Give 'em hell Barry!!!!!!

[elvis]

Obama really laid it out tonight. He almost sounded like Harry Truman (of whom my wife had the pleasure to meet).

.

Was Truman a liar too?
News from The Associated Press

Yes. Next question?

 

[Trajan]

Why is it you leftists continually insult the National Guard by pretending they arent part of the military?

You don't dodge the draft by joining the military. Stop insulting people simply because you dont like what part of the military they chose to serve in.

He never said he didn't like it. he is saying Bush got out of going to the rice paddies by joining the national guard.

apparently, the truth troubles our friend avatar. so much so that rather than acknowledge the truth of the statement, he has to pretend it's somehow bashing the military to tell the truth

oh...and avatar.... they absolutely DID get out of going to vietnam by joining the guard in those days (unlike what happened during iraq). it was the poor schmucks who got sent off to the rice paddies.

uhmmmmm, a weee bit yes and a lot of no.

of a third and a tad (38%) of those that were drafted (service wide), only 25% in toto actually were IN Vietnam.

and as far as education goes they were more highly educated by a huge margin than say those in ww2.

Oh and the other old canard? minorities being fed as fodder ? they were actually underrepresented by pop. % as KIAs.

 

[The Gadfly]

Look, first of all, the man was flying F-102s. I have it on good authority from some zoomies I know from the time that this aircraft was extremely unforgiving, and killed a fair percentage of pilots that flew it on routine missions. Now, being a grunt in Vietnam was not exactly a safe thing, but most of us in fact survived our tours, so it wasn't a death sentence either, and given my druthers, I'd rather fight on terra firma, or even jump out of an aircraft, than try to fly a fighter like that. I don't think I'd call a man who signed up for that duty a coward. Someone, on the other hand, who actually DID admittedly dodge the draft, and stated that his primary reason for doing so "was to protect myself from physical harm....while maintaining my future political viability...." well, I think that speaks for itself.

 

[The Gadfly]

apparently, the truth troubles our friend avatar. so much so that rather than acknowledge the truth of the statement, he has to pretend it's somehow bashing the military to tell the truth

oh...and avatar.... they absolutely DID get out of going to vietnam by joining the guard in those days (unlike what happened during iraq). it was the poor schmucks who got sent off to the rice paddies.

I was in those rice paddies, Jillian, and I was neither poor, nor a conscript-like two-thirds of those who served there, I enlisted voluntarily. I don't disparage those who served in the Guard or Reserve for their choice to do that, any more than I disparage those who were "in the rear with the gear" while I was carrying a ruck and a rifle. We were all on the same team. At least, they weren't in the street, chanting "Hell no, we won't go!", or cheering for Ho Chi Minh.

then you were part of a minority. and i respect your going. you put your money where your mouth is.

i'm afraid though, i don't see anything wrong with the 'hell no, we won't go' thing either. the people who said that believed with all their heart that we had no reason to be in vietnam.... just as you believed it was your duty to go.

Jillian,
I don't doubt that some of them did, but quite a few were simply cowards. It's also a little hard for me to accept that, when I saw men who were genuine conscientious objectors who refused to kill or even carry a weapon serve bravely as combat medics in Vietnam. I saw some of them give their lives trying to save the wounded; they were better men than I am; no one who served with any of them will ever forget them. Then too, if someone refused to go, that just meant someone else had to; to me that would have felt like just passing my burden off on some other guy, and I couldn't do that.

 

[elvis]

I was in those rice paddies, Jillian, and I was neither poor, nor a conscript-like two-thirds of those who served there, I enlisted voluntarily. I don't disparage those who served in the Guard or Reserve for their choice to do that, any more than I disparage those who were "in the rear with the gear" while I was carrying a ruck and a rifle. We were all on the same team. At least, they weren't in the street, chanting "Hell no, we won't go!", or cheering for Ho Chi Minh.

then you were part of a minority. and i respect your going. you put your money where your mouth is.

i'm afraid though, i don't see anything wrong with the 'hell no, we won't go' thing either. the people who said that believed with all their heart that we had no reason to be in vietnam.... just as you believed it was your duty to go.

Jillian,
I don't doubt that some of them did, but quite a few were simply cowards. It's also a little hard for me to accept that, when I saw men who were genuine conscientious objectors who refused to kill or even carry a weapon serve bravely as combat medics in Vietnam. I saw some of them give their lives trying to save the wounded; they were better men than I am; no one who served with any of them will ever forget them. Then too, if someone refused to go, that just meant someone else had to; to me that would have felt like just passing my burden off on some other guy, and I couldn't do that.

What, then, of Cheney and Rumsfeld's deferments? Didn't that mean someone else had to go in their place?

 

[Dr.House]

Obama really laid it out tonight. He almost sounded like Harry Truman (of whom my wife had the pleasure to meet).

.

I didn't watch...

Was it different than last years jobs plan he hatched after last year's vacation?

That one worked so well....

 

[oreo]

Obama really laid it out tonight. He almost sounded like Harry Truman (of whom my wife had the pleasure to meet).

.

I didn't watch...

Was it different than last years jobs plan he hatched after last year's vacation?

That one worked so well....

Well he talks about lowering taxes on small business--then in the next sentence raising taxes--then he talks about road and bridge work--and getting government workers back to work--and extending unemployment benefits another year--then tells the 12 member debt commission committee that THEY need to come up with a PLAN.

Still no nuts and bolts--but perfectly pronounced speeches read from a telepromter-and NOTHING on paper that can be debated. I guess that's suppose to come in a couple of weeks--and let's just hope that his next speech doesn't involve a joint session of congress to deliver it---

It still amazes me how this country could be swayed into voting for someone who has a job that is so over his head.

Mitt Romney couldn't have said it better: Obama is still plugging quarters into a pay phone booth (expecting the economy to improve)--when we live in the smart phone century.



Son of Stimulus is all it amounted to.

 

[Dr.House]

Obama really laid it out tonight. He almost sounded like Harry Truman (of whom my wife had the pleasure to meet).

.

I didn't watch...

Was it different than last years jobs plan he hatched after last year's vacation?

That one worked so well....

Well he talks about lowering taxes on small business--then in the next sentence raising taxes--then he talks about road and bridge work--and getting government workers back to work--and extending unemployment benefits another year--then tells the 12 member debt commission committee that THEY need to come up with a PLAN.

Still no nuts and bolts--but perfectly pronounced speeches read from a telepromter-and NOTHING on paper that can be debated. I guess that's suppose to come in a couple of weeks--and let's just hope that his next speech doesn't involve a joint session of congress to deliver it---

It still amazes me how this country could be swayed into voting for someone who has a job that is so over his head.

Mitt Romney couldn't have said it better: Obama is still plugging quarters into a pay phone booth (expecting the economy to improve)--when we live in the smart phone century.

View attachment 15150

Son of Stimulus is all it amounted to.

Did he mention anything about investing in solar energy companies?

He has kind of a track record on those....

 

[The Gadfly]

then you were part of a minority. and i respect your going. you put your money where your mouth is.

i'm afraid though, i don't see anything wrong with the 'hell no, we won't go' thing either. the people who said that believed with all their heart that we had no reason to be in vietnam.... just as you believed it was your duty to go.

Jillian,
I don't doubt that some of them did, but quite a few were simply cowards. It's also a little hard for me to accept that, when I saw men who were genuine conscientious objectors who refused to kill or even carry a weapon serve bravely as combat medics in Vietnam. I saw some of them give their lives trying to save the wounded; they were better men than I am; no one who served with any of them will ever forget them. Then too, if someone refused to go, that just meant someone else had to; to me that would have felt like just passing my burden off on some other guy, and I couldn't do that.

What, then, of Cheney and Rumsfeld's deferments? Didn't that mean someone else had to go in their place?

Have you seen me defend those? Look, I don't know how they got those deferments; legally or otherwise. I don't know whether those were justified, or not, and I have not commented, one way or the other. Look, some people beat the system; some got lucky with their lottery numbers; hell, for that matter, some actually wanted to serve, but could not (4-f's, and so on). All I know is everyone has to live with his own conscience. I could not order anyone into battle, if I hadn't gone myself, but that's me. I couldn't accept an office of public trust and honor, if I had been unwilling to serve my country as a soldier, but that's me. I was enlisted, before I was an officer, and I learned to take orders long before I learned to give them. I don't know what someone else's standards are; I only know what my standards are.

 

[pgm]

Did he mention anything about investing in solar energy companies?

He has kind of a track record on those....

I don't believe so. More about schools, roads and bridges. It's primarily about extending some tax cuts and government spending on unemployment insurance. The new ideas were Infrastructure Bank, A training program for the unemployed a la Georgia, extending the payroll tax break to employers (which should have been done in the first place because it's more effective at creating jobs than giving it to the employees), and some other things that I forgot, but will look up tomorrow.

Edit: I forgot aid to the states.

 

[zonly1]

The potus speech sounded like a lecture as if he thinks he's a king not the potus. It was a take it or leave it all in and I'll give the cost later theme(pass it know and read it later nancy). rinse and repeat. the same worn out crap starting with shovel ready jobs, the schools are breaking down, need more teachers, invest in the future, construction workers(union leader fat ass trumpka in the house), need new roads/bridges, improve home ownership as in the same practices that caused the housing bubble, and touchy feely moment about the children in dilapidated class rooms. I guess he forgot about a mega million dollar school in so cal that hasn't had one teacher nor one student walk through this new campi and I believe it ran out of taxpayer money..maybe foreclosures and losing jobs had something to do with it.

What was odd, the speech was for job creation and you have GE CEO(5k jobs in China start up) sitting next to Michele.

 

[DaGoose]

Obama really laid it out tonight. He almost sounded like Harry Truman (of whom my wife had the pleasure to meet).

.

I didn't watch...

Was it different than last years jobs plan he hatched after last year's vacation?

That one worked so well....

It still amazes me how this country could be swayed into voting for someone who has a job that is so over his head......

Why? We did it with Bush.

.

 

[California Girl]

apparently, the truth troubles our friend avatar. so much so that rather than acknowledge the truth of the statement, he has to pretend it's somehow bashing the military to tell the truth

oh...and avatar.... they absolutely DID get out of going to vietnam by joining the guard in those days (unlike what happened during iraq). it was the poor schmucks who got sent off to the rice paddies.

I was in those rice paddies, Jillian, and I was neither poor, nor a conscript-like two-thirds of those who served there, I enlisted voluntarily. I don't disparage those who served in the Guard or Reserve for their choice to do that, any more than I disparage those who were "in the rear with the gear" while I was carrying a ruck and a rifle. We were all on the same team. At least, they weren't in the street, chanting "Hell no, we won't go!", or cheering for Ho Chi Minh.

then you were part of a minority. and i respect your going. you put your money where your mouth is.

i'm afraid though, i don't see anything wrong with the 'hell no, we won't go' thing either. the people who said that believed with all their heart that we had no reason to be in vietnam.... just as you believed it was your duty to go.

I have no issue with those who chanted 'hell no, we won't go'.... but I have a serious issue with those who spat at those who did on their return. Those people are scum.

 

[Neotrotsky]

t/p By Mr. Fish

 

[Kiki Cannoli]

Inspiring campaign vision...yes. Detailed plan...no.

ETA: Tactical approach is interetesting though, here Congress pass a jobs bill...oh, you don't want jobs for America?

 

[nolebrakai]

im going to adopt a little ass backwards Conservative mythology here. After Reading past page 5, sure does seem Obama has the right all in tizzy, hes doing something right.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

im going to adopt a little ass backwards Conservative mythology here. After Reading past page 5, sure does seem Obama has the right all in tizzy, hes doing something right.

Are you equating a failing economy as doing something right?

 

[bigrebnc1775]

t/p By Mr. Fish

Thats what happens when you swallow bullshit to fast.

 

[sparky]

actions / words

Obama has command of the latter only imho

~S~

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Obama really laid it out tonight. He almost sounded like Harry Truman (of whom my wife had the pleasure to meet).

.

I didn't watch...

Was it different than last years jobs plan he hatched after last year's vacation?

That one worked so well....

Well he talks about lowering taxes on small business--then in the next sentence raising taxes--then he talks about road and bridge work--and getting government workers back to work--and extending unemployment benefits another year--then tells the 12 member debt commission committee that THEY need to come up with a PLAN.

Still no nuts and bolts--but perfectly pronounced speeches read from a telepromter-and NOTHING on paper that can be debated. I guess that's suppose to come in a couple of weeks--and let's just hope that his next speech doesn't involve a joint session of congress to deliver it---

It still amazes me how this country could be swayed into voting for someone who has a job that is so over his head.

Mitt Romney couldn't have said it better: Obama is still plugging quarters into a pay phone booth (expecting the economy to improve)--when we live in the smart phone century.

View attachment 15150

Son of Stimulus is all it amounted to.

Wouldn't this be the 3rd stimulus?