Can a orthodox or catholic be a born again Christian?

[Picaro]

Catholics are gods favorites

Maybe until the Renaissance; after that clearly they weren't.

Jesus was the first Catholic

Jesus IS a Jew.

Many don't know the difference between catholic and Catholic. they think they're the same thing.

I think I may be missing the distinction. Please enlighten me.

One is a sect, the other is a word meaning 'universal'; Christianity is a universal religion, 'Catholic' is a sect name taken from the former term.

Definition of CATHOLIC

• synonyms

SEE MORE SYNONYMS FOR catholic ON THESAURUS.COM
adjective
broad or wide-ranging in tastes, interests, or the like; having sympathies with all; broad-minded; liberal.
universal in extent; involving all; of interest to all.
pertaining to the whole Christian body or church.

Definition of catholic | Dictionary.com

Catholic (term) - Wikipedia

the Dallas Cowboys aren't the same as cowboys.

 

[Lysistrata]

Can a orthodox or catholic be a born again Christian?
I think they can if they have a personal relationship with christ and are born out of water and spirit. I have friends who are in free church and they told me a Catholic can be a christian if he has a personal relationship with christ. But not all catholics are christians. And we talked about the Pope and my friend said he is not sure if he is a christian I mean the Pope but that a Catholic can be christian.

Morti, there are several similarities between Islam and Catholicism. They are both tribalistic and violent. The Catholics persecuted people for not being Catholic for centuries. Islam does the same thing. The Catholics have a history of rounded up people and butchered them alive, burning people alive and the mass hanging of people for not being Catholic. ISIS does the same sort of ultra violent crimes against humanity. The European Catholics are obsessed with hating Jews. In America the Catholics are obsessed with hating the Evangelicals.(tribalism) During WWII the Catholics rounded up the Orthodox Christians and mass murdered them. The Nazi Party's genocidal hatred of Jews came right out of the Catholic Church's centuries of anti-Semitic teachings. The Mexican Catholics persecuted Texans for not being Catholic and that was what caused the Texas revolution. Thankfully today's Catholics are no longer violent bigots, but they are still very tribalistic. They want the whole world to be Catholic in the similar way that the Muslims want the whole world to be Muslim. BTW, I am not a Christian.

What is tragic is when people look at that horrible history of the Catholic Church and conflate it with actual Christianity, which is basically the exact opposite. Love your neighbor, love even your enemies. Be at peace with others. Blessed are the meek, the merciful and pure of heart... Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. etc. etc.

Thankfully, wise people understand the difference between mere religion and God/truth, but unfortunately many people don’t (and often those people end up becoming bitter atheists.)

What you are describing as "actual Christianity" might be true. But what is "actual Christianity"? What explains the evangelicals? As I said, we've seen graham, robertson, focus on the family, the falwells, etc. strutting about.They are frauds. So what is next?

 

[ding]

Can a orthodox or catholic be a born again Christian?
I think they can if they have a personal relationship with christ and are born out of water and spirit. I have friends who are in free church and they told me a Catholic can be a christian if he has a personal relationship with christ. But not all catholics are christians. And we talked about the Pope and my friend said he is not sure if he is a christian I mean the Pope but that a Catholic can be christian.

Morti, there are several similarities between Islam and Catholicism. They are both tribalistic and violent. The Catholics persecuted people for not being Catholic for centuries. Islam does the same thing. The Catholics have a history of rounded up people and butchered them alive, burning people alive and the mass hanging of people for not being Catholic. ISIS does the same sort of ultra violent crimes against humanity. The European Catholics are obsessed with hating Jews. In America the Catholics are obsessed with hating the Evangelicals.(tribalism) During WWII the Catholics rounded up the Orthodox Christians and mass murdered them. The Nazi Party's genocidal hatred of Jews came right out of the Catholic Church's centuries of anti-Semitic teachings. The Mexican Catholics persecuted Texans for not being Catholic and that was what caused the Texas revolution. Thankfully today's Catholics are no longer violent bigots, but they are still very tribalistic. They want the whole world to be Catholic in the similar way that the Muslims want the whole world to be Muslim. BTW, I am not a Christian.

What is tragic is when people look at that horrible history of the Catholic Church and conflate it with actual Christianity, which is basically the exact opposite. Love your neighbor, love even your enemies. Be at peace with others. Blessed are the meek, the merciful and pure of heart... Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. etc. etc.

Thankfully, wise people understand the difference between mere religion and God/truth, but unfortunately many people don’t (and often those people end up becoming bitter atheists.)

What you are describing as "actual Christianity" might be true. But what is "actual Christianity"? What explains the evangelicals? As I said, we've seen graham, robertson, focus on the family, the falwells, etc. strutting about.They are frauds. So what is next?

Actually Christianity is the belief that God so loved man that he chose to be born into this world to testify to the truth and sacrifice himself to reconcile justice with mercy. That’s it.

 

[norwegen]

Those people are going to hell.
Buddhism is not a sect of Hinduism.

Buddhists are atheists...Hindus are Henotheistic.

Buddha was born a Hindu. However, Hinduism and Buddhism, as Christianity and Judaism DRASTICALLY diverge on many core concepts.

He was a reformer of Hinduism as Jesus was a reformer of Judaism.

No...he was not a reformer of Hinduism. He was a single man on his search to end his suffering. He wanted to end the cycle of samsara. He was interested in any capacity in 'reforming' Hinduism.
Buddhism is simply his way, his truths as he found them. Buddha was a teacher, and a truth seeker.

Did he ever teach there was no God?

Buddha taught the four noble truths. He taught the eight noble precepts. He also taught that his system worked for him. However, if his system does not work for you and you do not find truths in it...then reject it.
He also taught that no man should have faith or believe in anything that was told to him. He should seek his own truths and seek his own way.
It's all in the dhammapada.

Those people are going to hell.
Buddhism is not a sect of Hinduism.

Buddhists are atheists...Hindus are Henotheistic.

Buddha was born a Hindu. However, Hinduism and Buddhism, as Christianity and Judaism DRASTICALLY diverge on many core concepts.

He was a reformer of Hinduism as Jesus was a reformer of Judaism.

No...he was not a reformer of Hinduism. He was a single man on his search to end his suffering. He wanted to end the cycle of samsara. He was interested in any capacity in 'reforming' Hinduism.
Buddhism is simply his way, his truths as he found them. Buddha was a teacher, and a truth seeker.

Did he ever teach there was no God?

Buddha taught the four noble truths. He taught the eight noble precepts. He also taught that his system worked for him. However, if his system does not work for you and you do not find truths in it...then reject it.
He also taught that no man should have faith or believe in anything that was told to him. He should seek his own truths and seek his own way.
It's all in the dhammapada.

Those people are going to hell.
Buddhism is not a sect of Hinduism.

Buddhists are atheists...Hindus are Henotheistic.

Buddha was born a Hindu. However, Hinduism and Buddhism, as Christianity and Judaism DRASTICALLY diverge on many core concepts.

He was a reformer of Hinduism as Jesus was a reformer of Judaism.

No...he was not a reformer of Hinduism. He was a single man on his search to end his suffering. He wanted to end the cycle of samsara. He was interested in any capacity in 'reforming' Hinduism.
Buddhism is simply his way, his truths as he found them. Buddha was a teacher, and a truth seeker.

Did he ever teach there was no God?

Buddha taught the four noble truths. He taught the eight noble precepts. He also taught that his system worked for him. However, if his system does not work for you and you do not find truths in it...then reject it.
He also taught that no man should have faith or believe in anything that was told to him. He should seek his own truths and seek his own way.
It's all in the dhammapada.

Those people are going to hell.
Buddhism is not a sect of Hinduism.

Buddhists are atheists...Hindus are Henotheistic.

Buddha was born a Hindu. However, Hinduism and Buddhism, as Christianity and Judaism DRASTICALLY diverge on many core concepts.

He was a reformer of Hinduism as Jesus was a reformer of Judaism.

No...he was not a reformer of Hinduism. He was a single man on his search to end his suffering. He wanted to end the cycle of samsara. He was interested in any capacity in 'reforming' Hinduism.
Buddhism is simply his way, his truths as he found them. Buddha was a teacher, and a truth seeker.

Did he ever teach there was no God?

Buddha taught the four noble truths. He taught the eight noble precepts. He also taught that his system worked for him. However, if his system does not work for you and you do not find truths in it...then reject it.
He also taught that no man should have faith or believe in anything that was told to him. He should seek his own truths and seek his own way.
It's all in the dhammapada.

Romans 3:10-12
10As it is written: “There is no one righteous, not even one. 11There is no one who understands, no one who seeks God. 12All have turned away; they have together become worthless; there is no one who does good, not even one.…

Ah, yes, a lament of David (Ps 14:1-3; 53:1-3). Thank God that that Old Covenant Age is over and that Paul knew his place in the transition.

Turns out, he made a pretty good spokesperson for the age they had been waiting for.

 

[norwegen]

You effectively have no idea what you are talking about.

How so?

How is this any different than Buddhism and Hinduism?

Buddhism is effectively a sect of Hinduism.

Those people are going to hell.
Buddhism is not a sect of Hinduism.

Buddhists are atheists...Hindus are Henotheistic.

Buddha was born a Hindu. However, Hinduism and Buddhism, as Christianity and Judaism DRASTICALLY diverge on many core concepts.

He was a reformer of Hinduism as Jesus was a reformer of Judaism.

Jesus was/is the expected Messiah. He didn't reform Judaism, He fulfilled it.

He tried to reform it. All you have to do is look at his ministry. He first ministered to the Jews.

He brought the kingdom of God exclusively to Israel. Dogs, pigs, and other assorted evildoers did not appear to be his to harvest.

His followers would do the greater things than he did. His followers would be the ones to bring it to the world.

 

[ding]

How so?

How is this any different than Buddhism and Hinduism?

Buddhism is effectively a sect of Hinduism.

Those people are going to hell.
Buddhism is not a sect of Hinduism.

Buddhists are atheists...Hindus are Henotheistic.

Buddha was born a Hindu. However, Hinduism and Buddhism, as Christianity and Judaism DRASTICALLY diverge on many core concepts.

He was a reformer of Hinduism as Jesus was a reformer of Judaism.

Jesus was/is the expected Messiah. He didn't reform Judaism, He fulfilled it.

He tried to reform it. All you have to do is look at his ministry. He first ministered to the Jews.

He brought the kingdom of God exclusively to Israel. Dogs, pigs, and other assorted evildoers did not appear to be his to harvest.

His followers would do the greater things than he did. His followers would be the ones to bring it to the world.

Then why not worship them?

 

[norwegen]

Those people are going to hell.
Buddhism is not a sect of Hinduism.

Buddhists are atheists...Hindus are Henotheistic.

Buddha was born a Hindu. However, Hinduism and Buddhism, as Christianity and Judaism DRASTICALLY diverge on many core concepts.

He was a reformer of Hinduism as Jesus was a reformer of Judaism.

Jesus was/is the expected Messiah. He didn't reform Judaism, He fulfilled it.

He tried to reform it. All you have to do is look at his ministry. He first ministered to the Jews.

He brought the kingdom of God exclusively to Israel. Dogs, pigs, and other assorted evildoers did not appear to be his to harvest.

His followers would do the greater things than he did. His followers would be the ones to bring it to the world.

Then why not worship them?

Go ahead. No doubt they deserve the reverence we bestow on them already.

However, they did not plant anything. They are not the ones by whom the foolishness of the past is over. They are not the ones who suffered and by whom God's glory manifests on the earth.

Jesus commissioned them. They did not commission him.

 

[ding]

He was a reformer of Hinduism as Jesus was a reformer of Judaism.

Jesus was/is the expected Messiah. He didn't reform Judaism, He fulfilled it.

He tried to reform it. All you have to do is look at his ministry. He first ministered to the Jews.

He brought the kingdom of God exclusively to Israel. Dogs, pigs, and other assorted evildoers did not appear to be his to harvest.

His followers would do the greater things than he did. His followers would be the ones to bring it to the world.

Then why not worship them?

Go ahead. No doubt they deserve the reverence we bestow on them already.

However, they did not plant anything. They are not the ones by whom the foolishness of the past is over. They are not the ones who suffered and by whom God's glory manifests on the earth.

Jesus commissioned them. They did not commission him.

Exactly. That’s why I’m surprised you believe they did greater things than him.

 

[norwegen]

Jesus was/is the expected Messiah. He didn't reform Judaism, He fulfilled it.

He tried to reform it. All you have to do is look at his ministry. He first ministered to the Jews.

He brought the kingdom of God exclusively to Israel. Dogs, pigs, and other assorted evildoers did not appear to be his to harvest.

His followers would do the greater things than he did. His followers would be the ones to bring it to the world.

Then why not worship them?

Go ahead. No doubt they deserve the reverence we bestow on them already.

However, they did not plant anything. They are not the ones by whom the foolishness of the past is over. They are not the ones who suffered and by whom God's glory manifests on the earth.

Jesus commissioned them. They did not commission him.

Exactly. That’s why I’m surprised you believe they did greater things than him.

You don't have to believe Jesus if you don't want to. That's your prerogative.

 

[ding]

He tried to reform it. All you have to do is look at his ministry. He first ministered to the Jews.

He brought the kingdom of God exclusively to Israel. Dogs, pigs, and other assorted evildoers did not appear to be his to harvest.

His followers would do the greater things than he did. His followers would be the ones to bring it to the world.

Then why not worship them?

Go ahead. No doubt they deserve the reverence we bestow on them already.

However, they did not plant anything. They are not the ones by whom the foolishness of the past is over. They are not the ones who suffered and by whom God's glory manifests on the earth.

Jesus commissioned them. They did not commission him.

Exactly. That’s why I’m surprised you believe they did greater things than him.

You don't have to believe Jesus if you don't want to. That's your prerogative.

I know where you got it from.

I don’t believe they did. It’s a value judgement.

 

[buttercup]

Can a orthodox or catholic be a born again Christian?
I think they can if they have a personal relationship with christ and are born out of water and spirit. I have friends who are in free church and they told me a Catholic can be a christian if he has a personal relationship with christ. But not all catholics are christians. And we talked about the Pope and my friend said he is not sure if he is a christian I mean the Pope but that a Catholic can be christian.

Morti, there are several similarities between Islam and Catholicism. They are both tribalistic and violent. The Catholics persecuted people for not being Catholic for centuries. Islam does the same thing. The Catholics have a history of rounded up people and butchered them alive, burning people alive and the mass hanging of people for not being Catholic. ISIS does the same sort of ultra violent crimes against humanity. The European Catholics are obsessed with hating Jews. In America the Catholics are obsessed with hating the Evangelicals.(tribalism) During WWII the Catholics rounded up the Orthodox Christians and mass murdered them. The Nazi Party's genocidal hatred of Jews came right out of the Catholic Church's centuries of anti-Semitic teachings. The Mexican Catholics persecuted Texans for not being Catholic and that was what caused the Texas revolution. Thankfully today's Catholics are no longer violent bigots, but they are still very tribalistic. They want the whole world to be Catholic in the similar way that the Muslims want the whole world to be Muslim. BTW, I am not a Christian.

What is tragic is when people look at that horrible history of the Catholic Church and conflate it with actual Christianity, which is basically the exact opposite. Love your neighbor, love even your enemies. Be at peace with others. Blessed are the meek, the merciful and pure of heart... Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. etc. etc.

Thankfully, wise people understand the difference between mere religion and God/truth, but unfortunately many people don’t (and often those people end up becoming bitter atheists.)

What you are describing as "actual Christianity" might be true. But what is "actual Christianity"?

Ding did a pretty good job answering your question, but I'll add to that. True Christianity is about a relationship, not religion. When God first created the world, everything was as it should be, and there was no separation between God and humanity. We were created to love and be loved by God. But when mankind went against God, everything began to change and it just got worse from there. That initial right relationship was broken, and since then there has been a separation.

The Gospel is about redemption and restoration. It's about us getting back to how things were meant to be, on an individual basis. But the thing is, each of us needs to get to the point where we realize our true spiritual condition, and our need for God. How can we receive forgiveness if we don't think we need forgiveness? Andylusion explained it well, in post #149. Where there is true Christianity, there will be good "fruit." The bible says the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control.

What explains the evangelicals? As I said, we've seen graham, robertson, focus on the family, the falwells, etc. strutting about.They are frauds. So what is next?

I don't know about Graham or Focus on the Family, but I think many of the televangelists are doing it for all the wrong reasons. Jesus warned that there would be wolves in sheep's clothing. I think the bottom line is, ALL humans are fallible and we should only look to God, not any human, because people will always fall short and let you down, but God is the only one who can always be trusted.

 

[ninja007]

Can a orthodox or catholic be a born again Christian?
I think they can if they have a personal relationship with christ and are born out of water and spirit. I have friends who are in free church and they told me a Catholic can be a christian if he has a personal relationship with christ. But not all catholics are christians. And we talked about the Pope and my friend said he is not sure if he is a christian I mean the Pope but that a Catholic can be christian.

It depends on what you mean by Orthodox. There are Jewish Orthodox, Greek Orthodox, etc.

Christian Orthodox. Greek, Russian, Serbian etc. Not jewish. Im Serbian-Orthodox but I accepted Jesus as my saviour. I went to free church, they introduced me to their circle and online I did a bible Course. Part of that Bible Course was to say a Prayer that Jesus Christ Comes into your life. Also I have Friends who are in free church, I read bible etc.

saying a prayer doesnt make you a Christian. Realizing your a sinner and need a Savior, Jesus, does. Realize without Jesus you are going to hell.

 

[zaangalewa]

... The Scripture was inspired by the moving of the Holy Spirit upon the hearts of men. What became the Bible was GOD's will and not that of men.

Sorry - but Christians were not forced from god to make a bible. The papan emperor - and others - liked to have a better information about what's Christian and not. So they went through their memories and notepads and tried to find out what was authentic and not. The result was the bible - a summary of the Christian faith in books and letters (and even some songs) over hundreds of years with hundreds or thousands of authors and co-authors. But the bible itselve is indeed not essential for the Christain faith - except you try to say the Christians in the first three centuries would had not been Christians. We can live inspired without bible too. Let me say: Holy books are in general overrated - specially they are not god. Books contain messages - but what's real important are the living messengers. So let me say: The authors and co-authors are essential - in their ways, how they understood, what god said to them - but it are also essential millions and more people of all times. Their lifes are written down in the book of life. And this book is still not finished nor published.

 

[zaangalewa]

Catholics are gods favorites

Maybe until the Renaissance; after that clearly they weren't.

Does God have favorites?

I believe he loves all of his creatures. Even the ones that don’t love him.

Why sounds this so depressing?

Let me try it this way: I'm sure god loves you more than anyhting else in this universe. He loves you with such an intensity that you burn ... and no love for anything else in this universe is still able to exist for you than only the love of god. ... And now you like to share this burning love with what? ... With the stars or with an idiot like you are? ...

 

[norwegen]

He brought the kingdom of God exclusively to Israel. Dogs, pigs, and other assorted evildoers did not appear to be his to harvest.

His followers would do the greater things than he did. His followers would be the ones to bring it to the world.

Then why not worship them?

Go ahead. No doubt they deserve the reverence we bestow on them already.

However, they did not plant anything. They are not the ones by whom the foolishness of the past is over. They are not the ones who suffered and by whom God's glory manifests on the earth.

Jesus commissioned them. They did not commission him.

Exactly. That’s why I’m surprised you believe they did greater things than him.

You don't have to believe Jesus if you don't want to. That's your prerogative.

I know where you got it from.

I don’t believe they did. It’s a value judgement.

Jesus did believe they would.

If you wish to disagree with Jesus, that's your prerogative.

 

[ding]

Then why not worship them?

Go ahead. No doubt they deserve the reverence we bestow on them already.

However, they did not plant anything. They are not the ones by whom the foolishness of the past is over. They are not the ones who suffered and by whom God's glory manifests on the earth.

Jesus commissioned them. They did not commission him.

Exactly. That’s why I’m surprised you believe they did greater things than him.

You don't have to believe Jesus if you don't want to. That's your prerogative.

I know where you got it from.

I don’t believe they did. It’s a value judgement.

Jesus did believe they would.

If you wish to disagree with Jesus, that's your prerogative.

Did he? Or did he say whoever?

And was it unconditional?

 

[ding]

Catholics are gods favorites

Maybe until the Renaissance; after that clearly they weren't.

Does God have favorites?

I believe he loves all of his creatures. Even the ones that don’t love him.

Why sounds this so depressing?

Let me try it this way: I'm sure god loves you more than anyhting else in this universe. He loves you with such an intensity that you burn ... and no love for anything else in this universe is still able to exist for you than only the love of god. ... And now you like to share this burning love with what? ... With the stars or with an idiot like you are? ...

I hope with an idiot like me too.

 

[norwegen]

Go ahead. No doubt they deserve the reverence we bestow on them already.

However, they did not plant anything. They are not the ones by whom the foolishness of the past is over. They are not the ones who suffered and by whom God's glory manifests on the earth.

Jesus commissioned them. They did not commission him.

Exactly. That’s why I’m surprised you believe they did greater things than him.

You don't have to believe Jesus if you don't want to. That's your prerogative.

I know where you got it from.

I don’t believe they did. It’s a value judgement.

Jesus did believe they would.

If you wish to disagree with Jesus, that's your prerogative.

Did he?

Yes.

Can you not read?

 

[ding]

Exactly. That’s why I’m surprised you believe they did greater things than him.

You don't have to believe Jesus if you don't want to. That's your prerogative.

I know where you got it from.

I don’t believe they did. It’s a value judgement.

Jesus did believe they would.

If you wish to disagree with Jesus, that's your prerogative.

Did he?

Yes.

Can you not read?

...whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing and they will do even greater things than these...

Is this the verse you believe supports your assertion?

 

[zaangalewa]

Catholics are gods favorites

Maybe until the Renaissance; after that clearly they weren't.

Jesus was the first Catholic

Jesus IS a Jew.

Many don't know the difference between catholic and Catholic. they think they're the same thing.

The Rennaissance was by the way made from Catholics and a step forward to a more catholic (=universal) way to think. The Christian roots are not only Jewish - they are also Greek (and Afro-Asia-European).