Five Alive: Constitutional Convention being explored by states

[The Rabbi]

.

I'd sure love to see a BBA, but it would force the liars in DC to directly justify their taxing & spending initiatives on both sides.

Imagine for a moment how much political influence would be lost.

Probably wishful thinking, I'm afraid.

.

Might be wishful thinking, but, the seeds are being sewn. When the states speak, Washington will be forced to listen. Just watch and see what happens.

You're incredibly naive.

The right always thinks bigger government is the answer.

That's why the Right engineered Dodd-Frank,Obamacare, and other huge programs? Dummy.

The right squandered a budget surplus, started two failed, illegal wars, and expanded the size and authority of the Federal government creating a massive deficit – all to the tune of billions of wasted dollars.

The last thing we need is conservative 'fiscal responsibility.'

blah blah blah, same retarded shit for a decade. 30 years from no they'll be chanting exactly the same mindless juvenile song.

They cannot think beyond bumper sticker slogans. They are impervious to logic and fact.

 

[Iceweasel]

Might be wishful thinking, but, the seeds are being sewn. When the states speak, Washington will be forced to listen. Just watch and see what happens.

You're incredibly naive.

The right always thinks bigger government is the answer.

That's why the Right engineered Dodd-Frank,Obamacare, and other huge programs? Dummy.

The right squandered a budget surplus, started two failed, illegal wars, and expanded the size and authority of the Federal government creating a massive deficit – all to the tune of billions of wasted dollars.

The last thing we need is conservative 'fiscal responsibility.'

blah blah blah, same retarded shit for a decade. 30 years from no they'll be chanting exactly the same mindless juvenile song.

They cannot think beyond bumper sticker slogans. They are impervious to logic and fact.

I guess if you repeat it enough, print it enough, chant it enough and put it out on enough cartoons and comedy shows it will become fact.

 

[gipper]

The power elite are the top .1% and they want world domination, which most see as a Marxist political command and control structure, centralized into the hands of a select few leaders they have complete control of.

You will find a far more receptive audience for that drivel in the Conspiracy Forum.

Conspiracy Theories US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum

Have you ever heard the famous quote from Mark Twain, the truth is stranger than fiction?

You would be wise to heed its meaning.

 

[The Rabbi]

You're incredibly naive.

The right always thinks bigger government is the answer.

That's why the Right engineered Dodd-Frank,Obamacare, and other huge programs? Dummy.

The right squandered a budget surplus, started two failed, illegal wars, and expanded the size and authority of the Federal government creating a massive deficit – all to the tune of billions of wasted dollars.

The last thing we need is conservative 'fiscal responsibility.'

blah blah blah, same retarded shit for a decade. 30 years from no they'll be chanting exactly the same mindless juvenile song.

They cannot think beyond bumper sticker slogans. They are impervious to logic and fact.

I guess if you repeat it enough, print it enough, chant it enough and put it out on enough cartoons and comedy shows it will become fact.

And if you repeat it enought o people who are not terribly bright, you get elected.

 

[JoeB131]

Name one time it has worked. (yawn)

BTW, the top 1% of earners paid 38% of all income taxes in 2012.

You mean the time period between 1945 and 1976, when America was an economic powerhouse, and the rich paid 70-93% top marginal rates. It was fucking awesome. We had money for schools and space programs and highways and even the occassional pointless war.

 

[JoeB131]

Yes, getting someone else to pay off debt certainly would be an effective way to continue spending money that you don't have. But the responsible thing to do would be to stop spending money you don't have.

I personally think that any solution to the debt WILL involve both cutting spending AND raising taxes.

But the raising of taxes has to come first.

 

[SwimExpert]

But the raising of taxes has to come first.

Why raise taxes before cutting spending?

 

[JoeB131]

But the raising of taxes has to come first.

Why raise taxes before cutting spending?

To show you are serious about meeting your obligations.

Here's the thing. When Reagan cut taxes, spending wasn't cut. IN fact, spending INCREASED, because, hey, you got all these benefits and no one had to pay for them.

It's how Reagan ran up three times the debt of his 39 predecessors combined.

 

[Derideo_Te]

.

I'd sure love to see a BBA, but it would force the liars in DC to directly justify their taxing & spending initiatives on both sides.

Imagine for a moment how much political influence would be lost.

Probably wishful thinking, I'm afraid.

.

We the People don't need a constitutional convention to pass a balanced budget amendment to the Constitution. The process for doing that already exists.

This push for a convention is an attempt to undermine the existing constitution and "legitimize" the failed libertarian dogma of the Koch bros.

Yeah! Let's talk about "We the People". It doesn't meant mob rule, numbnuts!

The ugly Libertarian squeals from the extreme right fringe!

 

[Derideo_Te]

We the People don't need a constitutional convention to pass a balanced budget amendment to the Constitution. The process for doing that already exists.

You are an idiot. A convention is the process that exists for "we the people" to amend the constitution.

This push for a convention is an attempt to undermine the existing constitution

Employing an amendment procedure that is explicitly stipulated in the constitution is an attempt to undermine it?

and "legitimize" the failed libertarian dogma of the Koch bros.

Are you saying that a balanced budget constitutes Libertarian dogma? I rescind my previous criticism. You're too stupid to be an idiot, you're a fanatic.

Ironic on all counts!

 

[Derideo_Te]

The power elite are the top .1% and they want world domination, which most see as a Marxist political command and control structure, centralized into the hands of a select few leaders they have complete control of.

You will find a far more receptive audience for that drivel in the Conspiracy Forum.

Conspiracy Theories US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum

Have you ever heard the famous quote from Mark Twain, the truth is stranger than fiction?

You would be wise to heed its meaning.

Mark Twain would have a field day exposing your conspiracy delusions.

 

[SwimExpert]

To show you are serious about meeting your obligations.

That is not a reason.

Here's the thing. When Reagan cut taxes, spending wasn't cut. IN fact, spending INCREASED, because, hey, you got all these benefits and no one had to pay for them.

It's how Reagan ran up three times the debt of his 39 predecessors combined.

So then we need to cut the spending.

 

[JoeB131]

To show you are serious about meeting your obligations.

That is not a reason.

Here's the thing. When Reagan cut taxes, spending wasn't cut. IN fact, spending INCREASED, because, hey, you got all these benefits and no one had to pay for them.

It's how Reagan ran up three times the debt of his 39 predecessors combined.

So then we need to cut the spending.

NO, we don't. We need to raise taxes first. Again, Reagan INCREASED spending when he cut taxes. So did Bush. Why? Because there was no demand to cut spending if you were getting all these things for free.

YOu see, this is what you guys don't get. If you are getting all the benefits from spending and none of the downside of paying taxes, you actually end up wanting MORE government, not less.

 

[SwimExpert]

NO, we don't. We need to raise taxes first. Again, Reagan INCREASED spending when he cut taxes.

So cut the fucking spending! Why is that so hard to understand? All you're saying is that you want to raise taxes, just because you want to. Like a kid in a candy store who wants mommy to give him something.

YOu see, this is what you guys don't get. If you are getting all the benefits from spending and none of the downside of paying taxes, you actually end up wanting MORE government, not less.

So cut the fucking spending! We're not the ones who want the spending, you are.

I've posted it before....we could completely eliminate income taxes on 95% of people, and cut spending dramatically, and end up with a nearly half billion budgetary surplus this year, and still maintain a social safety net. So enough with your tax and spend bullshit.

 

[Dana7360]

I would like to point out that Clinton didn't need a law or constitutional amendment to write balanced budgets.

It seems only the republicans need to be forced to do the right thing.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Why bo

Assuming you said "Why bother?"

I'll tell you why we should bother. How long would it take you to go bankrupt if you spent your money in the same manner our government did? First, you would run out of money, then you'd borrow and borrow to stay afloat, after borrowing so much money, your debt would be nearly impossible to pay off. You'd be on the streets.

The Constitution is ignored today. Placing another amendment to it, won't fix anything.

The political class is nearly entirely owned by the elites...and the elites always get their way.

So by giving up, we are saying the constitution doesn't matter anymore.

 

[TemplarKormac]

I would like to point out that Clinton didn't need a law or constitutional amendment to write balanced budgets.

It seems only the republicans need to be forced to do the right thing.

Too bad it's the democrat in the White House who needs to be forced to do the right thing.

 

[TemplarKormac]

But the number of states required to call Congress into a convention is 33, or three fourths of the states according to Article V of the US Constitution, meaning there would need to be 5 more states who must agrees

I believe you mean two thirds of the states must call for a convention. However, your math is still correct, it will require a total of 33 states.

Indeed.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Alaska, Florida and Georgia have passed legislation in support of a Constitutional Convention to ratify a new Amendment to rein in spending, force a balanced budget and/or prevent the US government's spending from exceeding its revenue. With 25 more considering to do the same, and assuming they all agree, the total would be 28. But the number of states required to call Congress into a convention is 33, or three fourths of the states according to Article V of the US Constitution, meaning there would need to be 5 more states who must agree. Any Amendment proposed at the convention would have to be agreed upon by 38. More here:

A state-level campaign to rein in the federal government by calling an unprecedented convention to amend the U.S. Constitution is gaining steam, picking up support from two high-profile Republicans as more states explore the idea.

The latest figures to endorse the effort are retired Oklahoma Sen. Tom Coburn and Ohio Gov. John Kasich.

Coburn, a legendary government-waste watchdog, announced this week that he has joined the effort by becoming a senior adviser for the group Convention of States Action, which wants states, not just Congress, to pass constitutional amendments. A primary goal is to get an amendment to the Constitution requiring a balanced federal budget, in which spending does not exceed revenue.

Article V of the Constitution says amendments can be ratified either by Congress or by states if two-thirds of them petition Congress to call a convention. Then, any amendment proposed at the convention must be ratified by three-fourth, or 38, states.

So far, the Alaska, Florida and Georgia legislatures have each passed a resolution in support of a convention, and 25 more are considering one, according to the group.

State-led push to force constitutional convention gains steam with high-profile Republican support Fox News

I doubt a CC could be limited to one topic.

Of course. Why would it be limited to one?

 

[TemplarKormac]

Why bother when the current one is so easily ignored or distorted?

Because someone has to remind them. What, should we just lay down and give up? This is our Valley Forge folks. Don't give in to the cold.