Florida Keys Deliver a Hard Message: As Seas Rise, Some Places Can’t Be Saved

[Ridgerunner]

Gee, thanks for bringing me to this intellectually stimulating discussion, K9. I think I'm going to go wash my hair now.

Curious minds would like to know if you warmed the water you used to clean your locks and if you did would algore approve?

 

[007]

Erosion eats away at the bottom, drags dirt and sand out to sea which then undermines that which is above it and causes it to collapse and flood.

Is it your belief that the Gulf of Mexico has risen 3-5 feet in recent years?

You called me to this thread, so I came and I commented. I would not have come into a global warming thread because I do not know a whole lot about it. I give my trust to the scientists and the thermometers world wide that agree the planet is warming rapidly, the ice is melting and (perhaps entirely coincidentally?) there is flooding now in low lying coastal areas where that was only seen before during extreme high tides.

I don't understand why the right needs to contradict and deny that. Do ALL of you have stock in BP? What on earth is your problem with doing what's necessary to limit C02 emissions? We have noggins for a reason. Try using yours.

The climate change industry is big business. Researchers are paid to conduct studies and the money goes away if they report that there is nothing to report. Don't be a sucker.

You called the NYT "reputable". They are not and I just provided you with an example.

There are no lies in that article. Just because they, like the rest of the educated world, understand that warmer temperatures are causing ice to melt, it doesn't make them liars. You would like to deny global warming because of your propensity to believe any made up hogwash that comes down the pike if it's spewed by the Alt Right factotums. Gee, thanks for bringing me to this intellectually stimulating discussion, K9. I think I'm going to go wash my hair now.

Claiming that the Keys are going under water due to "rising sea levels" is an absolute LIE.

Well here is what was a street three months ago. It has been flooded for three months straight.

So not a lie. You could get off your lazy stupd fiucking ass and go look. Go to the keys and see. Go to Miami and see it with your own eyes.

There is NO WAY UNDER THE SUN to VERIFY that is a picture of a street in the Keys, or that it has been flooded for more than even five minutes.

 

[Anathema]

Thankfully most of the Coastal areas are largely Liberal cesspools. The ocean will cleanse these areas by claiming them for itself, and washing away the trash as it does.

 

[evenflow1969]

You called me to this thread, so I came and I commented. I would not have come into a global warming thread because I do not know a whole lot about it. I give my trust to the scientists and the thermometers world wide that agree the planet is warming rapidly, the ice is melting and (perhaps entirely coincidentally?) there is flooding now in low lying coastal areas where that was only seen before during extreme high tides.

I don't understand why the right needs to contradict and deny that. Do ALL of you have stock in BP? What on earth is your problem with doing what's necessary to limit C02 emissions? We have noggins for a reason. Try using yours.

The climate change industry is big business. Researchers are paid to conduct studies and the money goes away if they report that there is nothing to report. Don't be a sucker.

You called the NYT "reputable". They are not and I just provided you with an example.

There are no lies in that article. Just because they, like the rest of the educated world, understand that warmer temperatures are causing ice to melt, it doesn't make them liars. You would like to deny global warming because of your propensity to believe any made up hogwash that comes down the pike if it's spewed by the Alt Right factotums. Gee, thanks for bringing me to this intellectually stimulating discussion, K9. I think I'm going to go wash my hair now.

Claiming that the Keys are going under water due to "rising sea levels" is an absolute LIE.

Well here is what was a street three months ago. It has been flooded for three months straight.

So not a lie. You could get off your lazy stupd fiucking ass and go look. Go to the keys and see. Go to Miami and see it with your own eyes.

There is NO WAY UNDER THE SUN to VERIFY that is a picture of a street in the Keys, or that it has been flooded for more than even five minutes.

Sure there is get off your lazy stupiud fucking ass ans see for your self.

 

[Leo123]

See OldLady the New York Times is a lying rag of bullshit. Read their article in the OP. Guess what? The Keys aren't sinking under "rising waters". The problem is with EROSION. I've provided an excerpt and a link:

There is a total of 36.3 miles of beaches that line the Florida Keys and attract both tourists and marine life. Unfortunately, 10.2 miles of this, or 28% of the beaches that line the Keys are deemed critically eroded.

Erosion - Coastal Issues in the Florida Keys

Yeah I also saw in the OP that someone called a "sustainability director" is responsible for this garbage statement. WTF is a "sustainability director" and why the heck don't the mods take this bullshit out of the Breaking News forum?

 

[Yarddog]

See OldLady the New York Times is a lying rag of bullshit. Read their article in the OP. Guess what? The Keys aren't sinking under "rising waters". The problem is with EROSION. I've provided an excerpt and a link:

There is a total of 36.3 miles of beaches that line the Florida Keys and attract both tourists and marine life. Unfortunately, 10.2 miles of this, or 28% of the beaches that line the Keys are deemed critically eroded.

Erosion - Coastal Issues in the Florida Keys

I didn't hear them lying anywhere, K9. I read your article, too, which talks about erosion, not flooding. The erosion of beaches is a big deal down there, where tourism is king. Saving beaches is important. I don't understand what makes you think that erosion of a beach would cause a strip of road to flood at high tide each winter? If you read the article, there is no doubt that the ocean is beginning to creep back over the Keys. That is not caused by erosion. Coastal cities everywhere are seeing it.

Yea? When are they going to be flooded by, 2160?

If that was your attempt at an explanation for why erosion causes repeated flooding, I think you failed.

Erosion eats away at the bottom, drags dirt and sand out to sea which then undermines that which is above it and causes it to collapse and flood.

Is it your belief that the Gulf of Mexico has risen 3-5 feet in recent years?

You called me to this thread, so I came and I commented. I would not have come into a global warming thread because I do not know a whole lot about it. I give my trust to the scientists and the thermometers world wide that agree the planet is warming rapidly, the ice is melting and (perhaps entirely coincidentally?) there is flooding now in low lying coastal areas where that was only seen before during extreme high tides.

I don't understand why the right needs to contradict and deny that. Do ALL of you have stock in BP? What on earth is your problem with doing what's necessary to limit C02 emissions? We have noggins for a reason. Try using yours.

Even if man made global warming is true, the United States is not the problem. It's China, India and other emerging regions who are increasing their CO2 output while we have been reducing ours. There seems to be this feeling among the AOC type democrats that we need to completely alter the United states as we know it, to save the world.
Its more than ridiculous and not based in fact.
There was once an Aluetian land bridge from Russia to Alaska, where people could walk across but its all under water now. Sea levels have been rising since the last big Ice Age and they will continue to rise until the next Ice age.Theres nothing man can really do to stop that from happening but civilization will survive just fine.

 

[cnm]

You worship government and believe whatever they tell you - sucker.

I now understand from where that paradigm comes.

 

[james bond]

Sea Level | Vital Signs – Climate Change: Vital Signs of the Planet

Sea level rise is caused primarily by two factors related to global warming: the added water from melting ice sheets and glaciers and the expansion of seawater as it warms. The first graph tracks the change in sea level since 1993 as observed by satellites.

The second graph, derived from coastal tide gauge data, shows how much sea level changed from about 1870 to 2000 (sic).

View attachment 293449

As a surfer who lived six blocks from Ocean Beach in SF, I have seen the beach in 1960 at high tide and in 2019. The width of the beach is very much smaller today then when I lived and surfed there in the 60's and 70's.

I lived close to Ocean Beach in SF for many years as I grew up in middle Richmond district in San Francisco. It's erosion there, too, caused by big storms. There is a huge 14' wastewater infrastructure that runs alongside the beach. If they do not shore it up with tons of additional sand to support it, then it could snap and cause a huge stinky mess. Thus, they bring lots of sand in many dump trucks from elsewhere and dump it on the beach. The problem isn't rising seas, but the libs all think that's the cause when it's erosion caused by storms and to shore up the wastewater infrastructure.. Why do you jump to conclusions?

ETA: There is no AGW and rising seas. It's all a scare story told by secular scientists. If the seas were truly rising, then the GRACE satellites would tell us. You would be getting information from them and getting warnings to evacuate. The problems we have is caused by changes to weather which we can't control.

 

[MAGAman]

Sadly, a lot of people simply do not get it, and that includes some posters on the USMB.

Sadly, sheep believe idiots in private planes telling them to stop driving their mopeds.

 

[Rye Catcher]

Sea Level | Vital Signs – Climate Change: Vital Signs of the Planet

Sea level rise is caused primarily by two factors related to global warming: the added water from melting ice sheets and glaciers and the expansion of seawater as it warms. The first graph tracks the change in sea level since 1993 as observed by satellites.

The second graph, derived from coastal tide gauge data, shows how much sea level changed from about 1870 to 2000 (sic).

View attachment 293449

As a surfer who lived six blocks from Ocean Beach in SF, I have seen the beach in 1960 at high tide and in 2019. The width of the beach is very much smaller today then when I lived and surfed there in the 60's and 70's.

I lived close to Ocean Beach in SF for many years as I grew up in middle Richmond district in San Francisco. It's erosion there, too, caused by big storms. There is a huge 14' wastewater infrastructure that runs alongside the beach. If they do not shore it up with tons of additional sand to support it, then it could snap and cause a huge stinky mess. Thus, they bring lots of sand in many dump trucks from elsewhere and dump it on the beach. The problem isn't rising seas, but the libs all think that's the cause when it's erosion caused by storms and to shore up the wastewater infrastructure.. Why do you jump to conclusions?

ETA: There is no AGW and rising seas. It's all a scare story told by secular scientists. If the seas were truly rising, then the GRACE satellites would tell us. You would be getting information from them and getting warnings to evacuate. The problems we have is caused by changes to weather which we can't control.

I've seen pictures of Ocean Beach well before my birth. I doubt your comment is the only reason why the Beach has shrunk. There is substance to your comment, since I recall a ship being anchored a few hundred yards off of Sloat Blvd., which the Chronicle wrote was mining sand. I don't know if it was to be replaced back on the beach, or used for the cement industry.

For the record, the sea wall was built years ago and the waves white water has reached the rocks at the end of Kelly's Cove and the sea wall during King Tides. Clearly those tids contribute to the erosion but I can't imagine what they take away goes too far out to sea, and so it is not replaced by in the process.

 

[james bond]

Sea Level | Vital Signs – Climate Change: Vital Signs of the Planet

Sea level rise is caused primarily by two factors related to global warming: the added water from melting ice sheets and glaciers and the expansion of seawater as it warms. The first graph tracks the change in sea level since 1993 as observed by satellites.

The second graph, derived from coastal tide gauge data, shows how much sea level changed from about 1870 to 2000 (sic).

View attachment 293449

As a surfer who lived six blocks from Ocean Beach in SF, I have seen the beach in 1960 at high tide and in 2019. The width of the beach is very much smaller today then when I lived and surfed there in the 60's and 70's.

I lived close to Ocean Beach in SF for many years as I grew up in middle Richmond district in San Francisco. It's erosion there, too, caused by big storms. There is a huge 14' wastewater infrastructure that runs alongside the beach. If they do not shore it up with tons of additional sand to support it, then it could snap and cause a huge stinky mess. Thus, they bring lots of sand in many dump trucks from elsewhere and dump it on the beach. The problem isn't rising seas, but the libs all think that's the cause when it's erosion caused by storms and to shore up the wastewater infrastructure.. Why do you jump to conclusions?

ETA: There is no AGW and rising seas. It's all a scare story told by secular scientists. If the seas were truly rising, then the GRACE satellites would tell us. You would be getting information from them and getting warnings to evacuate. The problems we have is caused by changes to weather which we can't control.

I've seen pictures of Ocean Beach well before my birth. I doubt your comment is the only reason why the Beach has shrunk. There is substance to your comment, since I recall a ship being anchored a few hundred yards off of Sloat Blvd., which the Chronicle wrote was mining sand. I don't know if it was to be replaced back on the beach, or used for the cement industry.

For the record, the sea wall was built years ago and the waves white water has reached the rocks at the end of Kelly's Cove and the sea wall during King Tides. Clearly those tids contribute to the erosion but I can't imagine what they take away goes too far out to sea, and so it is not replaced by in the process.

It's the wastewater pipe that is causing the work due to erosion. The sand transfers to shore up the wastewater infrastructure are annual. I've seen a line of those dump trucks to do the moving along the beach. They say it's caused by "the forces of nature and accelerated by the effect of climate change." The forces of nature are the storms and erosion. The liberal media wants you to buy into climate change.

"It’s a short-term measure the city has undertaken periodically since the early 2000s to combat and adapt to chronic coastal erosion at Ocean Beach south of Sloat Boulevard, where the shoreline’s attrition poses a mounting threat to critical wastewater infrastructure, natural habitats and beach access."

The above tells you what is noticeable and what SPUR is fighting.

Ocean Beach sand transfers will disrupt SF traffic on Great Highway

Ocean Beach Master Plan

 

[beautress]

This is the libs warning due to global warming. They do not understand Archimedes Principle. Even Neil DeGrasse Tyson gets it.

View attachment 293448

'KEY WEST, Fla. — Officials in the Florida Keys announced what many coastal governments nationwide have long feared, but few have been willing to admit: As seas rise and flooding gets worse, not everyone can be saved.

And in some places, it doesn’t even make sense to try.

On Wednesday morning, Rhonda Haag, the county’s sustainability director, released the first results of the county’s yearslong effort to calculate how high its 300 miles of roads must be elevated to stay dry, and at what cost. Those costs were far higher than her team expected — and those numbers, she said, show that some places can’t be protected, at least at a price that taxpayers can be expected to pay.

“I never would have dreamed we would say ‘no,’” Ms. Haag said in an interview. “But now, with the real estimates coming in, it’s a different story. And it’s not all doable.”'

Florida Keys Deliver a Hard Message: As Seas Rise, Some Places Can’t Be Saved

The Dutch of Holland did not let rising seas bother them. They built dikes and even expanded their lands by various means and dealt with leaks as needed. They're considered geniuses for saving their nation from the harshness of the north sea and included safety for their citizens over despair. I have sympathy for that stretch of human ingenuity for making an inhospitable place one of the most beautiful countries on earth, famous for their amazing flowers that are exported all over the globe for people who love beauty, caring, and taking care of each other.

World's Largest Flower Garden - Keukenhof Netherlands​

 

[james bond]

This is the libs warning due to global warming. They do not understand Archimedes Principle. Even Neil DeGrasse Tyson gets it.

View attachment 293448

'KEY WEST, Fla. — Officials in the Florida Keys announced what many coastal governments nationwide have long feared, but few have been willing to admit: As seas rise and flooding gets worse, not everyone can be saved.

And in some places, it doesn’t even make sense to try.

On Wednesday morning, Rhonda Haag, the county’s sustainability director, released the first results of the county’s yearslong effort to calculate how high its 300 miles of roads must be elevated to stay dry, and at what cost. Those costs were far higher than her team expected — and those numbers, she said, show that some places can’t be protected, at least at a price that taxpayers can be expected to pay.

“I never would have dreamed we would say ‘no,’” Ms. Haag said in an interview. “But now, with the real estimates coming in, it’s a different story. And it’s not all doable.”'

Florida Keys Deliver a Hard Message: As Seas Rise, Some Places Can’t Be Saved

The Dutch of Holland did not let rising seas bother them. They built dikes and even expanded their lands by various means and dealt with leaks as needed. They're considered geniuses for saving their nation from the harshness of the north sea and included safety for their citizens over despair. I have sympathy for that stretch of human ingenuity for making an inhospitable place one of the most beautiful countries on earth, famous for their amazing flowers that are exported all over the globe for people who love beauty, caring, and taking care of each other.

World's Largest Flower Garden - Keukenhof Netherlands​

Construction of the dike-in-boulevard, 2013

Dike building is certainly interesting. I think Golden Gate park still has a one Dutch windmill (non-working) and tulip garden. The photo above shows how it could be done. I'm not sure if they could build it alongside the wastewater infrastructure. What was suppose to be a temporary solution of sand moving has turned into a yearly event. Could a dike help alleviate the erosion and flooding from storms and inclement weather. The other thing I like about dikes is they help control the water pollution.

"Dike Period from 1985

A radical transformation in attitudes to water quality was triggered by an event that took place in 1986. Following a fierce fire at Sandoz chemicals factory in Basel, Switzerland, some twenty tonnes of pesticides became mixed with the water used to extinguish the fire and ended up in the Rhine. The toxic chemicals sowed death among fish for many hundreds of kilometres downstream. This was the era in which environmental activism came of age, with mussel farmers in uproar and nature conservationists staging furious protests against the closure of the Eastern Scheldt. There was also a slow change in attitudes to the country’s water defences. After the flooding of 1993 and 1995 – 240,000 people were evacuated in 1995 as a precautionary measure – the dikes were reinforced once again, but it also became clear that raising the prescribed norm was not the only solution. The policy document ‘Ruimte voor de Rivier’ (‘Space for the River’) advocated widening the riverbed instead of another largescale reinforcement of the dikes."

History | Dutch Dikes

 

[Weatherman2020]

This is the libs warning due to global warming. They do not understand Archimedes Principle. Even Neil DeGrasse Tyson gets it.

View attachment 293448

'KEY WEST, Fla. — Officials in the Florida Keys announced what many coastal governments nationwide have long feared, but few have been willing to admit: As seas rise and flooding gets worse, not everyone can be saved.

And in some places, it doesn’t even make sense to try.

On Wednesday morning, Rhonda Haag, the county’s sustainability director, released the first results of the county’s yearslong effort to calculate how high its 300 miles of roads must be elevated to stay dry, and at what cost. Those costs were far higher than her team expected — and those numbers, she said, show that some places can’t be protected, at least at a price that taxpayers can be expected to pay.

“I never would have dreamed we would say ‘no,’” Ms. Haag said in an interview. “But now, with the real estimates coming in, it’s a different story. And it’s not all doable.”'

Florida Keys Deliver a Hard Message: As Seas Rise, Some Places Can’t Be Saved

That’s hilarious. Time to buy a $15M mansion on the beach!

 

[mamooth]

This is the libs warning due to global warming. They do not understand Archimedes Principle.

As nobody has ever said melting icebergs will raise sea level, you're just displaying your abject ignorance of the topic.

Even Neil DeGrasse Tyson gets it.

He's wrong. Tyson. If all the floating icebergs melted, sea level would rise very slightly. Though I think Tyson does understand that, and that he's just dumbing it down a bit for the general public.It's like saying the earth is "round" instead of "ellipsoidal".

It's a bit complicated, why a melting iceberg raises sea level very slightly. It has to do with icebergs being fresh water, and the ocean being denser salt water. Icebergs floating in fresh water would not raise the water level when melting.

 

[mamooth]

Do you realize that the second graph kills the AGW theory? The graph shows a fairly consistent rise in sea levels since 1880,

No, it very clearly shows accelerating sea level rise. Are you really as inept at graph reading as you appear here, or are you faking your ineptitude?

and who knows about the previous 100 years.

In the 2000 years prior to 1850, sea level rise was pretty much zilch, less than 0.1 mm years. Now it's 3.3 mm/year and climbing.

AGW theory claims an acceleration of sea levels due to increased CO2 from humans.

And that's being directly observed. As is always the case, AGW theory is being confirmed by the hard data.

 

[mamooth]

Erosion eats away at the bottom, drags dirt and sand out to sea which then undermines that which is above it and causes it to collapse and flood.

So? That's still not any explanation as to why intact roads are now flooding when they didn't flood before. Water doesn't jump higher just because the shoreline recedes. You conservatives just don't seem to grasp common sense science.

s it your belief that the Gulf of Mexico has risen 3-5 feet in recent years?

It seems to be your belief that the ocean has to rise 3-5 feet to flood a coastal road. That belief makes no sense.

Claiming that the Keys are going under water due to "rising sea levels" is an absolute LIE.

Because you _feel_ it must be true?

You need to understand you're not talking to your fellow emotion-based conspiracy-addled conservatives. You're talking to hard-nosed liberals who deal in hard facts and hard reality. The hard data says the oceans are rising, therefore they are rising. No matter how badly it triggers you, it's still happening.

 

[K9Buck]

Erosion eats away at the bottom, drags dirt and sand out to sea which then undermines that which is above it and causes it to collapse and flood.

So? That's still not any explanation as to why intact roads are now flooding when they didn't flood before. Water doesn't jump higher just because the shoreline recedes. You conservatives just don't seem to grasp common sense science.

s it your belief that the Gulf of Mexico has risen 3-5 feet in recent years?

It seems to be your belief that the ocean has to rise 3-5 feet to flood a coastal road. That belief makes no sense.

Claiming that the Keys are going under water due to "rising sea levels" is an absolute LIE.

Because you _feel_ it must be true?

You need to understand you're not talking to your fellow emotion-based conspiracy-addled conservatives. You're talking to hard-nosed liberals who deal in hard facts and hard reality. The hard data says the oceans are rising, therefore they are rising. No matter how badly it triggers you, it's still happening.

The ocean is not rising.

New Policy Brief Shows No Evidence of Accelerated Sea-Level Rise

 

[mamooth]

The ocean is not rising.

New Policy Brief Shows No Evidence of Accelerated Sea-Level Rise

Well Golly! A couple of very well-paid shills from the Heartland Institute wrote something insane, so it must be true! All the tidal gauges are wrong! All the satellites are wrong! All the flooding is imaginary! It's all been a big conspiracy!

Thanks for clearing that up for us. Clearly, you are an extremely special snowflake, far smarter and braver than everyone around you, as only you and your very select band of freedom-fighters were capable of seeing through the liberal deception.

I bet it gives you a warm fuzzy feeling to believe that, eh? That's how cults draw people in.

 

[K9Buck]

Clearly, you are an extremely special snowflake...

And clearly you are triggered - sucker.