How Can There Be Multiple Gods and Multiple Truths?

[ChrisL]

Moses. One of the ridiculous characters I think of when I think what a farce the Bible really is. Lol. He was just a crazy man. Nothing more.

Just wondering...What do you know about him?

What's to know? There isn't even any solid evidence the man ever even existed for goodness sakes! That is Old Testament!!! Yikes!

We know for a fact he existed...sometime between 9000 and 15000 years ago give or take.

How do we know that?

 

[Indeependent]

There was a volcanic explosion, and ancient peoples would attribute something like that to "angry gods" and go sacrifice a virgin. Other "religious beliefs" are really not much different. If you've ever read the old testament, it is jam packed with bigotry, fear, and violence, as well as "sacrifices" and other such things. These beliefs are just borrowed from others before them, like Greek mythology, etc. Of course, when people traveled, these stories were spread, but they are still just stories with absolutely no solid evidence to back them, so I am going to go with science thanks.

There's nothing worse than wasting a virgin!

 

[ChrisL]

A character in a book based "loosely" upon a real individual? With a lot of myth and superstitions involved? Let's take a look at the Salem Witch trials period. Vampires anyone?

 

[Indeependent]

Moses. One of the ridiculous characters I think of when I think what a farce the Bible really is. Lol. He was just a crazy man. Nothing more.

Just wondering...What do you know about him?

What's to know? There isn't even any solid evidence the man ever even existed for goodness sakes! That is Old Testament!!! Yikes!

We know for a fact he existed...sometime between 9000 and 15000 years ago give or take.

I think it would be almost impossible to physically prove Moses existed.

 

[Boss]

It is a fluke that the earth just happens to be supportive of biologic

It's not just the thousands of things regarding Earth, it's the universe and the set of about 40 cosmological constants which had to be precise to amazing caliber in order for the hydrogen and helium to fuse and create carbon and stuff, for planets to exist, for anything material to exist.

You are now talking about a "fluke" of the following magnitude: If you went to the casinos and played roulette on a wheel with 10^80 numbers... that's 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 numbers on the wheel... little ball goes spinning around and you land on the one number that pays the jackpot.... and you do this 40-50 times in a row. Never missing the jackpot... and you have the basic "fluke" you're talking about. Realistic?

More realistic than an entity, yes. Most definitely. It just so happens that our earth provided a great environment for the development and branching out of different species, us being just one of many.

Get your mind off of "entities" for a sec... okay? Because when humans think about "entities" they tend to think in terms they comprehend... like creatures... like people... like imaginary or invisible deities... and that's probably not a good description of what created us. Instead, think about an energy form... like electricity or magnetic fields... wave function... frequency modulation... dark energy and dark matter... Elements of our universe we can't always observe but they are there.

This "branching out" is not happening now... obviously. And everything we look at with regard to how life functions work, says that it can't happen because DNA molecules which comprise every living thing, are tied to their amino acids and enzymes. Now. things can change within their genus family... that happens often but it's because the DNA enables remarkable adaptation of life to diversity in environment. The problem comes when you try to make that leap from one genus to another. There is just no biological mechanism that makes that possible... or we've not discovered it or observed any evidence to suggest it.

Even more interesting is what we see when we look at things on the subatomic level. It's really bizarre because our knowledge of physics appear to completely break down. Things are happening inside every atom that simply aren't supposed to happen. Atoms make up every material thing in the universe.

 

[Indeependent]

A character in a book based "loosely" upon a real individual? With a lot of myth and superstitions involved? Let's take a look at the Salem Witch trials period. Vampires anyone?

I'm interested in your definition of superstition.

 

[sealybobo]

It is a fluke that the earth just happens to be supportive of biologic
So you think that an invisible entity created the universe and the planets, etc.?

The Creator is neither Visible nor Invisible; we have no concept.
Can an arrow know the craftsman who made it?

But then he came and talked to Moses?

God communicated with Moshe when Moshe was 80 years old.
It took Moshe 60 years of meditation to attain such a state of tranquility where God's communication wouldn't cause Moshe to go insane or have his nervous system destroyed.
Notice at Mount Sinai where the Children of Israel cannot handle the communication and tell Moshe to tell God to communicate with them through Moshe and not directly with them.

Who is Moshe and how do you know this Moshe wasn't just a nut?

Moses; He attributed everything to God and never asked anybody for anything.

Except believe that he talked to God. Same thing Joseph Smith and Mohammad asked people to do. Or David koresh

 

[Gracie]

Do you agree with the following:

There is 1 God, with one path to Heaven.
There are multiple Gods, and many paths to Heaven.
Doesn't matter what you believe, as long as you believe in something?

If there are multiple Gods, who gets to decide what?
Why do they "disagree"?

Red is my answer.

 

[sealybobo]

I really cannot believe that people really and truly believe these things???

You don't have to because they're not telling you to.
Get it?
Those who follow the Torah don't try to convince anyone else to follow it.

This woman was on NPR talking about forced conversions and she pointed out Jews are not interested in converting

 

[Indeependent]

The Creator is neither Visible nor Invisible; we have no concept.
Can an arrow know the craftsman who made it?

But then he came and talked to Moses?

God communicated with Moshe when Moshe was 80 years old.
It took Moshe 60 years of meditation to attain such a state of tranquility where God's communication wouldn't cause Moshe to go insane or have his nervous system destroyed.
Notice at Mount Sinai where the Children of Israel cannot handle the communication and tell Moshe to tell God to communicate with them through Moshe and not directly with them.

Who is Moshe and how do you know this Moshe wasn't just a nut?

Moses; He attributed everything to God and never asked anybody for anything.

Except believe that he talked to God. Same thing Joseph Smith and Mohammad asked people to do. Or David koresh

Actually, God did most of the "talking".
I wish I knew the nature of the communication.

 

[ChrisL]

It is a fluke that the earth just happens to be supportive of biologic

It's not just the thousands of things regarding Earth, it's the universe and the set of about 40 cosmological constants which had to be precise to amazing caliber in order for the hydrogen and helium to fuse and create carbon and stuff, for planets to exist, for anything material to exist.

You are now talking about a "fluke" of the following magnitude: If you went to the casinos and played roulette on a wheel with 10^80 numbers... that's 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 numbers on the wheel... little ball goes spinning around and you land on the one number that pays the jackpot.... and you do this 40-50 times in a row. Never missing the jackpot... and you have the basic "fluke" you're talking about. Realistic?

More realistic than an entity, yes. Most definitely. It just so happens that our earth provided a great environment for the development and branching out of different species, us being just one of many.

Get your mind off of "entities" for a sec... okay? Because when humans think about "entities" they tend to think in terms they comprehend... like creatures... like people... like imaginary or invisible deities... and that's probably not a good description of what created us. Instead, think about an energy form... like electricity or magnetic fields... wave function... frequency modulation... dark energy and dark matter... Elements of our universe we can't always observe but they are there.

This "branching out" is not happening now... obviously. And everything we look at with regard to how life functions work, says that it can't happen because DNA molecules which comprise every living thing, are tied to their amino acids and enzymes. Now. things can change within their genus family... that happens often but it's because the DNA enables remarkable adaptation of life to diversity in environment. The problem comes when you try to make that leap from one genus to another. There is just no biological mechanism that makes that possible... or we've not discovered it or observed any evidence to suggest it.

Even more interesting is what we see when we look at things on the subatomic level. It's really bizarre because our knowledge of physics appear to completely break down. Things are happening inside every atom that simply aren't supposed to happen. Atoms make up every material thing in the universe.

It takes a long time for creatures to evolve, and they usually evolve to adapt to their environments. You would never "notice" it happening. Lol.

Breaking News, Analysis, Politics, Blogs, News Photos, Video, Tech Reviews - TIME.com

 

[Indeependent]

I really cannot believe that people really and truly believe these things???

You don't have to because they're not telling you to.
Get it?
Those who follow the Torah don't try to convince anyone else to follow it.

This woman was on NPR talking about forced conversions and she pointed out Jews are not interested in converting

We highly discourage such behavior.
I mean, the world is your oyster.

 

[ChrisL]

But then he came and talked to Moses?

God communicated with Moshe when Moshe was 80 years old.
It took Moshe 60 years of meditation to attain such a state of tranquility where God's communication wouldn't cause Moshe to go insane or have his nervous system destroyed.
Notice at Mount Sinai where the Children of Israel cannot handle the communication and tell Moshe to tell God to communicate with them through Moshe and not directly with them.

Who is Moshe and how do you know this Moshe wasn't just a nut?

Moses; He attributed everything to God and never asked anybody for anything.

Except believe that he talked to God. Same thing Joseph Smith and Mohammad asked people to do. Or David koresh

Actually, God did most of the "talking".
I wish I knew the nature of the communication.

So . . . you say you don't believe in man made religion, but you are basing your belief off of a book written by ignorant men thousands of years ago? Hmm. Makes sense.

 

[sealybobo]

It is a fluke that the earth just happens to be supportive of biologic

It's not just the thousands of things regarding Earth, it's the universe and the set of about 40 cosmological constants which had to be precise to amazing caliber in order for the hydrogen and helium to fuse and create carbon and stuff, for planets to exist, for anything material to exist.

You are now talking about a "fluke" of the following magnitude: If you went to the casinos and played roulette on a wheel with 10^80 numbers... that's 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 numbers on the wheel... little ball goes spinning around and you land on the one number that pays the jackpot.... and you do this 40-50 times in a row. Never missing the jackpot... and you have the basic "fluke" you're talking about. Realistic?

More realistic than an entity, yes. Most definitely. It just so happens that our earth provided a great environment for the development and branching out of different species, us being just one of many.

Get your mind off of "entities" for a sec... okay? Because when humans think about "entities" they tend to think in terms they comprehend... like creatures... like people... like imaginary or invisible deities... and that's probably not a good description of what created us. Instead, think about an energy form... like electricity or magnetic fields... wave function... frequency modulation... dark energy and dark matter... Elements of our universe we can't always observe but they are there.

This "branching out" is not happening now... obviously. And everything we look at with regard to how life functions work, says that it can't happen because DNA molecules which comprise every living thing, are tied to their amino acids and enzymes. Now. things can change within their genus family... that happens often but it's because the DNA enables remarkable adaptation of life to diversity in environment. The problem comes when you try to make that leap from one genus to another. There is just no biological mechanism that makes that possible... or we've not discovered it or observed any evidence to suggest it.

Even more interesting is what we see when we look at things on the subatomic level. It's really bizarre because our knowledge of physics appear to completely break down. Things are happening inside every atom that simply aren't supposed to happen. Atoms make up every material thing in the universe.

And thunder is God mad

 

[Indeependent]

God communicated with Moshe when Moshe was 80 years old.
It took Moshe 60 years of meditation to attain such a state of tranquility where God's communication wouldn't cause Moshe to go insane or have his nervous system destroyed.
Notice at Mount Sinai where the Children of Israel cannot handle the communication and tell Moshe to tell God to communicate with them through Moshe and not directly with them.

Who is Moshe and how do you know this Moshe wasn't just a nut?

Moses; He attributed everything to God and never asked anybody for anything.

Except believe that he talked to God. Same thing Joseph Smith and Mohammad asked people to do. Or David koresh

Actually, God did most of the "talking".
I wish I knew the nature of the communication.

So . . . you say you don't believe in man made religion, but you are basing your belief off of a book written by ignorant men thousands of years ago? Hmm. Makes sense.

Why do you believe anyone who lived 3,000 years ago had a low IQ or was unintelligent?
Were Aristotle or Alexander, The Great uneducated?

 

[ChrisL]

But then he came and talked to Moses?

God communicated with Moshe when Moshe was 80 years old.
It took Moshe 60 years of meditation to attain such a state of tranquility where God's communication wouldn't cause Moshe to go insane or have his nervous system destroyed.
Notice at Mount Sinai where the Children of Israel cannot handle the communication and tell Moshe to tell God to communicate with them through Moshe and not directly with them.

Who is Moshe and how do you know this Moshe wasn't just a nut?

Moses; He attributed everything to God and never asked anybody for anything.

Except believe that he talked to God. Same thing Joseph Smith and Mohammad asked people to do. Or David koresh

Actually, God did most of the "talking".
I wish I knew the nature of the communication.

God just told me to tell you to worship me and to do everything I say. Seriously. He's sitting right here next to me.

 

[Indeependent]

It is a fluke that the earth just happens to be supportive of biologic

It's not just the thousands of things regarding Earth, it's the universe and the set of about 40 cosmological constants which had to be precise to amazing caliber in order for the hydrogen and helium to fuse and create carbon and stuff, for planets to exist, for anything material to exist.

You are now talking about a "fluke" of the following magnitude: If you went to the casinos and played roulette on a wheel with 10^80 numbers... that's 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 numbers on the wheel... little ball goes spinning around and you land on the one number that pays the jackpot.... and you do this 40-50 times in a row. Never missing the jackpot... and you have the basic "fluke" you're talking about. Realistic?

More realistic than an entity, yes. Most definitely. It just so happens that our earth provided a great environment for the development and branching out of different species, us being just one of many.

Get your mind off of "entities" for a sec... okay? Because when humans think about "entities" they tend to think in terms they comprehend... like creatures... like people... like imaginary or invisible deities... and that's probably not a good description of what created us. Instead, think about an energy form... like electricity or magnetic fields... wave function... frequency modulation... dark energy and dark matter... Elements of our universe we can't always observe but they are there.

This "branching out" is not happening now... obviously. And everything we look at with regard to how life functions work, says that it can't happen because DNA molecules which comprise every living thing, are tied to their amino acids and enzymes. Now. things can change within their genus family... that happens often but it's because the DNA enables remarkable adaptation of life to diversity in environment. The problem comes when you try to make that leap from one genus to another. There is just no biological mechanism that makes that possible... or we've not discovered it or observed any evidence to suggest it.

Even more interesting is what we see when we look at things on the subatomic level. It's really bizarre because our knowledge of physics appear to completely break down. Things are happening inside every atom that simply aren't supposed to happen. Atoms make up every material thing in the universe.

And thunder is God mad

More like, "Here's to a great harvest!".

 

[Indeependent]

God communicated with Moshe when Moshe was 80 years old.
It took Moshe 60 years of meditation to attain such a state of tranquility where God's communication wouldn't cause Moshe to go insane or have his nervous system destroyed.
Notice at Mount Sinai where the Children of Israel cannot handle the communication and tell Moshe to tell God to communicate with them through Moshe and not directly with them.

Who is Moshe and how do you know this Moshe wasn't just a nut?

Moses; He attributed everything to God and never asked anybody for anything.

Except believe that he talked to God. Same thing Joseph Smith and Mohammad asked people to do. Or David koresh

Actually, God did most of the "talking".
I wish I knew the nature of the communication.

God just told me to tell you to worship me and to do everything I say. Seriously. He's sitting right here next to me.

But I'm not a slave in Egypt.
Did he tell you to ask me for money?

 

[sealybobo]

I'm sure that there are some stories that are actually "based" on facts. However, they are a highly embellished with myths to explain what people could not explain back in the old days.

It's funny how I read Torah Commentaries from 1,000 years ago that discuss the Big Bang Theory, Evolution and Comets.
There's nothing new under the sun.

Why did we have to wait for science to tell us about all these things then?

Instead of Darwin's theory who should we give credit to? Is it moses' theory of evolution?

 

[ChrisL]

What's that God? Okay, I'll tell them. God says send money.