How and why can people ignore their God’s immoral ways?

[Mikeoxenormous]

How and why can people ignore their God’s immoral ways?

I find it quite strange that Christian, Muslims and Jews can ignore the immoral ways that their God is shown to have in the Bible, Qur’an and Talmud.

If you have read any of the critical books on God, you will have seen God described with some rather disingenuous terms that, if applied to a man, would see that man executed by any moral government in quick order. The Buddhist saying that if you ever meet God, kill him seems quite fitting. Frankly, I think killing him without making him suffer for a time would be too good for him. If hell were real, that would be a better end for him as mankind would surely need to see that torture to gain real closure for God’s crimes against humanity. This aside.

I can appreciate the value for society of local churches, mosques and temples but cannot fathom why lying priests, preachers and imams try to sell their God as a good God, when he is obviously more satanic than Satan. Perhaps scripture speak at least one truth in that the whole world would be deceived by Satan and his lying preachers and imams. Not that I believe in Satan.

As a Gnostic Christian, my focus has been to try to become a Parfait, a perfected moral man, using the methods Jesus taught. It has been a long climb up Jacob’s ladder and apotheosis put me up one rung and I have tried to climb higher, but seem to have stalled due to my inability to find arguments that are persuasive enough to loosen Satan’s grip on the minds of Christians, Muslims and Jews. Their need of fellowship is stronger than their work on their moral sense and they stay in their religions even though they know that their God is immoral and not worthy of their idol worship. This Gnostic Christian truth is not a flattering epithet for God, which is likely what cause their destruction by Inquisition.

The truth hurts the religious even when given with a loving touch. I am not that good at that but have seen good honest lovers of Christ get verbally abused by theists. They think hate is motivating those who speak against their God even when love is the motivator. Hate is born of love, and the Gnostic hate of God is justified on moral grounds, and the attempted correction of a believers moral sense and their thinking is done out of love. They forget that that is how Jesus was and how that love driven expression of hate with what he saw around him almost got him killed at the hands of the Jews. So the myth says.

The fact that I have had many theists resist entering into moral argument of their God indicates that they know that their God is immoral. I can appreciate that once a person accepts the fellowship that his tribal nature seeks, and he can survive without having better morals, he is loath to jeopardize the comfort zone he has created for himself. The problem is that theists are living in self-deception and for one who seeks or has attained Gnosis, a deeper knowing of himself, self-deception is basically not allowed. That is why I have to bother fighting a fight that is almost un-winnable.

If you have an answer to the question I posed at the onset, please enlighten me as I am quite disappointed to see so many living in self-deception and without Gnosis, and following Gods who are demonstrably more Satan like than God like.

In the terrible days that we will face from environmental degradation that will soon be upon us, a new and moral God will be required and we presently do not have one.

I recognize that our tribal and fellowship needs are quite strong and a part of our basic instincts. Do you have any idea as to how we can break Satan’s hold on Christians, Muslims and Jews and change their fellowship and tribal needs to a need for a God with decent moral values?

Regards
DL

A human trying to understand God is like an insect trying to figure out humanity....

So, how do you develop a "close, personal relationship" with him? I mean, I have dated some people whom I found to be incomprehensible to me, and trust me when I say those relationships were anything but "close, and personal", and almost none of them lasted long.

Maybe you need to stop looking at God's relationship like you do with another person.

 

[Czernobog]

How and why can people ignore their God’s immoral ways?

I find it quite strange that Christian, Muslims and Jews can ignore the immoral ways that their God is shown to have in the Bible, Qur’an and Talmud.

If you have read any of the critical books on God, you will have seen God described with some rather disingenuous terms that, if applied to a man, would see that man executed by any moral government in quick order. The Buddhist saying that if you ever meet God, kill him seems quite fitting. Frankly, I think killing him without making him suffer for a time would be too good for him. If hell were real, that would be a better end for him as mankind would surely need to see that torture to gain real closure for God’s crimes against humanity. This aside.

I can appreciate the value for society of local churches, mosques and temples but cannot fathom why lying priests, preachers and imams try to sell their God as a good God, when he is obviously more satanic than Satan. Perhaps scripture speak at least one truth in that the whole world would be deceived by Satan and his lying preachers and imams. Not that I believe in Satan.

As a Gnostic Christian, my focus has been to try to become a Parfait, a perfected moral man, using the methods Jesus taught. It has been a long climb up Jacob’s ladder and apotheosis put me up one rung and I have tried to climb higher, but seem to have stalled due to my inability to find arguments that are persuasive enough to loosen Satan’s grip on the minds of Christians, Muslims and Jews. Their need of fellowship is stronger than their work on their moral sense and they stay in their religions even though they know that their God is immoral and not worthy of their idol worship. This Gnostic Christian truth is not a flattering epithet for God, which is likely what cause their destruction by Inquisition.

The truth hurts the religious even when given with a loving touch. I am not that good at that but have seen good honest lovers of Christ get verbally abused by theists. They think hate is motivating those who speak against their God even when love is the motivator. Hate is born of love, and the Gnostic hate of God is justified on moral grounds, and the attempted correction of a believers moral sense and their thinking is done out of love. They forget that that is how Jesus was and how that love driven expression of hate with what he saw around him almost got him killed at the hands of the Jews. So the myth says.

The fact that I have had many theists resist entering into moral argument of their God indicates that they know that their God is immoral. I can appreciate that once a person accepts the fellowship that his tribal nature seeks, and he can survive without having better morals, he is loath to jeopardize the comfort zone he has created for himself. The problem is that theists are living in self-deception and for one who seeks or has attained Gnosis, a deeper knowing of himself, self-deception is basically not allowed. That is why I have to bother fighting a fight that is almost un-winnable.

If you have an answer to the question I posed at the onset, please enlighten me as I am quite disappointed to see so many living in self-deception and without Gnosis, and following Gods who are demonstrably more Satan like than God like.

In the terrible days that we will face from environmental degradation that will soon be upon us, a new and moral God will be required and we presently do not have one.

I recognize that our tribal and fellowship needs are quite strong and a part of our basic instincts. Do you have any idea as to how we can break Satan’s hold on Christians, Muslims and Jews and change their fellowship and tribal needs to a need for a God with decent moral values?

Regards
DL

Do tell us how one can have morality?

Oh yeah, it is whatever you feel is moral.

Without a higher authority telling you what is moral your morality is just as valid as anyone else's. Charles Manson etc etc.

Bullshit. This is a perversion of moral relativism. Moral relativism is simply the moral propositions are only true or false from a particular perspective, such as from a specific culture, time period or circumstance. It has nothing to do with "whatever you feel" in the moment. Culture is the major factor in moral relativism. You wanna see that in practice? Slavery. Here in the the US, Slavery was considered perfectly acceptable right up until about 150 years ago. Religion defended this practice. you doubt this? Here is a small list of religious tretises defending Slavery. Most can still be found online, for anbyone who would like to peruse them:

• A Defense of Southern Slavery by a Southern Clergyman - 1851
• Bible Defense of Slavery by Rev. Josiah A.M. 1852
• An Essay on the Origin, Habits of the African Race by John Jacobus Flournoy 1835 (Expounds on the "Curse of Cain")
• Cotton is King and Pro-Slavery Arguments by E.N. Elliot LLD, 1860, over 900 pages
• Slavery as Recognized in the Mosaic Civil Law by Rev. Stuart Robinson
• Bible Servitude Re-Examined, with Special Reference to Pro-Slavery Interpretations and Infidel Objections by Rev. Reuben Hatch 1862
• Slavery Sanctioned by the Bible - A Tract for Northern Christians 1861
• The American Churches the Bulwarks of American Slavery by James Gillespie Birney 1885
• The Pro-slavery Argument, as Maintained by the Most Distinguished Writers by William Harper, William Gilmore Simms, James Henry Hammond, Thomas Roderick Dew 1852
• Religion and Slavery by Rev. James McNeilly, D.D. (Presbyterian Minister) 1911
• The Right of American Slavery by True Worthy Hoit 1815
• The Christian Doctrine of Slavery by George Armstron 1857
• Does Slavery Christianize the Negro? by Thomas Wentworth Higginson 1855
• Slavery Ordained by God by Rev. Fred. A. Ross, D.D.
• Review of Bishop Hopkins' Bible view of slavery by JP Lundy 1863
• Slavery Examined in the Light of the Bible by Lee Luther 1855
• Bible Vindicated: A Series of Essays on American Slavery by Jonas Hartzel 1858
• The Interest in Slavery of the Southern non-slave-holder. The Right of Peaceful Secession. Slavery in the Bible by JDB De Bow 1860
• The Bible and Slavery - A Brief Examination of the Old and New Testaments on Servitude 1867
• Southern Slavery and the Bible - A Scriptural refutation of the principal arguments upon which the abolitionists rely. A vindication of southern slavery from the Old and New Testaments by EW Warren 1864
• Bible Slaveholding not Sinful by HD Ganse 1856 (poor quality)
• Scriptural Researches on the Licitness of the Slave-trade by R Harris 1788
• White Supremacy and Negro Subordination; Or, Negroes a Subordinate Race, by John H. Van Evrie 1870

Slavery didn't end because it was deemed immoral because of religion; it ended because it became culturally, and financially unfeasible to continue. Relative morality - the culture changed, and the morality changed with it. The reality is that religion is more often than not wrong on their moral opinions. Same Sex Marriage? The culture is hanging, in spite of all of religious effort to hold it back. Equality of women? Society is changing, in spite of the religious effort to hold it back.

There is nothing wrong with recognising that society changes, and morality needs to change with it.

 

[Czernobog]

How and why can people ignore their God’s immoral ways?

I find it quite strange that Christian, Muslims and Jews can ignore the immoral ways that their God is shown to have in the Bible, Qur’an and Talmud.

If you have read any of the critical books on God, you will have seen God described with some rather disingenuous terms that, if applied to a man, would see that man executed by any moral government in quick order. The Buddhist saying that if you ever meet God, kill him seems quite fitting. Frankly, I think killing him without making him suffer for a time would be too good for him. If hell were real, that would be a better end for him as mankind would surely need to see that torture to gain real closure for God’s crimes against humanity. This aside.

I can appreciate the value for society of local churches, mosques and temples but cannot fathom why lying priests, preachers and imams try to sell their God as a good God, when he is obviously more satanic than Satan. Perhaps scripture speak at least one truth in that the whole world would be deceived by Satan and his lying preachers and imams. Not that I believe in Satan.

As a Gnostic Christian, my focus has been to try to become a Parfait, a perfected moral man, using the methods Jesus taught. It has been a long climb up Jacob’s ladder and apotheosis put me up one rung and I have tried to climb higher, but seem to have stalled due to my inability to find arguments that are persuasive enough to loosen Satan’s grip on the minds of Christians, Muslims and Jews. Their need of fellowship is stronger than their work on their moral sense and they stay in their religions even though they know that their God is immoral and not worthy of their idol worship. This Gnostic Christian truth is not a flattering epithet for God, which is likely what cause their destruction by Inquisition.

The truth hurts the religious even when given with a loving touch. I am not that good at that but have seen good honest lovers of Christ get verbally abused by theists. They think hate is motivating those who speak against their God even when love is the motivator. Hate is born of love, and the Gnostic hate of God is justified on moral grounds, and the attempted correction of a believers moral sense and their thinking is done out of love. They forget that that is how Jesus was and how that love driven expression of hate with what he saw around him almost got him killed at the hands of the Jews. So the myth says.

The fact that I have had many theists resist entering into moral argument of their God indicates that they know that their God is immoral. I can appreciate that once a person accepts the fellowship that his tribal nature seeks, and he can survive without having better morals, he is loath to jeopardize the comfort zone he has created for himself. The problem is that theists are living in self-deception and for one who seeks or has attained Gnosis, a deeper knowing of himself, self-deception is basically not allowed. That is why I have to bother fighting a fight that is almost un-winnable.

If you have an answer to the question I posed at the onset, please enlighten me as I am quite disappointed to see so many living in self-deception and without Gnosis, and following Gods who are demonstrably more Satan like than God like.

In the terrible days that we will face from environmental degradation that will soon be upon us, a new and moral God will be required and we presently do not have one.

I recognize that our tribal and fellowship needs are quite strong and a part of our basic instincts. Do you have any idea as to how we can break Satan’s hold on Christians, Muslims and Jews and change their fellowship and tribal needs to a need for a God with decent moral values?

Regards
DL

A human trying to understand God is like an insect trying to figure out humanity....

So, how do you develop a "close, personal relationship" with him? I mean, I have dated some people whom I found to be incomprehensible to me, and trust me when I say those relationships were anything but "close, and personal", and almost none of them lasted long.

Maybe you need to stop looking at God's relationship like you do with another person.

Riiight. Because it's so easy to have a "close personal relationship" with the completely incomprehensible... only if you're delusional.

 

[Czernobog]

Why do christians think the commanded murder of infants and young children moral
but abortion isnt?
Does it not count if they are born or something?

The Canaanite nations as a whole were guilty of gross crimes, and for those crimes the same kind of justice was served on a large scale. If you think it is wrong for persons to experience suffering and terror as a result of their sins, you fail to see what sin really is in the eyes of God. No one escapes God’s punishment for sin, except through the grace given through Jesus Christ. Now obviously it is impossible for us humans to imagine individual justice being scaled up to justice on a national level, but it is no stretch for God to think in that way.

No they weren't. The Canaanite men, may have been guilty of this. The women, the children, the infants? They were certainly not guilty of anything. What possible "gross crimes" do you suppose that an infant could have been guilty of?

 

[Czernobog]

I can only speak to the Christian belief, and, that is that God can not sin.
How they can overlook what others view or interpret as immoral that God does or has done according to the Bible is this - since God is perfect, His ways and thoughts are Higher (and more perfect) than ours. Therefore, Christians accept that they don't know true morality, as, God is perfect, and, there are things that we just won't ever be able to understand because our minds are not capable of understanding it.

This is the problem with people like DL. They think they have the absolute answer to what is MORAL or IMMORAL. They don't even consider that we may have it all wrong... and that includes how we interpret the Bible is interpreted and what it really means

Sooo...because he's God, he gets held to a different standard than us. How convenient. And why should this be? What could possibly be different from his perspective compared to ours? Lemme guess..."That's one of those things we'll understand when we stand before him..."

You are describing the ultimate Meritocracy. "I get to do things you don't, because I know things you don't. No, I won't tell you what those are. You just have to trust me," REALLY?!?!? And that seems rational to, otherwise, intelligent, reasonable Christians?!?!

 

[Weatherman2020]

Why do christians think the commanded murder of infants and young children moral
but abortion isnt?
Does it not count if they are born or something?

The Canaanite nations as a whole were guilty of gross crimes, and for those crimes the same kind of justice was served on a large scale. If you think it is wrong for persons to experience suffering and terror as a result of their sins, you fail to see what sin really is in the eyes of God. No one escapes God’s punishment for sin, except through the grace given through Jesus Christ. Now obviously it is impossible for us humans to imagine individual justice being scaled up to justice on a national level, but it is no stretch for God to think in that way.

No they weren't. The Canaanite men, may have been guilty of this. The women, the children, the infants? They were certainly not guilty of anything. What possible "gross crimes" do you suppose that an infant could have been guilty of?

Of course you need to parse what I posted so you could at least make a half ass rebuttal.

And only an idiot can claim children don’t commit crimes.

 

[Czernobog]

Why do christians think the commanded murder of infants and young children moral
but abortion isnt?
Does it not count if they are born or something?

The Canaanite nations as a whole were guilty of gross crimes, and for those crimes the same kind of justice was served on a large scale. If you think it is wrong for persons to experience suffering and terror as a result of their sins, you fail to see what sin really is in the eyes of God. No one escapes God’s punishment for sin, except through the grace given through Jesus Christ. Now obviously it is impossible for us humans to imagine individual justice being scaled up to justice on a national level, but it is no stretch for God to think in that way.

No they weren't. The Canaanite men, may have been guilty of this. The women, the children, the infants? They were certainly not guilty of anything. What possible "gross crimes" do you suppose that an infant could have been guilty of?

Of course you need to parse what I posted so you could at least make a half ass rebuttal.

And only an idiot can claim children don’t commit crimes.

And only a moron would claim that infants do! God ordered the to kill. Them. All!!!! He didn't make any distinction about age. He specifically said the babies, and infants! You keep trying to gloss over that, like it's a minor detail. No. It's not. When you claim that they all deserved it, you are claiming that barely born infants DESERVED IT!!!! I'm sorry. You are going to have to demonstrate when infants have ever done anything to deserve to be slaughtered.

 

[Weatherman2020]

Why do christians think the commanded murder of infants and young children moral
but abortion isnt?
Does it not count if they are born or something?

The Canaanite nations as a whole were guilty of gross crimes, and for those crimes the same kind of justice was served on a large scale. If you think it is wrong for persons to experience suffering and terror as a result of their sins, you fail to see what sin really is in the eyes of God. No one escapes God’s punishment for sin, except through the grace given through Jesus Christ. Now obviously it is impossible for us humans to imagine individual justice being scaled up to justice on a national level, but it is no stretch for God to think in that way.

No they weren't. The Canaanite men, may have been guilty of this. The women, the children, the infants? They were certainly not guilty of anything. What possible "gross crimes" do you suppose that an infant could have been guilty of?

Of course you need to parse what I posted so you could at least make a half ass rebuttal.

And only an idiot can claim children don’t commit crimes.

And only a moron would claim that infants do! God ordered the to kill. Them. All!!!! He didn't make any distinction about age. He specifically said the babies, and infants! You keep trying to gloss over that, like it's a minor detail. No. It's not. When you claim that they all deserved it, you are claiming that barely born infants DESERVED IT!!!! I; sorry. You are going to have to demostrate when infants have ever done anything to deserve to be slaughtered.

Your position is so pathetic you need to parse my quotes.

 

[Czernobog]

Why do christians think the commanded murder of infants and young children moral
but abortion isnt?
Does it not count if they are born or something?

The Canaanite nations as a whole were guilty of gross crimes, and for those crimes the same kind of justice was served on a large scale. If you think it is wrong for persons to experience suffering and terror as a result of their sins, you fail to see what sin really is in the eyes of God. No one escapes God’s punishment for sin, except through the grace given through Jesus Christ. Now obviously it is impossible for us humans to imagine individual justice being scaled up to justice on a national level, but it is no stretch for God to think in that way.

No they weren't. The Canaanite men, may have been guilty of this. The women, the children, the infants? They were certainly not guilty of anything. What possible "gross crimes" do you suppose that an infant could have been guilty of?

Of course you need to parse what I posted so you could at least make a half ass rebuttal.

And only an idiot can claim children don’t commit crimes.

And only a moron would claim that infants do! God ordered the to kill. Them. All!!!! He didn't make any distinction about age. He specifically said the babies, and infants! You keep trying to gloss over that, like it's a minor detail. No. It's not. When you claim that they all deserved it, you are claiming that barely born infants DESERVED IT!!!! I; sorry. You are going to have to demostrate when infants have ever done anything to deserve to be slaughtered.

Your position is so pathetic you need to parse my quotes.

Oh! I'm sorry. Let's look at that part that I "parsed":

"Of course there were probably some persons involved who were innocent of these gross crimes, especially if there were children who were really caught up in the exterminations. But God has the ability to make it right for them, even after death."

So, yeah. Even though I just said that the nation, as a whole, was guilty, and deserved to be slaughtered, I'm well aware that I am full of shit. But, that's okay, because after these kids are slaughtered who did nothing wrong, God is going to give them an "After-life" lollie! REALLY!?!?!? That's how you justify Genocide! God knows full well what he did was fucked up, and immoral, but he'll make it right Hey, genius, if it was the right, and moral thing to do in the first place, then God shouldn't need to make it right! The very fact that you are suggesting that God will "make it right" demonstrates that you know fucking well it wasn't the right fucking thing to do in the first place!!! You are justifying God's immorality by admitting his immorality!!!

And this is what passes for reason for you!

 

[Czernobog]

And, while we're at it, Weatherman2020 , let's consider this little gem:

Joshua 11:20 - “For it was the Lord himself who hardened their hearts to wage war against Israel, so that he might destroy them totally, exterminating them without mercy, as the Lord had commanded Moses”.
So, God wants the gratuitous destruction of everyone except Israel. Not only is that implicitly racist, but he himself created all these other non-Jews! Why create them and then destroy them? That has never been explained. Furthermore, if God can make human hearts want to go to war, couldn’t he, just as easily, make all of them completely devout to God and repenting for all their sins? Couldn’t he make them want to be wonderful people. He could. But he doesn’t. Because?

And you can't say, "Free Will" because this verse explicitly nullifies Free will. It states, unequivocally that these people didn't choose to defy God, and the Israelites; No. God made them do that. That's kinda the exact opposite of free will. Again, immoral, genocidal dick of a God.

 

[Weatherman2020]

The Canaanite nations as a whole were guilty of gross crimes, and for those crimes the same kind of justice was served on a large scale. If you think it is wrong for persons to experience suffering and terror as a result of their sins, you fail to see what sin really is in the eyes of God. No one escapes God’s punishment for sin, except through the grace given through Jesus Christ. Now obviously it is impossible for us humans to imagine individual justice being scaled up to justice on a national level, but it is no stretch for God to think in that way.

No they weren't. The Canaanite men, may have been guilty of this. The women, the children, the infants? They were certainly not guilty of anything. What possible "gross crimes" do you suppose that an infant could have been guilty of?

Of course you need to parse what I posted so you could at least make a half ass rebuttal.

And only an idiot can claim children don’t commit crimes.

And only a moron would claim that infants do! God ordered the to kill. Them. All!!!! He didn't make any distinction about age. He specifically said the babies, and infants! You keep trying to gloss over that, like it's a minor detail. No. It's not. When you claim that they all deserved it, you are claiming that barely born infants DESERVED IT!!!! I; sorry. You are going to have to demostrate when infants have ever done anything to deserve to be slaughtered.

Your position is so pathetic you need to parse my quotes.

Oh! I'm sorry. Let's look at that part that I "parsed":

"Of course there were probably some persons involved who were innocent of these gross crimes, especially if there were children who were really caught up in the exterminations. But God has the ability to make it right for them, even after death."

So, yeah. Even though I just said that the nation, as a whole, was guilty, and deserved to be slaughtered, I'm well aware that I am full of shit. But, that's okay, because after these kids are slaughtered who did nothing wrong, God is going to give them an "After-life" lollie! REALLY!?!?!? That's how you justify Genocide! God knows full well what he did was fucked up, and immoral, but he'll make it right Hey, genius, if it was the right, and moral thing to do in the first place, then God shouldn't need to make it right! The very fact that you are suggesting that God will "make it right" demonstrates that you know fucking well it wasn't the right fucking thing to do in the first place!!! You are justifying God's immorality by admitting his immorality!!!

And this is what passes for reason for you!

Glad you acknowledge you’re full of shit. But then you go onto claim children never commit crimes.

You have a ways to go in your repentance.

 

[Czernobog]

No they weren't. The Canaanite men, may have been guilty of this. The women, the children, the infants? They were certainly not guilty of anything. What possible "gross crimes" do you suppose that an infant could have been guilty of?

Of course you need to parse what I posted so you could at least make a half ass rebuttal.

And only an idiot can claim children don’t commit crimes.

And only a moron would claim that infants do! God ordered the to kill. Them. All!!!! He didn't make any distinction about age. He specifically said the babies, and infants! You keep trying to gloss over that, like it's a minor detail. No. It's not. When you claim that they all deserved it, you are claiming that barely born infants DESERVED IT!!!! I; sorry. You are going to have to demostrate when infants have ever done anything to deserve to be slaughtered.

Your position is so pathetic you need to parse my quotes.

Oh! I'm sorry. Let's look at that part that I "parsed":

"Of course there were probably some persons involved who were innocent of these gross crimes, especially if there were children who were really caught up in the exterminations. But God has the ability to make it right for them, even after death."

So, yeah. Even though I just said that the nation, as a whole, was guilty, and deserved to be slaughtered, I'm well aware that I am full of shit. But, that's okay, because after these kids are slaughtered who did nothing wrong, God is going to give them an "After-life" lollie! REALLY!?!?!? That's how you justify Genocide! God knows full well what he did was fucked up, and immoral, but he'll make it right Hey, genius, if it was the right, and moral thing to do in the first place, then God shouldn't need to make it right! The very fact that you are suggesting that God will "make it right" demonstrates that you know fucking well it wasn't the right fucking thing to do in the first place!!! You are justifying God's immorality by admitting his immorality!!!

And this is what passes for reason for you!

Glad you acknowledge you’re full of shit. But then you go onto claim children never commit crimes.

You have a ways to go in your repentance.

I admittede no such thing. You did. Re read the post again, and quote where I admitted any such thing.

 

[Weatherman2020]

Of course you need to parse what I posted so you could at least make a half ass rebuttal.

And only an idiot can claim children don’t commit crimes.

And only a moron would claim that infants do! God ordered the to kill. Them. All!!!! He didn't make any distinction about age. He specifically said the babies, and infants! You keep trying to gloss over that, like it's a minor detail. No. It's not. When you claim that they all deserved it, you are claiming that barely born infants DESERVED IT!!!! I; sorry. You are going to have to demostrate when infants have ever done anything to deserve to be slaughtered.

Your position is so pathetic you need to parse my quotes.

Oh! I'm sorry. Let's look at that part that I "parsed":

"Of course there were probably some persons involved who were innocent of these gross crimes, especially if there were children who were really caught up in the exterminations. But God has the ability to make it right for them, even after death."

So, yeah. Even though I just said that the nation, as a whole, was guilty, and deserved to be slaughtered, I'm well aware that I am full of shit. But, that's okay, because after these kids are slaughtered who did nothing wrong, God is going to give them an "After-life" lollie! REALLY!?!?!? That's how you justify Genocide! God knows full well what he did was fucked up, and immoral, but he'll make it right Hey, genius, if it was the right, and moral thing to do in the first place, then God shouldn't need to make it right! The very fact that you are suggesting that God will "make it right" demonstrates that you know fucking well it wasn't the right fucking thing to do in the first place!!! You are justifying God's immorality by admitting his immorality!!!

And this is what passes for reason for you!

Glad you acknowledge you’re full of shit. But then you go onto claim children never commit crimes.

You have a ways to go in your repentance.

I admittede no such thing. You did. Re read the post again, and quote where I admitted any such thing.

So, yeah. Even though I just said that the nation, as a whole, was guilty, and deserved to be slaughtered, I'm well aware that I am full of shit.

Have a nice day!

 

[Czernobog]

And only a moron would claim that infants do! God ordered the to kill. Them. All!!!! He didn't make any distinction about age. He specifically said the babies, and infants! You keep trying to gloss over that, like it's a minor detail. No. It's not. When you claim that they all deserved it, you are claiming that barely born infants DESERVED IT!!!! I; sorry. You are going to have to demostrate when infants have ever done anything to deserve to be slaughtered.

Your position is so pathetic you need to parse my quotes.

Oh! I'm sorry. Let's look at that part that I "parsed":

"Of course there were probably some persons involved who were innocent of these gross crimes, especially if there were children who were really caught up in the exterminations. But God has the ability to make it right for them, even after death."

So, yeah. Even though I just said that the nation, as a whole, was guilty, and deserved to be slaughtered, I'm well aware that I am full of shit. But, that's okay, because after these kids are slaughtered who did nothing wrong, God is going to give them an "After-life" lollie! REALLY!?!?!? That's how you justify Genocide! God knows full well what he did was fucked up, and immoral, but he'll make it right Hey, genius, if it was the right, and moral thing to do in the first place, then God shouldn't need to make it right! The very fact that you are suggesting that God will "make it right" demonstrates that you know fucking well it wasn't the right fucking thing to do in the first place!!! You are justifying God's immorality by admitting his immorality!!!

And this is what passes for reason for you!

Glad you acknowledge you’re full of shit. But then you go onto claim children never commit crimes.

You have a ways to go in your repentance.

I admittede no such thing. You did. Re read the post again, and quote where I admitted any such thing.

So, yeah. Even though I just said that the nation, as a whole, was guilty, and deserved to be slaughtered, I'm well aware that I am full of shit.

Have a nice day!

Now who's parsing shit. That wasn't me admitting I was full of shit! That was me translating your statement. Here lemme edit the post so you will understand what I was posting, Weatherman2020 :

Oh! I'm sorry. Let's look at that part that I "parsed":

"Of course there were probably some persons involved who were innocent of these gross crimes, especially if there were children who were really caught up in the exterminations. But God has the ability to make it right for them, even after death."

TRANSLATION: "So, yeah. Even though I just said that the nation, as a whole, was guilty, and deserved to be slaughtered, I'm well aware that I am full of shit. But, that's okay, because after these kids are slaughtered who did nothing wrong, God is going to give them an "After-life" lollie!" REALLY!?!?!? That's how you justify Genocide! God knows full well what he did was fucked up, and immoral, but he'll make it right Hey, genius, if it was the right, and moral thing to do in the first place, then God shouldn't need to make it right! The very fact that you are suggesting that God will "make it right" demonstrates that you know fucking well it wasn't the right fucking thing to do in the first place!!! You are justifying God's immorality by admitting his immorality!!!

And this is what passes for reason for you​

Now. Would you like to honestly reply? Because I don't think you are nearly as stupid as you just pretended to be. I think you knew exactly what I posted, and just wanted to avoid having to try to explain your bullshit.

 

[Weatherman2020]

Your position is so pathetic you need to parse my quotes.

Oh! I'm sorry. Let's look at that part that I "parsed":

"Of course there were probably some persons involved who were innocent of these gross crimes, especially if there were children who were really caught up in the exterminations. But God has the ability to make it right for them, even after death."

So, yeah. Even though I just said that the nation, as a whole, was guilty, and deserved to be slaughtered, I'm well aware that I am full of shit. But, that's okay, because after these kids are slaughtered who did nothing wrong, God is going to give them an "After-life" lollie! REALLY!?!?!? That's how you justify Genocide! God knows full well what he did was fucked up, and immoral, but he'll make it right Hey, genius, if it was the right, and moral thing to do in the first place, then God shouldn't need to make it right! The very fact that you are suggesting that God will "make it right" demonstrates that you know fucking well it wasn't the right fucking thing to do in the first place!!! You are justifying God's immorality by admitting his immorality!!!

And this is what passes for reason for you!

Glad you acknowledge you’re full of shit. But then you go onto claim children never commit crimes.

You have a ways to go in your repentance.

I admittede no such thing. You did. Re read the post again, and quote where I admitted any such thing.

So, yeah. Even though I just said that the nation, as a whole, was guilty, and deserved to be slaughtered, I'm well aware that I am full of shit.

Have a nice day!

Now who's parsing shit. That wasn't me admitting I was full of shit! That was me translating your statement. Here lemme edit the post so you will understand what I was posting, Weatherman2020 :

Oh! I'm sorry. Let's look at that part that I "parsed":

"Of course there were probably some persons involved who were innocent of these gross crimes, especially if there were children who were really caught up in the exterminations. But God has the ability to make it right for them, even after death."

TRANSLATION: "So, yeah. Even though I just said that the nation, as a whole, was guilty, and deserved to be slaughtered, I'm well aware that I am full of shit. But, that's okay, because after these kids are slaughtered who did nothing wrong, God is going to give them an "After-life" lollie!" REALLY!?!?!? That's how you justify Genocide! God knows full well what he did was fucked up, and immoral, but he'll make it right Hey, genius, if it was the right, and moral thing to do in the first place, then God shouldn't need to make it right! The very fact that you are suggesting that God will "make it right" demonstrates that you know fucking well it wasn't the right fucking thing to do in the first place!!! You are justifying God's immorality by admitting his immorality!!!

And this is what passes for reason for you​

Now. Would you like to honestly reply? Because I don't think you are nearly as stupid as you just pretended to be. I think you knew exactly what I posted, and just wanted to avoid having to try to explain your bullshit.

Reply to what? Your belief children commit no evil or your belief God does not take care of innocents?

 

[Czernobog]

Oh! I'm sorry. Let's look at that part that I "parsed":

"Of course there were probably some persons involved who were innocent of these gross crimes, especially if there were children who were really caught up in the exterminations. But God has the ability to make it right for them, even after death."

So, yeah. Even though I just said that the nation, as a whole, was guilty, and deserved to be slaughtered, I'm well aware that I am full of shit. But, that's okay, because after these kids are slaughtered who did nothing wrong, God is going to give them an "After-life" lollie! REALLY!?!?!? That's how you justify Genocide! God knows full well what he did was fucked up, and immoral, but he'll make it right Hey, genius, if it was the right, and moral thing to do in the first place, then God shouldn't need to make it right! The very fact that you are suggesting that God will "make it right" demonstrates that you know fucking well it wasn't the right fucking thing to do in the first place!!! You are justifying God's immorality by admitting his immorality!!!

And this is what passes for reason for you!

Glad you acknowledge you’re full of shit. But then you go onto claim children never commit crimes.

You have a ways to go in your repentance.

I admittede no such thing. You did. Re read the post again, and quote where I admitted any such thing.

So, yeah. Even though I just said that the nation, as a whole, was guilty, and deserved to be slaughtered, I'm well aware that I am full of shit.

Have a nice day!

Now who's parsing shit. That wasn't me admitting I was full of shit! That was me translating your statement. Here lemme edit the post so you will understand what I was posting, Weatherman2020 :

Oh! I'm sorry. Let's look at that part that I "parsed":

"Of course there were probably some persons involved who were innocent of these gross crimes, especially if there were children who were really caught up in the exterminations. But God has the ability to make it right for them, even after death."

TRANSLATION: "So, yeah. Even though I just said that the nation, as a whole, was guilty, and deserved to be slaughtered, I'm well aware that I am full of shit. But, that's okay, because after these kids are slaughtered who did nothing wrong, God is going to give them an "After-life" lollie!" REALLY!?!?!? That's how you justify Genocide! God knows full well what he did was fucked up, and immoral, but he'll make it right Hey, genius, if it was the right, and moral thing to do in the first place, then God shouldn't need to make it right! The very fact that you are suggesting that God will "make it right" demonstrates that you know fucking well it wasn't the right fucking thing to do in the first place!!! You are justifying God's immorality by admitting his immorality!!!

And this is what passes for reason for you​

Now. Would you like to honestly reply? Because I don't think you are nearly as stupid as you just pretended to be. I think you knew exactly what I posted, and just wanted to avoid having to try to explain your bullshit.

Reply to what? Your belief children commit no evil or your belief God does not take care of innocents?

So, you are incapable of justifying God's immoral genocide. Your concession is noted. Dismissed.

 

[Weatherman2020]

Glad you acknowledge you’re full of shit. But then you go onto claim children never commit crimes.

You have a ways to go in your repentance.

I admittede no such thing. You did. Re read the post again, and quote where I admitted any such thing.

So, yeah. Even though I just said that the nation, as a whole, was guilty, and deserved to be slaughtered, I'm well aware that I am full of shit.

Have a nice day!

Now who's parsing shit. That wasn't me admitting I was full of shit! That was me translating your statement. Here lemme edit the post so you will understand what I was posting, Weatherman2020 :

Oh! I'm sorry. Let's look at that part that I "parsed":

"Of course there were probably some persons involved who were innocent of these gross crimes, especially if there were children who were really caught up in the exterminations. But God has the ability to make it right for them, even after death."

TRANSLATION: "So, yeah. Even though I just said that the nation, as a whole, was guilty, and deserved to be slaughtered, I'm well aware that I am full of shit. But, that's okay, because after these kids are slaughtered who did nothing wrong, God is going to give them an "After-life" lollie!" REALLY!?!?!? That's how you justify Genocide! God knows full well what he did was fucked up, and immoral, but he'll make it right Hey, genius, if it was the right, and moral thing to do in the first place, then God shouldn't need to make it right! The very fact that you are suggesting that God will "make it right" demonstrates that you know fucking well it wasn't the right fucking thing to do in the first place!!! You are justifying God's immorality by admitting his immorality!!!

And this is what passes for reason for you​

Now. Would you like to honestly reply? Because I don't think you are nearly as stupid as you just pretended to be. I think you knew exactly what I posted, and just wanted to avoid having to try to explain your bullshit.

Reply to what? Your belief children commit no evil or your belief God does not take care of innocents?

So, you are incapable of justifying God's immoral genocide. Your concession is noted. Dismissed.

The fact you ignore my questions answers that.

 

[GreatestIam]

How and why can people ignore their God’s immoral ways?

I find it quite strange that Christian, Muslims and Jews can ignore the immoral ways that their God is shown to have in the Bible, Qur’an and Talmud.

If you have read any of the critical books on God, you will have seen God described with some rather disingenuous terms that, if applied to a man, would see that man executed by any moral government in quick order. The Buddhist saying that if you ever meet God, kill him seems quite fitting. Frankly, I think killing him without making him suffer for a time would be too good for him. If hell were real, that would be a better end for him as mankind would surely need to see that torture to gain real closure for God’s crimes against humanity. This aside.

I can appreciate the value for society of local churches, mosques and temples but cannot fathom why lying priests, preachers and imams try to sell their God as a good God, when he is obviously more satanic than Satan. Perhaps scripture speak at least one truth in that the whole world would be deceived by Satan and his lying preachers and imams. Not that I believe in Satan.

As a Gnostic Christian, my focus has been to try to become a Parfait, a perfected moral man, using the methods Jesus taught. It has been a long climb up Jacob’s ladder and apotheosis put me up one rung and I have tried to climb higher, but seem to have stalled due to my inability to find arguments that are persuasive enough to loosen Satan’s grip on the minds of Christians, Muslims and Jews. Their need of fellowship is stronger than their work on their moral sense and they stay in their religions even though they know that their God is immoral and not worthy of their idol worship. This Gnostic Christian truth is not a flattering epithet for God, which is likely what cause their destruction by Inquisition.

The truth hurts the religious even when given with a loving touch. I am not that good at that but have seen good honest lovers of Christ get verbally abused by theists. They think hate is motivating those who speak against their God even when love is the motivator. Hate is born of love, and the Gnostic hate of God is justified on moral grounds, and the attempted correction of a believers moral sense and their thinking is done out of love. They forget that that is how Jesus was and how that love driven expression of hate with what he saw around him almost got him killed at the hands of the Jews. So the myth says.

The fact that I have had many theists resist entering into moral argument of their God indicates that they know that their God is immoral. I can appreciate that once a person accepts the fellowship that his tribal nature seeks, and he can survive without having better morals, he is loath to jeopardize the comfort zone he has created for himself. The problem is that theists are living in self-deception and for one who seeks or has attained Gnosis, a deeper knowing of himself, self-deception is basically not allowed. That is why I have to bother fighting a fight that is almost un-winnable.

If you have an answer to the question I posed at the onset, please enlighten me as I am quite disappointed to see so many living in self-deception and without Gnosis, and following Gods who are demonstrably more Satan like than God like.

In the terrible days that we will face from environmental degradation that will soon be upon us, a new and moral God will be required and we presently do not have one.

I recognize that our tribal and fellowship needs are quite strong and a part of our basic instincts. Do you have any idea as to how we can break Satan’s hold on Christians, Muslims and Jews and change their fellowship and tribal needs to a need for a God with decent moral values?

Regards
DL

A human trying to understand God is like an insect trying to figure out humanity....

So, how do you develop a "close, personal relationship" with him? I mean, I have dated some people whom I found to be incomprehensible to me, and trust me when I say those relationships were anything but "close, and personal", and almost none of them lasted long.

If they were like God, jealous, did they say like that prick does to us; love me or burn in hell?

Regards
DL

 

[GreatestIam]

How and why can people ignore their God’s immoral ways?

I find it quite strange that Christian, Muslims and Jews can ignore the immoral ways that their God is shown to have in the Bible, Qur’an and Talmud.

If you have read any of the critical books on God, you will have seen God described with some rather disingenuous terms that, if applied to a man, would see that man executed by any moral government in quick order. The Buddhist saying that if you ever meet God, kill him seems quite fitting. Frankly, I think killing him without making him suffer for a time would be too good for him. If hell were real, that would be a better end for him as mankind would surely need to see that torture to gain real closure for God’s crimes against humanity. This aside.

I can appreciate the value for society of local churches, mosques and temples but cannot fathom why lying priests, preachers and imams try to sell their God as a good God, when he is obviously more satanic than Satan. Perhaps scripture speak at least one truth in that the whole world would be deceived by Satan and his lying preachers and imams. Not that I believe in Satan.

As a Gnostic Christian, my focus has been to try to become a Parfait, a perfected moral man, using the methods Jesus taught. It has been a long climb up Jacob’s ladder and apotheosis put me up one rung and I have tried to climb higher, but seem to have stalled due to my inability to find arguments that are persuasive enough to loosen Satan’s grip on the minds of Christians, Muslims and Jews. Their need of fellowship is stronger than their work on their moral sense and they stay in their religions even though they know that their God is immoral and not worthy of their idol worship. This Gnostic Christian truth is not a flattering epithet for God, which is likely what cause their destruction by Inquisition.

The truth hurts the religious even when given with a loving touch. I am not that good at that but have seen good honest lovers of Christ get verbally abused by theists. They think hate is motivating those who speak against their God even when love is the motivator. Hate is born of love, and the Gnostic hate of God is justified on moral grounds, and the attempted correction of a believers moral sense and their thinking is done out of love. They forget that that is how Jesus was and how that love driven expression of hate with what he saw around him almost got him killed at the hands of the Jews. So the myth says.

The fact that I have had many theists resist entering into moral argument of their God indicates that they know that their God is immoral. I can appreciate that once a person accepts the fellowship that his tribal nature seeks, and he can survive without having better morals, he is loath to jeopardize the comfort zone he has created for himself. The problem is that theists are living in self-deception and for one who seeks or has attained Gnosis, a deeper knowing of himself, self-deception is basically not allowed. That is why I have to bother fighting a fight that is almost un-winnable.

If you have an answer to the question I posed at the onset, please enlighten me as I am quite disappointed to see so many living in self-deception and without Gnosis, and following Gods who are demonstrably more Satan like than God like.

In the terrible days that we will face from environmental degradation that will soon be upon us, a new and moral God will be required and we presently do not have one.

I recognize that our tribal and fellowship needs are quite strong and a part of our basic instincts. Do you have any idea as to how we can break Satan’s hold on Christians, Muslims and Jews and change their fellowship and tribal needs to a need for a God with decent moral values?

Regards
DL

A human trying to understand God is like an insect trying to figure out humanity....

So, how do you develop a "close, personal relationship" with him? I mean, I have dated some people whom I found to be incomprehensible to me, and trust me when I say those relationships were anything but "close, and personal", and almost none of them lasted long.

Maybe you need to stop looking at God's relationship like you do with another person.

You tell him.

Uppity G D slave should not complain of their slavery and submission. Right?

Regards
DL

 

[Czernobog]

The fact you ignore my questions answers that.

Okay. I'll play your game, Weatherman2020 .

Reply to what? Your belief children commit no evil or your belief God does not take care of innocents?

No, you don't have to reply to any of that, because none of that has been claimed. I conceded children, but never infants. You conceded that children were, most likely, not guilty. However, you never said God "takes care of the innocent". In fact, wouldn't "taking care of the innocent" mean that God would have protected them from the genocide that he commanded? No. You said he would "make it right" for the slaughtered innocent babies who had done nothing wrong. In order to make something right, it first has to be wrong. What could possibly have been wrong for those Canaanite babies? And who perpetrated that wrong? And by who's command? Oh. That's right. They were slaughtered. By the Israelites. At. God's. Command. As soon as you acknowledge that God is going to "make" that "right for them" with after-life lollies, you concede that it was wrong to slaughter them, in the first place. God. Acted. Immorally.