Founding Fathers: We Are Not a Christian Nation

[JakeStarkey]

1. The Constitution was created by men who wanted to keep organized religion out of government.

2. Some believed in Jesus Christ, some did not, and they made a secular Constitution.

3. Yes, it was a secular document in order for it to work well.

4. The Jews were present, most notably in New York City and Charleston at this time.

5. Yes, one of the great reasons for immigration to America was religious, to worship as one pleased. Most did not believe others necessarily had the same right.

6. We have always been generally a nation of Christians.

 

[PaintMyHouse]

Sorry bout that,


1. So there you have it, Mike Griffith1 just explained that the Constitution was indeed created by Christians, who in fact did believe in God, and tried to be careful not to name him in order to not identify themselves as any particular religion, which was their way to not promote one religion of Christ above another.
2. Although they believed in Jesus Christ, they were cogniant they were not making a religious document.
3. It had to be a secular document in order to establish itself as a *Effective Document* to govern this Nation, which it did.
4. At this time in American history even the Jews were not present in America, they didn't brave to journey from Europe to the New Country, and at that time as well the muslims were not in Europe in large numbers either so they were excluded as well, thank God.
5. On the most part the people who came to America, were Christians, who were wanting to escape some other religious intolerance be it the British form of religion or the Rome form.
6. We are indeed an historical Christian based Nation, Christians are what make USA Great, and that community thats still here is why we remain Great, we do have an opposing population of islamic evil people who curse this Nation and its people, who want to over throw it, and us, all the while we allow more in, which is insanity.

A nation of Christians, not a Christian Nation. Those exist, they wrote that in their Constitutions, but ours is not one of them.

 

[Wyld Kard]

And liberals have tried, and continue to fuck things up. All we end up with is a Big Government - More control, a Nanny State, Political Correctness, Redistribution of Wealth, and Debt.

If you don't like then get the fuck out. It's a Liberal Nation, it wasn't founded for your kind.

Your religion wasn't wanted in government here 230 years ago, and it isn't now either. Go move to Jesusland.

My religion?
That's what you get for assuming you stupid fuck. I'm not religious.

Well if you have no religion then you have no excuse for not understanding what founded this fucking nation, Liberalism. If you ain't Liberal then you are un-American.

The Influence of the Enlightenment on The Formation of the United States

If you ain't Liberal then you are un-American.

 

[Bill Angel]

Was America founded as a Christian nation - CNN.com
Some people still think so:
Sidewalk Gospel Preacher

 

[mikegriffith1]

That is a very dishonest way to use that quote, and you have been corrected on this before. From my article "American Not A Christian Nation?":

John Adams, a key figure in the American Revolution and our second President, said that the principles upon which we achieved independence were "the general principles of Christianity":

The general principles upon which the Fathers achieved independence were the general principles of Christianity. . . . I will avow that I believed and now believe that those general principles of Christianity are as eternal and immutable as the existence and the attributes of God. (Letter to Thomas Jefferson, June 28, 1813)​

In his first inaugural address, President Adams said,

I feel it to be my duty to add, if a veneration for the religion of a people who profess and call themselves Christians, and a fixed resolution to consider a decent respect for Christianity among the best recommendations for the public service, can enable me in any degree to comply with your wishes, it shall be my strenuous endeavor that this sagacious injunction of the two Houses shall not be without effect. (First Inaugural Address, March 4, 1797)​

John Jay, the first chief justice of the U.S. Supreme Court, appointed by George Washington, called America a Christian nation:

Providence has given to our people the choice of their rulers. And it is the duty as well as the privilege and interest of our Christian nation to select and prefer Christians for their rulers. (Letter to Jedidiah Morse, February 28, 1797)​

Benjamin Rush, a signer of the Declaration of Independence and who later served in the administrations of George Washington, John Adams, and James Madison, had this to say on the matter:

Such is my veneration for every religion that reveals the attributes of the Deity, or a future state of rewards and punishments, that I had rather see the opinions of Confucius or Mohammed inculcated upon our youth, than see them grow up wholly devoid of a system of religious principles. But the religion I mean to recommend in this place is that of the New Testament. (Of the Mode of Education Proper in a Republic, 1798, p. 88)​

President John Quincy Adams, our sixth President and son of President John Adams, acknowledged the Christian foundation of America’s beginnings in a speech he delivered on July 4, 1837:

Is it not that, in the chain of human events, the birthday of the nation is indissolubly linked with the birth-day of the Savior? That it forms a leading event in the progress of the gospel dispensation? Is it not that the Declaration of Independence first organized the social compact on the foundation of the Redeemer’s mission upon earth? That it laid the corner stone of human government upon the first precepts of Christianity, and gave to the world the first irrevocable pledge of the fulfillment of the prophecies, announced directly from Heaven at the birth of the Savior and predicted by the greatest of the Hebrew prophets six hundred years before? (An Oration Delivered before the Inhabitants of the Town of Newburyport [Massachusetts], at Their Request, on the Sixty-First Anniversary of the Declaration of Independence, July 4th, 1837, by John Quincy Adams. Newburyport: Charles Whipple, printed by Morse and Brewster, 1837, pp. 5-6)​

In 1854 the House Judiciary Committee said the following in a report on the meaning of the First Amendment and the separation of church and state:

Had the people during the Revolution had a suspicion of any attempt to wage war against Christianity, that Revolution would have been strangled in its cradle. At the time of the adoption of the Constitution and the amendments, the universal sentiment was that Christianity should be encouraged, not any one sect. Any attempt to level and discard all religion would have been received with universal indignation. . . .​

But we beg leave to rescue ourselves from the imputation of asserting that religion is not needed to the safety of civil society. It must be considered as the foundation on which the whole structure rests. Laws will not have permanence or power without the sanction of religious sentiment—without a firm belief that there is a Power above us that will reward our virtues and punish our sins.​

In this age there can be no substitute for Christianity; that in its general principles is the great conservative element on which we must rely for the purity and permanence of free institutions. That was the religion of the founders of the republic, and they expected it to remain the religion of their descendants. (Reports of Committees of the House of Representatives Made During the First Session of the Thirty-Third Congress, Washington: A. O. P. Nicholson, 1854; John Minor, The Bible in the Public Schools, Robert Clarke & Co., 1870, pp. 200-201)​

America Not a Christian Nation

 

[JakeStarkey]

MikeT is lifting David Barton's line of argument.

Adams believed in a God, generally a Unitarian God, not necessarily a Christian God.

 

[SwimExpert]

Words on paper do not define a nation.

Fuck you, and your trampling of our Constitution. If you don't like it, get the fuck out.

 

[Wildman]

Fuck you, and your trampling of our Constitution. If you don't like it, get the fuck out.

AMEN to that my friend.., and to them, stay the fuck out and NEVER come back !!!!

 

[JakeStarkey]

We disagree on history all the time, as the following demonstrate: "The Virginia and Kentucky Resolutios. The Hartford Convention. The 1832 Tariff Crisis. The Civil War. The Great Depression." ACA. Marriage Equality. etc etc and etc.

Nine of the original states had established religion, when the 1st Congress said, "uh uh for the good old USA. We are not going to be stupid like that." Within 40 years, all the states got in line.

We are generally a Christian-believing with a very strong dissenting minority. We govern ourselves secularly.

 

[Ava]

Sorry bout that,


1. We are a Christian Country in any working sense, and always will be, still are, most of the real people of this Nation are Christians, we are the ones doing all the good in this Nation, its losers like the PMH who try to pull it down, with voting in other losers like Obama.
2. I hate people like that!

My people founded the place. Take your God and your guns, and get the fuck out. You aren't wanted here.

Your GOD COMPLEX brought on by you....

Is showing ...again!

Considering that I want all humans dead, including myself, your theory has a big hole in it there Dr. Freud.

I believe you lie, kill yourself and I'll believe you....Honest, I will!

It's impossible for me to respect any adult who is still living with their mother, unless they have mental issues. I don't think Paint lives with his mommy.

 

[hipeter924]

We disagree on history all the time, as the following demonstrate: "The Virginia and Kentucky Resolutios. The Hartford Convention. The 1832 Tariff Crisis. The Civil War. The Great Depression." ACA.

Nine of the original states had established religion, when the 1st Congress said, "uh uh for the gold USA. We are not going to be stupid like that." Within 40 years, all the states got in line.

We are generally a Christian-believing with a very strong dissenting minority. We govern ourselves secularly.

Which is how it should be, even if some people want to live in the Republic of Gilead:

 

[American_Jihad]

Atheists will not want to read this one

November 21, 2015
The Purpose of America
By Bruce Walker


There is a myth about the founding of America and a myth about the purpose of America when it first began as a nation. This myth muddles all debate about immigration, and especially the current debate about allowing Syrian Muslims into America. Debunking this myth is crucial to our victory against menacing and wicked enemies who seek our end.

America, beginning with those colonies that would become America, was founded not to promote some general ideal of religious freedom, but rather to specifically protect serious Christians from the religious persecution they had suffered in Europe. Several of the colonies – Massachusetts, Pennsylvania, Maryland – were created to allow groups of persecuted Christians like Puritans, Quakers, and Catholics to have a specific home polity.

Other colonies like Rhode Island and Connecticut were founded to allow Christians to practice faith as they chose outside Massachusetts. Virtually all the colonies were populated by profoundly serious Christians. It was not the free practice of "religion," but the free practice of Christianity that the early Americans fought and died for. This mystified Europe (it mystifies Europe to this very day), because Europe at its most religious was never as religious as America.

It is a stunning fact, almost always ignored by secular historians, that before the twentieth century began, writers were noting the profound irreligion or even atheism in much of Europe. This was most pronounced in Germany, where books published during this period consistently note that even clergymen often did not own Bibles or believe in God. This cavalier attitude toward Christianity permeated nearly every nation in Europe.

America was intended to be the Israel of Christianity, and commitment to that ideal explains the obstinacy of the rebelling colonists, who shed blood, lost treasure, and risked everything for freedom. The purpose of America was never to protect its citizens from Christianity, but instead to protect Christians from the oppression of the state.

...

Every malignancy in modern world affairs is ultimately rooted in hatred of Judeo-Christianity. Although it seems odd to us, the angry of this world see all devout Christians of every denomination as being more or less the same and see Christians and Jews of every variety as also being more or less the same. That is the real explanation for Iranian leaders calling America the "Great Satan" and Israel the "Little Satan." Those two nations have never warred upon Iran or occupied Iran. These hate our country not for anything wrong that it has done, but for being what it is.

Read more: http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2015/11/the_purpose_of_america.html#ixzz3sCCMG1kx

 

[Programmer]

No one can deny that many of the founding fathers of the United States of America were men of deep religious convictions based in the Bible and their Christian faith in Jesus Christ. Of the 56 men who signed the Declaration of Independence, nearly half (24) held seminary or Bible school degrees.

In the post-enlightenment, studying 'divinity and letters' or the like was common, but not an indication that you were this devout christian. See deism, which excludes the deep religious conviction and biblical basis that you describe.

 

[BULLDOG]

Atheists will not want to read this one

November 21, 2015
The Purpose of America
By Bruce Walker


There is a myth about the founding of America and a myth about the purpose of America when it first began as a nation. This myth muddles all debate about immigration, and especially the current debate about allowing Syrian Muslims into America. Debunking this myth is crucial to our victory against menacing and wicked enemies who seek our end.

America, beginning with those colonies that would become America, was founded not to promote some general ideal of religious freedom, but rather to specifically protect serious Christians from the religious persecution they had suffered in Europe. Several of the colonies – Massachusetts, Pennsylvania, Maryland – were created to allow groups of persecuted Christians like Puritans, Quakers, and Catholics to have a specific home polity.

Other colonies like Rhode Island and Connecticut were founded to allow Christians to practice faith as they chose outside Massachusetts. Virtually all the colonies were populated by profoundly serious Christians. It was not the free practice of "religion," but the free practice of Christianity that the early Americans fought and died for. This mystified Europe (it mystifies Europe to this very day), because Europe at its most religious was never as religious as America.

It is a stunning fact, almost always ignored by secular historians, that before the twentieth century began, writers were noting the profound irreligion or even atheism in much of Europe. This was most pronounced in Germany, where books published during this period consistently note that even clergymen often did not own Bibles or believe in God. This cavalier attitude toward Christianity permeated nearly every nation in Europe.

America was intended to be the Israel of Christianity, and commitment to that ideal explains the obstinacy of the rebelling colonists, who shed blood, lost treasure, and risked everything for freedom. The purpose of America was never to protect its citizens from Christianity, but instead to protect Christians from the oppression of the state.

...

Every malignancy in modern world affairs is ultimately rooted in hatred of Judeo-Christianity. Although it seems odd to us, the angry of this world see all devout Christians of every denomination as being more or less the same and see Christians and Jews of every variety as also being more or less the same. That is the real explanation for Iranian leaders calling America the "Great Satan" and Israel the "Little Satan." Those two nations have never warred upon Iran or occupied Iran. These hate our country not for anything wrong that it has done, but for being what it is.

Read more: http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2015/11/the_purpose_of_america.html#ixzz3sCCMG1kx

Looks like you are the one who has fallen for a myth. It is true that most of he original pilgrims were one form of Christianity or another, they had no desire for a state sponsored religion. They were looking for a place where no religion was given preference over any other. They were well aware of how someone worshiping differently than the rulers of the country are mistreated. They wanted nothing to do with that.
Even if the fable you are trying to sell were true, our constitution was written specifically to allow freedom to practice any or no religion. The constitutional framers were smart enough to understand that no good would come from having a state sanctioned religion.
Your entire thesis is ridiculous and unfounded in facts.
Your entire last paragraph is absurd, and shows you have no idea about past relations between the US and the countries you named.Open a history book and then try again.

 

[JakeStarkey]

The Founders were a mixture of weak to devout Christians and several deists.

 

[Lakhota]

The Founders were a mixture of weak to devout Christians and several deists.

It doesn't much matter what the founders were - because they gave us a "Godless" secular Constitution. That's all that matters - the document they created.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Lakahota, they gave us a Constitution that protects religious belief, so too bad for you.

 

[SuperDemocrat]

Shouldn't this be removed? I know this guy didn't write this. Unless he gives credit of where he got this then it is considered plagiarism. He should write something like communist leaflet propaganda and property of the communist party.

 

[Lakhota]

Lakahota, they gave us a Constitution that protects religious belief, so too bad for you.

Too bad for me? What does that mean? The "Godless" secular Constitution does protect religious beliefs - or none at all. It gives no preference to any one particular religion - hence, the thread title: We are not a Christian nation.

 

[Lakhota]

Shouldn't this be removed? I know this guy didn't write this. Unless he gives credit of where he got this then it is considered plagiarism. He should write something like communist leaflet propaganda and property of the communist party.

Who are you talking about? If it's me - the source link is clearly stated in the OP.