France, 1930's: A Fatal Flaw in Liberalism

[elvis]

Conservatism has no flaws:

At least they don't seem to see any.

Odd...you posted a picture of liberalism's foreign policy.

Odd. It was Republicans who let Bin Laden go. It wasn't Republicans who got him.

Odd. you're still a worthless piece of shit partisan hack jackass.

 

[Dragon]

Oh, goody. I was just thinking to myself, "Y'know, we need a blowhard leftist around here to define what a 'real conservative' is based on his stereotypes and leftist programming".

Sorry, I didn't use any stereotypes. I just used a dictionary. I recommend the practice if you're confused about what a word means. I recommend it even more highly when you're wrong.

 

[Peach]

Oh, goody. I was just thinking to myself, "Y'know, we need a blowhard leftist around here to define what a 'real conservative' is based on his stereotypes and leftist programming".

Sorry, I didn't use any stereotypes. I just used a dictionary. I recommend the practice if you're confused about what a word means. I recommend it even more highly when you're wrong.

***************************************************
And if you confused about France & WWII, read a history book, or ""link" to a reliable source.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Today's liberals are saying "We can do better -- even though our ideas have all been proven failures by history. No, really, it'll work this time, honest!!"

Our ideas have not been proven wrong by history...

Civil rights
Womens rights
Worker protections
Environmental protections
Gay rights
Social Security
Medicare

All were pursued by liberals......all were opposed by conservatives

Conservatives have consistently been on the wrong side of history......they still are

************************************************
France formed a coalition against Germany with GB and Poland in 1939 also; I see this thread as incorrect about history actually.

Stop blowing smoke and articulate any error you see....

 

[Peach]

Our ideas have not been proven wrong by history...

Civil rights
Womens rights
Worker protections
Environmental protections
Gay rights
Social Security
Medicare

All were pursued by liberals......all were opposed by conservatives

Conservatives have consistently been on the wrong side of history......they still are

************************************************
France formed a coalition against Germany with GB and Poland in 1939 also; I see this thread as incorrect about history actually.

Stop blowing smoke and articulate any error you see....

************************************************
Chautemps was not socialist, Blum was. each served one year. France went through many Prime Ministers in the 1930's. Some were Socialists, some were not. France in the 1930's is not a good example of Socialist government. The USSR IS. Either repression or depression.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Of course, what PC neglects to tell us is that FDR was our greatest Liberal President and that it was the US Conservatives that urged us to mind our own business and stay out of the war

Classical Liberals...known as conservatives, today...get any credit for the creation of the United States, and for writing the greatest political document in the history of the world, the US Constitution?

Not quite....but good try anyway

It was the Conservatives of the day who supported the crown

Liberals liked to tar and feather them

1. History: Classical liberalism
a. “The American intellectual class from the mid 19th century onward has disliked liberalism (which originally referred to individualism, private property, and limits on power) precisely because the liberal society has no overarching goal.” War Is the Health of the State

b. Thus, those views identify the 'conservative' of today!

2. The 'revisionism' is actually the change of the name 'progressive' by John Dewey, to obfuscate due to the extreme dislike of the public for progressives.

a. Woodrow Wilson and the Progressives tried to make war socialism permanent, but the voters didn’t agree. They (Progressives) began to agree more and more with Bismarckian top-down socialism, and looked to Russia and Italy where ‘men of action’ were creating utopias. Also, John Dewey renamed Progressivism as ‘liberalism,’ which had referred to political and economic liberty, along the lines of John Locke and Adam Smith: maximum individual freedom under a minimalist state. Dewey changed the meaning to the Prussian meaning: alleviation of material and educational poverty, and the removal of old ideas and faiths. Classical liberals were more like what we call Conservatives.

b. “Finally, Dewey arguably did more than any other reformer to repackage progressive social theory in a way that obscured just how radically its principles departed from those of the American founding. Like Ely and many of his fellow progressive academics, Dewey initially embraced the term "socialism" to describe his social theory. Only after realizing how damaging the name was to the socialist cause did he, like other progressives, begin to avoid it. In the early 1930s, accordingly, Dewey begged the Socialist party, of which he was a longtime member, to change its name. "The greatest handicap from which special measures favored by the Socialists suffer," Dewey declared, "is that they are advanced by the Socialist party as Socialism.”
John Dewey and the Philosophical Refounding of America by Tiffany Jones Miller - National Review Online

c. “DEWEY'S influential 1935 tract, "Liberalism and Social Action," should be read in light of this conclusion. In this essay, Dewey purportedly recounts the "history of liberalism." "Liberalism," he suggests, is a social theory defined by a commitment to certain "enduring," fundamental principles, such as liberty and individualism. After defining these principles in the progressives' terms--…”
Ibid.

3. Here's why he changed the name:
“The United States presidential election of 1920 was dominated by the aftermath of World War I and the hostile reaction to Woodrow Wilson, the Democratic president. Harding's victory remains the largest popular-vote percentage margin (60.3% to 34.1%) in Presidential elections after the so-called "Era of Good Feelings" ended with the victory of James Monroe in the election of 1820. ” United States presidential election, 1920 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


So, let's review....
Because the progressives were so hated, Dewey and the the socialist bunch ducked for cover by trying to self-identify as classical liberals, otherwise known as conservatives.



Should I point out that Mussolini's fascists, Hitler's National Socialists, and FDR's New Dealers were like three peas in a pod until the Holocaust was revealed....then, under cover of the media, they did a 'Dewey' and branded the Right as the fascists....

Is that sweat breaking out on your forehead, wingy???

 

[PoliticalChic]

************************************************
France formed a coalition against Germany with GB and Poland in 1939 also; I see this thread as incorrect about history actually.

Stop blowing smoke and articulate any error you see....

************************************************
Chautemps was not socialist, Blum was. each served one year. France went through many Prime Ministers in the 1930's. Some were Socialists, some were not. France in the 1930's is not a good example of Socialist government. The USSR IS. Either repression or depression.

1."France in the 1930's is not a good example of Socialist government."
The OP does not say what you claim it does.
Read more carefully.
This, from the OP:
"The French Socialists of the 1930’s had impeccable democratic credentials, dating back to the 19th century. They won elections, and in Leon Blum they produced a great leader, a prime minister who had the ability to fuse French patriotism and social justice, and the finest cultural values."

Does that say 'French government throughout the 1930's was socialist," or would you like to admit you were in error?

2. Try not to post anything so patently incorrect again.

3. "I see this thread as incorrect about history actually."
Clean off your specs, you see no such thing. Actually.

 

[Dragon]

We really are confused in our discourse about the meaning of those two words "liberal" and "conservative." Another good example, besides the hijacking of the latter word by a radical movement that is about as conservative as Chariman Mao, is the idea that "classical liberals" held the same views as "movement conservatives" today.

Yes, classical liberals did indeed favor small, limited government. They also believed in economic equality, distrusted rich people, loathed capitalists and corporations, and were extremely wary of a strong, standing military. If you're going to call someone who is around today a "classical liberal," that person should share ALL of these positions, not just roughly half of one of them.

The truth is that modern liberals share almost all of these attitudes. While they don't share one hundred percent of them, and therefore shouldn't be called "classical liberals," to call them "liberals" is perfectly sound, as it recognizes that they and men like Locke, Smith, and Jefferson are almost entirely in agreement.

Conservatives -- real or "movement" -- come nowhere within shooting range of being classical liberals.

 

[Peach]

Stop blowing smoke and articulate any error you see....

************************************************
Chautemps was not socialist, Blum was. each served one year. France went through many Prime Ministers in the 1930's. Some were Socialists, some were not. France in the 1930's is not a good example of Socialist government. The USSR IS. Either repression or depression.

1."France in the 1930's is not a good example of Socialist government."
The OP does not say what you claim it does.
Read more carefully.
This, from the OP:
"The French Socialists of the 1930’s had impeccable democratic credentials, dating back to the 19th century. They won elections, and in Leon Blum they produced a great leader, a prime minister who had the ability to fuse French patriotism and social justice, and the finest cultural values."

Does that say 'French government throughout the 1930's was socialist," or would you like to admit you were in error?

2. Try not to post anything so patently incorrect again.

3. "I see this thread as incorrect about history actually."
Clean off your specs, you see no such thing. Actually.

********************************************
France was not "socialist" throughout the 1930's, France was in turmoil, bad economic conditions, and went from one leader to another to other. I do not see how France can be labeled SOCIALIST through the entire decade(.) I see the USSR as an example of the Socialism/Communism failures.

 

[Peach]

************************************************
Chautemps was not socialist, Blum was. each served one year. France went through many Prime Ministers in the 1930's. Some were Socialists, some were not. France in the 1930's is not a good example of Socialist government. The USSR IS. Either repression or depression.

1."France in the 1930's is not a good example of Socialist government."
The OP does not say what you claim it does.
Read more carefully.
This, from the OP:
"The French Socialists of the 1930’s had impeccable democratic credentials, dating back to the 19th century. They won elections, and in Leon Blum they produced a great leader, a prime minister who had the ability to fuse French patriotism and social justice, and the finest cultural values."

Does that say 'French government throughout the 1930's was socialist," or would you like to admit you were in error?

2. Try not to post anything so patently incorrect again.

3. "I see this thread as incorrect about history actually."
Clean off your specs, you see no such thing. Actually.

********************************************
France was not "socialist" throughout the 1930's, France was in turmoil, bad economic conditions, and went from one leader to another to other. I do not see how France can be labeled SOCIALIST through the entire decade(.) I see the USSR as an example of the Socialism/Communism failures.

********************************************
Blum lasted a year, as did Chautempt. With so many changes in leadership, I don't think France can be pigeon holed for a DECADE.

 

[rightwinger]

Classical Liberals...known as conservatives, today...get any credit for the creation of the United States, and for writing the greatest political document in the history of the world, the US Constitution?

Not quite....but good try anyway

It was the Conservatives of the day who supported the crown

Liberals liked to tar and feather them

1. History: Classical liberalism
a. “The American intellectual class from the mid 19th century onward has disliked liberalism (which originally referred to individualism, private property, and limits on power) precisely because the liberal society has no overarching goal.” War Is the Health of the State

b. Thus, those views identify the 'conservative' of today!

2. The 'revisionism' is actually the change of the name 'progressive' by John Dewey, to obfuscate due to the extreme dislike of the public for progressives.

a. Woodrow Wilson and the Progressives tried to make war socialism permanent, but the voters didn’t agree. They (Progressives) began to agree more and more with Bismarckian top-down socialism, and looked to Russia and Italy where ‘men of action’ were creating utopias. Also, John Dewey renamed Progressivism as ‘liberalism,’ which had referred to political and economic liberty, along the lines of John Locke and Adam Smith: maximum individual freedom under a minimalist state. Dewey changed the meaning to the Prussian meaning: alleviation of material and educational poverty, and the removal of old ideas and faiths. Classical liberals were more like what we call Conservatives.

b. “Finally, Dewey arguably did more than any other reformer to repackage progressive social theory in a way that obscured just how radically its principles departed from those of the American founding. Like Ely and many of his fellow progressive academics, Dewey initially embraced the term "socialism" to describe his social theory. Only after realizing how damaging the name was to the socialist cause did he, like other progressives, begin to avoid it. In the early 1930s, accordingly, Dewey begged the Socialist party, of which he was a longtime member, to change its name. "The greatest handicap from which special measures favored by the Socialists suffer," Dewey declared, "is that they are advanced by the Socialist party as Socialism.”
John Dewey and the Philosophical Refounding of America by Tiffany Jones Miller - National Review Online

c. “DEWEY'S influential 1935 tract, "Liberalism and Social Action," should be read in light of this conclusion. In this essay, Dewey purportedly recounts the "history of liberalism." "Liberalism," he suggests, is a social theory defined by a commitment to certain "enduring," fundamental principles, such as liberty and individualism. After defining these principles in the progressives' terms--…”
Ibid.

3. Here's why he changed the name:
“The United States presidential election of 1920 was dominated by the aftermath of World War I and the hostile reaction to Woodrow Wilson, the Democratic president. Harding's victory remains the largest popular-vote percentage margin (60.3% to 34.1%) in Presidential elections after the so-called "Era of Good Feelings" ended with the victory of James Monroe in the election of 1820. ” United States presidential election, 1920 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


So, let's review....
Because the progressives were so hated, Dewey and the the socialist bunch ducked for cover by trying to self-identify as classical liberals, otherwise known as conservatives.



Should I point out that Mussolini's fascists, Hitler's National Socialists, and FDR's New Dealers were like three peas in a pod until the Holocaust was revealed....then, under cover of the media, they did a 'Dewey' and branded the Right as the fascists....

Is that sweat breaking out on your forehead, wingy???

More PC cut and paste?



Skip it

 

[PoliticalChic]

************************************************
Chautemps was not socialist, Blum was. each served one year. France went through many Prime Ministers in the 1930's. Some were Socialists, some were not. France in the 1930's is not a good example of Socialist government. The USSR IS. Either repression or depression.

1."France in the 1930's is not a good example of Socialist government."
The OP does not say what you claim it does.
Read more carefully.
This, from the OP:
"The French Socialists of the 1930’s had impeccable democratic credentials, dating back to the 19th century. They won elections, and in Leon Blum they produced a great leader, a prime minister who had the ability to fuse French patriotism and social justice, and the finest cultural values."

Does that say 'French government throughout the 1930's was socialist," or would you like to admit you were in error?

2. Try not to post anything so patently incorrect again.

3. "I see this thread as incorrect about history actually."
Clean off your specs, you see no such thing. Actually.

********************************************
France was not "socialist" throughout the 1930's, France was in turmoil, bad economic conditions, and went from one leader to another to other. I do not see how France can be labeled SOCIALIST through the entire decade(.) I see the USSR as an example of the Socialism/Communism failures.

1. An interesting exercise in reality. When one makes a mistake and same is pointed out, the response of the one in error speaks volumes.

2. You incorrectly stated that the OP was historically inaccurate. When asked to elucidate, you went on about the French Government of the 1930's.

3. Unfortunately for you, the OP was about a party, the French Socialists, rather than the government of France.
I proved same with "The French Socialists of the 1930’s ...."

4. The honorable response to said situation would have been a post from you that began with something along the lines of "Ah, now I see.....and so on and so forth."

5. The cover-up is always worse than the crime.
You're dismissed.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Not quite....but good try anyway

It was the Conservatives of the day who supported the crown

Liberals liked to tar and feather them

1. History: Classical liberalism
a. “The American intellectual class from the mid 19th century onward has disliked liberalism (which originally referred to individualism, private property, and limits on power) precisely because the liberal society has no overarching goal.” War Is the Health of the State

b. Thus, those views identify the 'conservative' of today!

2. The 'revisionism' is actually the change of the name 'progressive' by John Dewey, to obfuscate due to the extreme dislike of the public for progressives.

a. Woodrow Wilson and the Progressives tried to make war socialism permanent, but the voters didn’t agree. They (Progressives) began to agree more and more with Bismarckian top-down socialism, and looked to Russia and Italy where ‘men of action’ were creating utopias. Also, John Dewey renamed Progressivism as ‘liberalism,’ which had referred to political and economic liberty, along the lines of John Locke and Adam Smith: maximum individual freedom under a minimalist state. Dewey changed the meaning to the Prussian meaning: alleviation of material and educational poverty, and the removal of old ideas and faiths. Classical liberals were more like what we call Conservatives.

b. “Finally, Dewey arguably did more than any other reformer to repackage progressive social theory in a way that obscured just how radically its principles departed from those of the American founding. Like Ely and many of his fellow progressive academics, Dewey initially embraced the term "socialism" to describe his social theory. Only after realizing how damaging the name was to the socialist cause did he, like other progressives, begin to avoid it. In the early 1930s, accordingly, Dewey begged the Socialist party, of which he was a longtime member, to change its name. "The greatest handicap from which special measures favored by the Socialists suffer," Dewey declared, "is that they are advanced by the Socialist party as Socialism.”
John Dewey and the Philosophical Refounding of America by Tiffany Jones Miller - National Review Online

c. “DEWEY'S influential 1935 tract, "Liberalism and Social Action," should be read in light of this conclusion. In this essay, Dewey purportedly recounts the "history of liberalism." "Liberalism," he suggests, is a social theory defined by a commitment to certain "enduring," fundamental principles, such as liberty and individualism. After defining these principles in the progressives' terms--…”
Ibid.

3. Here's why he changed the name:
“The United States presidential election of 1920 was dominated by the aftermath of World War I and the hostile reaction to Woodrow Wilson, the Democratic president. Harding's victory remains the largest popular-vote percentage margin (60.3% to 34.1%) in Presidential elections after the so-called "Era of Good Feelings" ended with the victory of James Monroe in the election of 1820. ” United States presidential election, 1920 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


So, let's review....
Because the progressives were so hated, Dewey and the the socialist bunch ducked for cover by trying to self-identify as classical liberals, otherwise known as conservatives.



Should I point out that Mussolini's fascists, Hitler's National Socialists, and FDR's New Dealers were like three peas in a pod until the Holocaust was revealed....then, under cover of the media, they did a 'Dewey' and branded the Right as the fascists....

Is that sweat breaking out on your forehead, wingy???

More PC cut and paste?



Skip it

Now, now...we both know the truth.....

 

[Peach]

Not quite....but good try anyway

It was the Conservatives of the day who supported the crown

Liberals liked to tar and feather them

1. History: Classical liberalism
a. “The American intellectual class from the mid 19th century onward has disliked liberalism (which originally referred to individualism, private property, and limits on power) precisely because the liberal society has no overarching goal.” War Is the Health of the State

b. Thus, those views identify the 'conservative' of today!

2. The 'revisionism' is actually the change of the name 'progressive' by John Dewey, to obfuscate due to the extreme dislike of the public for progressives.

a. Woodrow Wilson and the Progressives tried to make war socialism permanent, but the voters didn’t agree. They (Progressives) began to agree more and more with Bismarckian top-down socialism, and looked to Russia and Italy where ‘men of action’ were creating utopias. Also, John Dewey renamed Progressivism as ‘liberalism,’ which had referred to political and economic liberty, along the lines of John Locke and Adam Smith: maximum individual freedom under a minimalist state. Dewey changed the meaning to the Prussian meaning: alleviation of material and educational poverty, and the removal of old ideas and faiths. Classical liberals were more like what we call Conservatives.

b. “Finally, Dewey arguably did more than any other reformer to repackage progressive social theory in a way that obscured just how radically its principles departed from those of the American founding. Like Ely and many of his fellow progressive academics, Dewey initially embraced the term "socialism" to describe his social theory. Only after realizing how damaging the name was to the socialist cause did he, like other progressives, begin to avoid it. In the early 1930s, accordingly, Dewey begged the Socialist party, of which he was a longtime member, to change its name. "The greatest handicap from which special measures favored by the Socialists suffer," Dewey declared, "is that they are advanced by the Socialist party as Socialism.”
John Dewey and the Philosophical Refounding of America by Tiffany Jones Miller - National Review Online

c. “DEWEY'S influential 1935 tract, "Liberalism and Social Action," should be read in light of this conclusion. In this essay, Dewey purportedly recounts the "history of liberalism." "Liberalism," he suggests, is a social theory defined by a commitment to certain "enduring," fundamental principles, such as liberty and individualism. After defining these principles in the progressives' terms--…”
Ibid.

3. Here's why he changed the name:
“The United States presidential election of 1920 was dominated by the aftermath of World War I and the hostile reaction to Woodrow Wilson, the Democratic president. Harding's victory remains the largest popular-vote percentage margin (60.3% to 34.1%) in Presidential elections after the so-called "Era of Good Feelings" ended with the victory of James Monroe in the election of 1820. ” United States presidential election, 1920 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


So, let's review....
Because the progressives were so hated, Dewey and the the socialist bunch ducked for cover by trying to self-identify as classical liberals, otherwise known as conservatives.



Should I point out that Mussolini's fascists, Hitler's National Socialists, and FDR's New Dealers were like three peas in a pod until the Holocaust was revealed....then, under cover of the media, they did a 'Dewey' and branded the Right as the fascists....

Is that sweat breaking out on your forehead, wingy???

More PC cut and paste?



Skip it

************************************************
There was no consistent leader in France in the 1930's; a new PM each year. How was socialism different than Laval's failure?

 

[PoliticalChic]

We really are confused in our discourse about the meaning of those two words "liberal" and "conservative." Another good example, besides the hijacking of the latter word by a radical movement that is about as conservative as Chariman Mao, is the idea that "classical liberals" held the same views as "movement conservatives" today.

Yes, classical liberals did indeed favor small, limited government. They also believed in economic equality, distrusted rich people, loathed capitalists and corporations, and were extremely wary of a strong, standing military. If you're going to call someone who is around today a "classical liberal," that person should share ALL of these positions, not just roughly half of one of them.

The truth is that modern liberals share almost all of these attitudes. While they don't share one hundred percent of them, and therefore shouldn't be called "classical liberals," to call them "liberals" is perfectly sound, as it recognizes that they and men like Locke, Smith, and Jefferson are almost entirely in agreement.

Conservatives -- real or "movement" -- come nowhere within shooting range of being classical liberals.

Bogus.


"They also believed in economic equality,..."

Nonsense, as I'm about to prove.
The following is from Glenn Greenwald, “With Liberty and Justice for Some; How the Law Is Used to Destroy Equality and Protect the Powerful,”....a Liberal in the moderns sense...as you are.
The difference between you and Greenwald is that he knows what he is talking about.

1. The central principle of America’s founding was that the rule of law would be the prime equalizing force; the founders considered vast inequality in every other realm to be inevitable and even desirable…. A small number would of individuals would be naturally endowed with unique and extraordinary talents while most people, by definition, would be ordinary. So the American concept of liberty would be premised on the inevitability of outcome inequality- success of some, failure of others.

a. Law was the one exception; no inequality was tolerable. It was the sine qua non ensuring fairness.

2. None of the founders believed in equality as a general proposition. The opposite is true: they considered inequality on every level, other than law, to be the natural, inevitable, and just state of affairs. Even Jefferson, one of the most egalitarian of the founders, held that there was “a natural aristocracy” among men, based on “virtue and talents.” This was not only natural, but desirable: “The natural aristocracy I consider as the most precious gift of nature for the instruction, the trusts, and the government of society.”

a. Adams the same. “It already appears, that there must be in every society of men superiors an inferiors, because God has laid in the constitution and course of nature the foundations of the distinction.”


Help me with this: is it because you are remarkably uneducated...or that you simply make things up on the spot?

Either way, it is fun eviscerating your nonsense.

 

[PoliticalChic]

1. History: Classical liberalism
a. “The American intellectual class from the mid 19th century onward has disliked liberalism (which originally referred to individualism, private property, and limits on power) precisely because the liberal society has no overarching goal.” War Is the Health of the State

b. Thus, those views identify the 'conservative' of today!

2. The 'revisionism' is actually the change of the name 'progressive' by John Dewey, to obfuscate due to the extreme dislike of the public for progressives.

a. Woodrow Wilson and the Progressives tried to make war socialism permanent, but the voters didn’t agree. They (Progressives) began to agree more and more with Bismarckian top-down socialism, and looked to Russia and Italy where ‘men of action’ were creating utopias. Also, John Dewey renamed Progressivism as ‘liberalism,’ which had referred to political and economic liberty, along the lines of John Locke and Adam Smith: maximum individual freedom under a minimalist state. Dewey changed the meaning to the Prussian meaning: alleviation of material and educational poverty, and the removal of old ideas and faiths. Classical liberals were more like what we call Conservatives.

b. “Finally, Dewey arguably did more than any other reformer to repackage progressive social theory in a way that obscured just how radically its principles departed from those of the American founding. Like Ely and many of his fellow progressive academics, Dewey initially embraced the term "socialism" to describe his social theory. Only after realizing how damaging the name was to the socialist cause did he, like other progressives, begin to avoid it. In the early 1930s, accordingly, Dewey begged the Socialist party, of which he was a longtime member, to change its name. "The greatest handicap from which special measures favored by the Socialists suffer," Dewey declared, "is that they are advanced by the Socialist party as Socialism.”
John Dewey and the Philosophical Refounding of America by Tiffany Jones Miller - National Review Online

c. “DEWEY'S influential 1935 tract, "Liberalism and Social Action," should be read in light of this conclusion. In this essay, Dewey purportedly recounts the "history of liberalism." "Liberalism," he suggests, is a social theory defined by a commitment to certain "enduring," fundamental principles, such as liberty and individualism. After defining these principles in the progressives' terms--…”
Ibid.

3. Here's why he changed the name:
“The United States presidential election of 1920 was dominated by the aftermath of World War I and the hostile reaction to Woodrow Wilson, the Democratic president. Harding's victory remains the largest popular-vote percentage margin (60.3% to 34.1%) in Presidential elections after the so-called "Era of Good Feelings" ended with the victory of James Monroe in the election of 1820. ” United States presidential election, 1920 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


So, let's review....
Because the progressives were so hated, Dewey and the the socialist bunch ducked for cover by trying to self-identify as classical liberals, otherwise known as conservatives.



Should I point out that Mussolini's fascists, Hitler's National Socialists, and FDR's New Dealers were like three peas in a pod until the Holocaust was revealed....then, under cover of the media, they did a 'Dewey' and branded the Right as the fascists....

Is that sweat breaking out on your forehead, wingy???

More PC cut and paste?



Skip it

************************************************
There was no consistent leader in France in the 1930's; a new PM each year. How was socialism different than Laval's failure?

When you're in a hole, you should stop digging.

 

[rightwinger]

1. History: Classical liberalism
a. “The American intellectual class from the mid 19th century onward has disliked liberalism (which originally referred to individualism, private property, and limits on power) precisely because the liberal society has no overarching goal.” War Is the Health of the State

b. Thus, those views identify the 'conservative' of today!

2. The 'revisionism' is actually the change of the name 'progressive' by John Dewey, to obfuscate due to the extreme dislike of the public for progressives.

a. Woodrow Wilson and the Progressives tried to make war socialism permanent, but the voters didn’t agree. They (Progressives) began to agree more and more with Bismarckian top-down socialism, and looked to Russia and Italy where ‘men of action’ were creating utopias. Also, John Dewey renamed Progressivism as ‘liberalism,’ which had referred to political and economic liberty, along the lines of John Locke and Adam Smith: maximum individual freedom under a minimalist state. Dewey changed the meaning to the Prussian meaning: alleviation of material and educational poverty, and the removal of old ideas and faiths. Classical liberals were more like what we call Conservatives.

b. “Finally, Dewey arguably did more than any other reformer to repackage progressive social theory in a way that obscured just how radically its principles departed from those of the American founding. Like Ely and many of his fellow progressive academics, Dewey initially embraced the term "socialism" to describe his social theory. Only after realizing how damaging the name was to the socialist cause did he, like other progressives, begin to avoid it. In the early 1930s, accordingly, Dewey begged the Socialist party, of which he was a longtime member, to change its name. "The greatest handicap from which special measures favored by the Socialists suffer," Dewey declared, "is that they are advanced by the Socialist party as Socialism.”
John Dewey and the Philosophical Refounding of America by Tiffany Jones Miller - National Review Online

c. “DEWEY'S influential 1935 tract, "Liberalism and Social Action," should be read in light of this conclusion. In this essay, Dewey purportedly recounts the "history of liberalism." "Liberalism," he suggests, is a social theory defined by a commitment to certain "enduring," fundamental principles, such as liberty and individualism. After defining these principles in the progressives' terms--…”
Ibid.

3. Here's why he changed the name:
“The United States presidential election of 1920 was dominated by the aftermath of World War I and the hostile reaction to Woodrow Wilson, the Democratic president. Harding's victory remains the largest popular-vote percentage margin (60.3% to 34.1%) in Presidential elections after the so-called "Era of Good Feelings" ended with the victory of James Monroe in the election of 1820. ” United States presidential election, 1920 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


So, let's review....
Because the progressives were so hated, Dewey and the the socialist bunch ducked for cover by trying to self-identify as classical liberals, otherwise known as conservatives.



Should I point out that Mussolini's fascists, Hitler's National Socialists, and FDR's New Dealers were like three peas in a pod until the Holocaust was revealed....then, under cover of the media, they did a 'Dewey' and branded the Right as the fascists....

Is that sweat breaking out on your forehead, wingy???

More PC cut and paste?



Skip it

Now, now...we both know the truth.....

Sorry, but if you want to make a point.....make it

I don't debate cut and pastes

 

[elvis]

More PC cut and paste?



Skip it

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There was no consistent leader in France in the 1930's; a new PM each year. How was socialism different than Laval's failure?

When you're in a hole, you should stop digging.

You said hole.

 

[Peach]

More PC cut and paste?



Skip it

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There was no consistent leader in France in the 1930's; a new PM each year. How was socialism different than Laval's failure?

When you're in a hole, you should stop digging.

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Using France in the 1930's as an example of American political beliefs today starts a chasm.

 

[Dragon]

a. “The American intellectual class from the mid 19th century onward has disliked liberalism ...

b. Thus, those views identify the 'conservative' of today! ...

Woodrow Wilson and the Progressives tried to make war socialism permanent...

Mussolini's fascists, Hitler's National Socialists, and FDR's New Dealers were like three peas in a pod until the Holocaust was revealed

All of these statements are false. American intellectuals are disproportionately liberal. Classical liberals shared almost all of the views of modern liberals, and almost no views of modern conservatives. There has never been any such thing in this country, in power, running the government, as socialism, "war" or otherwise. And Roosevelt did not incarcerate and execute all of the Republicans, which would be a prerequisite for him being identical with Hitler or Mussolini. That's just for starters; then he'd have to murder all of the Democratic progressives, the way Hitler slaughtered all of the Nazi socialists in the Night of the Long Knives. And attempting to conquer Canada and Mexico would also increase the similarity.