Extreme Marine Heatwave Underway in North Atlantic

[justoffal]

That is incorrect.

View attachment 802435
Note that while not by much, China's emissions ARE decreasing. Note also that the US has a much higher per capita rate of emissions than do China or India and we are, in fact, 16th out of the 209 countries on this full chart by that measure. If you go to the website, you can sort it on any column.

CO2 Emissions by Country - Worldometer

Carbon Dioxide (CO2) Emissions by Country in the world with Global share of CO2 greenhouse emissions by country

www.worldometers.info

You should check again, because they are. China has more wind and solar capacity installed than any other nation on the planet.

While leaving theirs alone? What are you suggesting? Tariffs? War?

You have been listening to a disingenuous source if you think that's what this is all about. Go to Another record! June was the hottest month ever recorded on Earth for an accurate translation of what the man actually said.

Get your facts straight before you make up your mind.

You left out a very important detail. China is building coal fired plants all over the world not just in China. So the total and per Capita don't really reflect the actual. The output is increasing not decreasing.
Btw....in this context per Capita is meaningless. We all share the same atmosphere.


Jo

 

[CrusaderFrank]

For the sake of discussion - and to save your sanity - let's say all of your data and predictions are correct. All of the effects from Western Europe and the US do not come close to the carbon footprint of China or India and, last I checked, they aren't doing a damned thing to lower it. So why should we allow our economies to crater while leaving theirs alone? Maybe because the whole situation is being used for a redistribution of wealth and as an excuse for more control by governments? Thankee, no...

^ 10 minute standing ovation like Ravi Shankar at Monterey or Zappa’s Yellow Shark

 

[fncceo]

Water temperatures off the UK are up to 9F higher than average in some locations. Fish dead of anoxia (hot water holds less oxygen) are washing up in the Gulf. In 2021 a marine heatwave in the Canadian west killed a billion shellfish.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/20/europe/marine-heatwave-north-atlantic-climate-scn-intl/index.html

Pretty ..

 

[Kruska]

Since the majority of their carbon footprint consists of their car and their electricity usage, there isn't much to be done till EVs of some sort are widely available and their residential electricity ALL comes from renewable sources.

What a lousy and profane - excuse.

Those who believe in CO2:

Immediately stop driving private fossil burning cars and get a bicycle, a mule or public transport.
No flying for "selfish" reasons, like holiday
Use household electricity for only 1 hour a day. (heating your shower and cooking) - for hot days keep in the shade, add sunshades and try a Japanese hand fan. In winter simply dress warm also whilst sitting in the living room or sleeping. Throw out those fridges - check out a cool spot in the house to store, and use your bicycle or mule to buy fresh food and drinks every day.
Also drinking lukewarm water doesn't kill anyone.
Stop buying any kind of fossil based plastic products. (Fuck the capitalistic industry) incl. Mobiles, TV's and DvD players - they also use up electricity. Get a phone with a landline. Get some books - recycled paper to spend your leisure time - AT HOME - no public amusement parks or cinemas - loads of electric consumption. Use a sickle to cut your lawn.

Stop buying solar panels - their production process really screws up the environment.

Try to raise an Amish spirit for yourself and live like one.

 

[Crick]

What a lousy and profane - excuse.

You'll have to explain how I was profane back there.

Those who believe in CO2:

"Believe in CO2"? You mean believe that CO2 is the primary cause of the warming observed over the last 150 years?

Immediately stop driving private fossil burning cars and get a bicycle, a mule or public transport.
No flying for "selfish" reasons, like holiday
Use household electricity for only 1 hour a day. (heating your shower and cooking) - for hot days keep in the shade, add sunshades and try a Japanese hand fan. In winter simply dress warm also whilst sitting in the living room or sleeping. Throw out those fridges - check out a cool spot in the house to store, and use your bicycle or mule to buy fresh food and drinks every day.
Also drinking lukewarm water doesn't kill anyone.
Stop buying any kind of fossil based plastic products. (Fuck the capitalistic industry) incl. Mobiles, TV's and DvD players - they also use up electricity. Get a phone with a landline. Get some books - recycled paper to spend your leisure time - AT HOME - no public amusement parks or cinemas - loads of electric consumption. Use a sickle to cut your lawn.

Stop buying solar panels - their production process really screws up the environment.

Try to raise an Amish spirit for yourself and live like one.

It's entirely possible for all of us to live a 21st century existence while eliminating GHG emissions. And childishly attacking mitigation measures as you're doing here says absolutely nothing about the science. You seem to reject the science. Do you have the balls to tell us why?

 

[Kruska]

You'll have to explain how I was profane back there.

"Believe in CO2"? You mean believe that CO2 is the primary cause of the warming observed over the last 150 years?

It's entirely possible for all of us to live a 21st century existence while eliminating GHG emissions. And childishly attacking mitigation measures as you're doing here says absolutely nothing about the science. You seem to reject the science. Do you have the balls to tell us why?

You are profane in regards to not taking your propagated and preached CO2 religion and believes serious - since you refute/refuse not to do your obvious part, aka disrespect your religious obligation to reduce CO2.

Understood now?

 

[Crick]

You left out a very important detail. China is building coal fired plants all over the world not just in China.

Chinese contractors may be doing so but those plants will come under the numbers for the country in which they exist. China is not forcing anyone to build coal plants.

So the total and per Capita don't really reflect the actual.

They most certainly do.

The output is increasing not decreasing.

The amount of coal capacity in China is decreasing. This is due to:

Renewable energy capacity worldwide by country 2023 | Statista

The leading countries for installed renewable energy in 2023 were China, the U.S., Brazil.

www.statista.com

Btw....in this context per Capita is meaningless. We all share the same atmosphere.

That is complete nonsense. Large nations like China, Russia, India Canada, the US have large emissions numbers because they have large populations to service. It is in everyone's interest that such nations reduce their per capita consumption

 

[justoffal]

Chinese contractors may be doing so but those plants will come under the numbers for the country in which they exist. China is not forcing anyone to build coal plants.

They most certainly do.

The amount of coal capacity in China is decreasing. This is due to:
View attachment 802492

Renewable energy capacity worldwide by country 2023 | Statista

The leading countries for installed renewable energy in 2023 were China, the U.S., Brazil.

www.statista.com

That is complete nonsense. Large nations like China, Russia, India Canada, the US have large emissions numbers because they have large populations to service. It is in everyone's interest that such nations reduce their per capita consumption

Ultimately it is foolish even to consider per Capita. You cannot separate the atmosphere into national regions. China has increased it's us of coal and is using more now than ever. I'm not sure how you have managed to decieve yourself on this. Building wind and solar alongside it does not suddenly make it LESS.

There is a parallel issue here however and that is China's population growth which is now declining. That along with the horrific pollution problems they're experiencing as a population will no doubt force them away from hydrocarbons sooner than they had planned to do so.

jo

 

[Crick]

Ultimately it is foolish even to consider per Capita. You cannot separate the atmosphere into national regions. China has increased it's us of coal and is using more now than ever.

You tell us that we should not consider national regions then in the very next sentence criticize China.

Each nation's government sets policies that will determine how much CO2 it produces to serve the energy and transportation needs of its citizens. That is why you must address nations.

I'm not sure how you have managed to decieve yourself on this. Building wind and solar alongside it does not suddenly make it LESS.

Yes it does. You might have caught this in the news in the last day or two: California’s electricity duck curve is deepening

There is a parallel issue here however and that is China's population growth which is now declining.

The rate has declined, but their population is still growing. They never achieved ZPG.

That along with the horrific pollution problems they're experiencing as a population will no doubt force them away from hydrocarbons sooner than they had planned to do so.

They have been planning all along to shift to renewables and close fossil fuel plants when they were able. Whether or not they can meet their needs or the worlds is still a debatable issue.

 

[justoffal]

You tell us that we should not consider national regions then in the very next sentence criticize China.

Each nation's government sets policies that will determine how much CO2 it produces to serve the energy and transportation needs of its citizens. That is why you must address nations.

Yes it does. You might have caught this in the news in the last day or two: California’s electricity duck curve is deepening

The rate has declined, but their population is still growing. They never achieved ZPG.

They have been planning all along to shift to renewables and close fossil fuel plants when they were able. Whether or not they can meet their needs or the worlds is still a debatable issue.

We all share the same atmosphere. There is only one relevant per Capita number..... total CO2/total population.....I see no value in trying to elevate national boundaries into the atmosphere. It's a form of self deception.

I am not criticizing China...I am merely observing that they are for a fact using more not less coal. How you can see it as less escapes me.

Yes....let's hope that they keep their stated goal.
However it should be noted that according to a good segment of respected climatologists that the feed back loop has already been set in motion. I'm no expert on the subject but that more or less speaks for itself.

Jo

 

[Crick]

Pretty ..

View attachment 802476

If you don't have anything pertinent or meaningful to say, why don't you go find something else to do?

 

[Crick]

We all share the same atmosphere. There is only one relevant per Capita number..... total CO2/total population.....I see no value in trying to elevate national boundaries into the atmosphere. It's a form of self deception.

I am not criticizing China...I am merely observing that they are for a fact using more not less coal. How you can see it as less escapes me.

Yes....let's hope that they keep their stated goal.
However it should be noted that according to a good segment of respected climatologists that the feed back loop has already been set in motion. I'm no expert on the subject but that more or less speaks for itself.

Jo

Yes. There is a very, very good chance that it is too late. And given the tepid response worldwide and the existence of people like those in this forum, I'd say our worst case scenario is virtually guaranteed.

 

[justoffal]

If you don't have anything pertinent or meaningful to say, why don't you go find something else to do?

Actually it's a clever comment on maps and charts. They haven't always been accurate but they always manage to be a
eye-catching.

 

[HikerGuy83]

Man can preserve the earth and himself,
or
The earth can rid itself of man.
In either case the earth will win.

Get some popcorn.

 

[HikerGuy83]

Yes. There is a very, very good chance that it is too late. And given the tepid response worldwide and the existence of people like those in this forum, I'd say our worst case scenario is virtually guaranteed.

Better start buying stock in ice.

Sounds like it's going to be great.

 

[Crick]

You are profane in regards to not taking your propagated and preached CO2 religion and believes serious - since you refute/refuse not to do your obvious part, aka disrespect your religious obligation to reduce CO2.

Understood now?

I understand you seem to be an ESL student. Science is not a religion. And you are neither qualified nor authorized to tell anyone what they have to do to combat AGW. Feel free to address your elected representatives on this issue.

 

[justoffal]

Yes. There is a very, very good chance that it is too late. And given the tepid response worldwide and the existence of people like those in this forum, I'd say our worst case scenario is virtually guaranteed.

Frightening thought. Who would have ever imagined that man could actually affect the entire planet?

 

[Woodznutz]

Yes
Yes
and Yes

CO2 is necessary for plants to thrive. Plants take in CO2 and release Oxygen (O2). It's part of the cycle of life. And humans, by the way, are carbon based. Carbon Dioxide ain't bad and it plays its role.

Plants also give up CO2, half when they are alive, almost all when they die. Only a small amount is sequestered as wood or soil. Also, plants have other nutrient needs that may limit their growth even in the presence of adequate amounts of CO2.

 

[Woodznutz]

Chinese contractors may be doing so but those plants will come under the numbers for the country in which they exist. China is not forcing anyone to build coal plants.

They most certainly do.

The amount of coal capacity in China is decreasing. This is due to:
View attachment 802492

Renewable energy capacity worldwide by country 2023 | Statista

The leading countries for installed renewable energy in 2023 were China, the U.S., Brazil.

www.statista.com

That is complete nonsense. Large nations like China, Russia, India Canada, the US have large emissions numbers because they have large populations to service. It is in everyone's interest that such nations reduce their per capita consumption

China is preparing to reduce its population drastically by preparing for war with the west, which will reduce its carbon emissions. The west will also suffer population losses as well, which will also help mitigate climate change. Of course, the war itself will add lots of pollution to the earth and atmosphere.

 

[fncceo]

If you don't have anything pertinent or meaningful to say, why don't you go find something else to do?

In what way is a crayola colored map, with no legend to equate scary red with actual temps, no error bars, no source data pertinent to anything?

It's just your way of trying to scare people into complying with your agenda.

So, when you get serious, I will treat you serious.