Daunting space mission: Send astronauts to asteroid

[Liability]

Taxi!

 

[Patrick2]

Even my astronomy 101 students would laugh themselves silly at your stupidity!

You teach, too? Wow, you are a jack of all trades.

Yep - I'm a renaissance man. To make up for the slack in aerospace contracts. I'm not teaching now, but occasionally teach math, science and computer science.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

LOL. Really? Right up until President Kennedy was assinated, the right wing of that day refered to him as "That Pinko Punk in the White House". About every other week, there was an article concerning how he was going to let the Pope run the nation.

Who, besides Hoover, ever referred to JFK as a pinko?

Kind of hard to talk about going to the asteroid belt when we cannot afford to repair the bridges on our Interstates. And if he had suggested something like that in a State of the Union address, you people would have been all over him for suggesting it.

Yet you are attempting to defend going to the asteroids.

I would not be all over anyone that I thought was serious about getting this country to the asteroids. I will, however, point out that if Obama was serious about getting us anywhere he would not have cancelled the Orion Project when the space shuttle was retired. If you can counter that, feel free.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

I Considering the moon is a mere quarter of a million millions away and Mars averages around 300 MILLION miles away, it's like building a gas station next door on your way to driving to California.

(The retard doesn't get the immense fuel/weight advantage of an escape velocity of 2.4 km/sec instead of 11.2 km/sec. )

What did you do in physics class - masturbate in the last row?

Now that's hilarious. The amount of fuel your talking about is negligible when comparing a quarter of a million miles with 300 MILLION miles. Look at the size of the rockets it took to go to the moon. They were huge. Sure they coasted, but it took a lot of fuel to get up to the speed needed to coast and a lot of fuel to slow down. Then you have to come back the same way.

Why do you think they are talking "ion" drive and using the gravity of earth and the moon? They start the ion drive ship and use the earth's and moon's gravity to increase speed to the point where you can sling shot off into space. They can do it over and over again for a long period of time to build up speed and no one even has to be on board. Then you use a fast rocket to catch up and dock with it and load it with passengers and whatever else they need.

Right wingers think they should just go ahead and build a "warp" drive and get it "out of the way'. Now THAT is hilarious. No wonder they don't make good scientists.

You just proved you are not an engineer.

Ion drives do not work in atmosphere, or even within the Van Allen belts. That means that we still have to get those ion drive ships into space the same way we get everything else into space, why sitting it on top of a controlled explosion. If you actually understood basic Newtonian physics you would know that.

Now I know that you do not just lie about politics, you actually lie about your education.

 

[flacaltenn]

Just the title of this thread gives me the willies..

It could be "send prisoners to an asteroid".

That makes more sense since it sounds like a punishment -- not a reward. After all that was basis for the founding of places like Georgia and Australia.. Maybe Obama's thinking of a better solution to his Gitmo promises..

 

[HenryBHough]

If it were not for the U.S. space program the world would never have had Teflon.

Therefore Bill would be in jail for some of the mysterious deaths in Arkansas.

Indeed Teflon IS wonderful stuff!

 

[American Horse]

Ihe International Lunar Exploration Working Group (ILEWG), a working group of scientists and others consisting of representatives from space agencies, scientific institutions and industry still leans toward staging any planned exploration of Mars beginning on the moon.

In addition to being the logical testing ground for missions to Mars, the international Lunar Base will be the political sine qua non for human flights beyond the moon. They contend that human missions to Mars are not feasible without some sort of apprenticeship. Bases in Martian caves will require preliminary testing of equipment and methods in lunar caves. They see the known existence of lava tube caves as natural ready made habitats to be exploited for temporary or permanent human presence on the moon and Mars.

I find it refreshing that there are others out there who see another route to Mars than the direct one, albeit after visiting asteroids and other space rocks. Its a good way of keeping our options open. Apparently the industry and others in the international community for space exploration don't want to be led by NASA and American presidents (not even the One) for their space exploration goals.

 

[Liability]

You can NEVER get a Taxi when you need one.

 

[waltky]

Earth has leading asteroid...

Trojan asteroid discovered leading Earth's orbit
July 28, 2011 - Trojan asteroid: NASA has discovered that Earth has an asteroid companion traveling just ahead of our planet as it orbits the sun. This so-called Trojan asteroid could serve as a stepping stone to celestial objects farther afield.

The first in a long-sought type of asteroid companion to Earth has now been discovered, a space rock that always dances in front of the planet along its orbital path, just beyond its reach. The asteroid, called 2010 TK7, is nearly 1,000 feet (300 meters) across and currently leading the Earth by about 50 million miles (80 million kilometers).

The asteroid is the first in a category known as Earth's Trojans, a family of space rocks that could potentially be easier to reach than the moon, even though its member asteroids can be dozens of times more distant, researchers said. Such asteroids, which have long been suspected but not confirmed until now, could one day be valuable destinations for missions, especially loaded as they might be with elements rare on Earth's surface, they added.

To imagine where Trojan asteroids are, picture the sun and Earth as being two points in a triangle whose sides are equal in length. The other point of such a triangle is known as a Trojan point, or a Lagrangian point after the mathematician who discovered them. The sun and Earth have two such points, one leading ahead of Earth, known as its L-4 point, and one trailing behind, its L-5 point.

The sun and other planets have Lagrangian points as well, and asteroids have been seen at those the sun shares with Jupiter, Neptune and Mars. Scientists had long suspected the sun and Earth had Trojans as well, but these companions would dwell mostly in the daytime sky as seen from Earth, making them largely hidden in the sunlight. Now, with the aid of the Wide-field Infrared Survey Explorer (WISE) satellite launched in 2009, astronomers have discovered Earth's first probable Trojan, a rock that spends its time at the sun-Earth L-4 point.

Earth's first Trojan asteroid

 

[Liability]

The Obama Administration SPACE Themesong:


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c5dwksSbD34]‪Harry Chapin--Taxi‬‏ - YouTube[/ame]

 

[nainocarD]

In the same week, I read of a mission to the Asteroids and an article on Russia's intention of de-orbiting the ISS in 2020...What a waste. Especially considering the tremendous expense of lifting a payload out of Earth's gravity well.
Let's use the existing structures of the ISS to save both money and time. Mount control, propulsion, additional shielding, power systems and the (planned/spoken of) new aux vehicle(s). Put the new crew in-place and move it out of orbit on the round trip to the asteroids. We can park it again and resume it's present observational duties or expand it yet again and use to to to Mars when it returns. The ISS is already there, and has proven that it can support a number of crewmembers for extended periods safely, albeit with periodic supply and trash missions. Using this platform will give the planned mission a major boost and may allow it to happen in considerably fewer than 15 years at much less cost. We all need positive, pro-active news...more so now than ever. Both NASA and the world in general would benefit. Let us do this!

 

[daveman]

(The retard doesn't get the immense fuel/weight advantage of an escape velocity of 2.4 km/sec instead of 11.2 km/sec. )

What did you do in physics class - masturbate in the last row?

Now that's hilarious. The amount of fuel your talking about is negligible when comparing a quarter of a million miles with 300 MILLION miles. Look at the size of the rockets it took to go to the moon. They were huge. Sure they coasted, but it took a lot of fuel to get up to the speed needed to coast and a lot of fuel to slow down. Then you have to come back the same way.

Why do you think they are talking "ion" drive and using the gravity of earth and the moon? They start the ion drive ship and use the earth's and moon's gravity to increase speed to the point where you can sling shot off into space. They can do it over and over again for a long period of time to build up speed and no one even has to be on board. Then you use a fast rocket to catch up and dock with it and load it with passengers and whatever else they need.

Right wingers think they should just go ahead and build a "warp" drive and get it "out of the way'. Now THAT is hilarious. No wonder they don't make good scientists.

You just proved you are not an engineer.

Ion drives do not work in atmosphere, or even within the Van Allen belts. That means that we still have to get those ion drive ships into space the same way we get everything else into space, why sitting it on top of a controlled explosion. If you actually understood basic Newtonian physics you would know that.

Now I know that you do not just lie about politics, you actually lie about your education.

He's a womyn's studies engineer.

 

[Liability]

Now that's hilarious. The amount of fuel your talking about is negligible when comparing a quarter of a million miles with 300 MILLION miles. Look at the size of the rockets it took to go to the moon. They were huge. Sure they coasted, but it took a lot of fuel to get up to the speed needed to coast and a lot of fuel to slow down. Then you have to come back the same way.

Why do you think they are talking "ion" drive and using the gravity of earth and the moon? They start the ion drive ship and use the earth's and moon's gravity to increase speed to the point where you can sling shot off into space. They can do it over and over again for a long period of time to build up speed and no one even has to be on board. Then you use a fast rocket to catch up and dock with it and load it with passengers and whatever else they need.

Right wingers think they should just go ahead and build a "warp" drive and get it "out of the way'. Now THAT is hilarious. No wonder they don't make good scientists.

You just proved you are not an engineer.

Ion drives do not work in atmosphere, or even within the Van Allen belts. That means that we still have to get those ion drive ships into space the same way we get everything else into space, why sitting it on top of a controlled explosion. If you actually understood basic Newtonian physics you would know that.

Now I know that you do not just lie about politics, you actually lie about your education.

He's a womyn's studies engineer.

I have had occasion to make a study of some women.

I make no claim to being an engineer, though.

 

[daveman]

You just proved you are not an engineer.

Ion drives do not work in atmosphere, or even within the Van Allen belts. That means that we still have to get those ion drive ships into space the same way we get everything else into space, why sitting it on top of a controlled explosion. If you actually understood basic Newtonian physics you would know that.

Now I know that you do not just lie about politics, you actually lie about your education.

He's a womyn's studies engineer.

I have had occasion to make a study of some women.

I make no claim to being an engineer, though.

I see you've never tried to study a womyn.

 

[American Horse]

Fifty-six years to get from the moon to an asteroid?

That's pathetic.

I sorta enjoyed this comment from the link for Exploring a Near-Earth Asteroid - Mission Animation.

[The] animation shows the Space Exploration Vehicle (SEV) exploring a near-Earth asteroid.

Not very convincing. Not exciting. Unimaginative. Boring. However, we probably should go to an asteroid some day AFTER we establish the infrastructure in space that would support and benefit from such a mission. Moonbase comes to mind first, but also reliable, versatile, and practical space craft and launch vehicles. This video shows a Holy-God-Expensive, Hundreds-of-Billions-of-Dollars Decade-in-the-Making program which culminates in a supposed 14-day visit to an asteroid with a spacecraft capable of nothing else at all. Zero, Zilch, Nada, Nothing! Upon the return of the astronauts from this utter-waste-of-an-entire-decade's-worth-of-resources mission, it is assumed that our nation will begin examining a more practical and relevant program such as Constellation.

 

[American Horse]

All this has to be ready to launch by 2025 by presidential order.

It has the dreamers of NASA both excited and anxious.

"This is a risky mission. It's a challenging mission," says NASA chief technology officer Bobby Braun. "It's the kind of mission that engineers will eat up."

This is a matter of sending "humans farther than ever before," says NASA Deputy Administrator Lori Garver. It is all a stepping stone to the dream of flying astronauts to Mars in the mid 2030s.

"I think it is THE mission NASA should embrace," says University of Tennessee aerospace professor John Muratore. "To be successful at this mission, you've got to embrace all of the technologies that you need for Mars."

The reason NASA Administrator Charles Bolden and others give is that this mission could save civilization.

If NASA goes to ion propulsion, the best bet would be to start the bulk of the ship on a trip to and around the moon without astronauts. That would take a while, but if no one is on it, it doesn't matter, Joosten says. Then when that ship is far from Earth, astronauts aboard Orion would dock and join the rest of the trip. By this time, the ship would have picked up sufficient speed and keep on accelerating.

Much of the habitat could be inflatable, launched in a lightweight form, and inflated in space. On Friday, July 22, 2011, NASA announced a competition among four universities to design potential exploration habitats.

Daunting space mission: Send astronauts to asteroid | R&D Mag

Brilliant plan by visionairies. Truly brilliant.

I think they got excited when they still had something to do. Now they are trying to figure out what for: Save civilization? hmm.... They are going to go there and experiment with methods of deflecting one of some large size, like a 300-feet rocky asteroid.

BTW Dawn has arrived at asteroid Vesta, somewhere beyond the orbit of Mars, 46 months after leaving Earth and a gravity assist from Mars. It coasted into orbit around Vesta this month. Dawn matched the asteroids speed so precisely that it gently fell into orbit like a car merging into freeway traffic after accelerating along an entrance ramp. The craft and the asteriod were travelling at 46,000 mph around the Sun, but their relative speed was less than 110 mph for the capture. it will be at Vesta for a year's survey of the rock and then it will head for Ceres, further out still, arriving in February 2015 for an orbital recon/survey lasting five months.

Since leaving earth orbit it has been powered by an ion drive engine.

 

[The_GiantNoodle]

I see no advantage to go to a asteroid. Its a waste of money, no?

 

[rdean]

Ihe International Lunar Exploration Working Group (ILEWG), a working group of scientists and others consisting of representatives from space agencies, scientific institutions and industry still leans toward staging any planned exploration of Mars beginning on the moon.

In addition to being the logical testing ground for missions to Mars, the international Lunar Base will be the political sine qua non for human flights beyond the moon. They contend that human missions to Mars are not feasible without some sort of apprenticeship. Bases in Martian caves will require preliminary testing of equipment and methods in lunar caves. They see the known existence of lava tube caves as natural ready made habitats to be exploited for temporary or permanent human presence on the moon and Mars.

I find it refreshing that there are others out there who see another route to Mars than the direct one, albeit after visiting asteroids and other space rocks. Its a good way of keeping our options open. Apparently the industry and others in the international community for space exploration don't want to be led by NASA and American presidents (not even the One) for their space exploration goals.

The distance from the earth to the moon is a mere quarter of a million miles. The distance from the earth to Mars averages around 300 million miles. Building a base on the moon would require enormous resources and a lot of time. And you would still have to go 300 million miles. The moon may be smaller than the earth. It may have less gravity, but it's still a world. Much larger than an asteroid.

Some asteroids are miles across. Some are made from water. Water can be broken down into oxygen and hydrogen.

We've been using the same old chemical rockets since the 60's. We need to develop new technology. Rocket fuel won't get us very far. It burns too fast. The rocket have to be huge. Remember, we are talking 300 million miles. We used enormous rockets to get us to the moon and back and didn't even have enough fuel left to land. We had to splash down.

I think the right wing has difficulty understanding "innovation" and "new technology". Even here, they still want to do things the old fashioned way. They are not "forward thinkers". They are always "looking backward".

NASA's on board with this. They are excited about it and they are the ones that went to the moon.

 

[rdean]

I see no advantage to go to a asteroid. Its a waste of money, no?

No.

Where you have water and electricity, you can sustain life. Some asteroids are nearly sold iron. They could be mined. Others are pure ice. Ice is water. With electricity, you can break water down into Oxygen and Hydrogen. Hydrogen is a great fuel. Spaceships with football field sized solar panels can produce huge amounts of electricity. Imagine being able to refuel any time you want. Having smaller ships or rocket packs running on hydrogen and oxygen. Electrically generated light and heat.

There is so much possibility there.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Fifty-six years to get from the moon to an asteroid?

That's pathetic.

I sorta enjoyed this comment from the link for Exploring a Near-Earth Asteroid - Mission Animation.

[The] animation shows the Space Exploration Vehicle (SEV) exploring a near-Earth asteroid.

Not very convincing. Not exciting. Unimaginative. Boring. However, we probably should go to an asteroid some day AFTER we establish the infrastructure in space that would support and benefit from such a mission. Moonbase comes to mind first, but also reliable, versatile, and practical space craft and launch vehicles. This video shows a Holy-God-Expensive, Hundreds-of-Billions-of-Dollars Decade-in-the-Making program which culminates in a supposed 14-day visit to an asteroid with a spacecraft capable of nothing else at all. Zero, Zilch, Nada, Nothing! Upon the return of the astronauts from this utter-waste-of-an-entire-decade's-worth-of-resources mission, it is assumed that our nation will begin examining a more practical and relevant program such as Constellation.

That sums it up for me, and every other space enthusiast I know. Then we have rdean step in and try to sell that this is a big deal, and that it is the next step on the way to Mars. What are we supposed to learn my going to an asteroid? We already know we can get into space, stay there a couple of weeks, and come back. Unless that asteroid turns out to be a monolith it won't be worth the effort.

If we go to the moon and set up an exploration/manufacturing facility we could go to the asteroid, ship it to the moon, and mine it for materials to get to Mars, or anywhere else we want to go. Instead we will let Russia, Japan, China, and everyone else in the world who wants to go, beat us into space.