China Fears North Korea US Conflict At Any Moment

[JimBowie1958]

What has he done that Obama hadn't?

Tweeted

Not just Tweeting but Extreme Tweeting.

Better than Obama's bleeting.

 

[toomuchtime_]

China has warned that "conflict could break out at any moment" as tension over North Korea increases.

Foreign Minister Wang Yi said if war occurred there could be no winner.

Mr Wang's comments come as the US voices increasing concern at North Korea's development of nuclear weapons and deploys a Navy carrier group off the Korean peninsula.

China fears North Korea-US conflict 'at any moment' - BBC News

Amazing isn't it?

Trump has managed to bring both our relations with both Russia and North Korea to the most unstable in decades- in only 3 months.

I'm not sure Trump is to blame for North Korea. It was ready to explode before he arrived. He is doing the same thing Obama did--trying to get China to do something about it. What has he done that Obama hadn't?

What President Trump did was excuse himself from lunch with President Xi, saying, "I'm so sorry but I have to go bomb Syria now because they didn't do what I told them to do. You do understand what I'm saying, don't you?" to get China to take him seriously.

 

[Care4all]

I worry about the 20-25k U.S.military in South Korea

 

[toomuchtime_]

I worry about the 20-25k U.S.military in South Korea

And not at all about the Koreans?

 

[JimBowie1958]

How are their subs going to get here? Ship themselves by UPS?

Well I would guess that they would come underwater propelled by their engines, Admiral.

Resupply ships are not exactly advanced technology, and the US navy apparently is not worried about them and does not track them because, in theory, they have short range.

 

[imawhosure]

Yeah, no shit. I can see the South Koreans now:

"HEY. We're right here. WE'RE RIGHT HERE. They've got a bunch of fucking CANNONS pointed at us and these people are not exactly STABLE. If you like your fucking Samsung teevees and cell phones, you had better REMEMBER that we're RIGHT FUCKING HERE."
.

Given the proper timing and coordination, our Air Force could easily take out 99% of NK's assets on the ground and most of their sea assets also.

I am worried that they may have a few submarines off our coast with suicide crews to detonate atomic bombs within their subs near American cities.

The water vapor would be radioactive and would contaminate large areas of the West Coast.

The NK does not have the technology to mask their submarines. They are not Russia, nor even China. If our military doesn't know exactly where they are, then they are asleep at the wheel.

By the way, I wonder how many people would insist upon keeping our borders unguarded, IF we took out the NK and they wanted retaliation. That is not a political question, it is an AMERICAN question! Maybe the Trump wall would become more popular in the blue states, but one never knows!

 

[Care4all]

I worry about the 20-25k U.S.military in South Korea

And not at all about the Koreans?

I didn't say that...?

 

[idb]

How are their subs going to get here? Ship themselves by UPS?

Well I would guess that they would come underwater propelled by their engines, Admiral.

Resupply ships are not exactly advanced technology, and the US navy apparently is not worried about them and does not track them because, in theory, they have short range.

This is such an educational thread!

 

[Dragonlady]

I cannot believe you people are discussing invading yet another nation. This is the same kind of shit that got you in trouble in Iraq.

The Chinese have a history and a treaty with North Korea. They are treaty bound to defend N. Korea, and they would lose face with their allies if they don't.

So if you think the Chinese will stand idly by and let the US attack N. Korea - think again.

Less than 100 days it took Trump to go from an isolationist, to dropping bombs on three countries. This isn't a foreign policy. This is insanity.

 

[JimBowie1958]

How are their subs going to get here? Ship themselves by UPS?

Well I would guess that they would come underwater propelled by their engines, Admiral.

Resupply ships are not exactly advanced technology, and the US navy apparently is not worried about them and does not track them because, in theory, they have short range.

This is such and educational thread!

Remember the lost NK submarine a few years ago, or when NK sent out 50 submarines and know one knew where they went?

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

How are their subs going to get here? Ship themselves by UPS?

Well I would guess that they would come underwater propelled by their engines, Admiral.

Resupply ships are not exactly advanced technology, and the US navy apparently is not worried about them and does not track them because, in theory, they have short range.

This is such and educational thread!

Remember the lost NK submarine a few years ago, or when NK sent out 50 submarines and know one knew where they went?

Nobody cared either.

These rust buckets were designed in the 1940s and they are not likely to be capable of a trans'Pacific crossing by any stretch of the imagination.

 

[Flopper]

Can't they evacuate Seoul? If I lived there, I'd be on the road yesterday.

The word is that Japan is making plans to evacuate it's citizens that are in South Korea.

Japan discusses how to evacuate citizens from South Korea if crisis hits

Japan is also preparing to do another evacuation drill itself.

Japan to conduct evacuation drill to prepare for North Korea missiles

Glad to hear it. Seoul should be doing the same.

Strangely most of South Korea doesn't seem to be freaking out, experts also say that Seoul opposes any unilateral action from America.

Seoul to oppose unilateral US action

"WASHINGTON D.C. ― South Korea will oppose any unilateral U.S. military action against North Korea which U.S. President Donald Trump says is "looking for trouble," according to leading U.S. experts.

While Trump has said the U.S. will solve the problem of North Korea on its own unless China helps, analysts said that any U.S. action against the North should be based on a prior agreement with Seoul.

"Seoul will oppose any unilateral military action plan by the United States against North Korea," said Scott Snyder, director of the Program on US-Korea Policy at the Council of Foreign Relations, in a recent interview with the Medill News Service."

Here's the rest of the article.

'Seoul to oppose unilateral US action'

Of course they oppose unilateral action by the U.S. We know Seoul will be targeted immediately, before our bombs can stop him, apparently. China doesn't want a mess of NK refugees, either. So they push for negotiations. I have nothing at all against trying, and I hope Trump is listening. If we do something without their blessing, it is going to cause quite the mess once the fun part of blowing holes in NK is over.

Yeah, no shit. I can see the South Koreans now:

"HEY. We're right here. WE'RE RIGHT HERE. They've got a bunch of fucking CANNONS pointed at us and these people are not exactly STABLE. If you like your fucking Samsung teevees and cell phones, you had better REMEMBER that we're RIGHT FUCKING HERE."
.

The word is that Japan is making plans to evacuate it's citizens that are in South Korea.

Japan discusses how to evacuate citizens from South Korea if crisis hits

Japan is also preparing to do another evacuation drill itself.

Japan to conduct evacuation drill to prepare for North Korea missiles

Glad to hear it. Seoul should be doing the same.

Strangely most of South Korea doesn't seem to be freaking out, experts also say that Seoul opposes any unilateral action from America.

Seoul to oppose unilateral US action

"WASHINGTON D.C. ― South Korea will oppose any unilateral U.S. military action against North Korea which U.S. President Donald Trump says is "looking for trouble," according to leading U.S. experts.

While Trump has said the U.S. will solve the problem of North Korea on its own unless China helps, analysts said that any U.S. action against the North should be based on a prior agreement with Seoul.

"Seoul will oppose any unilateral military action plan by the United States against North Korea," said Scott Snyder, director of the Program on US-Korea Policy at the Council of Foreign Relations, in a recent interview with the Medill News Service."

Here's the rest of the article.

'Seoul to oppose unilateral US action'

Of course they oppose unilateral action by the U.S. We know Seoul will be targeted immediately, before our bombs can stop him, apparently. China doesn't want a mess of NK refugees, either. So they push for negotiations. I have nothing at all against trying, and I hope Trump is listening. If we do something without their blessing, it is going to cause quite the mess once the fun part of blowing holes in NK is over.

A full blown war between the koreas would be a catastrophe costing millions of lives and leaving both countries devastated and unsettling the region. So if military force is to be used, which I strongly doubt, there would seem to be only two options, either launch surgical strikes that would take out key elements of NK's nuclear or missile programs or other high value targets or obliterate NK in a preemptive strike. I'm not sure the first option would have a desirable long term effect but the second option would settle the issue once and forever.

Everyone on this board needs to realize that NK has to be dealt with, before they have the means to deliver nukes to the West coast or you and your country is going to be held hostage. This mess was created by BOTH party's Presidents and; the only reason NK was not dealt with before by those Presidents was its cozy relationship with China. I have little doubt that most of the Presidents from EITHER party who held the office once the NK got close to a nuke would have done a preemptive strike of non-nuclear weapons were it not for the Chinese.

We now have a very short time before the NK can hit the West coast. The person on that button kills his uncles with artillery shells for show, and assassinates his 1/2 brother. You think he gives a damn about you, your children, or grandchildren; or even human life!

How many here do NOT want a peaceful solution to the problem? Can I see a show of hands!

That is what I thought, 99.9% of us want a peaceful solution. Much of this debate is misguided. It is not about we want, or do not want war; it is about if we are willing to let a person or regime like this have the capability of hitting the West coast with a nuke soon, and the rest of the country soon after. How far are you willing to go to stop him, or are you of the mindset that we shouldn't do a thing. And then, a week after NK has that missile with a nuke, Iran has it also since they are helping fund the research.

I urge everyone to understand the reality---------->this regime constantly insists it wants to kill YOU, because YOU are an American. Same with Iran. Do you actually believe that if their agents captured you, they would kiss you because you are a pacifist?

Like or hate Trump, he is going to have to deal with it, or very soon your life is going to change. How many of you were alive when Kennedy shut down the missiles in Cuba? Kids had to be taught how to hide under their desks in school, and the truth was, it was just for reassurance; they were DEAD if nukes flew in. Do you want that power in the FATBOY's hands? The Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marines will not be able to save you from a missile with a nuke on it, if it goes off in your city. Your children and grandchildren will cease to exist if it is near them, and you survive! What would be your answer then? How many of you would want to face life without either your children, or grandchildren........because FATBOY thinks he is invincible; even if we incinerated him and his regime in retaliation?

Peaceful solution? Yes! But only if it is really a solution instead of just kicking the can the last 2 feet to what is really the end of the road. For those of you who despise liberals, and those of you who despise Republicans; wait and see how you feel when FATBOY or IRAN tells you to poop, how high, and what color; or they are going to incinerate LA or San Fran! At that time, your carrier group means squat, cause they will start fueling their missiles, and our government will see it by satellite. That means, we either give them their way, or one or more of our cities are coming down.

So then, regardless of the way we must FORCE a solution, are you SURE you want to wait for 6 more months, or a year! Do you want an American President from ANY party have to make the decision to sacrifice one of our major cities to defeat these people? Because we all know, that America will not shoot off the 1st nuke. This means 1 of our cities; if not more will fall before we shut them down with a strike of our own. Which city are you willing to gamble with? That is the question of our time, and like or hate Trump, you better pray to your God for his infinite wisdom!

I think Russia is most likely to align itself with North Korea in a military conflict just as they did in 1950 but China is likely to remain mostly neutral. North Korea has listed Russia as it's most friendly ally for 3 years, not China. Russia has recently written off 90% of the North Korean debt and trade with Russia has been increasing for several years. Russia involvement would raise the stakes considerably but it might lower the chances of nuclear exchange.

One big difference between a military conflict today and 1950 is the US is going it alone so far. In the Korean War, the US supplied only 1/3 of the military personnel.

 

[imawhosure]

A missile attack on NK probably means that Seoul is toast.

I have a feeling that there will be a war with 24 hrs. I also believe that the Pentagon has thoroughly thought this through and has more than a few surprises for N. Korea. This will probably be the shortest war in history.

Under estimating North Korea is a big mistake. You can bomb them to hell and back and the only way you will beat them is troops on the ground. They have a huge military for the size of the country and practically nothing else. Their GDP is 25 billion. By comparison the US spends three times that on just food stamps and 50 times that on defense. NK starves the people to feed the army. The population is 24 million and 10% are either active duty, about 1.1 million, in the reserves, or civilians working for the military. It is a military state which has been at war with the United States for over 60 years. In the Korean War the US and it's allies had a military force of a million troops in the war and after nearly 3 years, we were only able to negotiated an armistice put no peace treaty.

"You can bomb them to hell and back and the only way you will beat them is troops on the ground."

There would be 0 support for putting Western nations troops on the ground in North Korea, if it came to that the Chinese would have to go in and put troops on the ground.

But this is of course the same with nearly all war situations, no war has ever been won from the air, you always have to put ground troops in.

I will tell you both this-----------> if the Chinese nod yes under a deal..............if Trump and his generals believe there is an 80% chance they can take out the nukes in a 1st strike, then the decision is done if a peaceful solution is not forthcoming. Without their nukes and Chinese help, the NK is done!

If those things are not in place, then it will drag to the very last minute before a decision is made. Again I say, pray for wisdom on this one, because it is going to shape your life if they choose wrong throughout your lifetime, and probably all of your immediate family too.

Both sides have been preparing for war for so long that a first strike would have to take out far more then NK's nuclear program to prevent a Korean war that would devastate both countries killing millions. If we launch a preemptive strike against NK, we must aim to take out much more than just their nuclear program; we must take out their whole ability to make war and that will mean most of the infrastructure of the country, military and civilian would have to be destroyed.

In a modern war, it is apparent no country can stand against us without a nuke. The only way we could lose a war, is by not being committed to win it. How committed would the United States be? That is a political question!

99 times out of 100, before war, we begin to see the reasons, propaganda, excuses, reasoning, theories, of why we must fight this war. If this war is without nukes, (please God) and the Koreas were to be united, then the South Koreans would have responsibility to take care of the aftermath.

I am telling you that it is 10 weeks tops with no nukes before it is a clean up operation. For crying out loud, you could STARVE them out while just holding the line if you wanted to be PC as long as China agreed.

Without nukes or China, fatboy is a paper tiger. Oh yes, we are going to lose people, and that is a national shame. But this would not be a war for the benefit of others, this would be a war for ourselves. Our soldiers would not be dying for Iraq, or anyone else, but rather protection of their country.

Does that make it right? No! No war right! But we are NOT the ones saying we are going to kill them ASAP after we get a delivery system, that is what they are telling us. We could have delivered them a nuke long, long, long, ago; and in fact plopped one in their lap during the Korean war, which we did not! Therefore, there may be no GOOD war, but this is a war of self preservation, along with self determination. If the NK wants FATBOY to run them fine, let them! But, if he wants to kill you, or me, or any other American, that is exactly why WE pay taxes for our military, isn't it!

 

[idb]

A missile attack on NK probably means that Seoul is toast.

I have a feeling that there will be a war with 24 hrs. I also believe that the Pentagon has thoroughly thought this through and has more than a few surprises for N. Korea. This will probably be the shortest war in history.

Under estimating North Korea is a big mistake. You can bomb them to hell and back and the only way you will beat them is troops on the ground. They have a huge military for the size of the country and practically nothing else. Their GDP is 25 billion. By comparison the US spends three times that on just food stamps and 50 times that on defense. NK starves the people to feed the army. The population is 24 million and 10% are either active duty, about 1.1 million, in the reserves, or civilians working for the military. It is a military state which has been at war with the United States for over 60 years. In the Korean War the US and it's allies had a military force of a million troops in the war and after nearly 3 years, we were only able to negotiated an armistice put no peace treaty.

"You can bomb them to hell and back and the only way you will beat them is troops on the ground."

There would be 0 support for putting Western nations troops on the ground in North Korea, if it came to that the Chinese would have to go in and put troops on the ground.

But this is of course the same with nearly all war situations, no war has ever been won from the air, you always have to put ground troops in.

I will tell you both this-----------> if the Chinese nod yes under a deal..............if Trump and his generals believe there is an 80% chance they can take out the nukes in a 1st strike, then the decision is done if a peaceful solution is not forthcoming. Without their nukes and Chinese help, the NK is done!

If those things are not in place, then it will drag to the very last minute before a decision is made. Again I say, pray for wisdom on this one, because it is going to shape your life if they choose wrong throughout your lifetime, and probably all of your immediate family too.

Both sides have been preparing for war for so long that a first strike would have to take out far more then NK's nuclear program to prevent a Korean war that would devastate both countries killing millions. If we launch a preemptive strike against NK, we must aim to take out much more than just their nuclear program; we must take out their whole ability to make war and that will mean most of the infrastructure of the country, military and civilian would have to be destroyed.

In a modern war, it is apparent no country can stand against us without a nuke. The only way we could lose a war, is by not being committed to win it. How committed would the United States be? That is a political question!

99 times out of 100, before war, we begin to see the reasons, propaganda, excuses, reasoning, theories, of why we must fight this war. If this war is without nukes, (please God) and the Koreas were to be united, then the South Koreans would have responsibility to take care of the aftermath.

I am telling you that it is 10 weeks tops with no nukes before it is a clean up operation. For crying out loud, you could STARVE them out while just holding the line if you wanted to be PC as long as China agreed.

Without nukes or China, fatboy is a paper tiger. Oh yes, we are going to lose people, and that is a national shame. But this would not be a war for the benefit of others, this would be a war for ourselves. Our soldiers would not be dying for Iraq, or anyone else, but rather protection of their country.

Does that make it right? No! No war right! But we are NOT the ones saying we are going to kill them ASAP after we get a delivery system, that is what they are telling us. We could have delivered them a nuke long, long, long, ago; and in fact plopped one in their lap during the Korean war, which we did not! Therefore, there may be no GOOD war, but this is a war of self preservation, along with self determination. If the NK wants FATBOY to run them fine, let them! But, if he wants to kill you, or me, or any other American, that is exactly why WE pay taxes for our military, isn't it!

A military victory is one thing...but there are much wider issues to be considered.
Iraq is the shining example.

 

[Flopper]

I cannot believe you people are discussing invading yet another nation. This is the same kind of shit that got you in trouble in Iraq.

The Chinese have a history and a treaty with North Korea. They are treaty bound to defend N. Korea, and they would lose face with their allies if they don't.The Trump administration has no foreign policy.

So if you think the Chinese will stand idly by and let the US attack N. Korea - think again.

Less than 100 days it took Trump to go from an isolationist, to dropping bombs on three countries. This isn't a foreign policy. This is insanity.

The Trump administration has no foreign policy.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

What has he done that Obama hadn't?

Tweeted

Not just Tweeting but Extreme Tweeting.

Better than Obama's bleeting.

Just so everyone is aware, it's now Saturday 15th April in North Korea and the time is 10.14AM, it is "The Day of The Sun", so Kim Jong-Un has threatened to detonate this nuclear missile or whatever it is today....so it could be ANYTIME from NOW he either does it or everyone will know he was just bluffing all along.

 

[Flopper]

What has he done that Obama hadn't?

Tweeted

Not just Tweeting but Extreme Tweeting.

Better than Obama's bleeting.

Just so everyone is aware, it's now Saturday 15th April in North Korea and the time is 10.14AM, it is "The Day of The Sun", so Kim Jong-Un has threatened to detonate this nuclear missile or whatever it is today....so it could be ANYTIME from NOW he either does it or everyone will know he was just bluffing all along.

He just displayed a new submarine based missile and warned the United States to end its "military hysteria" or face retaliation. There is no details on this new missle. The idea of course is that it can be moved to the US coast to attack coastal cities. Whether it has ever been tested or even it's just a mockup, who knows. It looks pretty big for submarine launch missile.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Nobody cared either.
These rust buckets were designed in the 1940s and they are not likely to be capable of a trans'Pacific crossing by any stretch of the imagination.

Lol the key word here being 'likely'.

Compare the outcome risked to the plausibility that these rust buckets could make their way across the Pacific.

Not a good bet IMO.

We should be tracking and accounting for each and every one of those subs.

 

[JimBowie1958]

The Trump administration has no foreign policy.

There is a foreign policy.

That it makes no sense to liberals is immaterial.

 

[skye]

I hope things cool down with North Korea.

Nobody wants war

well, nobody apart from the military war complex and neocons

Diplomacy first .....thank you very much.