France banned all rifles...130 dead in attack on Rock Concert, here...58 killed

[Lewdog]

Do you remember what kinds of guns our Founding Fathers had?

Do you know what kinds of guns the govt has???

You totally missed the point. When the Second Amendment was written their guns looked like this:

Today guns look like this:

Which is why they were smart enough to know to make the Constitution so that it could be amended to meet the changing times.

And if the Founders knew that in our future, national socialists would murder 12 million unarmed Europeans in gas chambers, the soviet communists would murder 12 million unarmed men, women and children, and that the chinese communists would murder 70 million unarmed people....not to forget the drug cartels in Mexico murdering 10s of thousands of citizens every year with the help of police, and the other mass murder, genocide and ethnic cleansing around the world.......

They would have mandated that every single American have guns by law...no exceptions.....

What does that have to do with the U.S.? Nothing.

 

[2aguy]

Do you know what kinds of guns the govt has???

You totally missed the point. When the Second Amendment was written their guns looked like this:

Today guns look like this:

Which is why they were smart enough to know to make the Constitution so that it could be amended to meet the changing times.

so how would you amend it??

Here's the thing, I'm for the Second Amendment, however our government is going the wrong way with it. They are trying to pass legislation to legalizes silencers. Why the fuck would someone need a silencer to use for protection!?!?

This guy, Larry Correia.....a gun expert, explains it...

http://monsterhunternation.com/2017/09/26/an-opinion-on-suppressors-and-the-hearing-protection-act/

First off, it’s education time. How do suppressors work and why do we use them? When a cartridge is fired, the gun powder burns extremely rapidly, and this creates pressure which forces the bullet down the barrel. When those hot expanding gasses escape into the atmosphere, it is rather energetic and extremely loud.

If you’ve ever been around a really loud bang, you may have noticed that afterwards your ears ring. I’ve got some bad news for you, that ringing means you’ve permanently damaged your hearing. When that fades you will have lost some measure of hearing, and hearing damage is permanent and cumulative. The more of these loud bangs you are exposed to, the greater the damage. It will never get better. It will only continue to get worse.

I was a firearms instructor for about a decade and spent a lot of time running ranges and teaching people. I was religious about wearing my hearing protection, but if you spend enough time on the range you will be caught unaware eventually and somebody is going to touch something off right after you take your muffs off.

I have tinnitus. Basically, there is literally no sound of silence in my world. For me it is a constant ringing noise that’s about the same pitch as my lawn sprinklers. I also can’t pick up a lot of things in higher ranges, like for many years, my daughters’ voices. If you’ve ever spoken to me in the dealer’s room of a con, you’ll notice that I tend to lean over the table to get close to the speaker. That’s not because I’m being weird, it’s that I can’t understand you, especially in a room with background noise that aggravates the perpetual ringing.

I’m not alone. I’m sure audiologists love old gun nuts because they sell a lot of hearing aids that way.

Guns are loud, but are also incredibly useful. If you want to be proficient with a firearm, you must practice with it. So we put up with the loudness and put things in or over our ears in order to mitigate the damage as much as possible.

However, muffs slip. It is really easy to break the seal of an ear muff when you place your cheek on the stock of a rifle. Boom. Hearing damage. Or that little foam plug in your ear isn’t squished in quite right, or deforms and falls out? Boom. Hearing damage. I used to hate when I came home from a long day teaching a class, and I’d hear that ring that told me that at some point I’d screwed up. Because there’s no going back.

Suppressors were invented to mitigate that danger. You can call them silencers too, that’s fine, but Silencer was a brand name, not a particularly true description. It’s like Xerox or Kleenex. Many of us gun nuts just refer to them as cans, because that’s basically all they are.

I wasn’t joking when I said they work exactly like the muffler on your car. As those expanding gasses from the burning gun powder escape the muzzle, instead of flying outward to bombard those delicate little hairs in your ears, the gasses are trapped in a can screwed onto the end. That’s basically it.

Cans are usually filled with something that increases the interior surface area that gives the sound waves more things to bounce off of. In the olden days we used things like rubber gaskets, steel wool, grease, and all sorts of other stuff. Nowadays since good precision machine tools are common and cheap, most of them use metal baffles. The hardest part about building a can to last is dealing with the temperature. That energy which would normally escape as noise gets trapped as heat. Cans get hot fast.

So if you screw a suppressor onto the end of your gun, usually it isn’t going to make it silent. Not even close. The actual noise reduction is going to vary greatly depending on a whole bunch of different factors. The quality and construction of the can is secondary to the power level of the gun. The more powerful the boom, the more can required to contain it. It’s all about the amount of expanding gasses escaping that muzzle.

Also, most bullets are supersonic. Just like a fighter jet, when that bullet breaks the speed of sound it is going to make a sonic boom. Though since bullets are much smaller, it is more of a sonic crack. The baffles in a modern can never actually touch the bullet, so they do nothing about the bullet breaking the sound barrier.

I won’t get into decibel ratings (which are indecipherable gibberish to most folks anyway) but if you slap a suppressor onto a standard rifle, shooting standard ammunition, it is still pretty loud. It is still noticeable by anybody nearby. Everybody is still going to hear the sonic crack of the bullet. Only for the shooter is doesn’t feel like you’re getting hit in the ear canal with a hammer.

Regular pistols with regular ammo aren’t movie gun quiet. Not even close. In the movies the hit man shoots somebody with his 9mm and the people in the next room don’t hear it. Bullshit. A suppressed 115 grain standard 9mm sounds like taking a big ass dictionary and slamming it down as hard as you can flat on a hardwood floor. WHUMP. Bystanders are still going to hear, it’s just not as sharp.

There’s also the mechanical action of the gun working. On a semi-automatic firearm, the action is still going to cycle, and that also makes a pretty distinct noise. Bullet impacts are surprisingly loud, especially when they land close to you.


----

Excuse me, your highness, but if it pleases the crown, I would like to have the ability to teach my children to use firearms safely, in such a manner that they don’t end up hearing perpetual lawn sprinkler noises for the rest of their lives.

There is absolutely, positively, NO REASON for them to be legalized. I don't care how much you like guns, there is too many negative things with them than positive.

There are close to 16 million of them in private hands.......right now. At most a few each year are used to commit crimes and murder...vs, again, 16 million of them.....

there were 6 mass public shootings in 2016....71 people were murdered...not all 6 shootings involved rifles.

Knives were used to murder 1,604 people in the same year....

1,604 vs 71 ( an not all of those were rifles)

Can you tell which number is bigger?

Blunt objects were used to murder 472 people in 2016.

472 vs. 71

Can you tell which number is bigger?

Bare hands murdered 656 people in 2016.

656 vs. 71

Can you tell which number is bigger?

So tell us again how out of 16 million rifles, in a country of over 320 million people.....these rifles should be banned because less than 71 people were murdered with them...........cars killed 35,161 people in 2015......

This is why we know you are irrational.

 

[2aguy]

Do you remember what kinds of guns our Founding Fathers had?

Do you know what kinds of guns the govt has???

You totally missed the point. When the Second Amendment was written their guns looked like this:

Today guns look like this:

Which is why they were smart enough to know to make the Constitution so that it could be amended to meet the changing times.

And if the Founders knew that in our future, national socialists would murder 12 million unarmed Europeans in gas chambers, the soviet communists would murder 12 million unarmed men, women and children, and that the chinese communists would murder 70 million unarmed people....not to forget the drug cartels in Mexico murdering 10s of thousands of citizens every year with the help of police, and the other mass murder, genocide and ethnic cleansing around the world.......

They would have mandated that every single American have guns by law...no exceptions.....

What does that have to do with the U.S.? Nothing.

Mass murder, genocide, and ethnic cleansing only happen to people who don't have guns....that is why it is relevant here....we don't want mass murder, genocide and ethnic cleansing to happen to us.......

 

[Lewdog]

You totally missed the point. When the Second Amendment was written their guns looked like this:

Today guns look like this:

Which is why they were smart enough to know to make the Constitution so that it could be amended to meet the changing times.

so how would you amend it??

Here's the thing, I'm for the Second Amendment, however our government is going the wrong way with it. They are trying to pass legislation to legalizes silencers. Why the fuck would someone need a silencer to use for protection!?!?

This guy, Larry Correia.....a gun expert, explains it...

http://monsterhunternation.com/2017/09/26/an-opinion-on-suppressors-and-the-hearing-protection-act/

First off, it’s education time. How do suppressors work and why do we use them? When a cartridge is fired, the gun powder burns extremely rapidly, and this creates pressure which forces the bullet down the barrel. When those hot expanding gasses escape into the atmosphere, it is rather energetic and extremely loud.

If you’ve ever been around a really loud bang, you may have noticed that afterwards your ears ring. I’ve got some bad news for you, that ringing means you’ve permanently damaged your hearing. When that fades you will have lost some measure of hearing, and hearing damage is permanent and cumulative. The more of these loud bangs you are exposed to, the greater the damage. It will never get better. It will only continue to get worse.

I was a firearms instructor for about a decade and spent a lot of time running ranges and teaching people. I was religious about wearing my hearing protection, but if you spend enough time on the range you will be caught unaware eventually and somebody is going to touch something off right after you take your muffs off.

I have tinnitus. Basically, there is literally no sound of silence in my world. For me it is a constant ringing noise that’s about the same pitch as my lawn sprinklers. I also can’t pick up a lot of things in higher ranges, like for many years, my daughters’ voices. If you’ve ever spoken to me in the dealer’s room of a con, you’ll notice that I tend to lean over the table to get close to the speaker. That’s not because I’m being weird, it’s that I can’t understand you, especially in a room with background noise that aggravates the perpetual ringing.

I’m not alone. I’m sure audiologists love old gun nuts because they sell a lot of hearing aids that way.

Guns are loud, but are also incredibly useful. If you want to be proficient with a firearm, you must practice with it. So we put up with the loudness and put things in or over our ears in order to mitigate the damage as much as possible.

However, muffs slip. It is really easy to break the seal of an ear muff when you place your cheek on the stock of a rifle. Boom. Hearing damage. Or that little foam plug in your ear isn’t squished in quite right, or deforms and falls out? Boom. Hearing damage. I used to hate when I came home from a long day teaching a class, and I’d hear that ring that told me that at some point I’d screwed up. Because there’s no going back.

Suppressors were invented to mitigate that danger. You can call them silencers too, that’s fine, but Silencer was a brand name, not a particularly true description. It’s like Xerox or Kleenex. Many of us gun nuts just refer to them as cans, because that’s basically all they are.

I wasn’t joking when I said they work exactly like the muffler on your car. As those expanding gasses from the burning gun powder escape the muzzle, instead of flying outward to bombard those delicate little hairs in your ears, the gasses are trapped in a can screwed onto the end. That’s basically it.

Cans are usually filled with something that increases the interior surface area that gives the sound waves more things to bounce off of. In the olden days we used things like rubber gaskets, steel wool, grease, and all sorts of other stuff. Nowadays since good precision machine tools are common and cheap, most of them use metal baffles. The hardest part about building a can to last is dealing with the temperature. That energy which would normally escape as noise gets trapped as heat. Cans get hot fast.

So if you screw a suppressor onto the end of your gun, usually it isn’t going to make it silent. Not even close. The actual noise reduction is going to vary greatly depending on a whole bunch of different factors. The quality and construction of the can is secondary to the power level of the gun. The more powerful the boom, the more can required to contain it. It’s all about the amount of expanding gasses escaping that muzzle.

Also, most bullets are supersonic. Just like a fighter jet, when that bullet breaks the speed of sound it is going to make a sonic boom. Though since bullets are much smaller, it is more of a sonic crack. The baffles in a modern can never actually touch the bullet, so they do nothing about the bullet breaking the sound barrier.

I won’t get into decibel ratings (which are indecipherable gibberish to most folks anyway) but if you slap a suppressor onto a standard rifle, shooting standard ammunition, it is still pretty loud. It is still noticeable by anybody nearby. Everybody is still going to hear the sonic crack of the bullet. Only for the shooter is doesn’t feel like you’re getting hit in the ear canal with a hammer.

Regular pistols with regular ammo aren’t movie gun quiet. Not even close. In the movies the hit man shoots somebody with his 9mm and the people in the next room don’t hear it. Bullshit. A suppressed 115 grain standard 9mm sounds like taking a big ass dictionary and slamming it down as hard as you can flat on a hardwood floor. WHUMP. Bystanders are still going to hear, it’s just not as sharp.

There’s also the mechanical action of the gun working. On a semi-automatic firearm, the action is still going to cycle, and that also makes a pretty distinct noise. Bullet impacts are surprisingly loud, especially when they land close to you.


----

Excuse me, your highness, but if it pleases the crown, I would like to have the ability to teach my children to use firearms safely, in such a manner that they don’t end up hearing perpetual lawn sprinkler noises for the rest of their lives.

There is absolutely, positively, NO REASON for them to be legalized. I don't care how much you like guns, there is too many negative things with them than positive.

There are close to 16 million of them in private hands.......right now. At most a few each year are used to commit crimes and murder...vs, again, 16 million of them.....

there were 6 mass public shootings in 2016....71 people were murdered...not all 6 shootings involved rifles.

Knives were used to murder 1,604 people in the same year....

1,604 vs 71 ( an not all of those were rifles)

Can you tell which number is bigger?

Blunt objects were used to murder 472 people in 2016.

472 vs. 71

Can you tell which number is bigger?

Bare hands murdered 656 people in 2016.

656 vs. 71

Can you tell which number is bigger?

So tell us again how out of 16 million rifles, in a country of over 320 million people.....these rifles should be banned because less than 71 people were murdered with them...........cars killed 35,161 people in 2015......

This is why we know you are irrational.

Please tell me how a silencer is going to help with defending yourself from a home invasion or while concealed carry. Why would you need a silencer to help defend yourself against the government in case of some kind of Police State round up.

Now let's talk about how a silencer would help a criminal doing a home invasion to murder an entire family...

 

[Lewdog]

Do you remember what kinds of guns our Founding Fathers had?

Do you know what kinds of guns the govt has???

You totally missed the point. When the Second Amendment was written their guns looked like this:

Today guns look like this:

Which is why they were smart enough to know to make the Constitution so that it could be amended to meet the changing times.

And if the Founders knew that in our future, national socialists would murder 12 million unarmed Europeans in gas chambers, the soviet communists would murder 12 million unarmed men, women and children, and that the chinese communists would murder 70 million unarmed people....not to forget the drug cartels in Mexico murdering 10s of thousands of citizens every year with the help of police, and the other mass murder, genocide and ethnic cleansing around the world.......

They would have mandated that every single American have guns by law...no exceptions.....

What does that have to do with the U.S.? Nothing.

Mass murder, genocide, and ethnic cleansing only happen to people who don't have guns....that is why it is relevant here....we don't want mass murder, genocide and ethnic cleansing to happen to us.......

I'm not saying get rid of all guns. What we don't need is when ONE person can get enough guns, and have guns that by himself he can kill 59 people and injure over 500.

 

[Old Rocks]

Do you remember what kinds of guns our Founding Fathers had?

Do you know what kinds of guns the govt has???

You totally missed the point. When the Second Amendment was written their guns looked like this:

Today guns look like this:

Which is why they were smart enough to know to make the Constitution so that it could be amended to meet the changing times.

And if the Founders knew that in our future, national socialists would murder 12 million unarmed Europeans in gas chambers, the soviet communists would murder 12 million unarmed men, women and children, and that the chinese communists would murder 70 million unarmed people....not to forget the drug cartels in Mexico murdering 10s of thousands of citizens every year with the help of police, and the other mass murder, genocide and ethnic cleansing around the world.......

They would have mandated that every single American have guns by law...no exceptions.....

What does that have to do with the U.S.? Nothing.

Mass murder, genocide, and ethnic cleansing only happen to people who don't have guns....that is why it is relevant here....we don't want mass murder, genocide and ethnic cleansing to happen to us.......

Oh, I see. nobody at that concert owned a gun? Fucking little lying cocksucks like you arm the crazies, then blame the sane for the crimes of the crazies. All at the concert should file a class action against the NRA for their creating the climate in which a crazy could do this.

 

[BlackSand]

What does that have to do with the U.S.? Nothing.

The same stuff not happening in the US would kind of prove his point the fact we are armed keeps it from happening here ...

.

 

[Lewdog]

What does that have to do with the U.S.? Nothing.

The same stuff not happening in the US would kind of prove his point the fact we are armed keeps it from happening here ...

.

We are armed and it didn't stop the Vegas attack.

 

[BlackSand]

We are armed and it didn't stop the Vegas attack.

Your question, his post nor my response referred to the Vegas attack ...

.

 

[Lewdog]

We are armed and it didn't stop the Vegas attack.

Your question, his post nor my response referred to the Vegas attack ...

.

This thread is about the Vegas attack. Things would be a lot more clear if you didn't keep editing off parts of the quote chain.

 

[BlackSand]

This thread is about the Vegas attack. Things would be a lot more clear if you didn't keep editing off parts of the quote chain.

Your question wasn't about the Vegas attack ... His post wasn't ... Nor was my response.
I just edited so you wouldn't get confused ... Looks like you still did ... And I am betting you will continue to be confused about the matter ...

.

 

[Lewdog]

This thread is about the Vegas attack. Things would be a lot more clear if you didn't keep editing off parts of the quote chain.

Your question wasn't about the Vegas attack ... His post wasn't ... Nor was my response.
I just edited so you wouldn't get confused ... Looks like you still did ... And I am betting you will continue to be confused about the matter ...

.

Do you know what the original post was in the chain? Let's see if you really are paying attention.

 

[BlackSand]

Your question wasn't about the Vegas attack ... His post wasn't ... Nor was my response.
I just edited so you wouldn't get confused ... Looks like you still did ... And I am betting you will continue to be confused about the matter ...

Do you know what the original post was in the chain? Let's see if you really are paying attention.

Yep ... I would have won that bet ...

.

 

[Lewdog]

Your question wasn't about the Vegas attack ... His post wasn't ... Nor was my response.
I just edited so you wouldn't get confused ... Looks like you still did ... And I am betting you will continue to be confused about the matter ...

Do you know what the original post was in the chain? Let's see if you really are paying attention.

Yep ... I would have won that bet ...

.

The quote chain literally goes all the way back to the OP's initial post... but the forum software eventually cuts off replies to add the new ones.

 

[BlackSand]

Do you remember what kinds of guns our Founding Fathers had?

Do you know what kinds of guns the govt has???

You totally missed the point. When the Second Amendment was written their guns looked like this:

Today guns look like this:

Which is why they were smart enough to know to make the Constitution so that it could be amended to meet the changing times.

And if the Founders knew that in our future, national socialists would murder 12 million unarmed Europeans in gas chambers, the soviet communists would murder 12 million unarmed men, women and children, and that the chinese communists would murder 70 million unarmed people....not to forget the drug cartels in Mexico murdering 10s of thousands of citizens every year with the help of police, and the other mass murder, genocide and ethnic cleansing around the world.......

They would have mandated that every single American have guns by law...no exceptions.....

What does that have to do with the U.S.? Nothing.

...........

This thread is about the Vegas attack. Things would be a lot more clear if you didn't keep editing off parts of the quote chain.

That's the original quote chain I responded to and it doesn't mention Vegas anywhere therein.
Never Did, Never Will ... No matter how long you want to protest otherwise ...

.

 

[Lewdog]

Do you remember what kinds of guns our Founding Fathers had?

Do you know what kinds of guns the govt has???

You totally missed the point. When the Second Amendment was written their guns looked like this:

Today guns look like this:

Which is why they were smart enough to know to make the Constitution so that it could be amended to meet the changing times.

And if the Founders knew that in our future, national socialists would murder 12 million unarmed Europeans in gas chambers, the soviet communists would murder 12 million unarmed men, women and children, and that the chinese communists would murder 70 million unarmed people....not to forget the drug cartels in Mexico murdering 10s of thousands of citizens every year with the help of police, and the other mass murder, genocide and ethnic cleansing around the world.......

They would have mandated that every single American have guns by law...no exceptions.....

What does that have to do with the U.S.? Nothing.

...........

This thread is about the Vegas attack. Things would be a lot more clear if you didn't keep editing off parts of the quote chain.

That's the original quote chain I responded to and it doesn't mention Vegas anywhere therein.
Never Did, Never Will ... No matter how long you want to protest otherwise ...

.

And keep going back... The Founding Fathers post from me was a reply to posts before that.

 

[BlackSand]

And keep going back... The Founding Fathers post from me was a reply to posts before that.

I wasn't responding to anything further back ... Just your question to the previous poster.
If I had been responding to anything else ... I would have included it ...

A point I am willing to bet you still won't get.

.

 

[Lewdog]

And keep going back... The Founding Fathers post from me was a reply to posts before that.

I wasn't responding to anything further back ... Just your question to the previous poster.
If I had been responding to anything else ... I would have included it ...

A point I am willing to bet you still won't get.

.

And you continue NOT to get the point. You said none of the comments had to do with Vegas. Well only to you because the conversation between me and 2aGuy went all the way back to the very post in the thread, which most certainly had to do with Vegas.

I'm sorry I can't be responsible for you not keeping up with the flow of conversation in the thread.

 

[BlackSand]

And you continue NOT to get the point. You said none of the comments had to do with Vegas. Well only to you because the conversation between me and 2aGuy went all the way back to the very post in the thread, which most certainly had to do with Vegas.

I'm sorry I can't be responsible for you not keeping up with the flow of conversation in the thread.

I posted the entire quote thread I responded to and it doesn't mention Vegas anywhere ... Never did, never will ...
I really don't care anymore that you cannot accept that ... So by all means have a good evening.

.

 

[Lewdog]

And you continue NOT to get the point. You said none of the comments had to do with Vegas. Well only to you because the conversation between me and 2aGuy went all the way back to the very post in the thread, which most certainly had to do with Vegas.

I'm sorry I can't be responsible for you not keeping up with the flow of conversation in the thread.

I posted the entire quote thread I responded to and it doesn't mention Vegas anywhere ... Never did, never will ...
I really don't care anymore that you cannot accept that ... So by all means have a good evening.

.

And you still don't get it.

The first quote in the chain you just showed, has the reply about the Founding Fathers. Well here is the link to the post for that... and notice my reply was to a reply chain that already existed. This is what happens when you jump into a conversation already in progress and don't pay attention to the whole thread. The worst part is you continue to argue your point instead of going back to see you're wrong.

France banned all rifles...130 dead in attack on Rock Concert, here...58 killed