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Christianity's single requirement and Islam's plenty

ding

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Wrong. Much can be learned about God by men seeking God. We can learn about God through his creation.
Got some examples to share?
Sure. You ever created anything? Can I use that creation to learn things about you?
You're describing science but science tells us nothing that is in the Bible.
I’m not describing science, and I’m not discussing what’s in the Bible either.

I am telling you that much can be learned about God by examining his creation like I could learn about you by examining your creations.

You asked for an example and I am using your experiences as an example.
Well I have studied the world we live in and I can tell you that, if there is a God, he set up time, space, and the forces of nature. Period. End of story.
Seems like more than enough to me.
 

Hawkins

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What humans don't understand is the process of human witnessing. Mohammad didn't make a difference.
To simply put, all God's OT prophets are eyewitnesses of God. That's significant on how human witnessing works at all. Mohammad is a copycat without knowing the big picture. he thought that hearing from an claimed angel did the job.
 

Avatar4321

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When the people asked the Apostles what they should do in response to their preaching, Peter responded:

“Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

“For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.” Acts 2:38-39

I don’t know all things but that verse mentions more than one thing
 

ABikerSailor

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You're ignorant about Christian and Jewish tenents. Judaism is especially abundant in strict rules to live by... to a crazy degree.

If you are talking about the 613 Mitzvoh, those are rules for a healthy community, and while it applies to everyone, not everyone has to follow all of the same rules. Sure, there are specific ones that apply to all members of the community, but then there are some that apply to only the butchers, some that apply to only rabbis, some that apply to only women, etc.

No. One person doesn't follow all 613 rules.
 

karpenter

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What humans don't understand is the process of human witnessing. Mohammad didn't make a difference.
To simply put, all God's OT prophets are eyewitnesses of God. That's significant on how human witnessing works at all. Mohammad is a copycat without knowing the big picture. he thought that hearing from an claimed angel did the job.
Anyone With A Reasonable Knowledge
Of The Story Of Mohammed
Only Has To Ponder:

If Mohammed Is Telling The Truth
Then All Other Hebrew Prophets, Including Jesus
Are Liars
OR:
If The Hebrew Prophets, Hand Picked By God Himself
Are Telling The Truth
Then Mohammed Stands Alone As A False Prophet
A Charlatan, The Mouth-Piece Of The Deceiver

Mohammed Never Claims God Ever Spoke Directly To Him
 

Shusha

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We don't know if he will or will not, or what his standards are. His holiness is somewhat---arbitrary. Right? This is what I'm understanding. Because Allah can accept less than perfectly holy people into his presence.

In Christianity, ... any sin eliminates your chance of being with a perfectly Holy God forever--that is, in Heaven with that perfectly Holy God. So, in that state, we were doomed.

I'd disagree that the standards of behavior for acceptance by G-d within Islam are arbitrary. From the OP, it seems clear that the standards are quite explicit. They just don't require absolute perfection. At least, if I understand it correctly. That is not the same meaning as arbitrary.

If I was to sum-up each faith (entirely unfair and without nuance, but what can you do on a thread like this?)

Judaism claims that each soul is a spark of G-d and thus we can never, ever be truly and permanently cut off from Him. Repentance, return, repair are always possible.

Christianity claims that a single sin, even the most minor, even the sin of just being human, cuts us off permanently from Him and without JC's sacrifice we would all be lost.

Islam claims that there is some middle ground between the two extremes.

Does that seem close enough?
 

karpenter

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Shusha said:
Islam claims that there is some middle ground between the two extremes.
Islam Says Martyrdom Is The Only Guarantee Of Paradise
Even Mohammed Didn't Know If He Would Make It
I Don't Know Enough To Tell You
Where Islam Stands On The Forgiveness Sins

Seventy-Two Virgins:

33os60m.jpg
 

karpenter

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So Mohammed Was Watching The Battle
He Grabbed Some Of The Original Reciters
To Protect Himself From The Hail Of Arrows
That Cut Down All Those Around Him

I Guess Mo Wasn't Big On His Own Martyrdom

Thinking Of Which
All Those Original Reciters Were Lost
Yet All Muslims Will Tell You Their Word Is Un-Broken
It Is The Bible That Has Been Corrupted Over Time

Illiterates Judging Dedicated Hebrew Scribes
 

Iamartiewhitefox

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Stay away from Islam. It, and the tree God told Adam and Eve to stay away from, are the same. Muslims paradise is Satan's prison. A holding pen for final judgment:

1 Peter 3:19-2019 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;​

20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

King James Version
 

Iamartiewhitefox

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I’m not describing science, and I’m not discussing what’s in the Bible either.

I am telling you that much can be learned about God by examining his creation like I could learn about you by examining your creations.

You asked for an example and I am using your experiences as an example.
Sodomites were easily inflamed when Lot did not let one person judge the two beings in Lots house. God did not save lot from sex when Sodomites wanted to do worse to Lot than the two beings in Lots house. Genisis 19:9 KJV old Scofield Study Bible. The church made the Leftist socialists' people. 2 Peter 2:7 - 8 , God saved Lot from people who had froward unfriendly speech - filthy conversation. They were defiled religious people. Lies made the left to be the way they are.
 

Iamartiewhitefox

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So in Islam, if you just TRY REALLY HARD, I mean really hard, your entire life, or who knows how long, or how hard, Allah might accept you into Heaven. We don't know if he will or will not, or what his standards are. His holiness is somewhat---arbitrary. Right? This is what I'm understanding. Because Allah can accept less than perfectly holy people into his presence. I don't understand how this works.

This is not the case in Christianity.

In Christianity, our supremely Holy God, whose Holiness is not mitigated and can NEVER ever be attained by us, not now or ever, no matter how hard or long we try, is not arbitrary.

It is perfect Holiness. And perfect Holiness cannot accept into its presence less than perfect Holiness, because Holiness is also perfectly just. It cannot wave its hand at any sin, any injustice, and say, "well, you tried REALLY HARD, so okay."

Nope. EVERY sin, any sin eliminates your chance of being with a perfectly Holy God forever--that is, in Heaven with that perfectly Holy God. So, in that state, we were doomed.

But God is loving, and He is merciful. Thus, Jesus Christ, His only Son, stood in our place as a substitute for our sin. A sacrifice, an atonement that God will accept. He suffered the punishment, we reap the benefit. The penalty is paid, thus Justice is served.

None of this is true in Islam. I don't know how you pay penalty for sins, or how God forgives them, and how this is just. Allah is arbitrary. And that's how it is.
Devils believe, and tremble. They that tremble will hurt others wanting them to tremble with fear giving laws. They try to see when Jesus will come back, always being wrong. Jesus saves us by living in us, talking through us.
 

Votto

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Muslims, looking at Christianity, can't help but feel embarrassment because of the great oddness of Christianity.

Christianity has one requirement to reach heaven: to believe in Jesus as the God Who died for the people to be saved.

On the other hand, Islam has many requirements to reach heaven. There are 3 types of requirements: some pertain to what one believes (God, angels, Prophets, revealed books, Day of Judgment, etc...), some pertain to what worship one does and how (5 daily prayers, fasting, pilgrimage in Mecca, mandatory alms-giving, regular remembrance and mention of God, etc...), some pertain to having and keeping a pure heart (not to hate anyone, to love everyone and every living thing, not to lie, not to cheat, not to deceive, not to come against anyone, to love God, to fear God, to hope in God, to trust in God, to dedicate oneself to God, to live for God, and for His beloved Prophet and favourite friend, Muhammad, peace be upon him, etc...)

The first thing asked of a Muslim is to seek knowledge. Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "to seek knowledge is mandatory for every Muslim". Islam goes by its scholars. Islamic libraries are filled with tons and tons of books. All these books are explaining the Qur'an and the Hadiths (the Hadiths are the sayings of Muhammad, peace be upon him). The Muslim must learn these books and acquire knowledge, that is mandatory and the first requirement. Maybe the most famous and the greatest of all the books of Islam is the Ihya Ulum Id Din of Abu Hamid Al Ghazali, perhaps the greatest theologian and scholar of the history of Islam, and who has been nicknamed Hujjat Al Islam (Proof of Islam).

And then Islam would be a ''cult'', and Christianity or Judaism would be the ''religions''. Perhaps, you may now realise how insane this sounds.

Islam is about its Ulama and Awliya (scholars and saints): Rumi, Ibn Arabi (of 12th century Muslim Spain), Saadi, Hafiz, Al Ghazali, etc. Some are specialised in the Sharia (the Divine Islamic Law): Imam Shafi, Imam Malik, Imam Abou Hanifa, Imam Ahmad Hanbal, etc.

Islam is not a "cult''. It is a religion. Muhammad (peace be upon him) is not a "highly intelligent" leader, he is a divine prophet of God. Jesus was, (peace be upon him), and Abraham was (peace be upon him), Moses was (peace be upon him), Noah was (peace be upon him), Joseph was (peace be upon him and his family) and many others, numbering 124 000, (peace be upon them all). But I don't think Christianity or Judaism teaches any of that.
Well see here is the thing, Christianity teaches that salvation is a gift from God and all that is required is faith in what God has already done for us.

All other religions teach that salvation is earned by what you do. The focus is how great you are instead of how great God is. You just hope the good outweighs the bad is all.

One gives peace while the other religions give an ulcer and/or pride and arrogance
 

Iamartiewhitefox

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Well see here is the thing, Christianity teaches that salvation is a gift from God and all that is required is faith in what God has already done for us.

All other religions teach that salvation is earned by what you do. The focus is how great you are instead of how great God is. You just hope the good outweighs the bad is all.

One gives peace while the other religions give an ulcer and/or pride and arrogance
Notice the word "gift". We have pay a price. God gives gifts. God's mind needs to be in our mind. Satan says pay a price. Free cannot exist, when money exists. Free existed in the USA, when Indians were there. We need God talking through people world wide. Faith will be seen when money is gone, giving gifts to each other. Many will know what that gift will be. Others will seek and find. Jamies 1:26 - 27, KJV is talking about different religions? The church is blind. We obtain salvation by what Jesus does through us. They that think what they do will say: Lord, Lord we cast out Devils in your name. Accept us. Jesus will not know them. Good outweighs the bad? Good displaces bad. False belife systems are they that give good spirited people ulcers. Those false belief systems say fear me, comforting no one. Those false belief systems want the world to not be like the gift giving Lord God. The giving we have now is Satan's form of, this is what another person does not want. You are beneath them, unable to buy thngs.
 
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Iamartiewhitefox

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The Thing About The Interpretation Of Prophecy
Is People Interpret It In Different Ways
So One Group's Opinion Is No Better Than Any Others
...But Thanx

Mohammed, By His Own Admission
To The Christians And Jews Of His Time
Still Does Not Pass Scriptural Muster As A Prophet
Puss in Boots. That is the truth. Muhammad is not a prophet.
 

surada

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Yet you believe the same God that created Judaism and Christianity created Islam. Are you embarrassed by God's work?


Yet none of God's previous messengers mentioned 5 daily prayers (or pilgrimage in Mecca) or most requirements of Islam. Same eternal God but different rules?

Do you think God created religions?
 

surada

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Yet you believe the same God that created Judaism and Christianity created Islam. Are you embarrassed by God's work?


Yet none of God's previous messengers mentioned 5 daily prayers (or pilgrimage in Mecca) or most requirements of Islam. Same eternal God but different rules?

Many of Muhmmed's sermons begin this way: "Save yourselves. I cannot save you. Return to the God of Abraham."
 

surada

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The Thing About The Interpretation Of Prophecy
Is People Interpret It In Different Ways
So One Group's Opinion Is No Better Than Any Others
...But Thanx

Mohammed, By His Own Admission
To The Christians And Jews Of His Time
Still Does Not Pass Scriptural Muster As A Prophet

Muhammed is a messenger not a fortune teller. They had schools for prophets in Israel.
 

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