How many disasters before preperation is done

[Old Rocks]

New York Mostly Ignored Reports Warning Of Superstorm

Immediately after a disaster, a lot of talk. Then the estimates are made, and it is shoved under the table. Until the next disaster, when it is reliezed that the cost of preperation would have been less than a tenth of the cost of reapairing the damage. And then the talk begins again, with the same result.

 

[westwall]

New York Mostly Ignored Reports Warning Of Superstorm

Immediately after a disaster, a lot of talk. Then the estimates are made, and it is shoved under the table. Until the next disaster, when it is reliezed that the cost of preperation would have been less than a tenth of the cost of reapairing the damage. And then the talk begins again, with the same result.

That's the problem with trusting the government to have your best interests in mind. It doesn't. Government is populated mainly by the folks who do a good average job but are otherwise unremarkable.

They do a basic job (some of them do it very well) but in the long run they aren't going to risk their positions so will constantly opass the buck along to the next guy hoping that they don't get stuck with it.

When you do find a bureaucrat who does an exceptional job, let them know it and treasure them and nurture them because they are a very rare breed indeed!

 

[RetiredGySgt]

New York Mostly Ignored Reports Warning Of Superstorm

Immediately after a disaster, a lot of talk. Then the estimates are made, and it is shoved under the table. Until the next disaster, when it is reliezed that the cost of preperation would have been less than a tenth of the cost of reapairing the damage. And then the talk begins again, with the same result.

That's the problem with trusting the government to have your best interests in mind. It doesn't. Government is populated mainly by the folks who do a good average job but are otherwise unremarkable.

They do a basic job (some of them do it very well) but in the long run they aren't going to risk their positions so will constantly opass the buck along to the next guy hoping that they don't get stuck with it.

When you do find a bureaucrat who does an exceptional job, let them know it and treasure them and nurture them because they are a very rare breed indeed!

Government agencies promote to the idiot level. Someone will get promoted to high for their skill sets every time. Whats that called again?

Further it is NOT the federal Governments job, responsibility or tax base that should be "preparing" local areas for storms or disasters. That is the local or State JOB. There is NOTHING in the Constitution about the federal Government paying for local communities to meet local requirements for storm or disaster preparedness. Further we shouldn't be bailing them out after every one. It encourages building in areas that simply should not be built in.

My State is no different, we have houses and businesses building on barrier Islands that simple are not stable enough to support those communities or structures. and then when the sand gets washed away the State or fed bail them out with more unsound plans. And when Hurricanes hit the fed rebuilds everything in the same spots that are unsafe to begin with.

 

[Old Rocks]

The thrust of the article dealt with state and local governments. And one finds the same impediments at that level. More in some ways. A developer decides that there is major money to be made developing land in an unstable area, or one that has a history of weather washing over it. A local beauracrat says no, that is not a safe place for houses, and then finds that the developer has put major money to get someone elected that will terminate his job, or move him to a position where he cannot influence that development. Much easier to do, and more commonly done at the local level.

Money and sanity seldom mix. And people seldom look beyond the view and neighbors.

And there are areas, such as the one I live in that will have a catastrophic disaster for sure, but the time scale varies from 300 to 900 years apart. And the magnitude of the quakes we get were not even understood 20 years ago.

There are basic things that can be done, reasonable precautions a materials stored in appropriate places to alleviate the results of disasters. But, at present, if you are in the way of a hurricane, or flood, get out. For in very few places have any efforts been made to prepare for known disasters.

 

[skookerasbil]

Lets just up and build a giant bubble for the country...........could probably be done for a cool 1 trillion = problem solved.

 

[Wry Catcher]

New York Mostly Ignored Reports Warning Of Superstorm

Immediately after a disaster, a lot of talk. Then the estimates are made, and it is shoved under the table. Until the next disaster, when it is reliezed that the cost of preperation would have been less than a tenth of the cost of reapairing the damage. And then the talk begins again, with the same result.

That's the problem with trusting the government to have your best interests in mind. It doesn't. Government is populated mainly by the folks who do a good average job but are otherwise unremarkable.

They do a basic job (some of them do it very well) but in the long run they aren't going to risk their positions so will constantly opass the buck along to the next guy hoping that they don't get stuck with it.

When you do find a bureaucrat who does an exceptional job, let them know it and treasure them and nurture them because they are a very rare breed indeed!

There is some truth to what you wrote, though to single out government bureaucrats isn't fair and doesn't tell the whole story. A leader, and that includes middle management and even supervisors, is someone who has a vision, understands his/her responsibility and authority and never asks this question, "How does this effect me". This question is asked in both the private sector and the public sector too often!

 

[jasonnfree]

Lets just up and build a giant bubble for the country...........could probably be done for a cool 1 trillion = problem solved.

A trillion for a bubble for the country would be nice but Bush wasted that cool trillion on Iraq.

 

[whitehall]

What do you geniuses suggest? Should we undertake the construction of a gigantic sea wall along the Atlantic coast? Environmentalists might have a problem with that concept. How about suspending the Constitution for a while and force American property owners to abandon their coastal property? Which businesses should we authorize to operate on the coast? Just the gambling casinos?

 

[Mr. H.]

We've identified 100 year floodplains and plan accordingly. Why would 100 year hurricane zones be any different?

 

[westwall]

New York Mostly Ignored Reports Warning Of Superstorm

Immediately after a disaster, a lot of talk. Then the estimates are made, and it is shoved under the table. Until the next disaster, when it is reliezed that the cost of preperation would have been less than a tenth of the cost of reapairing the damage. And then the talk begins again, with the same result.

That's the problem with trusting the government to have your best interests in mind. It doesn't. Government is populated mainly by the folks who do a good average job but are otherwise unremarkable.

They do a basic job (some of them do it very well) but in the long run they aren't going to risk their positions so will constantly opass the buck along to the next guy hoping that they don't get stuck with it.

When you do find a bureaucrat who does an exceptional job, let them know it and treasure them and nurture them because they are a very rare breed indeed!

There is some truth to what you wrote, though to single out government bureaucrats isn't fair and doesn't tell the whole story. A leader, and that includes middle management and even supervisors, is someone who has a vision, understands his/her responsibility and authority and never asks this question, "How does this effect me". This question is asked in both the private sector and the public sector too often!

Your last comment is the important one IMO. In the private sector there are remedies for those who fail. In the Public Sector that is not the truth. The Public Employees are not responsible for you, your property, your loved ones. This has been adjudicated many times.

Nor should they be. However, they must also not be allowed to inhibit the ability of the individual to defend themselves or prepare for a disaster.

 

[westwall]

We've identified 100 year floodplains and plan accordingly. Why would 100 year hurricane zones be any different?

You could certainly build so that the storm surge wouldn't be a factor. However the randomness of the hurricane's strike would still entail wind damage.

 

[Old Rocks]

What do you geniuses suggest? Should we undertake the construction of a gigantic sea wall along the Atlantic coast? Environmentalists might have a problem with that concept. How about suspending the Constitution for a while and force American property owners to abandon their coastal property? Which businesses should we authorize to operate on the coast? Just the gambling casinos?

So you have to go hyperbolic even on the simplist points.

A store of sandbags adjacent to the subway entrances would not be a really big deal. A tree trimming program along the overhead power lines that are most vulneble to being downed by high winds is not budget busting for a utility.

What you are going to get is a situation where the Federal and State governments state that if you build in a certain area, you will get no help beyond that required to save lives. And the insurance companies will not insure your home for any amount.

And what does this have to do with the Constitution? Nothing in the Constitution states that the Government or Insurance companies have to cover you if you are stupid enough to build in a known hazard area.

The people operating and owning property in the at risk areas on the coast are going to have to realize that the rest of us cannot bail them out for rebuilding in an area known to be repeatedly in harms way.

Nobody says that people have to abandon their property. Just that the rest of us will not continue to pay to have the buildings continually rebuilt and destroyed. You have the money to do that, go ahead and build. And when that is destroyed or damaged, if you can afford it, build again.

 

[Old Rocks]

We've identified 100 year floodplains and plan accordingly. Why would 100 year hurricane zones be any different?

You could certainly build so that the storm surge wouldn't be a factor. However the randomness of the hurricane's strike would still entail wind damage.

One can build to alleviate wind damage. There are types of buildings that can survive even F-5's with minimal damage. Power lines can be re-inforced, trees trimmed or removed in vulneable areas, and sub-station raised above possible flood lines.

 

[whitehall]

What do you geniuses suggest? Should we undertake the construction of a gigantic sea wall along the Atlantic coast? Environmentalists might have a problem with that concept. How about suspending the Constitution for a while and force American property owners to abandon their coastal property? Which businesses should we authorize to operate on the coast? Just the gambling casinos?

So you have to go hyperbolic even on the simplist points.

A store of sandbags adjacent to the subway entrances would not be a really big deal. A tree trimming program along the overhead power lines that are most vulneble to being downed by high winds is not budget busting for a utility.

What you are going to get is a situation where the Federal and State governments state that if you build in a certain area, you will get no help beyond that required to save lives. And the insurance companies will not insure your home for any amount.

And what does this have to do with the Constitution? Nothing in the Constitution states that the Government or Insurance companies have to cover you if you are stupid enough to build in a known hazard area.

The people operating and owning property in the at risk areas on the coast are going to have to realize that the rest of us cannot bail them out for rebuilding in an area known to be repeatedly in harms way.

Nobody says that people have to abandon their property. Just that the rest of us will not continue to pay to have the buildings continually rebuilt and destroyed. You have the money to do that, go ahead and build. And when that is destroyed or damaged, if you can afford it, build again.

Interesting comparison to the Katrina disaster when they said it was all the federal government's fault. Everyone knew that decades of government funding that should have gone into levee maintenance went to graft and corruption but that was life in the Big Easy. The mayor let the school buses drown in a parking lot instead of being used to for evacuation and the police officers were videoed while looting a shoe store but we managed to blame FEMA and the Bush administration while it was politically convenient. Sooner or later the beautiful Outer Banks in North Carolina are going to get hit with the big one. What do we do about it? Sand bags and trimming trees?

 

[Old Rocks]

Once again, nonsense. Fema could have gone in days earlier and brought the people out of the stadiums. That kid that stole a bus and drove in proved that. FEMA, under the direction of a failed horse show manager totally failed in Katrina. And the man who should have been on Brown like white on rice was oblivious to what was going on.

Was Sandy handled better. Yes. Could it have been handled better than it was. Yes.

As for the Outer Banks. Those that have property there should realize that what they have they own on borrowed time. It will be destroyed sooner or later. And destroyed again after that. It is just a matter of time. As to what we do about it, we arrange to get the people out. The property is irrelevant.

 

[whitehall]

Once again, nonsense. Fema could have gone in days earlier and brought the people out of the stadiums. That kid that stole a bus and drove in proved that. FEMA, under the direction of a failed horse show manager totally failed in Katrina. And the man who should have been on Brown like white on rice was oblivious to what was going on.

Was Sandy handled better. Yes. Could it have been handled better than it was. Yes.

As for the Outer Banks. Those that have property there should realize that what they have they own on borrowed time. It will be destroyed sooner or later. And destroyed again after that. It is just a matter of time. As to what we do about it, we arrange to get the people out. The property is irrelevant.

Everybody lives on borrowed time. We need to take control of our own lives and take the risks that seem sustainable. If we depend on the fools who make the rules in the federal government to make life less hazardous we will be in a shit stew before we can say FEMA.

 

[westwall]

Once again, nonsense. Fema could have gone in days earlier and brought the people out of the stadiums. That kid that stole a bus and drove in proved that. FEMA, under the direction of a failed horse show manager totally failed in Katrina. And the man who should have been on Brown like white on rice was oblivious to what was going on.

Was Sandy handled better. Yes. Could it have been handled better than it was. Yes.

As for the Outer Banks. Those that have property there should realize that what they have they own on borrowed time. It will be destroyed sooner or later. And destroyed again after that. It is just a matter of time. As to what we do about it, we arrange to get the people out. The property is irrelevant.

I'm not trying to make this political by any means, but how exactly was Sandy handled "better" than Katrina?

 

[Trajan]

I am simply astounded at the $60 some odd Billion dollars that the Area is asking for. Sixty billion? That would run the entire state of NYC or California for 6 months...they are out of their minds.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Clearly, Bush's fault

 

[skookerasbil]

Whats that old saying........."Mans plans today are God's joke for tomorrow!!!"


All these idea's sound hunky dorey in a world where one does not have to factor in necessary tradeoffs. What is hysterical about this thread is that we've entered a time where there is no money to be proactive about this and the people with all the spectacular idea's are also the people who support economic policies that net our country growth rates of 1% to 2%. How laughable............cant have it both ways. There is no growth in the economy on the horizon and the government in power has no interest in changing that dynamic.

It is quite ironic to see environmentalists talking about being innovative on stuff like this while at the same time supporing tax policy that brings less revenue into the government. New York is in a death spriral as a state, just like California...........

Do You Live In A Death Spiral State? - Forbes




The politicians will do a couple of token measures in the near term, but there is no money whatsoever to be proactive with this stuff.



And ps......this idea that you can significantly minimize the forces of nature is comical............look at the Japanese. They spent tens of billions over the last 20 years on tsunami protections, which nature laughed at 2 years ago.