For those who don't understand American gun culture...Open Carry and it's issues, by Massad Ayoob.

[2aguy]

A look at one aspect of American gun culture, the debate about open carrying of guns.

Where this writer is coming from is the lonely middle ground. I’m not against open carry, but I don’t carry that way exclusively except when wearing a police department-issue uniform. Years of doing just that have left me acutely conscious of the fact some folks are scared of guns, and a few of them would just love to take the gun from you for their own messed-up reasons.
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Points In Favor
I would like to see open carry made legal nationwide without specific license, for any adult with a clean criminal record who has not been adjudicated mentally incompetent. One reason is often a non-gun person becomes a gun carrier out of desperate need when, overnight, they become the victim of a homicidal stalker. Having to wait for a carry permit application to be processed—sometimes 90 days or more—is not conducive to survival. In some jurisdictions, the wind blowing a coat open to expose a carry permit holder’s legal gun to view can be grounds for revocation of the permit, or even criminal charges. Legal, permitless open carry would end such draconian foolishness.

Open carry advocates believe the practice deters criminals, who generally seek easy marks and don’t want to get shot. Open carry opponents say, “Show me one case.” OK!

In 2013, a 40-ish psycho named James DiMaggio kidnapped Hannah Anderson, the 16-year-old girl his sick fantasies had fixated on after murdering her mother and brother. He fled with his captive into the woods of Idaho. On foot with his victim in tow, he approached a small group of people on horseback with what is generally believed to be the intent of killing them to steal their horses … and fled when he saw one or more of them were carrying handguns holstered in plain sight. The riders caught on and contacted police, who subsequently closed in on DiMaggio, rescued the teenage hostage, and killed DiMaggio in a gunfight like the mad dog he was.

The Case Of Open Carry

“Open Carry”—guns worn visibly in public, presumably loaded—has long been a hot-button topic in the world of the gun, and in the last few years, the deb

gunsmagazine.com

 

[2aguy]

The other side...

We discussed the “pros” of open carry. Now we have to discuss the “cons.” There are physical hazards to open carry. Opponents of the concept say, “The openly carried gun will make you a target. Either the bad guys will grab your gun or they’ll shoot you first.” Advocates of open carry say “No, that’s never happened.” Unfortunately, they’re wrong.

TV station KOIN in Portland, Oregon, reported in early 2015, “William Coleman III was robbed of his Walther-brand P22 just after 2:00 a.m. October 4 in Gresham by a young man who asked him for it—and flashed his own weapon as persuasion. Coleman, 21, was talking to his cousin in the 17200 block of NE Glisan St., after purchasing the handgun earlier that day, when a young man asked him for a cigarette, police said. The man then asked about the gun, pulled a gun from his own waistband and said ‘I like your gun. Give it to me.’ Coleman handed over the gun and the man fled on foot.”
-----
The anti-gun people claim to be peaceful, but if you read their websites and twitterstreams, an amazing number of them seem to be vicious bullies. You’ll see statements like “If I see anyone open carrying a gun, I’ll assume he’s the next mass murderer and clobber him from behind!” You’ll also see them recommend “SWAT-ing”: “Call the cops and tell them there’s a man with a gun there who’s about to murder everybody.”

In Tampa in 2015, a 62-year old black man with a carry permit was observed to have a concealed handgun by a 43-year old white guy, who took it upon himself to tackle the older man and take him to the ground in the entranceway of a Walmart while screaming, “He has a gun!” I suspect it was more an “anti-gun” thing than an “anti-black” thing, but it hasn’t gone to trial yet, so I don’t know for sure. The guy who attacked the legal carrier was charged with battery. It’s a miracle no one was killed, but it lets us all know there’s another danger to open carry out there today.

Open Carry Part II: The Case Against

We have to discuss the “cons.” There are physical hazards to open carry. Opponents of the concept say, “The openly carried gun will make you a target. Eit

gunsmagazine.com

 

[Mr Natural]

You got anything else going on in your life other than guns?

 

[WinterBorn]

I don't push to see open carry outlawed. But I think it has been used by idiots to strike fear in people and by "mall ninjas" trying to look cool.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

I don't push to see open carry outlawed. But I think it has been used by idiots to strike fear in people and by "mall ninjas" trying to look cool.

I see no other reason to open carry,unless you're in the woods since open carry is more comfortable.
I mean why would you want to advertise rather than surprise?

 

[White 6]

The other side...

We discussed the “pros” of open carry. Now we have to discuss the “cons.” There are physical hazards to open carry. Opponents of the concept say, “The openly carried gun will make you a target. Either the bad guys will grab your gun or they’ll shoot you first.” Advocates of open carry say “No, that’s never happened.” Unfortunately, they’re wrong.

TV station KOIN in Portland, Oregon, reported in early 2015, “William Coleman III was robbed of his Walther-brand P22 just after 2:00 a.m. October 4 in Gresham by a young man who asked him for it—and flashed his own weapon as persuasion. Coleman, 21, was talking to his cousin in the 17200 block of NE Glisan St., after purchasing the handgun earlier that day, when a young man asked him for a cigarette, police said. The man then asked about the gun, pulled a gun from his own waistband and said ‘I like your gun. Give it to me.’ Coleman handed over the gun and the man fled on foot.”
-----
The anti-gun people claim to be peaceful, but if you read their websites and twitterstreams, an amazing number of them seem to be vicious bullies. You’ll see statements like “If I see anyone open carrying a gun, I’ll assume he’s the next mass murderer and clobber him from behind!” You’ll also see them recommend “SWAT-ing”: “Call the cops and tell them there’s a man with a gun there who’s about to murder everybody.”

In Tampa in 2015, a 62-year old black man with a carry permit was observed to have a concealed handgun by a 43-year old white guy, who took it upon himself to tackle the older man and take him to the ground in the entranceway of a Walmart while screaming, “He has a gun!” I suspect it was more an “anti-gun” thing than an “anti-black” thing, but it hasn’t gone to trial yet, so I don’t know for sure. The guy who attacked the legal carrier was charged with battery. It’s a miracle no one was killed, but it lets us all know there’s another danger to open carry out there today.

Open Carry Part II: The Case Against

We have to discuss the “cons.” There are physical hazards to open carry. Opponents of the concept say, “The openly carried gun will make you a target. Eit

gunsmagazine.com

I am not an open carry supporter for hand guns. That goes double 100% against for long guns anywhere, anytime except in game hunting or range practice, acceptance for your own private property of course. In your house, yard, or anywhere on your land, carry anything you like or allow others to carry in plain sight locked and loaded if you choose. Heck for home defense I would approve full auto, belt fed if that is what you choose for your personal defense, figuring your house, your land, your rules. I am not against owning a being proficient with any type of weaponry. That said, they have no sane place on the streets of cities or towns and are only meant for intimidation or in use or preparation to perpetrate mass casualty incidents.

 

[White 6]

I don't push to see open carry outlawed. But I think it has been used by idiots to strike fear in people and by "mall ninjas" trying to look cool.

I would rather states got a handle on this issue, especially in regards to rifles. Regarding handguns, it does not bother me to see a barrel or butt poking out of somebody's clothes, though I would prefer knowing that if it was there, they had a permit, which is pretty much the case in my state. We still have sensible regulation here.

 

[WinterBorn]

I don't push to see open carry outlawed. But I think it has been used by idiots to strike fear in people and by "mall ninjas" trying to look cool.

I would rather states got a handle on this issue, especially in regards to rifles. Regarding handguns, it does not bother me to see a barrel or butt poking out of somebody's clothes, though I would prefer knowing that if it was there, they had a permit, which is pretty much the case in my state. We still have sensible regulation here.

The only time I have open carried a long gun was when I was going hunting and stopped for breakfast. Rather than leave over $1k in the truck (locked or not) I carried it inside with me. Little place out in the country, so nobody batted an eye.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

I don't push to see open carry outlawed. But I think it has been used by idiots to strike fear in people and by "mall ninjas" trying to look cool.

I would rather states got a handle on this issue, especially in regards to rifles. Regarding handguns, it does not bother me to see a barrel or butt poking out of somebody's clothes, though I would prefer knowing that if it was there, they had a permit, which is pretty much the case in my state. We still have sensible regulation here.

The only time I have open carried a long gun was when I was going hunting and stopped for breakfast. Rather than leave over $1k in the truck (locked or not) I carried it inside with me. Little place out in the country, so nobody batted an eye.

I've done the same with my shotgun,although I did put it in the case.

 

[White 6]

I don't push to see open carry outlawed. But I think it has been used by idiots to strike fear in people and by "mall ninjas" trying to look cool.

I would rather states got a handle on this issue, especially in regards to rifles. Regarding handguns, it does not bother me to see a barrel or butt poking out of somebody's clothes, though I would prefer knowing that if it was there, they had a permit, which is pretty much the case in my state. We still have sensible regulation here.

The only time I have open carried a long gun was when I was going hunting and stopped for breakfast. Rather than leave over $1k in the truck (locked or not) I carried it inside with me. Little place out in the country, so nobody batted an eye.

Sound like a sensible guy to me. Gone are the days you could safely leave your rifle or shotgun on the rack in the back widow of the pickup.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

I don't push to see open carry outlawed. But I think it has been used by idiots to strike fear in people and by "mall ninjas" trying to look cool.

I would rather states got a handle on this issue, especially in regards to rifles. Regarding handguns, it does not bother me to see a barrel or butt poking out of somebody's clothes, though I would prefer knowing that if it was there, they had a permit, which is pretty much the case in my state. We still have sensible regulation here.

The only time I have open carried a long gun was when I was going hunting and stopped for breakfast. Rather than leave over $1k in the truck (locked or not) I carried it inside with me. Little place out in the country, so nobody batted an eye.

Sound like a sensible guy to me. Gone are the days you could safely leave your rifle or shotgun on the rack in the back widow of the pickup.

Yep...when I was in highschool rifles and shotguns in the back window of trucks was a common sight.
I think thats a fine indicator of the good old days.

 

[WinterBorn]

I don't push to see open carry outlawed. But I think it has been used by idiots to strike fear in people and by "mall ninjas" trying to look cool.

I would rather states got a handle on this issue, especially in regards to rifles. Regarding handguns, it does not bother me to see a barrel or butt poking out of somebody's clothes, though I would prefer knowing that if it was there, they had a permit, which is pretty much the case in my state. We still have sensible regulation here.

The only time I have open carried a long gun was when I was going hunting and stopped for breakfast. Rather than leave over $1k in the truck (locked or not) I carried it inside with me. Little place out in the country, so nobody batted an eye.

I've done the same with my shotgun,although I did put it in the case.

Yeah, on occasion I had it in the softcase. If there were several of us the rifles were in the bed of the truck while we were driving.

 

[White 6]

I don't push to see open carry outlawed. But I think it has been used by idiots to strike fear in people and by "mall ninjas" trying to look cool.

I would rather states got a handle on this issue, especially in regards to rifles. Regarding handguns, it does not bother me to see a barrel or butt poking out of somebody's clothes, though I would prefer knowing that if it was there, they had a permit, which is pretty much the case in my state. We still have sensible regulation here.

The only time I have open carried a long gun was when I was going hunting and stopped for breakfast. Rather than leave over $1k in the truck (locked or not) I carried it inside with me. Little place out in the country, so nobody batted an eye.

Sound like a sensible guy to me. Gone are the days you could safely leave your rifle or shotgun on the rack in the back widow of the pickup.

Yep...when I was in highschool rifles and shotguns in the back window of trucks was a common sight.
I think thats a fine indicator of the good old days.

Of course. During junior or senior year, it was not uncommon to go hunting with friends and my house was way out of town.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

I don't push to see open carry outlawed. But I think it has been used by idiots to strike fear in people and by "mall ninjas" trying to look cool.

I would rather states got a handle on this issue, especially in regards to rifles. Regarding handguns, it does not bother me to see a barrel or butt poking out of somebody's clothes, though I would prefer knowing that if it was there, they had a permit, which is pretty much the case in my state. We still have sensible regulation here.

The only time I have open carried a long gun was when I was going hunting and stopped for breakfast. Rather than leave over $1k in the truck (locked or not) I carried it inside with me. Little place out in the country, so nobody batted an eye.

Sound like a sensible guy to me. Gone are the days you could safely leave your rifle or shotgun on the rack in the back widow of the pickup.

Yep...when I was in highschool rifles and shotguns in the back window of trucks was a common sight.
I think thats a fine indicator of the good old days.

Of course. During junior or senior year, it was not uncommon to go hunting with friends and my house was way out of town.

During Goose season here in Katy Texas it was common for kids to miss school to go hunting,especially on opening day.
The skies would be black with all the birds and the rice fields looked like they were covered in snow.
Nowadays I only see geese a few times each winter,i'm not an environmentalist by any stretch but it's sad to see the decline of their habitat.

 

[WinterBorn]

I don't push to see open carry outlawed. But I think it has been used by idiots to strike fear in people and by "mall ninjas" trying to look cool.

I would rather states got a handle on this issue, especially in regards to rifles. Regarding handguns, it does not bother me to see a barrel or butt poking out of somebody's clothes, though I would prefer knowing that if it was there, they had a permit, which is pretty much the case in my state. We still have sensible regulation here.

The only time I have open carried a long gun was when I was going hunting and stopped for breakfast. Rather than leave over $1k in the truck (locked or not) I carried it inside with me. Little place out in the country, so nobody batted an eye.

Sound like a sensible guy to me. Gone are the days you could safely leave your rifle or shotgun on the rack in the back widow of the pickup.

Yep...when I was in highschool rifles and shotguns in the back window of trucks was a common sight.
I think thats a fine indicator of the good old days.

Of course. During junior or senior year, it was not uncommon to go hunting with friends and my house was way out of town.

During Goose season here in Katy Texas it was common for kids to miss school to go hunting,especially on opening day.
The skies would be black with all the birds and the rice fields looked like they were covered in snow.
Nowadays I only see geese a few times each winter,i'm not an environmentalist by any stretch but it's sad to see the decline of their habitat.

Most of my hunting now involves 3 over populated species. Whitetail deer, feral pigs and coyotes.

 

[AFrench2]

For those who don't understand American gun culture-TopicTitle

Nah, we understand it. You compensate for things with your gun.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

I don't push to see open carry outlawed. But I think it has been used by idiots to strike fear in people and by "mall ninjas" trying to look cool.

I would rather states got a handle on this issue, especially in regards to rifles. Regarding handguns, it does not bother me to see a barrel or butt poking out of somebody's clothes, though I would prefer knowing that if it was there, they had a permit, which is pretty much the case in my state. We still have sensible regulation here.

The only time I have open carried a long gun was when I was going hunting and stopped for breakfast. Rather than leave over $1k in the truck (locked or not) I carried it inside with me. Little place out in the country, so nobody batted an eye.

Sound like a sensible guy to me. Gone are the days you could safely leave your rifle or shotgun on the rack in the back widow of the pickup.

Yep...when I was in highschool rifles and shotguns in the back window of trucks was a common sight.
I think thats a fine indicator of the good old days.

Of course. During junior or senior year, it was not uncommon to go hunting with friends and my house was way out of town.

During Goose season here in Katy Texas it was common for kids to miss school to go hunting,especially on opening day.
The skies would be black with all the birds and the rice fields looked like they were covered in snow.
Nowadays I only see geese a few times each winter,i'm not an environmentalist by any stretch but it's sad to see the decline of their habitat.

Most of my hunting now involves 3 over populated species. Whitetail deer, feral pigs and coyotes.

I'm not really big on white tails after eating axis deer,I will however take one on occasion, preferably a nice doe...unless of course I come across a buck that is bigger than my biggest.
Hogs and coyotes are another story,I'll cap em every chance I get.

 

[White 6]

I don't push to see open carry outlawed. But I think it has been used by idiots to strike fear in people and by "mall ninjas" trying to look cool.

I would rather states got a handle on this issue, especially in regards to rifles. Regarding handguns, it does not bother me to see a barrel or butt poking out of somebody's clothes, though I would prefer knowing that if it was there, they had a permit, which is pretty much the case in my state. We still have sensible regulation here.

The only time I have open carried a long gun was when I was going hunting and stopped for breakfast. Rather than leave over $1k in the truck (locked or not) I carried it inside with me. Little place out in the country, so nobody batted an eye.

Sound like a sensible guy to me. Gone are the days you could safely leave your rifle or shotgun on the rack in the back widow of the pickup.

Yep...when I was in highschool rifles and shotguns in the back window of trucks was a common sight.
I think thats a fine indicator of the good old days.

Of course. During junior or senior year, it was not uncommon to go hunting with friends and my house was way out of town.

During Goose season here in Katy Texas it was common for kids to miss school to go hunting,especially on opening day.
The skies would be black with all the birds and the rice fields looked like they were covered in snow.
Nowadays I only see geese a few times each winter,i'm not an environmentalist by any stretch but it's sad to see the decline of their habitat.

More duck than geese in TN. Habitat in west TN being maintained by ducks unlimited and politicians in east TN. You can get the crap sued out of you for even clearing clogs and beaver dams on you own property, so flooding more a problem than in the 70s or before. Lot of places you used to squirrel hunt, rabbit hunt or raise crops no longer tillable due to water. We don't control the streams. We just proclaim them wetlands whether they ever were for most of the 20th century or not then keep replacing bridges and making them higher. Ecology is fine. We have more hawks, fox, wild turkey, deer and yes, duck than ever, but just because you farmed the land when you were growing up or your dad and granddad did, doesn't mean you are free to keep farming it.

 

[WinterBorn]

I don't push to see open carry outlawed. But I think it has been used by idiots to strike fear in people and by "mall ninjas" trying to look cool.

I would rather states got a handle on this issue, especially in regards to rifles. Regarding handguns, it does not bother me to see a barrel or butt poking out of somebody's clothes, though I would prefer knowing that if it was there, they had a permit, which is pretty much the case in my state. We still have sensible regulation here.

The only time I have open carried a long gun was when I was going hunting and stopped for breakfast. Rather than leave over $1k in the truck (locked or not) I carried it inside with me. Little place out in the country, so nobody batted an eye.

Sound like a sensible guy to me. Gone are the days you could safely leave your rifle or shotgun on the rack in the back widow of the pickup.

Yep...when I was in highschool rifles and shotguns in the back window of trucks was a common sight.
I think thats a fine indicator of the good old days.

Of course. During junior or senior year, it was not uncommon to go hunting with friends and my house was way out of town.

During Goose season here in Katy Texas it was common for kids to miss school to go hunting,especially on opening day.
The skies would be black with all the birds and the rice fields looked like they were covered in snow.
Nowadays I only see geese a few times each winter,i'm not an environmentalist by any stretch but it's sad to see the decline of their habitat.

Most of my hunting now involves 3 over populated species. Whitetail deer, feral pigs and coyotes.

I'm not really big on white tails after eating axis deer,I will however take one on occasion, preferably a nice doe...unless of course I come across a buck that is bigger than my biggest.
Hogs and coyotes are another story,I'll cap em every chance I get.

I usually get a couple of does a year. Tasty fare.

 

[AZrailwhale]

The other side...

We discussed the “pros” of open carry. Now we have to discuss the “cons.” There are physical hazards to open carry. Opponents of the concept say, “The openly carried gun will make you a target. Either the bad guys will grab your gun or they’ll shoot you first.” Advocates of open carry say “No, that’s never happened.” Unfortunately, they’re wrong.

TV station KOIN in Portland, Oregon, reported in early 2015, “William Coleman III was robbed of his Walther-brand P22 just after 2:00 a.m. October 4 in Gresham by a young man who asked him for it—and flashed his own weapon as persuasion. Coleman, 21, was talking to his cousin in the 17200 block of NE Glisan St., after purchasing the handgun earlier that day, when a young man asked him for a cigarette, police said. The man then asked about the gun, pulled a gun from his own waistband and said ‘I like your gun. Give it to me.’ Coleman handed over the gun and the man fled on foot.”
-----
The anti-gun people claim to be peaceful, but if you read their websites and twitterstreams, an amazing number of them seem to be vicious bullies. You’ll see statements like “If I see anyone open carrying a gun, I’ll assume he’s the next mass murderer and clobber him from behind!” You’ll also see them recommend “SWAT-ing”: “Call the cops and tell them there’s a man with a gun there who’s about to murder everybody.”

In Tampa in 2015, a 62-year old black man with a carry permit was observed to have a concealed handgun by a 43-year old white guy, who took it upon himself to tackle the older man and take him to the ground in the entranceway of a Walmart while screaming, “He has a gun!” I suspect it was more an “anti-gun” thing than an “anti-black” thing, but it hasn’t gone to trial yet, so I don’t know for sure. The guy who attacked the legal carrier was charged with battery. It’s a miracle no one was killed, but it lets us all know there’s another danger to open carry out there today.

Open Carry Part II: The Case Against

We have to discuss the “cons.” There are physical hazards to open carry. Opponents of the concept say, “The openly carried gun will make you a target. Eit

gunsmagazine.com

I am not an open carry supporter for hand guns. That goes double 100% against for long guns anywhere, anytime except in game hunting or range practice, acceptance for your own private property of course. In your house, yard, or anywhere on your land, carry anything you like or allow others to carry in plain sight locked and loaded if you choose. Heck for home defense I would approve full auto, belt fed if that is what you choose for your personal defense, figuring your house, your land, your rules. I am not against owning a being proficient with any type of weaponry. That said, they have no sane place on the streets of cities or towns and are only meant for intimidation or in use or preparation to perpetrate mass casualty incidents.

My motorcycle club was talking about this at breakfast Thursday. Out of the twelve riders present, five were carrying concealed (sort of), three others had permits but weren't carrying and the remaining four were from states that don't allow CCWs and were part time Arizona residents. That seems pretty average of non-outlaw bikers around here. Of course the outlaws are all armed.