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Aside from the fact that you're wrong...That's your recourse. You don't havwe to like it - but there it is.Have fun with that. At best, you'll eliminate one letter and stick another one in there.
There no legal way to force a 3+ party system.
Exactly, without fundamentally changing our system of government, there is no way to create a 3+ party system.
Deal with it.
Show how this is the case. I'm more than familair with the document and I dont see anything in it that does anything like what you mention here.Sorry, I thought it was that simple.You didnt answer the question.
Why would we "have" to do that?
That is, why is your proposal the only way to germinate a 3+ party system; why is there no other way such a system could come about absent the implementation of your proposal?
If is so simple, you should then have no issue explaining these things.
We would have to do that because our constitution creates a two party system due to the "winner takes all nature of politics".
Son, read what you wrote here, and then read what you wrote in the above quote.I realize that there is nothing in the constitution about political parties and Washington abhored them, but it's irrelevant.
How is this the "only" alternative?The only alternative is a parliamentary system of government.
Specifically, how?It certainly does.Nothing in our electoral process precludes 3+ parties with representation in any given legislative body,
Again, between this line and the above, you're contradicting yourself.It doesn't necessitate two parties, but it still creates them.nor does it necessitate that there will only ever be two dominant parties.
Amended to: "Good luck with the whole chucking the constitution thing".
I think our system works fine. Clunky at times, but no need to throw the baby out with the bathwater.
This simply cannot happen.No. My recourse is to suggest that we should get rid of ALL political parties.Your recourse? Get busy organizing/supporting a party that creates a viable alternative to the R and D.
:roll:Exactly. That's why we need to blow the whole system up and start again from scratch.
Let us know when the convention starts.
Aside from the fact that you're wrong...That's your recourse. You don't havwe to like it - but there it is.
There no legal way to force a 3+ party system.
Exactly, without fundamentally changing our system of government, there is no way to create a 3+ party system.
Deal with it.
-I'm- not the one whining about the 2-party system.
But, then -I- understand that once the people decide to do somethng about it, it will be done. Nothing in the current system necessitates 2 prominent parties; nothing in the current system prevents 3+ prominent parties.
Let us know when the convention starts.
When it starts, you'll definitely know about it. It will be all over the news. Just like Tripoli and Egypt have been. Except with more gunfire and flames.
As long as were a country with 2 reining parties, were never going to get anywhere. It will continue to be Tit 4 Tat. We need something more like a 5 party system, to mix it up a little, so that we can move forward.
Members of both parties will just continue to toe the party line, you know it, and I know it.
"A HOUSE DIVIDED CANNOT STAND"
A five party system would be better for the USA because of all the diverse people and cultures. Either we are, or were not, the melting pot of the world.
Let us know when the convention starts.
When it starts, you'll definitely know about it. It will be all over the news. Just like Tripoli and Egypt have been. Except with more gunfire and flames.
Good luck with that. When the bullets really start flying, you are going to need more than an "ignore list" to win.
Considering the realities of other countries, I fail to see what is so wrong with this country that we have to start from the beginning.
Perhaps you could enlighten me to the perceived problems.
Good luck with that. When the bullets really start flying, you are going to need more than an "ignore list" to win.
Considering the realities of other countries, I fail to see what is so wrong with this country that we have to start from the beginning.
Perhaps you could enlighten me to the perceived problems.
When it starts, you'll definitely know about it. It will be all over the news. Just like Tripoli and Egypt have been. Except with more gunfire and flames.
Good luck with that. When the bullets really start flying, you are going to need more than an "ignore list" to win.
Considering the realities of other countries, I fail to see what is so wrong with this country that we have to start from the beginning.
Perhaps you could enlighten me to the perceived problems.
I agree, we have some issues which need addressing, But this is still the greatest System on earth. No need to scrap it and start over.
The single biggest thing Americans could do to effect change, is simply to get involved.
Having less than 50% of people even Vote is a shame. We can do better.
True. That's why I spend several evenings/mornings a month at the shooting range. That's why I have trained with hand-to-hand combat weapons and why I spend parts of 4-5 days a week at the gym.
Let's see if I can do just that.....
I actually have to agree with you that there isn't anywhere out there that is perfect. Hell, most places are far worse than the United States is at this point. There are other places that have some of the things we have wrong, right; but nowhere that has it all right, including here.
The main problem being that we have allowed the foundation on which this country was built to erode. This country was built on a foundation of morals, values, and personal responsibility. Without those three things, the entire concept of our governmental system and our society stop working (as we can see on a daily basis).
However, our founders were naive men. They believed that those ideals were intrinsic in the people and that they didn't need to be specifically enumerated and discussed in the documents they put forward at this country's beginning. This left a major loophole in the system.
Then came along a tall, thin, bearded lawyer from Springfield, Illinois. He carried those founding documents out to the outhouse behind 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue and used them as toilet paper before ignoring most everything that had been written on them.
Mr. Lincoln may have freed the slaves from their plantations but he enslaved the entirety of The States and The People to the Federal Government. He also provided the background for all of the other numerous desecrations of the US Constitution that have gone on over the last 150 years.
For a century and a half now, the US Constitution has been abused, eviscerated, ignored, and generally spat and shat upon by the entire Federal Government in every way possible. Hell, we now debate whether it was intended to be a "living" document as a means to ignore its most basic precepts and ideals. Those noble but infinitely naive men who gave us the document never foresaw the lack of morals, values and basic personal responsibility which now ravage this nation.
To that end, the US Constitution no longer really serves any purpose. Its wording is antiquated, its ideals and values have been thrown away, and its very existance is almost laughed at by most in Government and even more of the Citizenry. It is unfortunate to say, but it has ceased to have a usefullness in attempting to right the ship that is this nation before we go under entirely.
The fact that society functions on a day to day basis and that we have a bloodless coups every few years means our system works fine.
We aren't perfect, but we are nowhere near the hellhole you would have us believe we are. I'll agree we took a massive sing towards federalism after the civil war. It was necessary as we progressed from an agrarian to urban society.
No it does not. We don't have a "bloodless coup" every few years. We simply have the stage manager announce that tonight's Leading Role in the comedy/tragedy known as The United States of America will be played by...... for the next four years. There is ZERO difference between the lines, the acting, and the results regardless of which worthless bag of trash sits in the White House.
The system is NOT working fine. We have illegal immigrants crawling around like roaches. We have an economy that is totally in the tank. Our JUSTICE system has ceased to exist. Morals, Values, Basic Decency, Common Sense, and Personal Responsibility are all things of the past.
Personally, if it requires an agrarian society to bring this country back to what it was intended to be, then evacuate and burn every city with more than 50,000 residents to the ground.
I guess I should have said the system works fine if you aren't utterly histrionic.
Good luck with the revolution though. It was a lopsided fight in 1860 when the average citizen could match the average federal infantryman in firepower.
I am sure it will all be different this time though.
Yeah, I don't think our government is the problem here.
I know it isn't fashionable or common anymore, but some of us do actually believe in certain things sufficiently to put them in front of our own happiness. I understand that's not the accepted way to do things anymore, but some of us harken back to a BETTER DAY in certain ways.
It will be better to be DEAD than to live in what I believe this country will be in another 5-10 years.
Then you ARE part of the problem so far as I am concerned.
The fact that society functions on a day to day basis and that we have a bloodless coups every few years means our system works fine.
No it does not. We don't have a "bloodless coup" every few years. We simply have the stage manager announce that tonight's Leading Role in the comedy/tragedy known as The United States of America will be played by...... for the next four years. There is ZERO difference between the lines, the acting, and the results regardless of which worthless bag of trash sits in the White House.
The system is NOT working fine. We have illegal immigrants crawling around like roaches. We have an economy that is totally in the tank. Our JUSTICE system has ceased to exist. Morals, Values, Basic Decency, Common Sense, and Personal Responsibility are all things of the past.
We aren't perfect, but we are nowhere near the hellhole you would have us believe we are. I'll agree we took a massive sing towards federalism after the civil war. It was necessary as we progressed from an agrarian to urban society.
Personally, if it requires an agrarian society to bring this country back to what it was intended to be, then evacuate and burn every city with more than 50,000 residents to the ground.
What was better about it? Nostalgia is largely a man created event.
Or you could just go somewhere else. I don't like the "love it or leave it" mentality but when death is a more viable option, it's probably time to change your zip code.
I am sure the rest of us will be just fine.
I was just about to get all teary eyed about your hearkening back to a more simple time and prattling on about morality.
Now you tell me you want to burn people out of their houses and force people to farm?
Have you actually ever farmed? I mean real farming? It kind of sucks. There is a reason that people leave agrarian society behind and move to the cities.
Wow. Jefferson bemoaned the loss of agrarian society, while the vast majority were still farmers. However, he never wanted the current system to move back to medieval times. He was right happy with eyeglasses and other new technologies of the day. In fact, he invented many himself.
You are not for founding principles here, you are for a state of nature. No thank you.