Col. Richard Black: U.S. Leading World to Nuclear War

[Ringo]

 

[gipper]

Putin may have screwed up. Had he waited a little longer and Ukraine‘s army invaded Donbass then Putin goes in, the world might look at this a bit differently.

However most Americans know nothing about the coup by Obama, Biden, and Nuland in 2014 and the murdering of 14,000 ethnic Russians in the Donbass by Ukraine since the coup. So it’s likely the western media would twist any action by Putin as bad.

 

[alexa]

So what are you afraid of? Why are you so concerned? How can you call yourself American? Americans are not cowardly, they don't lie down and let bullies have their way. If their nukes were so great and unstoppable, they would have used them by now. They hate us. If they had the power, they'd use it. If their nukes are so great, and you'd be gone in a flash, so what would you care? You wouldn't know what hit you.

I'm not afraid of anything. I know there is the possibility of nuclear extinction but then we are also sitting on that with our messing of the climate. You are the one choosing to believe my arguments are formed by fear or now cowardice. The question is what is the truth? There are two good stories being given one of which is roughly Blacks which I had just been watching and was why I was interested - what you call cowardice and the other is the propaganda the West is getting. I am not American. You claim the reason for you fighting for a country which makes no difference to you who rules it, is because you do not like Russia - no other reason. You call Russia a bully but that is it. The other argument is given by the left - I didn't listen to the end of Black so do not know if he said this but the other reason given is you, the US wanting to be sitting on and breathing down Russia's throat and that that is the reason for this war which you , the US has been pushing for from the beginning. The way you talk pushes the reason far more towards that. Russia says that that way is not a safe one for them and that is the reason for this war. In this argument far from the US being helpful to Ukraine you are using them to get what you want. You do not care at all about what happens to them apart from damaging your enemy Russia.

 

[Confederate Soldier]

I'm not afraid of anything. I know there is the possibility of nuclear extinction but then we are also sitting on that with our messing of the climate. You are the one choosing to believe my arguments are formed by fear or now cowardice. The question is what is the truth? There are two good stories being given one of which is roughly Blacks which I had just been watching and was why I was interested - what you call cowardice and the other is the propaganda the West is getting. I am not American. You claim the reason for you fighting for a country which makes no difference to you who rules it, is because you do not like Russia - no other reason. You call Russia a bully but that is it. The other argument is given by the left - I didn't listen to the end of Black so do not know if he said this but the other reason given is you, the US wanting to be sitting on and breathing down Russia's throat and that that is the reason for this war which you , the US has been pushing for from the beginning. The way you talk pushes the reason far more towards that. Russia says that that way is not a safe one for them and that is the reason for this war. In this argument far from the US being helpful to Ukraine you are using them to get what you want. You do not care at all about what happens to them apart from damaging your enemy Russia.

I know who rules my country right now, and he is an idiot. But I know what my nation stands for, and what it has done in the past. I know who Russias leader is, and I know what he has done. He is a butcher of freedom. To defeat Russia indirectly or directly, can do nothing but benefit us.

 

[alexa]

I know who rules my country right now, and he is an idiot. But I know what my nation stands for, and what it has done in the past. I know who Russias leader is, and I know what he has done. He is a butcher of freedom. To defeat Russia indirectly or directly, can do nothing but benefit us.


View attachment 651604

Why can you not see that if your country is doing what you say above, never mind Russia, you are certainly a butcher. The 'freedom' that the US has is highly questionable. You believe your country has the right to decide who is right and who is wrong and to kill as many people as you need to to get what you want. You have no ability to self reflect and see that in trying to kill a Dictator you murder possibly hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians or in this situation possible millions even human extinction. You should allow the people of the country you do not like decide for itself when it is right to free itself rather than believing that you can use their lives to try and obtain your desires.

 

[Confederate Soldier]

Why can you not see that if your country is doing what you say above, never mind Russia, you are certainly a butcher. The 'freedom' that the US has is highly questionable. You believe your country has the right to decide who is right and who is wrong and to kill as many people as you need to to get what you want. You have no ability to self reflect and see that in trying to kill a Dictator you murder possibly hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians or in this situation possible millions even human extinction. You should allow the people of the country you do not like decide for itself when it is right to free itself rather than believing that you can use their lives to try and obtain your desires.

So says you, a scotsman who still hasn't learned that theres more to life than fucking and shearing sheep.

 

[alexa]

So says you, a scotsman who still hasn't learned that theres more to life than fucking and shearing sheep.

I see incapable of discussion. When you have lost just insults. I am not a man. Your fantasies not mine.

 

[Confederate Soldier]

I see incapable of discussion. When you have lost just insults. I am not a man. Your fantasies not mine.

And yours either. Taking Russias side when Russia has historically been the enemy of all that is free shows me that you are not good to debate either.

 

[EvilCat Breath]

So what are you afraid of? Why are you so concerned? How can you call yourself American? Americans are not cowardly, they don't lie down and let bullies have their way. If their nukes were so great and unstoppable, they would have used them by now. They hate us. If they had the power, they'd use it. If their nukes are so great, and you'd be gone in a flash, so what would you care? You wouldn't know what hit you.

Americans aren't cowardly. Democrats are cowardly. They would sell us out to the nearest cartel for a kilo of meth.

Russians are better than democrats.

 

[Ringo]

I know who rules my country right now, and he is an idiot. But I know what my nation stands for, and what it has done in the past. I know who Russias leader is, and I know what he has done. He is a butcher of freedom. To defeat Russia indirectly or directly, can do nothing but benefit us.


View attachment 651604

Do you want me to throw you similar photos, only with tougher police actions, only from France or the USA, for example?
You need to squeeze out of yourself a hypocrite drop by drop

 

[sparky]

We put a highly secretive CIA special activities center—these are kind of the James Bond guys of the Central Intelligence Agency, total Machiavellian; they will do anything, there’s no it’s no holds barred with these guys

those guys sure get around!

~S~

 

[JoeB131]

Wow, this is how you can tell the war is going badly for Putin when he tries to claim he didn't start it.

 

[Confederate Soldier]

Americans aren't cowardly. Democrats are cowardly. They would sell us out to the nearest cartel for a kilo of meth.

Russians are better than democrats.

So Murdering political opposition and jailing all political protestors/opponents is somehow better than being a democrat?

 

[EvilCat Breath]

So Murdering political opposition and jailing all political protestors/opponents is somehow better than being a democrat?

That IS being a democrat.

 

[badbob85037]

Nuclear weapons have a shelf life. Do you really think this third world country has been updating their nukes?

 

[alexa]

And yours either. Taking Russias side when Russia has historically been the enemy of all that is free shows me that you are not good to debate either.

I didn't take Russia's side at all. I just told you that there are two versions of events one which I have seen from the left of the US and is spoken about in this thread or another and another which is the propaganda we get in the West. Your belief that you have put several times is that we are fighting this war simply because your country does not like Russia and so that is the right thing to do. Your stance shows a total lack of morality.

 

[para bellum]

I didn't take Russia's side at all. I just told you that there are two versions of events one which I have seen from the left of the US and is spoken about in this thread or another and another which is the propaganda we get in the West. Your belief that you have put several times is that we are fighting this war simply because your country does not like Russia and so that is the right thing to do. Your stance shows a total lack of morality.

Well, yes you do take the Russian side when you push the Russian narrative that this is a NATO war, and call the US "butchers".

Look at some aerial views of Popasna, Lyman, Rubizhne. Those people have been "liberated". You think they are happy now?

There are not "two versions" of events. There is only one, and that is what's really happening. Russia is raping Ukraine, full stop. There is no alternate version. Maybe you are trying not to see, I don't know.

And "we" are not fighting this war. Ukraine is doing the fighting. The Western aid provided to Ukraine so far does not even replace their losses. If Ukraine can hold on for another month, the trajectory will shift in their favor- the pipeline is full now and reserve brigades are forming up. But it's going to get worse for Ukraine before it gets better because the West has been too stingy, and slow to step up to the plate.

I do not care if Ukraine is "corrupt" at the moment. All those former WarPac countries are going through transformation and that takes time.

The people living in those cities are not to blame- they are regular ordinary people who just want to go about their lives. But their towns are bombed to the foundations and depopulated because Putin thought he could exploit the weakness and division in the West.

It may still turn out that he was correct.

 

[Ringo]

Look at some aerial views of Popasna, Lyman, Rubizhne. Those people have been "liberated". You think they are happy now?

It is Dresden, 1945. You think they were happy being liberated?

 

[alexa]

Well, yes you do take the Russian side when you push the Russian narrative that this is a NATO war, and call the US "butchers".

Look at some aerial views of Popasna, Lyman, Rubizhne. Those people have been "liberated". You think they are happy now?

There are not "two versions" of events. There is only one, and that is what's really happening. Russia is raping Ukraine, full stop. There is no alternate version. Maybe you are trying not to see, I don't know.

You need to take the word 'butchered' within context which you have not done.

And "we" are not fighting this war. Ukraine is doing the fighting.

That depends on how you look at it. Would the US be providing for Ukraine if it did not want it to fight the war? Of course not. Could Ukraine fight this war without the aid of weapons coming again and again and again. Despite their well recognised skill and valour of course not. Are Ukrainians doing the physical fighting - yes but they are not the only people. Is their country being totally destroyed. Yes. Is this what they knew would happen?

The Western aid provided to Ukraine so far does not even replace their losses. If Ukraine can hold on for another month, the trajectory will shift in their favor- the pipeline is full now and reserve brigades are forming up. But it's going to get worse for Ukraine before it gets better because the West has been too stingy, and slow to step up to the plate.

I do not care if Ukraine is "corrupt" at the moment. All those former WarPac countries are going through transformation and that takes time.

If you don't care if Ukraine is corrupt. What are you wanting them fighting and killed for.

The people living in those cities are not to blame- they are regular ordinary people who just want to go about their lives. But their towns are bombed to the foundations and depopulated because Putin thought he could exploit the weakness and division in the West.

Was not all that was needed from Ukraine to avoid the war an agreement not to join nato and to be a neutral country - something which Zelensky promised within two or three weeks of war. You say' Putin believed that he could exploit the weakness and division in the West.' So basically you appear to be saying exactly what I said before. This is a war between the West and Russia. That is all you have mentioned. No reasons at all why Ukraine might feel a need to go to war with Russia.

Para bellum

It may still turn out that he was correct.

 

[para bellum]

You need to take the word 'butchered' within context which you have not done.

The context is your post. You accuse us of killing as many people as we need to get what we want. That we can decide what is right or wrong, and we murdered (or are in the process of murdering) hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians and possibly extincting the human race.

That is complete bullshit. Do you know the last time the US used an unguided munition in battle? It was 2004.

We do not target civilians, and we make every effort to avoid civilian casualties. We blew up an ISIS cement factory in the middle of the night, because we wanted the workers to be at home in bed.

Russia has been indiscriminately bombing Ukrainian cities and residential areas for 3 months now.

Did you look at the aerial photos of those places? There is nothing to go back to.

"Why can you not see that if your country is doing what you say above, never mind Russia, you are certainly a butcher. The 'freedom' that the US has is highly questionable. You believe your country has the right to decide who is right and who is wrong and to kill as many people as you need to to get what you want. You have no ability to self reflect and see that in trying to kill a Dictator you murder possibly hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians or in this situation possible millions even human extinction. You should allow the people of the country you do not like decide for itself when it is right to free itself rather than believing that you can use their lives to try and obtain your desires."

If you don't care if Ukraine is corrupt. What are you wanting them fighting and killed for.

If they don't want to fight for their freedom they are free to surrender to Russia. I want the decision to be theirs, and not have it imposed on them at the barrel of a gun.

They made the decision, not us. We offered to evacuate Zelensky on Feb 25. He declined in no uncertain terms, and his people rallied behind him.

HE turned to the west for HELP- this is not the west forcing him into a war.

Yes, I support giving them whatever they need to win. I would not hesitate to give them longer range and more powerful weapons to strike deep into Russia. Russians should feel the hurt of this war just as much as Ukrainians are made to.

Was not all that was needed from Ukraine to avoid the war an agreement not to join nato and to be a neutral country - something which Zelensky promised within two or three weeks of war.

That was not all that was was needed. Putin's demands also included the removal of the NATO security umbrella over Southern Europe and the Balts.

Russia does not get a vote in NATO's alliances, or dictate who can or cannot be a member.

NATO for Ukraine was off the table in 2014 when Russia annexed Crimea. Putin was completely aware of that. The only way NATO would even consider membership for Ukraine would have been if Zelensky had recognized Crimea and the L/DNR's as Russian territory.

Ukraine is a sovereign nation and is entitled to a say in their own security alliances.

You know what? I don't think their #1 threat does, or should have a say.

You say' Putin believed that he could exploit the weakness and division in the West.' So basically you appear to be saying exactly what I said before. This is a war between the West and Russia. That is all you have mentioned. No reasons at all why Ukraine might feel a need to go to war with Russia.

I said we are not fighting in this war. Putin started it, not the West. I'm saying the weakness and division in the west emboldens him. And he has good reason to think that way.

Ukraine did not "feel the need" to go to war with Russia. The need was impressed upon them when 100,000 Russian soldiers rolled into their country in tanks and armored vehicles, and Russian cruise missiles started raining down on Ukrainian cities.

You want to cede Ukraine and hope Putin will be happy? He might not want to do Poland next? Maybe just a "piece"? For a "buffer"? You know, to protect Russia from "NATO agression"?