Zone1 Here's Why White Guilt About Slavery Is Insane

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If disagreement automatically makes someone racist, then your position isn’t persuasive — it’s ideological. Real policies survive scrutiny without name-calling.

in my view I would argue racial profiling of the police in traffic stops. Since we are talking "egregious" racism.

I don't think however that's a bad measuring stick. Since things don't have to be "egregious racism" to disadvantage black people.

There are plenty of studies that show that black people get comparatively harsher punishments for similar crimes. I'm not sure that's a function of racism or economics. Worse legal representation causes worse outcomes. But it is racially tied. Just one example and I can name several.

The point is this. To this day a black person is more likely to be poor. Come from a broken home, and have a worse education. And the roots of those problems lay in slavery and continue to this day.

I don't think your necessarily racist. And I can defend my position without name-calling. So do you agree or disagree here?

 

[OODA_Loop]

The point is this. To this day a black person is more likely to be poor. Come from a broken home, and have a worse education. And the roots of those problems lay in slavery and continue to this day.

What roots of being poor, a broken home and having a worse education linger after 150 years.

Why are we surrounded by black people in our communities that aren’t poor, raise families and educated themselves?

What different about them?

 

[forkup]

The ACW was as much about how to abolish slavery more so than just abolition.

How do you abolish something you don’t have the support to do within the confines of the law?

The same way you resolve every other question within a Democracy. By having elections. Neither Minnesota nor California agrees with Trump's policies. They aren't saying they aren't part of the US anymore as a response now are they? Let alone raising armies and try to take Washington

The South seceded because they didn't like the outcome of the elections.

 

[Hafar1014]

Black boys need to feel guilty about refusing to be fathers

 

[forkup]

What roots of being poor, a broken home and having a worse education linger after 150 years.

Why are we surrounded by black people in our communities that aren’t poor, raise families and educated themselves?

What different about them?

What about the sentence "more likely" is hard for you? I'm talking averages here. And when you have a statistical significant difference in economic status that you can draw on skin color it's not hard to infer those differences are a result of that skin color. Otherwise it would be the worlds biggest coincidence.

The argument that there are black people that don't fit that average just shows me that you don't understand how averages work, or are, more likely, trying to gaslight.

 

[Hafar1014]

What about the sentence "more likely" is hard for you? I'm talking averages here. And when you have a statistical significant difference in economic status that you can draw on skin color it's not hard to infer those differences are a result of that skin color. Otherwise it would be the worlds biggest coincidence.

The argument that there are black people that don't fit that average just shows me that you don't understand how averages work, or are, more likely, trying to gaslight.

The difference is father in the home

 

[jotathought]

I don't think your necessarily racist. And I can defend my position without name-calling. So do you agree or disagree here?

Disparities don’t automatically equal racism. Even you point out economics and legal representation as major drivers. We can acknowledge real problems in policing, sentencing, and poverty without turning every unequal outcome into proof of ongoing racial intent or inherited guilt. Fixing what’s broken now matters more than arguing about permanent blame.

 

[forkup]

Disparities don’t automatically equal racism. Even you point out economics and legal representation as major drivers. We can acknowledge real problems in policing, sentencing, and poverty without turning every unequal outcome into proof of ongoing racial intent or inherited guilt. Fixing what’s broken now matters more than arguing about permanent blame.

To me, woke has never meant assigning personal guilt to people for what their ancestors did. That’s a cartoon version invented so people don’t have to engage with the substance.

What it actually means, is much simpler and much less hysterical:
It’s the demand that past actions be acknowledged as morally wrong, that the systems built on those actions be honestly described, and that the downstream consequences of those systems, where they still exist today, be recognized and mitigated.

That’s it.

No inherited guilt. No racial original sin. No collective punishment.
Just moral clarity about history and a refusal to pretend its effects conveniently stopped mattering the moment it became uncomfortable.

 

[ding]

Maybe, but at least the Dems are working to save them from ourselves.

I love how you guys think today's problems compare to what YOUR Party did. Please don't tell me you think government saves anyone. At its worst it did what your party did for over 150 years. At its best it stopped doing that. So what exactly is it that you believe government is going to do differently to save them from ourselves?

 

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You have no idea what you are talking about. Slavery goes as far back as recorded history does. The Spartans kept a class of slaves called Helots. If I recall correctly, they even had one day a year when any Spartan citizen could kill any Helot without penalty as a measure of control.

I was speaking about in America.

But since you know so much about the world history of slavery can you tell me the difference between indentured servitude and forced slavery. Then explain to me how the Greeks, Romans, Founding Fathers and Confederates justified forced slavery.

 

[ding]

The Roman Latifundio made the Southern plantations seem like charitable institutions. While in the ancient world, slavery wasn't race based, it was hereditary and slaves had zero rights. A master could do anything to a slave. American slavery was anything but inescapable, many slaves bought their freedom as well as that of family members. freedom.

American forced slavery (1619–1865) was distinct from many historical systems by creating a, racialized, lifelong, and hereditary "chattel" system where slaves were legal property. While many ancient systems allowed for social mobility or eventual freedom, American slavery was a permanent, intergenerational status with extreme, legally sanctioned violence.

Key differences between American slavery and historical precedents include:

• Racial and Legal Status: American slavery was explicitly based on race, with laws developed to define Africans as subhuman property, whereas other systems often included prisoners of war or debtors of various backgrounds.
• Hereditary Nature: American law stated that the status of the child followed the status of the mother, making enslavement an inescapable, inherited, life-long sentence.
• Industrialized Scale: American slavery, particularly on cotton and sugar plantations, was characterized by high-intensity, industrialized labor, aimed at maximizing profit, often with lower life expectancy compared to some forms of household or agricultural slavery in other eras.
• Comparisons to Other Systems:
  • Roman/Greek Slavery: While also brutal and chattel-based, Roman slaves sometimes had paths to freedom, could hold property, and were not always racially distinguishable from their masters.
  • African Slavery: Many African systems allowed enslaved people to integrate into the family/kinship group, and in some cases, they held rights, such as to own property or marry.
  • Debt Bondage: Premodern, non-chattel systems often allowed slaves to work off debts and eventually gain freedom, unlike the permanent nature of American slavery.

Despite these differences, historical slavery across the globe still included severe brutality, such as torture, sexual assault, and branding. The defining factor of American slavery was the combination of extreme cruelty with a legal, racial, and intergenerational structure that denied humanity.

 

[Lisa558]

What about the sentence "more likely" is hard for you? I'm talking averages here. And when you have a statistical significant difference in economic status that you can draw on skin color it's not hard to infer those differences are a result of that skin color. Otherwise it would be the worlds biggest coincidence.

The argument that there are black people that don't fit that average just shows me that you don't understand how averages work, or are, more likely, trying to gaslight.

You’re pivoting.

The fact is that MOST blacks have worked their way out of poverty - to the working and middle classes. So what is different about the majority of blacks, who aren’t stuck in poverty, and blacks who are?

I’ve asked this question a dozen times, and no leftist is willing to answer. And why? Because they’d have to admit personal responsibility is involved.

 

[Lisa558]

Maybe, but at least the Dems are working to save them from ourselves.

How so? Handing out welfare for generations has hurt them.

 

[OODA_Loop]

And when you have a statistical significant difference in economic status that you can draw on skin color it's not hard to infer those differences are a result of that skin color. Otherwise it would be the worlds biggest coincidence.

Or there are other contributing factors than mere amount of melanin like being raised with both parents in
the home, Being taught you’re not a victim of 150 years ago. You have to value and seek an education. And being taught you will never achieve anything unless your work for it.

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

Some slaves were abused; there were as many sadistic idiots back then as now. Most were treated better than the members of the endless waves of poor immigrants that fueled the expansion of the Northern industrial machine.

Obviously there were episodes of abuse but this was not a prison gang. These people weren’t being punished. They were being used to produce. You don’t beat the hell out of work gear. You treat it so it works efficiently.

 

[Robert W]

My master often went to the house, got drunk, and then came out to the field to whip, cut, slash, curse, swear, beat and knock down several, for the smallest offense, or nothing at all.

He divested a poor female slave of all wearing apparel, tied her down to stakes, and whipped her with a handsaw until he broke it over her naked body. In process of time, he ravished her person and became the father of a child by her. Besides, he always kept a colored Miss in the house with him. This is another curse of Slavery concubinage and illegitimate connections which is carried on to an alarming extent in the far South. A poor slave man who lives close by his wife is permitted to visit her but very seldom, and other men, both white and colored, cohabit with her. It is undoubtedly the worst place of incest and bigamy in the world. A white man thinks nothing of putting a colored man out to carry the fore row [front row in field work] and carry on the same sport with the colored man’s wife at the same time.

I know these facts will seem too awful to relate, but I am constrained to write of such revolting deeds, as they are some of the real “dark deeds of American Slavery.” Then, kind reader, pursue my narrative, remembering that I give no fiction in my details of horrid scenes. Nay, believe, with me, that the half can never be told of the misery the poor slaves are still suffering in this so-called land of freedom.
-William J. Anderson, Life and Narrative of William J. Anderson, Twenty-Four Years a Slave, 1857

William J. Anderson, Life and Narrative of William J. Anderson, Twenty-Four Years a Slave, Chicago: Daily Tribune Book and Job Printing Office, 1857. William J. Anderson, b. 1811. Life and Narrative of William J. Anderson, Twenty-four Years a Slave; Sold Eight Times! In Jail Sixty Times!! Whipped Three Hundred Times!!! or The Dark Deeds of American Slavery Revealed. Containing Scriptural Views of the Origin of the Black and of the White Man. Also, a Simple and Easy Plan to Abolish Slavery in the United States. Together with an Account of the Services of Colored Men in the Revolutionary War--Day and Date, and Interesting Facts.

Thats just one "fallacy".

Stop lying to yourself white aolescent male.

We white humans far and away due to the high cost of slaves, the fact injured they were not useful on the plantation and more know a few whites did as you say, but your story is just about one black man living with a horrible master.

 

[Robert W]

Obviously there were episodes of abuse but this was not a prison gang. These people weren’t being punished. They were being used to produce. You don’t beat the hell out of work gear. You treat it so it works efficiently.

IM2 brags he is a democrat. They owned the slaves he defends daily yet says nothing bad about democrats.

 

[Lisa558]

IM2 brags he is a democrat. They owned the slaves he defends daily yet says nothing bad about democrats.

Plus, to hear him rant, you’d think every white got rich off the backs of blacks. Only about 2% of Americans owned slaves. And at least half of Americans alive today didn’t have ancestors here until after slavery. (My own ancestors came in the 20th century, fleeing horrific and violent antisemitism.)

 

[Robert W]

Plus, to hear him rant, you’d think every white got rich off the backs of blacks. Only about 2% of Americans owned slaves. And at least half of Americans alive today didn’t have ancestors here until after slavery. (My own ancestors came in the 20th century, fleeing horrific and violent antisemitism.)

His focus is blurry.

 

[Robert W]

Plus, to hear him rant, you’d think every white got rich off the backs of blacks. Only about 2% of Americans owned slaves. And at least half of Americans alive today didn’t have ancestors here until after slavery. (My own ancestors came in the 20th century, fleeing horrific and violent antisemitism.)

You have accurate data. My ancestors in the USA date back to around 1620.