Zone1 Here's Why White Guilt About Slavery Is Insane

[Mr. Friscus]

What you went on about wasn’t “wokeness” in any meaningful sense, it was just an anti-woke rant aimed at a strawman.

To me, woke has never meant assigning personal guilt to people for what their ancestors did. That’s a cartoon version invented so people don’t have to engage with the substance.

"Woke" has a clear meaning nowadays.. it really doesn't matter if you have some secret definition. I'm fine defining terms for clarification in a discussion, but woke has established itself as a pretty proud, defined, and cliche meaning.

What it actually means, is much simpler and much less hysterical:

I'll go with you point by point

It’s the demand that past actions be acknowledged as morally wrong

That's called studying history. Nobody disagrees with this.

, that the systems built on those actions be honestly described

Ah, here's your first blemish. Of course, we all want history to be studied "honestly", but we've seen how radical leftist academics generally can't "honestly" teach education. They've lied so many times in teaching things like:
1. The Trans Atlantic Slave Trade (which I mentioned)
2. The original settlers in North America and their perpetuation of the Noble Savage, ignoring their violence and complete immorality.
3. The Spanish takeover of South America, and ignoring the horrible immorality of native populations who would murder children and tear their hearts out.
4. The Civil War, ignoring States Rights and Tariffs, and absolving the north in the their culpability in slavery as well as their clear instigation in starting the war, and ignore Lincoln's massive violations of the constitution. The North was just as guilty of slavery, they just didn't rely on it economically like the South did, so abolishing it was just a war-time measure to cripple the South to defeat them in the war.

I could go on. So much of history has been dishonestly taught by an institution (education) that is completely infiltrated and dominated by Democrat/leftists.

, and that the downstream consequences of those systems, where they still exist today, be recognized and mitigated.

That's activism, you demand certain political positions to be held (I'll assume Democrat and leftist ones)... For starters I don't buy the connections you try to make. They don't exist today. You can say they do, but I can also say there's a boogeyman in your closet too.

No inherited guilt. No racial original sin. No collective punishment.

These are mainstream leftist tropes against white people.

 

[Robert W]

Ah, here's your first blemish. Of course, we all want history to be studied "honestly", but we've seen how radical leftist academics generally can't "honestly" teach education. They've lied so many times in teaching things like:
1. The Trans Atlantic Slave Trade (which I mentioned)
2. The original settlers in North America and their perpetuation of the Noble Savage, ignoring their violence and complete immorality.
3. The Spanish takeover of South America, and ignoring the horrible immorality of native populations who would murder children and tear their hearts out.
4. The Civil War, ignoring States Rights and Tariffs, and absolving the north in the their culpability in slavery as well as their clear instigation in starting the war, and ignore Lincoln's massive violations of the constitution. The North was just as guilty of slavery, they just didn't rely on it economically like the South did, so abolishing it was just a war-time measure to cripple the South to defeat them in the war.

I could go on. So much of history has been dishonestly taught by an institution (education) that is completely infiltrated and dominated by Democrat/leftists.

100 percent accurate. I have spoken against Lincoln many times.

 

[Mr. Friscus]

100 percent accurate. I have spoken against Lincoln many times.

I'm not completely demonizing him, it's not absolute... but hey outright admitted everything. He was for slavery if it kept the country together. I think Lincoln realized the moral evil slavery was, but had to do whatever it took to keep the country united. He wasn't the only one to struggle with this. Robert E Lee noted how slavery was a moral and political evil.

The Civil War was complicated with many factors. Leftist propaganda has simplified it down to "SOUTH=SLAVERY=BAD. NORTH=NO SLAVERY=GOOD (which is a lie, there was still plenty of slavery in the North)".

 

[Mr. Friscus]

1. I have acknowleged on multiple occasions on here that slavery is an historical fact outside the US. Usually in the context of biblical slavery.

Well, at least you're not claiming Britain invented it.

2. So your assertion is, is that since it were blacks who did the capturing, whites aren't responsible.

My point is that Whites weren't most responsible, not near it.

It seems to me that the blacks in Africa captured their neighbouring tribes and sold them into slavery because whites provided the economic incentive to do so.

I think that's a knee-jerk stretch attempt. Africans didn't wake up one morning and decide to enslave others because America existed. As you mentioned, slavery has existed long before America.

3. You are right. On the other hand, the USA kept the instution of slavery long after most nations abandoned it.

1. Not "most nations". Slavery is still going on in nations today.
2. Not "long after", there's no need to be hyperbolic with time periods.

Fought a civil war to try to sustain it

The Civil War wasn't just whether slavery was good or not. Both sides were moving to get away from it over the coming decades IMO. The Emancipation wasn't a moral document, it was a war maneuver to cripple an enemy economically and defeat them in battle. That's it.

and after they couldn't kept Black people as second rate citizens well into the 20th century.

Indeed, it took time.

Something that still creates systemic problems to this day. So there's that.

Does it still? Or is that just victimhood mentality?

4. If by "owned" you mean held the deeds as an individual sure, the number is closer to 2 but sure. On the other hand if you look at it by household like I'd suggest an intellectual honest person would look at it, the number during the colonial era was more like 25 percent. And just before the civil war in the Southern States over 30.

You demand honesty but then go straight short-cut on your points.

You decide to chop off the graph and identify only Southern States, when the problem is that guess who economically benefitted from the Southern slavery... the North. The South did the agricultural portion, the North did the industrial portion. You can't just chop the North from the South, they were both benefitting from it and using it whether directly or indirectly.

See the reason you don't hear the points you make among leftists, is because you aren't really interested in hearing what they have to say if it doesn't fit your narrative.

I'm referring to incorrect narratives that have been taught by leftist academics and installed into textbook norms. Of course if you reference those textbooks, you'll say I must be wrong. But based on actual historical numbers their narratives aren't correct.

 

[Robert W]

I'm not completely demonizing him, it's not absolute... but hey outright admitted everything. He was for slavery if it kept the country together. I think Lincoln realized the moral evil slavery was, but had to do whatever it took to keep the country united. He wasn't the only one to struggle with this. Robert E Lee noted how slavery was a moral and political evil.

The Civil War was complicated with many factors. Leftist propaganda has simplified it down to "SOUTH=SLAVERY=BAD. NORTH=NO SLAVERY=GOOD (which is a lie, there was still plenty of slavery in the North)".

100% accurate.

 

[Robert W]

True - which shows it’s largely a lack of fathers in the home that correlates to high poverty and high crime - not racism, and not slavery. When whites have babies out of wedlock, they too struggle paying the bills and the kids don’t turn out as well. But of course they don’t have slavery to blame.

So it’s not slavery from two centuries back that is currently causing problems among the black underclass, it’s the 73% illegitimacy rate. And since blacks have around twice the rate as whites, they have twice the rate of poverty and crime.

There was a time in the United States when you and I would suffer the pillory for things we say today. But should we whine about the pillory when it no longer can harm us? Slavery is similar. Matter of fact, it would be nice to have IM2 in a pillory.

 

[Mr. Friscus]

True - which shows it’s largely a lack of fathers in the home that correlates to high poverty and high crime - not racism, and not slavery. When whites have babies out of wedlock, they too struggle paying the bills and the kids don’t turn out as well. But of course they don’t have slavery to blame.

So it’s not slavery from two centuries back that is currently causing problems among the black underclass, it’s the 73% illegitimacy rate. And since blacks have around twice the rate as whites, they have twice the rate of poverty and crime.

The folk on here who say the ambiguous claims of how past issues are still present today will not address this, because they can't.

They have to leave it in a vague, obscured assumption.

 

[Lockback]

I took a blood test to see if I was infected with any White Guilt.
I'm relieved to tell you I don't have any at all!!

 

[Mr. Friscus]

I took a blood test to see if I was infected with any White Guilt.
I'm relieved to tell you I don't have any at all!!

The middle of the country is being red-pilled on race for sure. However, White "normal" leftists will always continue to try to score points and loathe themselves because of their skin color, and try to gain authority from doing so. Their overlords (LGBT, black, arabian, latino, etc.) always love having pets around they can pat on the head and tell them to bark out more self-loathing statements whenever they desire.

 

[Robert W]

3. You are right. On the other hand, the USA kept the instution of slavery long after most nations abandoned it. Fought a civil war to try to sustain it, and after they couldn't kept Black people as second rate citizens well into the 20th century. Something that still creates systemic problems to this day. So there's that.

The South never fought the war due to slavery. Getting rid of Slavery was not on Lincolns mind at all. What was on the Souths mind was it got invaded in VA by Lincoln. Abe operated as if he was the owner of states. Abe definitely did not own a single state.
Sure, Democrats of today's mind did keep blacks down under. Republicans did a lot to free them. When has a Democrat president fought to free slaves? Mr Friscus is a great teacher.

 

[Lisa558]

The folk on here who say the ambiguous claims of how past issues are still present today will not address this, because they can't.

They have to leave it in a vague, obscured assumption.

Yes, and the other thing they refuse to address is why, if slavery is the cause of poverty (and related problems) among blacks, have most blacks moved beyond poverty and now live working or middle class lives?

 

[Mr. Friscus]

Yes, and the other thing they refuse to address is why, if slavery is the cause of poverty (and related problems) among blacks, have most blacks moved beyond poverty and now live working or middle class lives?

The truth is that the major falsehoods have been ingrained in their party and ideology's culture, and there's bottleneck mainstream portions of the American black community that will not ever let go of the narrative that black folk are unable to achieve anything in life because white people are holding them down. This is sadly a very appealing message to specifically young black males.. encouraging them that attaining personal power/freedom is impossible, and thus they take a deconstructionist approach and resort to so much crime. Young men can be drawn into anti-establishment radicalism easily given their wiring, and if you combine it with racial propaganda... it gets ugly, as we've seen in the data. Young black men commit a majority of murders in our country, and they only make up like 3-5% of the population.

 

[Lisa558]

The truth is that the major falsehoods have been ingrained in their party and ideology's culture, and there's bottleneck mainstream portions of the American black community that will not ever let go of the narrative that black folk are unable to achieve anything in life because white people are holding them down. This is sadly a very appealing message to specifically young black males.. encouraging them that attaining personal power/freedom is impossible, and thus they take a deconstructionist approach and resort to so much crime. Young men can be drawn into anti-establishment radicalism easily given their wiring, and if you combine it with racial propaganda... it gets ugly, as we've seen in the data. Young black men commit a majority of murders in our country, and they only make up like 3-5% of the population.

All true. Thank you.

 

[alang1216]

Really which ones?

Mandatory separation in waiting rooms, ticket windows, elevators, water fountains, and restrooms?

Railroad companies required to provide separate cars for Black and white passengers?

Segregated public schools, libraries, and nursing homes?

Restrictive covenants barred African Americans from buying homes in certain neighborhoods?

Poll taxes, literacy tests, and grandfather clauses?

Intermarriage between races forbidden?

Segregation in hospitals, asylums, and jail cells?

You are so emotional it's clouding your objectivity.

I was thinking more about the GOP removing laws that might help Blacks get better jobs, healthcare, housing, and education.

AI Overview

In 2025, a wave of legislative, executive, and regulatory actions led by the Republican Party has targeted Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) initiatives, affirmative action, and "disparate impact" rules, particularly affecting federal contractors and state-level education systems
. These actions are framed by supporters as returning to "merit-based" policies and removing "discriminatory preferences," while critics argue they dismantle protections against systemic discrimination in employment, housing, and education for Black Americans.
Key areas where these actions have taken place include:

1. Employment and Federal Contracting

• Removal of DEI Programs: Executive orders in 2025 mandated the termination of DEI offices and programs across the federal government and for federal contractors.
• Rescinding Non-Discrimination Orders: The administration rescinded previous orders designed to promote diversity, including 1965 executive orders that prohibited discrimination in federal contracting.
• Apprenticeship Changes: The Department of Labor (DOL) proposed removing requirements for apprenticeship programs to conduct targeted recruitment for minorities, women, and people with disabilities.
• Targeting "Disparate Impact" Rules: In April 2025, an executive order directed agencies to limit the use of the "disparate impact" standard, which had been used to challenge policies that appear neutral but have discriminatory effects.

2. Education

• State-Level DEI Bans: Numerous Republican-led states (Alabama, Idaho, Iowa, Kentucky, Utah, Indiana) signed laws in 2024 and 2025 prohibiting public universities and colleges from maintaining DEI offices, funding DEI activities, or requiring diversity statements in hiring.
• "Divisive Concepts" Restrictions: Legislation in these states often restricts teaching or training on topics related to race, systemic oppression, and implicit bias.
• Department of Education Reductions: Proposals to dismantle or significantly restructure the U.S. Department of Education were initiated, including efforts to cut funding for public K-12 education.

3. Housing and Healthcare

• Fair Housing Enforcement: The administration zeroed out funding for the Fair Housing Initiatives Program (FHIP), which supports non-profit groups that fight housing discrimination.
• Fair Housing Regulations: The Department of Housing and Urban Development (HUD) moved to alter "disparate impact" rules, making it more difficult to challenge housing providers and lenders on discrimination.
• Healthcare Access: Proposed budgets have targeted the reduction of Medicaid funding and the elimination of programs designed to address health disparities for minority populations.

4. Other Policy Areas

• Voting Rights Act: Republican-led initiatives have sought to limit the scope of the Voting Rights Act, specifically targeting the use of race in creating majority-Black districts.
• Economic Relief: Proposed budget plans have aimed to allow enhanced tax credits (like those in the Affordable Care Act) to expire, which critics argue will increase healthcare costs for low-income Black households.

These actions are part of a broader, stated initiative to dismantle what the current administration terms "radical and wasteful government DEI programs" and to promote "color-blind" policies.

 

[alang1216]

That was all removed more than 50 years ago, and blacks were better off in the 1970s than they are now.

Still doesn’t explain why blacks have gone BACKWARDS.

I love it when the Right just makes stuff up and then really believe it.

Data indicates that Black Americans are generally better off today than in the 1970s regarding poverty rates, education levels, and income. While disparities remain, the Black poverty rate has declined from nearly 30% in 1976 to below 20% in recent years, and college graduation rates have increased significantly.
Key comparisons between the 1970s and current trends include:

• Poverty and Income: Fewer Black Americans live in poverty now (27%) compared to 1976 (29%). Black median household income has seen significant growth since 2011, reaching a high in 2022.
• Education: High school and college completion rates for Black Americans have increased significantly over the past four decades, narrowing the educational gap with white Americans.
• Unemployment: The Black unemployment rate in 2023 was at a record low of 5.5%, which is roughly half the average rate of the 1970s.
• Wealth and Inequality: Despite improvements, the racial wealth gap has remained largely stagnant for 40 years. While some metrics show progress, other areas like incarceration rates, maternal mortality, and homeownership continue to show significant, persistent inequality.
• Historical Context: The 1970s were a turbulent period, but also marked by intense efforts in school desegregation, voting rights enforcement, and, initially, an increase in the number of Black families entering the middle class.

While economic, educational, and political progress has been made since the 1970s, structural inequalities in wealth and other areas persist.

 

[alang1216]

And let me guess.. you're suggesting you're a special source of knowledge?

Don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining. I saw the transformation of the Democrats with my own eyes.

 

[candycorn]

Modern woke pseudo-history paints a fabricated story of slavery; that white men came to Africa, stole Africans from their lands, and brought them to America. It was White American men, and only White American men, who were guilty of this, and it was a large majority of them as well. This was unique to the world at the time and in world history, and is a special evil in the history of mankind.

Of course, this is all complete nonsense, and is just woke propaganda we were taught in schools or are being told by politicians or media pundits today. But it's important to look at the context and just how insanely wrong these claims are. Let's look at total number of slaves, for example:

It is absolutely true that the Trans-Atlantic slave trade, in which Africans captured other Africans and sold them, shipped approximately 12.5 million slaves across the Atlantic to the Americas.

The Issue becomes where those slaves were taken. A woke liberal would probably assume that 12.5 million slaves were taken from Africa and sent to the American south. That would be insanely false. The breakdown looks like this:

• 5.4 million were sent to Brazil
• 3.6 million were sent to the Carribean
• 1.2 million were sent to Jamaica
• 900,000 were sent to St. Dominique (French Colony)
• 889,000 were sent to Cuba
• 470,000 were sent to the United States

So in this cry of woke left Democrat social justice warriors... cries of the unique evil of America, white men, etc... they make the claims they do when American only partook in 3% of the Trans-Atlantic Slave trade.

Add to that how there were only about 390,000 slave owners in the USA out of a population of 31 million... and you have approximately 1.2% of the population participating or benefitting from it, yet is that what Democrats, leftists, or educators say, address, or teach?

Slavery is an evil that has existed as long as human history has. All races have been enslaved, many continue to be. As far as America is concerned, it basically happened for 90 years nearly 200 years ago. However, no woke Democrat can legitimately point the finger at the USA as some unique evil in slavery, nor can they say we were any leader in it. They need to point the finger at Africans of the times first, and then all the South American/Brazilian/Carribean nations who were far greater participants.

And this is just the Trans-Atlantic slave trade. Again, Slavery exists across the world at far greater rates throughout history.

So, any person who wants to demonize the USA and White people as a unique evil as far as slavery, or as a major historical cause of it, is just revealing their tragic indoctrination and ignorance of history.

Please quote someone stating it was unique to the US.

 

[Lisa558]

I was thinking more about the GOP removing laws that might help Blacks get better jobs, healthcare, housing, and education.

AI Overview

In 2025, a wave of legislative, executive, and regulatory actions led by the Republican Party has targeted Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) initiatives, affirmative action, and "disparate impact" rules, particularly affecting federal contractors and state-level education systems
. These actions are framed by supporters as returning to "merit-based" policies and removing "discriminatory preferences," while critics argue they dismantle protections against systemic discrimination in employment, housing, and education for Black Americans.
Key areas where these actions have taken place include:

1. Employment and Federal Contracting

• Removal of DEI Programs: Executive orders in 2025 mandated the termination of DEI offices and programs across the federal government and for federal contractors.
• Rescinding Non-Discrimination Orders: The administration rescinded previous orders designed to promote diversity, including 1965 executive orders that prohibited discrimination in federal contracting.
• Apprenticeship Changes: The Department of Labor (DOL) proposed removing requirements for apprenticeship programs to conduct targeted recruitment for minorities, women, and people with disabilities.
• Targeting "Disparate Impact" Rules: In April 2025, an executive order directed agencies to limit the use of the "disparate impact" standard, which had been used to challenge policies that appear neutral but have discriminatory effects.

2. Education

• State-Level DEI Bans: Numerous Republican-led states (Alabama, Idaho, Iowa, Kentucky, Utah, Indiana) signed laws in 2024 and 2025 prohibiting public universities and colleges from maintaining DEI offices, funding DEI activities, or requiring diversity statements in hiring.
• "Divisive Concepts" Restrictions: Legislation in these states often restricts teaching or training on topics related to race, systemic oppression, and implicit bias.
• Department of Education Reductions: Proposals to dismantle or significantly restructure the U.S. Department of Education were initiated, including efforts to cut funding for public K-12 education.

3. Housing and Healthcare

• Fair Housing Enforcement: The administration zeroed out funding for the Fair Housing Initiatives Program (FHIP), which supports non-profit groups that fight housing discrimination.
• Fair Housing Regulations: The Department of Housing and Urban Development (HUD) moved to alter "disparate impact" rules, making it more difficult to challenge housing providers and lenders on discrimination.
• Healthcare Access: Proposed budgets have targeted the reduction of Medicaid funding and the elimination of programs designed to address health disparities for minority populations.

4. Other Policy Areas

• Voting Rights Act: Republican-led initiatives have sought to limit the scope of the Voting Rights Act, specifically targeting the use of race in creating majority-Black districts.
• Economic Relief: Proposed budget plans have aimed to allow enhanced tax credits (like those in the Affordable Care Act) to expire, which critics argue will increase healthcare costs for low-income Black households.

These actions are part of a broader, stated initiative to dismantle what the current administration terms "radical and wasteful government DEI programs" and to promote "color-blind" policies.

You mean the GOP removing laws that permitted leftists to discriminate against white people?

DEI allows for hiring a black who is less qualified than a white - simply due to skin color. THAT is racist.

Why is it leftists are OK with racism when it goes against whites?

 

[Lisa558]

I love it when the Right just makes stuff up and then really believe it.

Data indicates that Black Americans are generally better off today than in the 1970s regarding poverty rates, education levels, and income. While disparities remain, the Black poverty rate has declined from nearly 30% in 1976 to below 20% in recent years, and college graduation rates have increased significantly.
Key comparisons between the 1970s and current trends include:

• Poverty and Income: Fewer Black Americans live in poverty now (27%) compared to 1976 (29%). Black median household income has seen significant growth since 2011, reaching a high in 2022.
• Education: High school and college completion rates for Black Americans have increased significantly over the past four decades, narrowing the educational gap with white Americans.
• Unemployment: The Black unemployment rate in 2023 was at a record low of 5.5%, which is roughly half the average rate of the 1970s.
• Wealth and Inequality: Despite improvements, the racial wealth gap has remained largely stagnant for 40 years. While some metrics show progress, other areas like incarceration rates, maternal mortality, and homeownership continue to show significant, persistent inequality.
• Historical Context: The 1970s were a turbulent period, but also marked by intense efforts in school desegregation, voting rights enforcement, and, initially, an increase in the number of Black families entering the middle class.

While economic, educational, and political progress has been made since the 1970s, structural inequalities in wealth and other areas persist.

So blacks are better off after all the favoritism for the past 50 years? When they get special advantages over whites for college spots, jobs, and promotions? And that’s been going on for TWO generations?

And they still are behind whites? Well, news flash: that’s because a demographic cannot have 73% of babies out of wedlock, which leads to poverty and high crime rates - and expect to have the same outcomes as a demographic with half that rate.

Once blacks reduce their OOW rate to that equivalent to whites, and maintain that for a generation, THEN we can talk about equal outcomes.

 

[Lisa558]

Don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining. I saw the transformation of the Democrats with my own eyes.

So have I, from the party of the working class to the party that….

• prioritizes criminals over law-abiders,
• welfare recipients over the working class,
• Islamic terrorists over Jews,
• Iran over Israel,
• racist policies over merit, and
• violent illegal aliens over decent American citizens.