Explain to us Libs, what is a living wage?

[editec]

Asking the question: What is a living wage? is asking ourselves the wrong question.

the right question is: What does a living thriving economy look like?

The answer is: It is does NOT look like ours does today.

The sector I work in is collapsing to the point Canada as well as Australia is my only near term options it seems

Sorry to hear it.

Lot of that going on in a lot of industries.

Some of us is because of internationaL trade, some of it is technology, and some of it is just the current state of the economy.

I've had at least three distinctly different careers thus far. Some of that was by choice but a lot of it was just following the economy hoping to cash in on what is happening at that time.

One needs to be extrmely adaptable now to surivive.

 

[kwc57]

Then you aren't looking hard enough. Get a resume on career builder and/or monster. You don't even need a college education to make a living wage.

With respect, my issue is not a living wage and if you thought my compassion was built on my failure to make a living wage that is sad-?
any-way your are way out of touch of where the heart beat of this country really is. Out-side of the medical sector it is dying
There are just so many jobs for people who do what I do. I hate to say this but the problem with this nations economy is that exact lack of understanding
Obama has no clue what he is doing, that is just a fact


The housing sector is broke.

the power industry does not have a clue whether to build more power plants or what to do


Canada and Mexico is getting all of the fossil fuel related work we could be getting

your talking millions of jobs that we are losing as I firm believer in the trickle down effect

You're just plain wrong here JRK. The state of North Dakota right now is literally booming with fossil fuel production. Their unemployment rate is 3.4%. Do me a favor. Do what I asked. Put a resume on career builder and monster. Then, if somehow your inbox doesn't have a couple dozen job openings in it every week like mine, THEN you can come back on here and tell me there aren't any jobs. Deal?

Maybe your personal issue isn't a living wage, but you are most certainly advocating that it is your employers responsibility to provide for your needs and you also most definatley seem to be advocating that every job should pay a living wage. I really hope the heart beat of this country isn't reflective of the idea that it someone elses responsibility to take care of them. If it is, we really are screwed

Here in Oklahoma, the unemployment rate is 5.9%. I literally do not know anyone who is unemployed. A lot of that number is made up out in more rural areas where there are not nearly as many job opportunities. If I lived in one of the state highlighted in red below and I were out of work, I'd be looking for another state to move to where the prospects are better.

Local Area Unemployment Statistics Home Page

Alabama 9.8%
Alaska 7.6%
Arizona 9.1%
Arkansas 8.3%
California 11.9%
Colorado 8.3%
Connecticut 8.9%
Delaware 8.1%
D.C. 11.1%
Florida 10.6%
Georgia 10.3%
Hawaii 6.4%
Idaho 9.0%
Illinois 10.0%
Indiana 8.9%
Iowa 6.0%
Kansas 6.7%
Kentucky 9.7%
Louisiana 6.9%
Maine 7.5%
Maryland 7.4%
Massachusetts 7.3%
Michigan 11.1%
Minnesota 6.9%
Mississippi 10.6%
Missouri 8.7%
Montana 7.7%
Nebraska 4.2%
Nevada 13.4%
New Hampshire 5.4%
New Jersey 9.2%
New Mexico 6.6%
New York 8.0%
North Carolina 10.5%
North Dakota 3.5%
Ohio 9.1%
Oklahoma 5.9%
Oregon 9.6%
Pennsylvania 8.3%
Puerto Rico 15.1%
Rhode Island 10.5%
South Carolina 11.0%
South Dakota 4.6%
Tennessee 9.8%
Texas 8.5%
Utah 7.4%
Vermont 5.8%
Virginia 6.5%
Washington 9.1%
West Virginia 8.2%
Wisconsin 7.8%
Wyoming 5.8%

 

[JRK]

Then you aren't looking hard enough. Get a resume on career builder and/or monster. You don't even need a college education to make a living wage.

With respect, my issue is not a living wage and if you thought my compassion was built on my failure to make a living wage that is sad-?
any-way your are way out of touch of where the heart beat of this country really is. Out-side of the medical sector it is dying
There are just so many jobs for people who do what I do. I hate to say this but the problem with this nations economy is that exact lack of understanding
Obama has no clue what he is doing, that is just a fact


The housing sector is broke.

the power industry does not have a clue whether to build more power plants or what to do


Canada and Mexico is getting all of the fossil fuel related work we could be getting

your talking millions of jobs that we are losing as I firm believer in the trickle down effect

You're just plain wrong here JRK. The state of North Dakota right now is literally booming with fossil fuel production. Their unemployment rate is 3.4%. Do me a favor. Do what I asked. Put a resume on career builder and monster. Then, if somehow your inbox doesn't have a couple dozen job openings in it every week like mine, THEN you can come back on here and tell me there aren't any jobs. Deal?

Maybe your personal issue isn't a living wage, but you are most certainly advocating that it is your employers responsibility to provide for your needs and you also most definatley seem to be advocating that every job should pay a living wage. I really hope the heart beat of this country isn't reflective of the idea that it someone elses responsibility to take care of them. If it is, we really are screwed

Mr Lib, I have been patient with you
that patience is gone
you are as clueless as a person as I have ever met, that is not personal, you just need to start listening and stop thinking you have any idea whats really going on
The company I work for has a Man Camp job in N.D. right now. it requires about 300 people
we have about 1500 right here in Texas getting laid off or going to Canada in the next 3 months
My 1500 has 30,000 going with it in the next 12 weeks
you have no clue as what your talking about
You will learn in life to keep your nose where it does not belong and when you get in your 40s and 50s you will be in a place in which you know when to talk and when not to
The reason N.D has a 3% UE rate is all the jobs there are manned up.
Now
If Obama would allow this to take root in all of the other places there is this resource, I could see there being enough work for about 1/2 the other 75% that have no where to go but over sea's

 

[JRK]

With respect, my issue is not a living wage and if you thought my compassion was built on my failure to make a living wage that is sad-?
any-way your are way out of touch of where the heart beat of this country really is. Out-side of the medical sector it is dying
There are just so many jobs for people who do what I do. I hate to say this but the problem with this nations economy is that exact lack of understanding
Obama has no clue what he is doing, that is just a fact


The housing sector is broke.

the power industry does not have a clue whether to build more power plants or what to do


Canada and Mexico is getting all of the fossil fuel related work we could be getting

your talking millions of jobs that we are losing as I firm believer in the trickle down effect

You're just plain wrong here JRK. The state of North Dakota right now is literally booming with fossil fuel production. Their unemployment rate is 3.4%. Do me a favor. Do what I asked. Put a resume on career builder and monster. Then, if somehow your inbox doesn't have a couple dozen job openings in it every week like mine, THEN you can come back on here and tell me there aren't any jobs. Deal?

Maybe your personal issue isn't a living wage, but you are most certainly advocating that it is your employers responsibility to provide for your needs and you also most definatley seem to be advocating that every job should pay a living wage. I really hope the heart beat of this country isn't reflective of the idea that it someone elses responsibility to take care of them. If it is, we really are screwed

Here in Oklahoma, the unemployment rate is 5.9%. I literally do not know anyone who is unemployed. A lot of that number is made up out in more rural areas where there are not nearly as many job opportunities. If I lived in one of the state highlighted in red below and I were out of work, I'd be looking for another state to move to where the prospects are better.

Local Area Unemployment Statistics Home Page

Alabama 9.8%
Alaska 7.6%
Arizona 9.1%
Arkansas 8.3%
California 11.9%
Colorado 8.3%
Connecticut 8.9%
Delaware 8.1%
D.C. 11.1%
Florida 10.6%
Georgia 10.3%
Hawaii 6.4%
Idaho 9.0%
Illinois 10.0%
Indiana 8.9%
Iowa 6.0%
Kansas 6.7%
Kentucky 9.7%
Louisiana 6.9%
Maine 7.5%
Maryland 7.4%
Massachusetts 7.3%
Michigan 11.1%
Minnesota 6.9%
Mississippi 10.6%
Missouri 8.7%
Montana 7.7%
Nebraska 4.2%
Nevada 13.4%
New Hampshire 5.4%
New Jersey 9.2%
New Mexico 6.6%
New York 8.0%
North Carolina 10.5%
North Dakota 3.5%
Ohio 9.1%
Oklahoma 5.9%
Oregon 9.6%
Pennsylvania 8.3%
Puerto Rico 15.1%
Rhode Island 10.5%
South Carolina 11.0%
South Dakota 4.6%
Tennessee 9.8%
Texas 8.5%
Utah 7.4%
Vermont 5.8%
Virginia 6.5%
Washington 9.1%
West Virginia 8.2%
Wisconsin 7.8%
Wyoming 5.8%

those numbers are about 50% of reality
I am 800 miles from home today. the company I work for has a job in ND, the 1500 people there about to lay-off has no where to go bud
The reason the UE rate is not going down is no-one is hiring

 

[kwc57]

You're just plain wrong here JRK. The state of North Dakota right now is literally booming with fossil fuel production. Their unemployment rate is 3.4%. Do me a favor. Do what I asked. Put a resume on career builder and monster. Then, if somehow your inbox doesn't have a couple dozen job openings in it every week like mine, THEN you can come back on here and tell me there aren't any jobs. Deal?

Maybe your personal issue isn't a living wage, but you are most certainly advocating that it is your employers responsibility to provide for your needs and you also most definatley seem to be advocating that every job should pay a living wage. I really hope the heart beat of this country isn't reflective of the idea that it someone elses responsibility to take care of them. If it is, we really are screwed

Here in Oklahoma, the unemployment rate is 5.9%. I literally do not know anyone who is unemployed. A lot of that number is made up out in more rural areas where there are not nearly as many job opportunities. If I lived in one of the state highlighted in red below and I were out of work, I'd be looking for another state to move to where the prospects are better.

Local Area Unemployment Statistics Home Page

Alabama 9.8%
Alaska 7.6%
Arizona 9.1%
Arkansas 8.3%
California 11.9%
Colorado 8.3%
Connecticut 8.9%
Delaware 8.1%
D.C. 11.1%
Florida 10.6%
Georgia 10.3%
Hawaii 6.4%
Idaho 9.0%
Illinois 10.0%
Indiana 8.9%
Iowa 6.0%
Kansas 6.7%
Kentucky 9.7%
Louisiana 6.9%
Maine 7.5%
Maryland 7.4%
Massachusetts 7.3%
Michigan 11.1%
Minnesota 6.9%
Mississippi 10.6%
Missouri 8.7%
Montana 7.7%
Nebraska 4.2%
Nevada 13.4%
New Hampshire 5.4%
New Jersey 9.2%
New Mexico 6.6%
New York 8.0%
North Carolina 10.5%
North Dakota 3.5%
Ohio 9.1%
Oklahoma 5.9%
Oregon 9.6%
Pennsylvania 8.3%
Puerto Rico 15.1%
Rhode Island 10.5%
South Carolina 11.0%
South Dakota 4.6%
Tennessee 9.8%
Texas 8.5%
Utah 7.4%
Vermont 5.8%
Virginia 6.5%
Washington 9.1%
West Virginia 8.2%
Wisconsin 7.8%
Wyoming 5.8%

those numbers are about 50% of reality
I am 800 miles from home today. the company I work for has a job in ND, the 1500 people there about to lay-off has no where to go bud
The reason the UE rate is not going down is no-one is hiring

Bullshit. We just hired two employees in the past week......above "living wage" jobs and have a coworker who has been with us for 10 years moving to a better job next week. You can't seem to see the forest for the trees. Just because things might suck where you are, does not mean things suck elsewhere. If my wife and I were to lose our well paying jobs, I'd consider moving half way across the country if that is where we could find other jobs that allow us to continue living in the manner we're accustomed to. What I wouldn't do is move to Michigan or California. I'd be looking at Nebraska, North Dakota, South Dakota or Wyoming.

And cut the bullshit of calling the conservatives disagreeing with you liberals. Do you not realize that the few people who have agreed with you in this thread are screaming liberals? Your social engineering "living wage" argument is not conservative.

 

[Bern80]

With respect, my issue is not a living wage and if you thought my compassion was built on my failure to make a living wage that is sad-?
any-way your are way out of touch of where the heart beat of this country really is. Out-side of the medical sector it is dying
There are just so many jobs for people who do what I do. I hate to say this but the problem with this nations economy is that exact lack of understanding
Obama has no clue what he is doing, that is just a fact


The housing sector is broke.

the power industry does not have a clue whether to build more power plants or what to do


Canada and Mexico is getting all of the fossil fuel related work we could be getting

your talking millions of jobs that we are losing as I firm believer in the trickle down effect

You're just plain wrong here JRK. The state of North Dakota right now is literally booming with fossil fuel production. Their unemployment rate is 3.4%. Do me a favor. Do what I asked. Put a resume on career builder and monster. Then, if somehow your inbox doesn't have a couple dozen job openings in it every week like mine, THEN you can come back on here and tell me there aren't any jobs. Deal?

Maybe your personal issue isn't a living wage, but you are most certainly advocating that it is your employers responsibility to provide for your needs and you also most definatley seem to be advocating that every job should pay a living wage. I really hope the heart beat of this country isn't reflective of the idea that it someone elses responsibility to take care of them. If it is, we really are screwed

Mr Lib, I have been patient with you
that patience is gone
you are as clueless as a person as I have ever met, that is not personal, you just need to start listening and stop thinking you have any idea whats really going on
The company I work for has a Man Camp job in N.D. right now. it requires about 300 people
we have about 1500 right here in Texas getting laid off or going to Canada in the next 3 months
My 1500 has 30,000 going with it in the next 12 weeks
you have no clue as what your talking about
You will learn in life to keep your nose where it does not belong and when you get in your 40s and 50s you will be in a place in which you know when to talk and when not to
The reason N.D has a 3% UE rate is all the jobs there are manned up.
Now
If Obama would allow this to take root in all of the other places there is this resource, I could see there being enough work for about 1/2 the other 75% that have no where to go but over sea's

Are you ******* schizo? YOU are calling ME a lib? You truly are fucked up in the head JRK. Everyone who has been around this board for any length of time will attest that I am not a lib. YOU on the other hand are a hypcrite of epic proportion. Claiming to be a conservative yet advocating for something that is about as unconservative a position as one could have. I feel like I'm in the twilight zone here. When you, the supposed conservative is essentially advocating for less personal accountability, are calling me a liberal who is advocating for more personal responsibility. Yeah insisting that a person be responsible (as opposed to their employer) for providing for themselves is sooooo liberal. Maybe radical to the likes of you, but not liberal.

How do I know what I'm talking about in ND. BECAUSE I WAS THERE. They are hiring burger flippers at $11/hr. As the oil industry grows there, there is only going to be more and more job. And yor evidence that I'm wrong about ND is because you're losing jobs in TX?

 

[Bern80]

You're just plain wrong here JRK. The state of North Dakota right now is literally booming with fossil fuel production. Their unemployment rate is 3.4%. Do me a favor. Do what I asked. Put a resume on career builder and monster. Then, if somehow your inbox doesn't have a couple dozen job openings in it every week like mine, THEN you can come back on here and tell me there aren't any jobs. Deal?

Maybe your personal issue isn't a living wage, but you are most certainly advocating that it is your employers responsibility to provide for your needs and you also most definatley seem to be advocating that every job should pay a living wage. I really hope the heart beat of this country isn't reflective of the idea that it someone elses responsibility to take care of them. If it is, we really are screwed

Here in Oklahoma, the unemployment rate is 5.9%. I literally do not know anyone who is unemployed. A lot of that number is made up out in more rural areas where there are not nearly as many job opportunities. If I lived in one of the state highlighted in red below and I were out of work, I'd be looking for another state to move to where the prospects are better.

Local Area Unemployment Statistics Home Page

Alabama 9.8%
Alaska 7.6%
Arizona 9.1%
Arkansas 8.3%
California 11.9%
Colorado 8.3%
Connecticut 8.9%
Delaware 8.1%
D.C. 11.1%
Florida 10.6%
Georgia 10.3%
Hawaii 6.4%
Idaho 9.0%
Illinois 10.0%
Indiana 8.9%
Iowa 6.0%
Kansas 6.7%
Kentucky 9.7%
Louisiana 6.9%
Maine 7.5%
Maryland 7.4%
Massachusetts 7.3%
Michigan 11.1%
Minnesota 6.9%
Mississippi 10.6%
Missouri 8.7%
Montana 7.7%
Nebraska 4.2%
Nevada 13.4%
New Hampshire 5.4%
New Jersey 9.2%
New Mexico 6.6%
New York 8.0%
North Carolina 10.5%
North Dakota 3.5%
Ohio 9.1%
Oklahoma 5.9%
Oregon 9.6%
Pennsylvania 8.3%
Puerto Rico 15.1%
Rhode Island 10.5%
South Carolina 11.0%
South Dakota 4.6%
Tennessee 9.8%
Texas 8.5%
Utah 7.4%
Vermont 5.8%
Virginia 6.5%
Washington 9.1%
West Virginia 8.2%
Wisconsin 7.8%
Wyoming 5.8%

those numbers are about 50% of reality
I am 800 miles from home today. the company I work for has a job in ND, the 1500 people there about to lay-off has no where to go bud
The reason the UE rate is not going down is no-one is hiring

Again, I double dog dare you to post your resume on career builder or any job search career website and tell me no one is hiring.

 

[JRK]

You're just plain wrong here JRK. The state of North Dakota right now is literally booming with fossil fuel production. Their unemployment rate is 3.4%. Do me a favor. Do what I asked. Put a resume on career builder and monster. Then, if somehow your inbox doesn't have a couple dozen job openings in it every week like mine, THEN you can come back on here and tell me there aren't any jobs. Deal?

Maybe your personal issue isn't a living wage, but you are most certainly advocating that it is your employers responsibility to provide for your needs and you also most definatley seem to be advocating that every job should pay a living wage. I really hope the heart beat of this country isn't reflective of the idea that it someone elses responsibility to take care of them. If it is, we really are screwed

Mr Lib, I have been patient with you
that patience is gone
you are as clueless as a person as I have ever met, that is not personal, you just need to start listening and stop thinking you have any idea whats really going on
The company I work for has a Man Camp job in N.D. right now. it requires about 300 people
we have about 1500 right here in Texas getting laid off or going to Canada in the next 3 months
My 1500 has 30,000 going with it in the next 12 weeks
you have no clue as what your talking about
You will learn in life to keep your nose where it does not belong and when you get in your 40s and 50s you will be in a place in which you know when to talk and when not to
The reason N.D has a 3% UE rate is all the jobs there are manned up.
Now
If Obama would allow this to take root in all of the other places there is this resource, I could see there being enough work for about 1/2 the other 75% that have no where to go but over sea's

Are you ******* schizo? YOU are calling ME a lib? You truly are fucked up in the head JRK. Everyone who has been around this board for any length of time will attest that I am not a lib. YOU on the other hand are a hypcrite of epic proportion. Claiming to be a conservative yet advocating for something that is about as unconservative a position as one could have.

How do I know what I'm talking about in ND. BECAUSE I WAS THERE. They are hiring burger flippers at $11/hr. As the oil industry grows there, there is only going to be more and more job opportunity. Why the hell are saying I'm wrong about ND because you're losing jobs in TX. TEXAS ISN'T NORTH DAKOTA YOU GEOGRAPHICALLY ILLITERATE TOOL.

Not a Lib?
stop acting like one then

See your wrong again, I am in Texas for a job, this is not my home.
I am 800 miles from my home. You keep tripping
what have I claimed that is not conservative? that we need a free market solution to fixing poverty?
That we need to take welfare and cut it by providing a free market solution?
what exactly would you call that? tripped up again?

you have advocated that its the govts place in life to deal with poverty, not the free market. what do you think a living wage is?

 

[Foxfyre]

It IS government's job to deal with poverty by creating an environment in which poverty is less likely. That is done through a business-friendly and people friendly tax code, a business-friendly regulatory policy, and not imposing unnecessary mandates and removing mandates.

It is NOT government's job to make poor people less poor.

The more government puts business-unfriendly pressure on the free market and subsidizes poverty, the less of the former we will have and the more of the latter.

 

[Bern80]

Mr Lib, I have been patient with you
that patience is gone
you are as clueless as a person as I have ever met, that is not personal, you just need to start listening and stop thinking you have any idea whats really going on
The company I work for has a Man Camp job in N.D. right now. it requires about 300 people
we have about 1500 right here in Texas getting laid off or going to Canada in the next 3 months
My 1500 has 30,000 going with it in the next 12 weeks
you have no clue as what your talking about
You will learn in life to keep your nose where it does not belong and when you get in your 40s and 50s you will be in a place in which you know when to talk and when not to
The reason N.D has a 3% UE rate is all the jobs there are manned up.
Now
If Obama would allow this to take root in all of the other places there is this resource, I could see there being enough work for about 1/2 the other 75% that have no where to go but over sea's

Are you ******* schizo? YOU are calling ME a lib? You truly are fucked up in the head JRK. Everyone who has been around this board for any length of time will attest that I am not a lib. YOU on the other hand are a hypcrite of epic proportion. Claiming to be a conservative yet advocating for something that is about as unconservative a position as one could have.

How do I know what I'm talking about in ND. BECAUSE I WAS THERE. They are hiring burger flippers at $11/hr. As the oil industry grows there, there is only going to be more and more job opportunity. Why the hell are saying I'm wrong about ND because you're losing jobs in TX. TEXAS ISN'T NORTH DAKOTA YOU GEOGRAPHICALLY ILLITERATE TOOL.

Not a Lib?
stop acting like one then

See your wrong again, I am in Texas for a job, this is not my home.
I am 800 miles from my home. You keep tripping
what have I claimed that is not conservative? that we need a free market solution to fixing poverty?
That we need to take welfare and cut it by providing a free market solution?
what exactly would you call that? tripped up again?

you have advocated that its the govts place in life to deal with poverty, not the free market. what do you think a living wage is?

What have I advocated or done that could be remotely construed as liberal

You on the other hand...personal accountability has always been a tennent of conservativism and yet you are advoacting something that actually discourages and absolves people of personal accouontability. When you advocate that it is the employers job to provide everyone at least enough to live on, you are absolving people of personal responsibility. I get wanting to end welfare, but putting on an employer to provide for your basic needs is a LIBERAL'S solution to that problem not a conservative one.

 

[JRK]

It IS government's job to deal with poverty by creating an environment in which poverty is less likely. That is done through a business-friendly and people friendly tax code, a business-friendly regulatory policy, and not imposing unnecessary mandates and removing mandates.

It is NOT government's job to make poor people less poor.

The more government puts business-unfriendly pressure on the free market and subsidizes poverty, the less of the former we will have and the more of the latter.

I could not agree more
now that we have done that, why do you have an issue with a mandated minimum wage that is truly a living wage?
simple question, not a personal attack on you, the system, libs, conservatives
simple question.

If I bid on a federally funded project I will PAY bacon Davis wages, whats the difference if I own a hamburger joint?

 

[Foxfyre]

It IS government's job to deal with poverty by creating an environment in which poverty is less likely. That is done through a business-friendly and people friendly tax code, a business-friendly regulatory policy, and not imposing unnecessary mandates and removing mandates.

It is NOT government's job to make poor people less poor.

The more government puts business-unfriendly pressure on the free market and subsidizes poverty, the less of the former we will have and the more of the latter.

I could not agree more
now that we have done that, why do you have an issue with a mandated minimum wage that is truly a living wage?
simple question, not a personal attack on you, the system, libs, conservatives
simple question.

If I bid on a federally funded project I will PAY bacon Davis wages, whats the difference if I own a hamburger joint?

Bern is right that a federally mandated 'living wge', whatever that is, is NOT a conservative concept because it does not allow the free market to work and whenever you skew the free market in one place it has many other ripple effects.

Why should you have to pay Bacon Davis wages in order to bid on a federal job? It often substantially increases the cost of the contract on a labor intensive job and that cost everybody. Multiplied again and again across the country, it adds up to mega millions or billions in wasted taxes. Why is the prevailing wage of the area not sufficient? Of course your workers like the higher wage, but it comes at a cost to somebody else who had no say in the process.

Why not make certification of legal status of your employees a mandate and otherwise give the contract to the lowest bidder who can provide the product according to specifications? Would that not be better stewardship of the people's money?

 

[JRK]

Are you ******* schizo? YOU are calling ME a lib? You truly are fucked up in the head JRK. Everyone who has been around this board for any length of time will attest that I am not a lib. YOU on the other hand are a hypcrite of epic proportion. Claiming to be a conservative yet advocating for something that is about as unconservative a position as one could have.

How do I know what I'm talking about in ND. BECAUSE I WAS THERE. They are hiring burger flippers at $11/hr. As the oil industry grows there, there is only going to be more and more job opportunity. Why the hell are saying I'm wrong about ND because you're losing jobs in TX. TEXAS ISN'T NORTH DAKOTA YOU GEOGRAPHICALLY ILLITERATE TOOL.

Not a Lib?
stop acting like one then

See your wrong again, I am in Texas for a job, this is not my home.
I am 800 miles from my home. You keep tripping
what have I claimed that is not conservative? that we need a free market solution to fixing poverty?
That we need to take welfare and cut it by providing a free market solution?
what exactly would you call that? tripped up again?

you have advocated that its the govts place in life to deal with poverty, not the free market. what do you think a living wage is?

What have I advocated or done that could be remotely construed as liberal

You on the other hand...personal accountability has always been a tennent of conservativism and yet you are advoacting something that actually discourages and absolves people of personal accouontability. When you advocate that it is the employers job to provide everyone at least enough to live on, you are absolving people of personal responsibility. I get wanting to end welfare, but putting on an employer to provide for your basic needs is a LIBERAL'S solution to that problem not a conservative one.

Why would you think a person making 7.75 an hour or making 30.00 an hour be allowed to not do his job?
You keep talking like to earn this wage you have to do nothing in return, why do you think that?
Responsibility? so your to the feeling that a person who works for the county, or a logging company for years, gets up every day, on time and puts in a hard days work
makes below poverty level wages and is getting govt subsidies to survive is not responsible?

You keep bringing this up like I am saying this is some big give away

 

[JRK]

It IS government's job to deal with poverty by creating an environment in which poverty is less likely. That is done through a business-friendly and people friendly tax code, a business-friendly regulatory policy, and not imposing unnecessary mandates and removing mandates.

It is NOT government's job to make poor people less poor.

The more government puts business-unfriendly pressure on the free market and subsidizes poverty, the less of the former we will have and the more of the latter.

I could not agree more
now that we have done that, why do you have an issue with a mandated minimum wage that is truly a living wage?
simple question, not a personal attack on you, the system, libs, conservatives
simple question.

If I bid on a federally funded project I will PAY bacon Davis wages, whats the difference if I own a hamburger joint?

Bern is right that a federally mandated 'living wge', whatever that is, is NOT a conservative concept because it does not allow the free market to work and whenever you skew the free market in one place it has many other ripple effects.

Why should you have to pay Bacon Davis wages in order to bid on a federal job? It often substantially increases the cost of the contract on a labor intensive job and that cost everybody. Multiplied again and again across the country, it adds up to mega millions or billions in wasted taxes. Why is the prevailing wage of the area not sufficient? Of course your workers like the higher wage, but it comes at a cost to somebody else who had no say in the process.

Why not make certification of legal status of your employees a mandate and otherwise give the contract to the lowest bidder who can provide the product according to specifications? Would that not be better stewardship of the people's money?

I am not sure your reading my threads
bacon-davis wage act
let me help
The Davis–Bacon Act of 1931 is a United States federal law which established the requirement for paying prevailing wages on public works projects. All federal government construction contracts, and most contracts for federally assisted construction over $2,000, must include provisions for paying workers on-site no less than the locally prevailing wages and benefits paid on similar projects.
now can we start there?
It has done nothing to harm the free market, nothing
It has made it ultra competitive
You know exactly what tools you need
what is expected of you
etc.....

this is a real program that is a huge success

 

[kwc57]

sigh

 

[Bern80]

It IS government's job to deal with poverty by creating an environment in which poverty is less likely. That is done through a business-friendly and people friendly tax code, a business-friendly regulatory policy, and not imposing unnecessary mandates and removing mandates.

It is NOT government's job to make poor people less poor.

The more government puts business-unfriendly pressure on the free market and subsidizes poverty, the less of the former we will have and the more of the latter.

I could not agree more
now that we have done that, why do you have an issue with a mandated minimum wage that is truly a living wage?
simple question, not a personal attack on you, the system, libs, conservatives
simple question.

If I bid on a federally funded project I will PAY bacon Davis wages, whats the difference if I own a hamburger joint?

You said you 'totally agreed' with this statement

It is NOT government's job to make poor people less poor.

That is your answer to why we have an issue with a mandated living wage.

 

[JRK]

It IS government's job to deal with poverty by creating an environment in which poverty is less likely. That is done through a business-friendly and people friendly tax code, a business-friendly regulatory policy, and not imposing unnecessary mandates and removing mandates.

It is NOT government's job to make poor people less poor.

The more government puts business-unfriendly pressure on the free market and subsidizes poverty, the less of the former we will have and the more of the latter.

I could not agree more
now that we have done that, why do you have an issue with a mandated minimum wage that is truly a living wage?
simple question, not a personal attack on you, the system, libs, conservatives
simple question.

If I bid on a federally funded project I will PAY bacon Davis wages, whats the difference if I own a hamburger joint?

You said you 'totally agreed' with this statement

It is NOT government's job to make poor people less poor.

That is your answer to why we have an issue with a mandated living wage.

Bern I have an issue with people who argue for just the sake of arguing. It has been no less than 30 threads ago you made it clear to all of us the employer has rights, the employee has none
All I have done is offer a resolution to a problem that is costing the tax payers and the corporations in this country 100s of billions
It works over seas in a free market country of Australia and works here when Bacon Davis has jurisdiction. You know whats the craziest thing? companies, most of them would not care
Look we get it okay?
What else is there to talk about? Your a free market guy who wants the tax payer to keep dealing with poverty, that thinks people (100s of thousands of us) that are professionals need to go to N.D and get a job making 11.00 an hour, instead of doing what every-one else in my sector and go to Canada , Australia etc... until we get a real president in power


Bern this country is in a very very bad place, poverty is an issue that also needs resolve Bern
your plan does nothing to resolve it, think about it

 

[Bern80]

Not a Lib?
stop acting like one then

See your wrong again, I am in Texas for a job, this is not my home.
I am 800 miles from my home. You keep tripping
what have I claimed that is not conservative? that we need a free market solution to fixing poverty?
That we need to take welfare and cut it by providing a free market solution?
what exactly would you call that? tripped up again?

you have advocated that its the govts place in life to deal with poverty, not the free market. what do you think a living wage is?

What have I advocated or done that could be remotely construed as liberal

You on the other hand...personal accountability has always been a tennent of conservativism and yet you are advoacting something that actually discourages and absolves people of personal accouontability. When you advocate that it is the employers job to provide everyone at least enough to live on, you are absolving people of personal responsibility. I get wanting to end welfare, but putting on an employer to provide for your basic needs is a LIBERAL'S solution to that problem not a conservative one.

Why would you think a person making 7.75 an hour or making 30.00 an hour be allowed to not do his job?
You keep talking like to earn this wage you have to do nothing in return, why do you think that?
Responsibility? so your to the feeling that a person who works for the county, or a logging company for years, gets up every day, on time and puts in a hard days work
makes below poverty level wages and is getting govt subsidies to survive is not responsible?

You keep bringing this up like I am saying this is some big give away

You're bordering on gibberish in your sentence structure. I can't understand half of these questions. And your secenarios are wholly inrealistic. No one in any government position is making less than poverty level wages. A logger is paid based on the work that is available. Such trade jobs like logging, construction, etc. can't count on a consistant work over a period of time. However.....how hard either of those people work is irrelevent. As is their dependability to their employer. Certainly the later may occassionaly warant a small increase in wages, but at some point it's going to top out. In the fantasy world of yours, if such a scenario were to occur that individual needs to do somethig different. If a certain patter of behavior isn't yielding the outcome you want, you change your behavior. That is not a rocket science concept.

The simple fact is the economy does not nor should it work they way you would like it to. What you deserve is not nor should it be based on what you for compensation. It is based on the value of your skill set. If said skill set is valued at less than what a person could live on and you need an income to live then YOU need to do something different.

 

[kwc57]

I could not agree more
now that we have done that, why do you have an issue with a mandated minimum wage that is truly a living wage?
simple question, not a personal attack on you, the system, libs, conservatives
simple question.

If I bid on a federally funded project I will PAY bacon Davis wages, whats the difference if I own a hamburger joint?

You said you 'totally agreed' with this statement

It is NOT government's job to make poor people less poor.

That is your answer to why we have an issue with a mandated living wage.

Bern I have an issue with people who argue for just the sake of arguing. It has been no less than 30 threads ago you made it clear to all of us the employer has rights, the employee has none
All I have done is offer a resolution to a problem that is costing the tax payers and the corporations in this country 100s of billions
It works over seas in a free market country of Australia and works here when Bacon Davis has jurisdiction. You know whats the craziest thing? companies, most of them would not care
Look we get it okay?
What else is there to talk about? Your a free market guy who wants the tax payer to keep dealing with poverty, that thinks people (100s of thousands of us) that are professionals need to go to N.D and get a job making 11.00 an hour, instead of doing what every-one else in my sector and go to Canada , Australia etc... until we get a real president in power


Bern this country is in a very very bad place, poverty is an issue that also needs resolve Bern
your plan does nothing to resolve it, think about it

Not to speak for bern, but where did you ever get the idea that we conservatives were arguing for government to use taxpayer money to care for the poor. That really isn't any of the governments business and isn't even constitutional. There is a small minority of people who truely can not care for themselves and have no family that can care for them that needs a safety net. Beyond that, ending welfare would force those lazy 4th generation welfare folks to get off their ass and do something to actually support themselves. Now, if you think I am unempatehtic or unsympathetic, go back and read what I just said about the truely needy needing a safet net. The difference between you and me is in who the truely needy are. It isn't the people who have made bad choices in life that result in only being qualified for low paying jobs. There is no free lunch. Someone has to pay......and it should be the individual from the sweat of their own brow.

 

[JRK]

You said you 'totally agreed' with this statement



That is your answer to why we have an issue with a mandated living wage.

Bern I have an issue with people who argue for just the sake of arguing. It has been no less than 30 threads ago you made it clear to all of us the employer has rights, the employee has none
All I have done is offer a resolution to a problem that is costing the tax payers and the corporations in this country 100s of billions
It works over seas in a free market country of Australia and works here when Bacon Davis has jurisdiction. You know whats the craziest thing? companies, most of them would not care
Look we get it okay?
What else is there to talk about? Your a free market guy who wants the tax payer to keep dealing with poverty, that thinks people (100s of thousands of us) that are professionals need to go to N.D and get a job making 11.00 an hour, instead of doing what every-one else in my sector and go to Canada , Australia etc... until we get a real president in power


Bern this country is in a very very bad place, poverty is an issue that also needs resolve Bern
your plan does nothing to resolve it, think about it

Not to speak for bern, but where did you ever get the idea that we conservatives were arguing for government to use taxpayer money to care for the poor. That really isn't any of the governments business and isn't even constitutional. There is a small minority of people who truely can not care for themselves and have no family that can care for them that needs a safety net. Beyond that, ending welfare would force those lazy 4th generation welfare folks to get off their ass and do something to actually support themselves. Now, if you think I am unempatehtic or unsympathetic, go back and read what I just said about the truely needy needing a safet net. The difference between you and me is in who the truely needy are. It isn't the people who have made bad choices in life that result in only being qualified for low paying jobs. There is no free lunch. Someone has to pay......and it should be the individual from the sweat of their own brow.

get off of the ass
make 17,000 a year
and we give them another 10-15 in welfare
works for me

you guys have missed this entire conversation so far I will never get you back, and it is very disturbing the 2 of you feel that employers have all of these rights and the employee has none
Yet I am stuck with the bill when it comes to paying there taxes, my taxes and those taxes ones who live in poverty are not paying. This problem has grown under Obama to a 600 billion dollar a year issue, all most the entire amount it cost us to liberate Iraq in dollars

Now you guys have made your points okay?
Let me give all 3 of you some advice

To resolve a problem, you have to understand it first
use the 5 whys, it works every time (Google it)
whats the problem? we are spending way to much in tax dollars towards well fare
how do we resolve it?
Get of of your lazy ass and work
7.75 an hour is way below a living wage according to the federal govt

Now what we do?

Programs using the guidelines (or percentage multiples of the guidelines — for instance, 125 percent or 185 percent of the guidelines) in determining eligibility include Head Start, the Food Stamp Program, the National School Lunch Program, the Low-Income Home Energy Assistance Program, and the Children’s Health Insurance Program. Note that in general, cash public assistance programs (Temporary Assistance for Needy Families and Supplemental Security Income) do NOT use the poverty guidelines in determining eligibility. The Earned Income Tax Credit program also does NOT use the poverty guidelines to determine eligibility. For a more detailed list of programs that do and don’t use the guidelines, see the Frequently Asked Questions (FAQs).

The poverty guidelines (unlike the poverty thresholds) are designated by the year in which they

they start @ about 11,000 for 1 @ 100% and go to about 19,000 with the 185%
You make 10.00 an hour, 1 person, your own your own

Now no need to respond to me, I have had all I need of this, you cannot be a success in life ignoring problems
My resolve was and is a free market resolution, may not see it that way, but leaving it alone its going to get worse
we were spending 50% of this n 07, we dbl down again it will be over 1 trillion dollars a year