take what is given to you, at whatever they want to pay, and either like it or leave!

It is the same for every Democratic idea! You want an electric car today, who is stopping you? You want a fossil fueled base car, so be it. You want to take your voucher to another school, yes you can! Under their ideas, you are STUCK!

They are ANTI-choice on everything but abortion, plain and simple. The more choices available to you, the more free you are. That is how America works!

Their whole idea is to CONSTRICT your choices in one area at a time, that is how they always move the ball down the field. Before you know it, more and more choices are restricted by them, the ruling pointy-headed class who is going to guide your lives.

Sounds like a Breitbart rant to me. There is no reason why the government would "assign" patients to a specific doctor. I don't think you can show me a credible link showing that in Bernie's "plan." Actually, I have never seen any of you put up Bernie's plan. Doubt if you even know what is in it. But don't feel bad; neither do I because I have already decided I won't vote for him.

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

In a violent, droolingly triggered response to Mini-Mike proving CrAzY Bernie is a liar and hypocrite, CrAzY Bernie said it is very common for Vermont folks to have vacation houses on Lake Champlain. If you lived in Vermont and had the cash, your vacation house would be in Florida.

Take a peek at 'best known millionaire socialist' Bernie Sanders' three homes | Daily Mail Online



Folks, do your homework, the only reason CrAzY Bernie ever runs is to skim money from campaign funds into his bank accounts.

Hate her all you want but when Hillary Clinton stated Bernie never a damn thing in his life, she was correct!

Bernie is another government tit sucking welfare state communist that live off the taxpayer dollar!

Name one damn thing Bernie owned that made Billions while employing people that made damn good money?

Sanders is just jealous of mini-Mike and Mike should offer Sanders Ten Billion Dollars to drop from the race to see what Sanders would do?