Constitution says preemptive pardons are invalid

[ThisIsMe]

When they could be convicted of something.

What "could" they be convicted of?

 

[ThisIsMe]

Bannon.

But Bannon was convicted though.

 

[Marener]

But Bannon was convicted though.

He was facing trial for his fraud with the charity when Trump pardoned him for that. He was convicted later of contempt of congress after Trump left office.

Also technically Flynn, who was trying o withdraw his guilty plea and hadn’t been sentenced.

 

[ThisIsMe]

He was facing trial for his fraud with the charity when Trump pardoned him for that. He was convicted later of contempt of congress after Trump left office.

Also technically Flynn, who was trying o withdraw his guilty plea and hadn’t been sentenced.

Steve Bannon released from prison after 4-month sentence

Firebrand right-wing influencer Steve Bannon served a four-month sentence for defying a subpoena from a congressional committee that investigated the Jan. 6, 2021 attack on the U.S. Capitol.

www.cbsnews.com

Bannon was previously convicted in a similar federal case in 2020 but was later pardoned by Trump in one of his final acts as president.

Again, Flynn was convicted, right. ?

 

[Marener]

Steve Bannon released from prison after 4-month sentence

Firebrand right-wing influencer Steve Bannon served a four-month sentence for defying a subpoena from a congressional committee that investigated the Jan. 6, 2021 attack on the U.S. Capitol.

www.cbsnews.com

Again, Flynn was convicted, right. ?

I’m sure that article is mistaken.

Bannon’s pardon was especially notable given that the prosecution was still in its early stages and any trial was months away. Whereas pardon recipients are conventionally thought of as defendants who have faced justice, often by having served at least some prison time, the pardon nullifies the prosecution and effectively eliminates any prospect for punishment.

Trump pardons ex-strategist Steve Bannon, dozens of others

WASHINGTON (AP) — President Donald Trump pardoned former chief strategist Steve Bannon in the final hours of his White House term as part of a flurry of clemency action that benefited more than 140 people, including rap performers, ex-members of Congress and other allies of him and his family.

apnews.com

 

[Captain Caveman]

If someone is wrongfully convicted, how can they be pardoned if they committed no "offense"?

Pardons are to correct an injustice. So in your example, the injustice was being convicted without committing an offense.

 

[ThisIsMe]

I’m sure that article is mistaken.

Bannon’s pardon was especially notable given that the prosecution was still in its early stages and any trial was months away. Whereas pardon recipients are conventionally thought of as defendants who have faced justice, often by having served at least some prison time, the pardon nullifies the prosecution and effectively eliminates any prospect for punishment.

Trump pardons ex-strategist Steve Bannon, dozens of others

WASHINGTON (AP) — President Donald Trump pardoned former chief strategist Steve Bannon in the final hours of his White House term as part of a flurry of clemency action that benefited more than 140 people, including rap performers, ex-members of Congress and other allies of him and his family.

apnews.com

Probably so, still, preemptive pardons are extremely rare, and not what the presidential pardon was meant for. They didn't intend on it being "you are pardoned for whatever crimes you may or may not have committed for the last 10 years". Not sure it works that way.

 

[IDIOCRACY]

Yup....show me the person, and I'll show you the crime.
Right out of 'Marxist 101'. Right up IM2stupid's alley.

You're wrong.......It's IM#2

 

[westwall]

The constitution says that people can't be investigated for no reason also.

True, but democrats did it all the time.

 

[OKTexas]

Mick Mulvaney just said the swampiest thing ever
"If you were a lobbyist who never gave us money, I didn't talk to you. If you were a lobbyist who gave us money, I might talk to you." - Mick Mulvaney

And your point would be???????????

.

 

[Nostra]

pursuit is not the same as pardoning them,,

from you trying to spin the topic tells me you have nothing,,

Moroner has never had anything.

 

[WEATHER53]

Pardons are to correct an injustice. So in your example, the injustice was being convicted without committing an offense.

Yes
To correct and injustice. Nixon was for the Nation. This is for Joes peeps.

 

[ColonelAngus]

Great info from Barnes on the pardons.

 

[scruffy]

I agree. This whole line of thinking that Biden's pardons aren't legal is just stupid.

They're legal, but they're not good optics.

The Dems had to be awful damn scared to spend that much political capital.

 

[Foxfyre]

Nixon had three charges leveled against him!!!

No. Documents show a grand jury could/might have indicted him for three crimes but he was never officially charged with a crime.

 

[Nobody911]

The whole idea of a preemptive pardon is nonsense. Like talking about a non-deadly murder.

What The Founders Would Say About Biden And Trump's Pardons

In four years, Biden used his Article 2, Section 2 powers more than 8,064 times.

thefederalist.com

lol. If Trump wants to use Biden's pardons to put someone in jail, he will probably fail. He should find other ways.

The U.S. Constitution does not explicitly state that preemptive pardons are invalid. Article II, Section 2 grants the president broad powers to issue pardons for federal offenses, without specifying that a person must be convicted or charged beforehand[1][2]. Supreme Court rulings support the notion that pardons can be issued before legal proceedings occur, as long as they pertain to offenses against the United States[4][5]. Thus, preemptive pardons are constitutional, although their use may raise ethical and political questions[3][7].

sources:
[1] Why have Joe Biden’s preemptive pardons caused such a stir? A president’s pardoning power has few limits
[2] Presidential pardons: Settled Law, unsettled issues, and a downside for Trump
[3] The presidential pardon power, explained
[4] Ask Jordan: Are pre-emptive pardons constitutional?
[5] Overview of Pardon Power
[6] How does the president grant pardons under the Constitution? | Constitution Center
[7] Biden’s Preemptive Pardons Are an Unprecedented Vote of No Confidence in the New Administration
[8] Scope of the Pardon Power
[9] https://constitution.congress.gov/browse/essay/artII-S2-C1-3-1/ALDE_00013316/

The main limitations on the president's pardon power are here:

1. Scope of Offenses: The president can only grant pardons for federal offenses, not state crimes or civil matters[1][2][7].
2. Impeachment Cases: Pardons cannot be issued in cases of impeachment, preventing the president from obstructing the impeachment process[1][3][7].
3. Acceptance Requirement: A pardon must be accepted by the recipient to be effective; it can be rejected[7].
4. Conditional Limits: While conditional pardons are allowed, they cannot violate constitutional rights or serve to obstruct justice[4][5][6].

sources:
[1] Presidential pardons: Settled Law, unsettled issues, and a downside for Trump
[2] The presidential pardon power, explained
[3] https://constitution.congress.gov/browse/essay/artII-S2-C1-3-1/ALDE_00013316/
[4] Checking the Pardon Power
[5] Limiting the Pardon Power
[6] The President’s Conditional Pardon Power
[7] Federal pardons in the United States - Wikipedia
[8] Why have Joe Biden’s preemptive pardons caused such a stir? A president’s pardoning power has few limits

 

[Nostra]

To keep them from being improperly prosecuted by a corrupt DoJ.

Pardons are for people who have committed crimes against the US.

The SC has ruled accepting a pardon is an admission of guilt.

Next?

 

[hadit]

Pardons have been used to forgive someone wrongfully convicted.

Which of Quid Pro Joe's pre-emptive pardons are for wrongful convictions? I'm sure they were in the news somewhere.

 

[hadit]

The whole idea of a preemptive pardon is nonsense. Like talking about a non-deadly murder.

What The Founders Would Say About Biden And Trump's Pardons

In four years, Biden used his Article 2, Section 2 powers more than 8,064 times.

thefederalist.com

Quid Pro has just opened the door for an incoming president to issue pardons for his entire administration to shield them from investigation or prosecution.

 

[StatesRightsForever]

Pardons have been given to people because they were felt to have been innocent. Therefore, they committed no offense.

If the state thinks they are innocent they do not get a pardon; they get a reversal of conviction.