TroglocratsRdumb
Diamond Member
- Aug 11, 2017
- 38,287
- 50,383
- 2,915
Obama is who will need to be pardoned
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Bullshit. Trump could drop a white house pen on the sidewalk and you worthless leftist traitors would have him under investigation for littering before he picked it back up.So its another democrat fishing expedition, not anything illegal.Exactly. There are no Trump crimes/indictments to address with a "pardon".Pardon himself from what? MAGA?It is interesting, a president can pardon even people in investigations which possibly involve him, as Bush Sr. did with Iran Contra. Bush pardoned convicted members of the former Reagan administration and even Casper Weinberger who was indicted on two counts of perjury and one count of obstruction of justice.
A trial that may have provided evidence Bush as Vice President under Reagan knew all about Iran Contra and facilitated it.
Bush pardoned Weinberger before his trial.
Thus ending the trial.
So a President can use pardon as protection from legal prosecution, not only as clemency to the convicted.
Trump has a lot of power to pardon.
If he loses the election can he pardon himself?
Basic Western rule of law since the rise of an independent judiciary and legislative bodies would argue no, a self pardon is playing judge over oneself and hence an absolutist power not consistent with checks and balances.
But the constitution is silent on the subject.
Except it bans a President pardoning himself during impeachment. That could be construed to mean he cannot be judge over his own actions in this regard?
Or if one is a by the letter originalist it can be seen as only applying to impeachment?
Because I reckon Trump is going to issue a broad but vague personal pardon for everything he has ever done up to that point.
The Supreme Court is in for a fun time.
The FBI is investigating the Bidens for money laundering and influence peddling and illegal lobbying and....
I am guessing the OP is suggesting that Donald John Trump is being investigated by the State of New York and that is why they asked this asinine question...
Now do you want to pretend no investigation is going on at State level?
I'm sure Trump has more than a few layers of protection from any legal issues, even at the state level.
How do you know if he is guilty or innocent until all evidence is shown?
Trump has broken the law numerous times and paid the fines that were required of him, so I am not surprised that he is being investigated...
So as you proclaim it is a fishing expedition the fact is Trump and his corporations have been investigated for decades and have been in violation many times and this is nothing new but still it tell you why the OP asked the asinine question in the first place...
I love Jazz, know a lot about the history of it, listen to it every day. Jazz certainly takes the talent and dedication of a classical musician to play it, but jazz musicians do not paint by numbers follow the rules, they break them.
Jazz musicians actually do follow the "rules" in terms of modes of Major, modes of Melodic Minor, Minor Harmonic, and Half Whole Diminished (all possible chords), not including Holdsworth voicings. "Breaking the rules" will sound like a Frank Zappa mess.
Bullshit. Trump could drop a white house pen on the sidewalk and you worthless leftist traitors would have him under investigation for littering before he picked it back up.So its another democrat fishing expedition, not anything illegal.Exactly. There are no Trump crimes/indictments to address with a "pardon".Pardon himself from what? MAGA?It is interesting, a president can pardon even people in investigations which possibly involve him, as Bush Sr. did with Iran Contra. Bush pardoned convicted members of the former Reagan administration and even Casper Weinberger who was indicted on two counts of perjury and one count of obstruction of justice.
A trial that may have provided evidence Bush as Vice President under Reagan knew all about Iran Contra and facilitated it.
Bush pardoned Weinberger before his trial.
Thus ending the trial.
So a President can use pardon as protection from legal prosecution, not only as clemency to the convicted.
Trump has a lot of power to pardon.
If he loses the election can he pardon himself?
Basic Western rule of law since the rise of an independent judiciary and legislative bodies would argue no, a self pardon is playing judge over oneself and hence an absolutist power not consistent with checks and balances.
But the constitution is silent on the subject.
Except it bans a President pardoning himself during impeachment. That could be construed to mean he cannot be judge over his own actions in this regard?
Or if one is a by the letter originalist it can be seen as only applying to impeachment?
Because I reckon Trump is going to issue a broad but vague personal pardon for everything he has ever done up to that point.
The Supreme Court is in for a fun time.
The FBI is investigating the Bidens for money laundering and influence peddling and illegal lobbying and....
I am guessing the OP is suggesting that Donald John Trump is being investigated by the State of New York and that is why they asked this asinine question...
Now do you want to pretend no investigation is going on at State level?
I'm sure Trump has more than a few layers of protection from any legal issues, even at the state level.
How do you know if he is guilty or innocent until all evidence is shown?
Trump has broken the law numerous times and paid the fines that were required of him, so I am not surprised that he is being investigated...
So as you proclaim it is a fishing expedition the fact is Trump and his corporations have been investigated for decades and have been in violation many times and this is nothing new but still it tell you why the OP asked the asinine question in the first place...
I love Jazz, know a lot about the history of it, listen to it every day. Jazz certainly takes the talent and dedication of a classical musician to play it, but jazz musicians do not paint by numbers follow the rules, they break them.
Jazz musicians actually do follow the "rules" in terms of modes of Major, modes of Melodic Minor, Minor Harmonic, and Half Whole Diminished (all possible chords), not including Holdsworth voicings. "Breaking the rules" will sound like a Frank Zappa mess.
Your talking about the brushes, I am talking about the painting.
The entire concept of improvising, after learning the craft, then breaking the rules, is what made jazz.
All great art innovations learn the rules, then break them.
As John Coltrane said “Damn the rules, it's the feeling that counts."
I'm not saying Trump has never been investigated dumbass. I'm saying he is always being investigated. Yet, here he is - President of the United States - in spite of these bullshit investigations. Success does have its drawbacks. If the less successful can't have a piece of that pie, they investigate. Wasn't the Russia narrative an "investigation" by the FBI - fueled by purposely leaked misinformation by the DNC?Bullshit. Trump could drop a white house pen on the sidewalk and you worthless leftist traitors would have him under investigation for littering before he picked it back up.So its another democrat fishing expedition, not anything illegal.Exactly. There are no Trump crimes/indictments to address with a "pardon".Pardon himself from what? MAGA?It is interesting, a president can pardon even people in investigations which possibly involve him, as Bush Sr. did with Iran Contra. Bush pardoned convicted members of the former Reagan administration and even Casper Weinberger who was indicted on two counts of perjury and one count of obstruction of justice.
A trial that may have provided evidence Bush as Vice President under Reagan knew all about Iran Contra and facilitated it.
Bush pardoned Weinberger before his trial.
Thus ending the trial.
So a President can use pardon as protection from legal prosecution, not only as clemency to the convicted.
Trump has a lot of power to pardon.
If he loses the election can he pardon himself?
Basic Western rule of law since the rise of an independent judiciary and legislative bodies would argue no, a self pardon is playing judge over oneself and hence an absolutist power not consistent with checks and balances.
But the constitution is silent on the subject.
Except it bans a President pardoning himself during impeachment. That could be construed to mean he cannot be judge over his own actions in this regard?
Or if one is a by the letter originalist it can be seen as only applying to impeachment?
Because I reckon Trump is going to issue a broad but vague personal pardon for everything he has ever done up to that point.
The Supreme Court is in for a fun time.
The FBI is investigating the Bidens for money laundering and influence peddling and illegal lobbying and....
I am guessing the OP is suggesting that Donald John Trump is being investigated by the State of New York and that is why they asked this asinine question...
Now do you want to pretend no investigation is going on at State level?
I'm sure Trump has more than a few layers of protection from any legal issues, even at the state level.
How do you know if he is guilty or innocent until all evidence is shown?
Trump has broken the law numerous times and paid the fines that were required of him, so I am not surprised that he is being investigated...
So as you proclaim it is a fishing expedition the fact is Trump and his corporations have been investigated for decades and have been in violation many times and this is nothing new but still it tell you why the OP asked the asinine question in the first place...
Wow, another unhinged response by those making more false claims about a poster that is neither left nor right.
First off Trump has been investigated for decades and is under investigation by the State of New York and has been under audit by the IRS before becoming President, so nothing new and yet you will disagree and proclaim it is all because he is a Republican President...
Trump and his corporations have been hit with fines since the 1970’s by the Federal Government, so investigations into Trump businesses have been going on probably longer than you have been alive...
I know this blow your theory Trump is being targeted for his willingness to sacrifice his private life to be your messiah of a President and some investigations might well be political which come with the game he want to play, but still reality is Trump has been investigated for decades and this is nothing new...
Now go wrap yourself in your Trumptard flag, suckle your thumb and hold your Trump Bear and deny all I wrote when there is a well documented history of Trump past that you kindly forget...
Just imagine if Biden had so many business violations and how you would kick and scream or imagine if Trump were still a Democratic Party donor and how you would spit on him...
I'm not saying Trump has never been investigated dumbass. I'm saying he is always being investigated. Yet, here he is - President of the United States - in spite of these bullshit investigations. Success does have its drawbacks. If the less successful can't have a piece of that pie, they investigate. Wasn't the Russia narrative an "investigation" by the FBI - fueled by purposely leaked misinformation by the DNC?Bullshit. Trump could drop a white house pen on the sidewalk and you worthless leftist traitors would have him under investigation for littering before he picked it back up.So its another democrat fishing expedition, not anything illegal.Exactly. There are no Trump crimes/indictments to address with a "pardon".Pardon himself from what? MAGA?It is interesting, a president can pardon even people in investigations which possibly involve him, as Bush Sr. did with Iran Contra. Bush pardoned convicted members of the former Reagan administration and even Casper Weinberger who was indicted on two counts of perjury and one count of obstruction of justice.
A trial that may have provided evidence Bush as Vice President under Reagan knew all about Iran Contra and facilitated it.
Bush pardoned Weinberger before his trial.
Thus ending the trial.
So a President can use pardon as protection from legal prosecution, not only as clemency to the convicted.
Trump has a lot of power to pardon.
If he loses the election can he pardon himself?
Basic Western rule of law since the rise of an independent judiciary and legislative bodies would argue no, a self pardon is playing judge over oneself and hence an absolutist power not consistent with checks and balances.
But the constitution is silent on the subject.
Except it bans a President pardoning himself during impeachment. That could be construed to mean he cannot be judge over his own actions in this regard?
Or if one is a by the letter originalist it can be seen as only applying to impeachment?
Because I reckon Trump is going to issue a broad but vague personal pardon for everything he has ever done up to that point.
The Supreme Court is in for a fun time.
The FBI is investigating the Bidens for money laundering and influence peddling and illegal lobbying and....
I am guessing the OP is suggesting that Donald John Trump is being investigated by the State of New York and that is why they asked this asinine question...
Now do you want to pretend no investigation is going on at State level?
I'm sure Trump has more than a few layers of protection from any legal issues, even at the state level.
How do you know if he is guilty or innocent until all evidence is shown?
Trump has broken the law numerous times and paid the fines that were required of him, so I am not surprised that he is being investigated...
So as you proclaim it is a fishing expedition the fact is Trump and his corporations have been investigated for decades and have been in violation many times and this is nothing new but still it tell you why the OP asked the asinine question in the first place...
Wow, another unhinged response by those making more false claims about a poster that is neither left nor right.
First off Trump has been investigated for decades and is under investigation by the State of New York and has been under audit by the IRS before becoming President, so nothing new and yet you will disagree and proclaim it is all because he is a Republican President...
Trump and his corporations have been hit with fines since the 1970’s by the Federal Government, so investigations into Trump businesses have been going on probably longer than you have been alive...
I know this blow your theory Trump is being targeted for his willingness to sacrifice his private life to be your messiah of a President and some investigations might well be political which come with the game he want to play, but still reality is Trump has been investigated for decades and this is nothing new...
Now go wrap yourself in your Trumptard flag, suckle your thumb and hold your Trump Bear and deny all I wrote when there is a well documented history of Trump past that you kindly forget...
Just imagine if Biden had so many business violations and how you would kick and scream or imagine if Trump were still a Democratic Party donor and how you would spit on him...
Huh? Jill Stein? The DNC was after an inconsequential green party wacko - not Trump? The entire Moeller investigation was to bring down Jill Stein? Am I missing something here?I'm not saying Trump has never been investigated dumbass. I'm saying he is always being investigated. Yet, here he is - President of the United States - in spite of these bullshit investigations. Success does have its drawbacks. If the less successful can't have a piece of that pie, they investigate. Wasn't the Russia narrative an "investigation" by the FBI - fueled by purposely leaked misinformation by the DNC?Bullshit. Trump could drop a white house pen on the sidewalk and you worthless leftist traitors would have him under investigation for littering before he picked it back up.So its another democrat fishing expedition, not anything illegal.Exactly. There are no Trump crimes/indictments to address with a "pardon".Pardon himself from what? MAGA?It is interesting, a president can pardon even people in investigations which possibly involve him, as Bush Sr. did with Iran Contra. Bush pardoned convicted members of the former Reagan administration and even Casper Weinberger who was indicted on two counts of perjury and one count of obstruction of justice.
A trial that may have provided evidence Bush as Vice President under Reagan knew all about Iran Contra and facilitated it.
Bush pardoned Weinberger before his trial.
Thus ending the trial.
So a President can use pardon as protection from legal prosecution, not only as clemency to the convicted.
Trump has a lot of power to pardon.
If he loses the election can he pardon himself?
Basic Western rule of law since the rise of an independent judiciary and legislative bodies would argue no, a self pardon is playing judge over oneself and hence an absolutist power not consistent with checks and balances.
But the constitution is silent on the subject.
Except it bans a President pardoning himself during impeachment. That could be construed to mean he cannot be judge over his own actions in this regard?
Or if one is a by the letter originalist it can be seen as only applying to impeachment?
Because I reckon Trump is going to issue a broad but vague personal pardon for everything he has ever done up to that point.
The Supreme Court is in for a fun time.
The FBI is investigating the Bidens for money laundering and influence peddling and illegal lobbying and....
I am guessing the OP is suggesting that Donald John Trump is being investigated by the State of New York and that is why they asked this asinine question...
Now do you want to pretend no investigation is going on at State level?
I'm sure Trump has more than a few layers of protection from any legal issues, even at the state level.
How do you know if he is guilty or innocent until all evidence is shown?
Trump has broken the law numerous times and paid the fines that were required of him, so I am not surprised that he is being investigated...
So as you proclaim it is a fishing expedition the fact is Trump and his corporations have been investigated for decades and have been in violation many times and this is nothing new but still it tell you why the OP asked the asinine question in the first place...
Wow, another unhinged response by those making more false claims about a poster that is neither left nor right.
First off Trump has been investigated for decades and is under investigation by the State of New York and has been under audit by the IRS before becoming President, so nothing new and yet you will disagree and proclaim it is all because he is a Republican President...
Trump and his corporations have been hit with fines since the 1970’s by the Federal Government, so investigations into Trump businesses have been going on probably longer than you have been alive...
I know this blow your theory Trump is being targeted for his willingness to sacrifice his private life to be your messiah of a President and some investigations might well be political which come with the game he want to play, but still reality is Trump has been investigated for decades and this is nothing new...
Now go wrap yourself in your Trumptard flag, suckle your thumb and hold your Trump Bear and deny all I wrote when there is a well documented history of Trump past that you kindly forget...
Just imagine if Biden had so many business violations and how you would kick and scream or imagine if Trump were still a Democratic Party donor and how you would spit on him...
No, you try to pass off all investigations are baseless against Trump which is untrue and I stated some investigations are based on political motivation which come with the territory if you want to be in politics...
Again the fact is Trump and his corporations have been investigated for decades and have been found guilty of infractions which happens all the time with large corporations and Mitt Romney would know a lot about this along with Huntsman and why did I bring those two up is because they are well known politicians with business holdings...
As for your comment about Russia the fact is I never bought into the Russian influence except that Jill Stein was the one being used and not Trump...
Anyone that can search can find that Stein was in Moscow and met with Russian Officials and all she needed to do was take enough from Hillary Clinton to cause the chaos they were seeking...
Now the left will proclaim what I wrote is pure nonsense and bullshit while wearing their pussy hat, suckling their thumb and crying into their Hillary for President poster but the Russian agent in 2016 was Jill Stein and never Trump...
Now back to Trump the fact is Trump pissed off a lot of people and yes he is being targeted through investigations and is he guilty of some sort of infraction?
Who the hell knows but I will tell you people will dig much harder until he is out of office and to act like this is a surprise or how dare they, well that is politics and like a cheap whore you know sooner or later you will catch something that isn’t right and have to pay the price...
Frogen, in this Republic, families must raise children to be devoted to rightness through religion of their own choosing.It is interesting, a president can pardon even people in investigations which possibly involve him, as Bush Sr. did with Iran Contra. Bush pardoned convicted members of the former Reagan administration and even Casper Weinberger who was indicted on two counts of perjury and one count of obstruction of justice.
A trial that may have provided evidence Bush as Vice President under Reagan knew all about Iran Contra and facilitated it.
Bush pardoned Weinberger before his trial.
Thus ending the trial.
So a President can use pardon as protection from legal prosecution, not only as clemency to the convicted.
Trump has a lot of power to pardon.
If he loses the election can he pardon himself?
Basic Western rule of law since the rise of an independent judiciary and legislative bodies would argue no, a self pardon is playing judge over oneself and hence an absolutist power not consistent with checks and balances.
But the constitution is silent on the subject.
Except it bans a President pardoning himself during impeachment. That could be construed to mean he cannot be judge over his own actions in this regard?
Or if one is a by the letter originalist it can be seen as only applying to impeachment?
Because I reckon Trump is going to issue a broad but vague personal pardon for everything he has ever done up to that point.
The Supreme Court is in for a fun time.
EVIDENCE?? WHAT FUCKING CRIME?So its another democrat fishing expedition, not anything illegal.Exactly. There are no Trump crimes/indictments to address with a "pardon".Pardon himself from what? MAGA?It is interesting, a president can pardon even people in investigations which possibly involve him, as Bush Sr. did with Iran Contra. Bush pardoned convicted members of the former Reagan administration and even Casper Weinberger who was indicted on two counts of perjury and one count of obstruction of justice.
A trial that may have provided evidence Bush as Vice President under Reagan knew all about Iran Contra and facilitated it.
Bush pardoned Weinberger before his trial.
Thus ending the trial.
So a President can use pardon as protection from legal prosecution, not only as clemency to the convicted.
Trump has a lot of power to pardon.
If he loses the election can he pardon himself?
Basic Western rule of law since the rise of an independent judiciary and legislative bodies would argue no, a self pardon is playing judge over oneself and hence an absolutist power not consistent with checks and balances.
But the constitution is silent on the subject.
Except it bans a President pardoning himself during impeachment. That could be construed to mean he cannot be judge over his own actions in this regard?
Or if one is a by the letter originalist it can be seen as only applying to impeachment?
Because I reckon Trump is going to issue a broad but vague personal pardon for everything he has ever done up to that point.
The Supreme Court is in for a fun time.
The FBI is investigating the Bidens for money laundering and influence peddling and illegal lobbying and....
I am guessing the OP is suggesting that Donald John Trump is being investigated by the State of New York and that is why they asked this asinine question...
Now do you want to pretend no investigation is going on at State level?
I'm sure Trump has more than a few layers of protection from any legal issues, even at the state level.
How do you know if he is guilty or innocent until all evidence is shown?
Trump has broken the law numerous times and paid the fines that were required of him, so I am not surprised that he is being investigated...
So as you proclaim it is a fishing expedition the fact is Trump and his corporations have been investigated for decades and have been in violation many times and this is nothing new but still it tell you why the OP asked the asinine question in the first place...
Pardon himself from what? MAGA?It is interesting, a president can pardon even people in investigations which possibly involve him, as Bush Sr. did with Iran Contra. Bush pardoned convicted members of the former Reagan administration and even Casper Weinberger who was indicted on two counts of perjury and one count of obstruction of justice.
A trial that may have provided evidence Bush as Vice President under Reagan knew all about Iran Contra and facilitated it.
Bush pardoned Weinberger before his trial.
Thus ending the trial.
So a President can use pardon as protection from legal prosecution, not only as clemency to the convicted.
Trump has a lot of power to pardon.
If he loses the election can he pardon himself?
Basic Western rule of law since the rise of an independent judiciary and legislative bodies would argue no, a self pardon is playing judge over oneself and hence an absolutist power not consistent with checks and balances.
But the constitution is silent on the subject.
Except it bans a President pardoning himself during impeachment. That could be construed to mean he cannot be judge over his own actions in this regard?
Or if one is a by the letter originalist it can be seen as only applying to impeachment?
Because I reckon Trump is going to issue a broad but vague personal pardon for everything he has ever done up to that point.
The Supreme Court is in for a fun time.
No that is a T shirt marketing opportunity.
From tax investigations and his business dealings while in the presidency.
He did not go blind trust. That usually protects Presidents from business dealings they profit from while in the Presidency.
The courts are loathe to move on those with a sitting President, they will move if they find illegal dealings when he leaves office.
Whether he is guilty of breaking the law or not in these or other areas, I think Trump is the type to just say "we are not going there, I am pardoning myself."
Going on fishing expeditions to take down our esteemed President in nothing new...just ask Adam SchiffSo as you proclaim it is a fishing expedition the fact is Trump and his corporations have been investigated for decades and have been in violation many times and this is nothing new but still it tell you why the OP asked the asinine question in the first place...
You fought a war to get rid of a king but you grant regal privileges to selected citizens. Bizarre.
Going on fishing expeditions to take down our esteemed President in nothing new...just ask Adam SchiffSo as you proclaim it is a fishing expedition the fact is Trump and his corporations have been investigated for decades and have been in violation many times and this is nothing new but still it tell you why the OP asked the asinine question in the first place...
Robett Mueller and the democrat leadership. How did that turn out for you?
It is interesting, a president can pardon even people in investigations which possibly involve him, as Bush Sr. did with Iran Contra. Bush pardoned convicted members of the former Reagan administration and even Casper Weinberger who was indicted on two counts of perjury and one count of obstruction of justice.
A trial that may have provided evidence Bush as Vice President under Reagan knew all about Iran Contra and facilitated it.
Bush pardoned Weinberger before his trial.
Thus ending the trial.
So a President can use pardon as protection from legal prosecution, not only as clemency to the convicted.
Trump has a lot of power to pardon.
If he loses the election can he pardon himself?
Basic Western rule of law since the rise of an independent judiciary and legislative bodies would argue no, a self pardon is playing judge over oneself and hence an absolutist power not consistent with checks and balances.
But the constitution is silent on the subject.
Except it bans a President pardoning himself during impeachment. That could be construed to mean he cannot be judge over his own actions in this regard?
Or if one is a by the letter originalist it can be seen as only applying to impeachment?
Because I reckon Trump is going to issue a broad but vague personal pardon for everything he has ever done up to that point.
The Supreme Court is in for a fun time.