Bernie Sanders: We Will Raise Taxes On Anyone Making Over $29,000 To Fund Government Health Care

[pknopp]

In 2008 Democrats said they fixed healthcare.

How’d that work out here 11 years later?

The same way Trump's wall is working out. If one the end you or those who support a law realize Trump lied to you are you going to stop trying?

 

[flack]

Not all were irresponsible. Many would have made it if their loans had simply been refinanced to the lower fixed rates.

They had the ability to do that in most cases. If the bank wouldn't allow it, there were other banks to choose from. You don't need to keep your loan with the bank you originally opened the loan with. I would be willing to bet that most had the ability to do that, but didn't pay attention and just lived life day by day.

I bought my first house in 1986. Working two minimum wage jobs and had zero down. My ex still lives in that house.

I don't believe that for a minute. Nobody gave 0% down loans until the housing bubble.

In 1986 mortgage interest rates were around 10%.

 

[captkaos]

I love the "tax the corporations" ploy.

Tax corp's and they raise the price of their product that you and I pay for.

Tax big oil & the price of gasoline goes up & you and I pay for it.

STOP VOTING FOR PEOPLE WHO SAY TAX CORPORATIONS!!!

The "real" message is not heard by most sheeple. The message says to me . I'm only taxing the Businesses that make your job possible not you. Bernie has no Vision for freedom, his vision is for Govt take over of everything. Taxing "Corporations" Would affect all "Corporations". Joe's heating and cooling Inc. would feel the "BERN" just as much as Microsoft. Socialists hate private Business.

 

[Slyhunter]

I love the "tax the corporations" ploy.

Tax corp's and they raise the price of their product that you and I pay for.

Tax big oil & the price of gasoline goes up & you and I pay for it.

STOP VOTING FOR PEOPLE WHO SAY TAX CORPORATIONS!!!

Doesn't matter how much in taxes you charge a corporation as far as price of goods is concerned. Price of goods uses a supply and demand formula and is usually set at the max profitable value. Raise taxes or other expenses doesn't change it any. It just means the corporation makes less in profit. If they don't profit they go out of business and then the supply and demand formula changes with the change in supply.

 

[Flash]

Put your healthcare in the hands of government bueracrats that don't give a shit about you, whose bosses are corrupt politicians elected by special interest groups. It will also cause your taxes to sky rocket. What could possible go wrong?

Why should it cause taxes to skyrocket? Are we paying for things now?

If we don't have to raise taxes to pay for bombs and bail outs, why do we for health care?

When the hell has anything that the filthy government done that the cost didn't skyrocket? the government ***** up everything it touches. Just look at the corruption and mismanagement of the VA system, as an example. Trump had to go to the private sector to help fix that problem.

Their ain't no such thing as a free lunch. If you are going to give the stupid government control of your health care you are going to pay up the ass for it.

It is comical to see how naive you stupid Moon Bats are about the government. You dumb mutherfuckers think the government is your friend.

 

[dblack]

In 2008 Democrats said they fixed healthcare.

How’d that work out here 11 years later?

They "fixed" it alright.

 

[pknopp]

Not all were irresponsible. Many would have made it if their loans had simply been refinanced to the lower fixed rates.

They had the ability to do that in most cases. If the bank wouldn't allow it, there were other banks to choose from. You don't need to keep your loan with the bank you originally opened the loan with. I would be willing to bet that most had the ability to do that, but didn't pay attention and just lived life day by day.

I bought my first house in 1986. Working two minimum wage jobs and had zero down. My ex still lives in that house.

I don't believe that for a minute. Nobody gave 0% down loans until the housing bubble.

In 1986 mortgage interest rates were around 10%.

Yes, 9.9%

 

[pknopp]

Put your healthcare in the hands of government bueracrats that don't give a shit about you, whose bosses are corrupt politicians elected by special interest groups. It will also cause your taxes to sky rocket. What could possible go wrong?

Why should it cause taxes to skyrocket? Are we paying for things now?

If we don't have to raise taxes to pay for bombs and bail outs, why do we for health care?

When the hell has anything that the filthy government done that the cost didn't skyrocket? the government ***** up everything it touches. Just look at the corruption and mismanagement of the VA system, as an example. Trump had to go to the private sector to help fix that problem.

Their ain't no such thing as a free lunch. If you are going to give the stupid government control of your health care you are going to pay up the ass for it.

It is comical to see how naive you stupid Moon Bats are about the government. You dumb mutherfuckers think the government is your friend.

Everything has skyrocketed. Trucks are now $60-$80k in many cases. What do you consider that?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Not all were irresponsible. Many would have made it if their loans had simply been refinanced to the lower fixed rates.

They had the ability to do that in most cases. If the bank wouldn't allow it, there were other banks to choose from. You don't need to keep your loan with the bank you originally opened the loan with. I would be willing to bet that most had the ability to do that, but didn't pay attention and just lived life day by day.

No they did not. They were now upside down on their loans and no bank would touch them. Never mind that these same taxpayers had to bail the banks out.

The Plain Dealer did quite a few articles on this.

Ion't believe that for a minute. Nobody gave 0% down loans until the housing bubble.

FMHA. December 1985. Two minimum wage jobs and zero down. My payments were $268 a month.

47 Hickory St, Parkersburg, WV 26104 - realtor.com®

Oh right, the leftist Plain Dealer. I'm sure their articles were not biased. I couldn't find any articles from 1985 on loan requirements, but if you didn't have anything down and bought a home, that's the first I've ever heard about it. I don't doubt that you might have had two part-time jobs, because banks only look at the ability to repay less than the source.

 

[dblack]

Put your healthcare in the hands of government bueracrats that don't give a shit about you, whose bosses are corrupt politicians elected by special interest groups. It will also cause your taxes to sky rocket. What could possible go wrong?

Why should it cause taxes to skyrocket? Are we paying for things now?

If we don't have to raise taxes to pay for bombs and bail outs, why do we for health care?

When the hell has anything that the filthy government done that the cost didn't skyrocket? the government ***** up everything it touches. Just look at the corruption and mismanagement of the VA system, as an example. Trump had to go to the private sector to help fix that problem.

Their ain't no such thing as a free lunch. If you are going to give the stupid government control of your health care you are going to pay up the ass for it.

It is comical to see how naive you stupid Moon Bats are about the government. You dumb mutherfuckers think the government is your friend.

Everything has skyrocketed. Trucks are now $60-$80k in many cases. What do you consider that?

I consider it another one of your diversions. Health Insurance Inflation

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Not all were irresponsible. Many would have made it if their loans had simply been refinanced to the lower fixed rates.

They had the ability to do that in most cases. If the bank wouldn't allow it, there were other banks to choose from. You don't need to keep your loan with the bank you originally opened the loan with. I would be willing to bet that most had the ability to do that, but didn't pay attention and just lived life day by day.

I bought my first house in 1986. Working two minimum wage jobs and had zero down. My ex still lives in that house.

I don't believe that for a minute. Nobody gave 0% down loans until the housing bubble.

In 1986 mortgage interest rates were around 10%.

I also remember reading during the bubble that it was the first time banks offered loans with 0% down. I wish I could find an article on it.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Put your healthcare in the hands of government bueracrats that don't give a shit about you, whose bosses are corrupt politicians elected by special interest groups. It will also cause your taxes to sky rocket. What could possible go wrong?

Another ignorant ******* Trumpette.

The government is the payer,. YOU choose where to get your care from PRIVATE doctors in PRIVATE institutions.

Still making the doctors employees of the state. In other words slaves. You want to enslave an entire profession so you can get something for free.

If government took over and didn't pay the doctors what they are getting paid today, we would end up with a huge doctor shortage. You don't go to school for years and years, only to make five figures when it's all said and done.

 

[Flash]

Put your healthcare in the hands of government bueracrats that don't give a shit about you, whose bosses are corrupt politicians elected by special interest groups. It will also cause your taxes to sky rocket. What could possible go wrong?

Why should it cause taxes to skyrocket? Are we paying for things now?

If we don't have to raise taxes to pay for bombs and bail outs, why do we for health care?

When the hell has anything that the filthy government done that the cost didn't skyrocket? the government ***** up everything it touches. Just look at the corruption and mismanagement of the VA system, as an example. Trump had to go to the private sector to help fix that problem.

Their ain't no such thing as a free lunch. If you are going to give the stupid government control of your health care you are going to pay up the ass for it.

It is comical to see how naive you stupid Moon Bats are about the government. You dumb mutherfuckers think the government is your friend.

Everything has skyrocketed. Trucks are now $60-$80k in many cases. What do you consider that?

You are really dumb Moon Bat, aren't you? Either that or confused about everything, which is evident.

Of course pathetic little Moon Bats like you don't worry about cost because you want the government to control health care so you can get it for free. You are a greedy Moon Bat that thinks you are entitled to free health care simply because you are alive and the government will give it to you.

I have a much better idea than the ******* government doing health care. I'll provide for my own health care and you provide for yours and we leave the corrupt bloated oppressive government out of it. How does that sound Sport?

 

[pknopp]

Put your healthcare in the hands of government bueracrats that don't give a shit about you, whose bosses are corrupt politicians elected by special interest groups. It will also cause your taxes to sky rocket. What could possible go wrong?

Why should it cause taxes to skyrocket? Are we paying for things now?

If we don't have to raise taxes to pay for bombs and bail outs, why do we for health care?

When the hell has anything that the filthy government done that the cost didn't skyrocket? the government ***** up everything it touches. Just look at the corruption and mismanagement of the VA system, as an example. Trump had to go to the private sector to help fix that problem.

Their ain't no such thing as a free lunch. If you are going to give the stupid government control of your health care you are going to pay up the ass for it.

It is comical to see how naive you stupid Moon Bats are about the government. You dumb mutherfuckers think the government is your friend.

Everything has skyrocketed. Trucks are now $60-$80k in many cases. What do you consider that?

I consider it another one of your diversions. Health Insurance Inflation

You ignoring that everything has gone up but only condemning it one area is the one doing the diverting.

Did Obamacare address any portion of costs? No, it was a total failure and a sell out to wall street.

 

[pknopp]

Put your healthcare in the hands of government bueracrats that don't give a shit about you, whose bosses are corrupt politicians elected by special interest groups. It will also cause your taxes to sky rocket. What could possible go wrong?

Why should it cause taxes to skyrocket? Are we paying for things now?

If we don't have to raise taxes to pay for bombs and bail outs, why do we for health care?

When the hell has anything that the filthy government done that the cost didn't skyrocket? the government ***** up everything it touches. Just look at the corruption and mismanagement of the VA system, as an example. Trump had to go to the private sector to help fix that problem.

Their ain't no such thing as a free lunch. If you are going to give the stupid government control of your health care you are going to pay up the ass for it.

It is comical to see how naive you stupid Moon Bats are about the government. You dumb mutherfuckers think the government is your friend.

Everything has skyrocketed. Trucks are now $60-$80k in many cases. What do you consider that?

You are really dumb Moon Bat, aren't you? Either that or confused about everything, which is evident.

Of course pathetic little Moon Bats like you don't worry about cost because you want the government to control health care so you can get it for free. You are a greedy Moon Bat that thinks you are entitled to free health care simply because you are alive and the government will give it to you.

I have a much better idea than the ******* government doing health care. I'll provide for my own health care and you provide for yours and we leave the corrupt bloated oppressive government out of it. How does that sound Sport?

That's right, rather than address my point get triggered and call me names.

Typical.

 

[NightFox]

Put your healthcare in the hands of government bueracrats that don't give a shit about you, whose bosses are corrupt politicians elected by special interest groups. It will also cause your taxes to sky rocket. What could possible go wrong?

Why should it cause taxes to skyrocket? Are we paying for things now?

If we don't have to raise taxes to pay for bombs and bail outs, why do we for health care?

When the hell has anything that the filthy government done that the cost didn't skyrocket? the government ***** up everything it touches. Just look at the corruption and mismanagement of the VA system, as an example. Trump had to go to the private sector to help fix that problem.

Their ain't no such thing as a free lunch. If you are going to give the stupid government control of your health care you are going to pay up the ass for it.

It is comical to see how naive you stupid Moon Bats are about the government. You dumb mutherfuckers think the government is your friend.

Everything has skyrocketed. Trucks are now $60-$80k in many cases. What do you consider that?

You are really dumb Moon Bat, aren't you? Either that or confused about everything, which is evident.

Of course pathetic little Moon Bats like you don't worry about cost because you want the government to control health care so you can get it for free. You are a greedy Moon Bat that thinks you are entitled to free health care simply because you are alive and the government will give it to you.

I have a much better idea than the ******* government doing health care. I'll provide for my own health care and you provide for yours and we leave the corrupt bloated oppressive government out of it. How does that sound Sport?

That's right, rather than address my point get triggered and call me names.

Typical.

Sheesh...stop whining and wear that "Moon Bat" badge with pride and some dignity, ya pansy.

"Let me give you some counsel, bastard. Never forget what you are, for surely the world will not. Make it your strength. Then it can never be your weakness. Armor yourself in it, and it will never be used to hurt you." -- Tyrion Lannister, Game of Thrones

 

[Grumblenuts]

Well yes, because I would say 99% was government, and the main "fault" of the banks as it were, was trusting government.

Government was suing banks to make bad loans.
Government was pushing banks to make bad loans.
Government incentivized banks to make bad loans.
Government even required banks to make bad loans in order to get merger approvals.
Government even guaranteed sub-prime loans.

And the problem is, with all this concerted effort to push banks to make bad loans, then you want to point at the banks and say they should not have done that. Well.... while technically true, that is entirely unfair.

Without government intervention, the sub-prime crash would never have happened. Because prior to 1997, the government didn't make any direct overt moves to push sub-prime loans, and before 1997, they were a niche market.

Prior to 1997, sub-prime loans were tiny, and the market was flat. There was no real significant growth, until the government got involved in 1997.

No bank was sued to make a bad loan. When you start like this, I stop.

From 1998


"They would not have qualified for loan, but for this affirmative action by the banks."
"To take a greater risk."
"which will be a higher risk, and I'm sure will be a higher default rate than the rest of the portfolio"

HUD being led by Andrew Cuomo,



Bill Clinton, openly saying that the money lent to people who did not qualify, was mostly done under his administration.

Obama 2007 at NASDAQ "Subprime lending started off as a good idea - helping Americans buy homes who couldn't previously afford to."
https://2008election.procon.org/sourcefiles/Obama20070917.pdf

How Obama Bankrupted Black Homeowners | Investor's Business Daily

The pressure worked. In 1994, Clinton's top bank regulators signed a landmark anti-redlining policy that declared traditional mortgage underwriting standards racist and mandated banks apply easier lending rules for minorities.​

John Allison wrote a book:
https://www.amazon.com/Financial-Crisis-Free-Market-Cure/dp/0071806776&tag=ff0d01-20?tag=usmb-20

In this he describes how he was an executive at a bank in the late 90s, and had regulators say that their standards were discriminator, and how they had to change them. The regulators never explained how they were discriminatory, nor what they should do to improve, only that they needed changed.

The fact that the Clinton Administration was suing banks to force them to make bad loans, is beyond debate. It is a documented, video'd, recorded and published fact.

Once again, you have the right to be wrong... .but if you deny this, that's all you are..... is wrong.

I haven't argued that the government didn't push for lower standards. The banks did it when they were freed up and the government gaurantees the loans.

Greenspan said his biggest mistake in trusting that the banks would do the right thing.

Greenspan, was a brilliant idiot. You can't trust people to do the right thing, when government is directly suing people to do the wrong thing.

The banks did it when they were freed up and the government gaurantees the loans.

And there is where the rub comes. If the government guaranteed the loans..... then the banks didn't do it.

The banks were always 'freed up'. There was never anything that prevented banks from making a sub-prime loan. Any bank could have made a subprime loan before the 90s, or the 80s, or even the 70s. Nothing ever prevented a bank from making a bad loan.

They simply didn't. Why? Because it was a bad loan. Without government backing the loan, they would have lost money. So they simply didn't make the loan.

It was government, not the banks, which changed the market incentives, which caused banks to make bad loans.

This is why I say it's 99% government. You are pointing to 1% of the cause. If government had not guaranteed those loans.... we wouldn't be discussing a subprime crash, because it never would have happened.

Before 1997, when Freddie Mac guaranteed sub-prime loans, and allowed them to be bundled with prime loans.... subprime was a niche market. Flat growth from the graph I posted before.

At least I am grateful you are aware of the issue unlike others.

Yeah, quite the polished presentation. Of course there's some truth to every assertion. Way beyond Andy's normal capabilities though so vastly lifted from a Koch Bros think tank bucket no doubt. Problem is some of us were quite alive and aware throughout. Typical rw nutjob rewriting of history. Corporate corruption? Oh np, we'll just skip ahead to everyone freaking out over the outcome and look back very selectively so as to put all the blame on govt. Greedy private lenders, bundlers, financial advisors, investors, insurers? All innocent as the driven snow. Govt made me do it! Bad govt, BAD! Government changed the market incentives causing banks to make bad loans!

Yeah, right. Cry me a river. Who corrupted the govt officials to play along? No higher govt position or salary is lucrative enough for any professional to take on such huge personal risk. It takes a system wide concerted effort by groups of private shitheads with deep, deep pockets and a common commitment to steal all they possibly can in order to keep gaining vastly more. We corrupted them and then they helped us. See? Their fault! We're victims!

First you get some money, then you corrupt some power, then you get boatloads more money! Want to know who's really to blame? Same as ever.. duh!.. follow the money! Proof that greed uber alles capitalism has been attempted enough and run its course. The supposed "free market" is and always was bullshit doomed to fail. Significant public transparency and oversight is absolutely required. Legal ability to hide and take zero responsibility is the problem.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

Liberal morons think the same people that can’t get homeless people in shipping container houses for less than 600k a unit are going to get them cheaper healthcare.

Fricken idiots.

 

[pknopp]

No bank was sued to make a bad loan. When you start like this, I stop.

From 1998


"They would not have qualified for loan, but for this affirmative action by the banks."
"To take a greater risk."
"which will be a higher risk, and I'm sure will be a higher default rate than the rest of the portfolio"

HUD being led by Andrew Cuomo,



Bill Clinton, openly saying that the money lent to people who did not qualify, was mostly done under his administration.

Obama 2007 at NASDAQ "Subprime lending started off as a good idea - helping Americans buy homes who couldn't previously afford to."
https://2008election.procon.org/sourcefiles/Obama20070917.pdf

How Obama Bankrupted Black Homeowners | Investor's Business Daily

The pressure worked. In 1994, Clinton's top bank regulators signed a landmark anti-redlining policy that declared traditional mortgage underwriting standards racist and mandated banks apply easier lending rules for minorities.​

John Allison wrote a book:
https://www.amazon.com/Financial-Crisis-Free-Market-Cure/dp/0071806776&tag=ff0d01-20?tag=usmb-20

In this he describes how he was an executive at a bank in the late 90s, and had regulators say that their standards were discriminator, and how they had to change them. The regulators never explained how they were discriminatory, nor what they should do to improve, only that they needed changed.

The fact that the Clinton Administration was suing banks to force them to make bad loans, is beyond debate. It is a documented, video'd, recorded and published fact.

Once again, you have the right to be wrong... .but if you deny this, that's all you are..... is wrong.

I haven't argued that the government didn't push for lower standards. The banks did it when they were freed up and the government gaurantees the loans.

Greenspan said his biggest mistake in trusting that the banks would do the right thing.

Greenspan, was a brilliant idiot. You can't trust people to do the right thing, when government is directly suing people to do the wrong thing.

The banks did it when they were freed up and the government gaurantees the loans.

And there is where the rub comes. If the government guaranteed the loans..... then the banks didn't do it.

The banks were always 'freed up'. There was never anything that prevented banks from making a sub-prime loan. Any bank could have made a subprime loan before the 90s, or the 80s, or even the 70s. Nothing ever prevented a bank from making a bad loan.

They simply didn't. Why? Because it was a bad loan. Without government backing the loan, they would have lost money. So they simply didn't make the loan.

It was government, not the banks, which changed the market incentives, which caused banks to make bad loans.

This is why I say it's 99% government. You are pointing to 1% of the cause. If government had not guaranteed those loans.... we wouldn't be discussing a subprime crash, because it never would have happened.

Before 1997, when Freddie Mac guaranteed sub-prime loans, and allowed them to be bundled with prime loans.... subprime was a niche market. Flat growth from the graph I posted before.

At least I am grateful you are aware of the issue unlike others.

Yeah, quite the polished presentation. Of course there's some truth to every assertion. Way beyond Andy's normal capabilities though so vastly lifted from a Koch Bros think tank bucket no doubt. Problem is some of us were quite alive and aware throughout. Typical rw nutjob rewriting of history. Corporate corruption? Oh np, we'll just skip ahead to everyone freaking out over the outcome and look back very selectively so as to put all the blame on govt. Greedy private lenders, bundlers, financial advisors, investors, insurers? All innocent as the driven snow. Govt made me do it! Bad govt, BAD! Government changed the market incentives causing banks to make bad loans!

Yeah, right. Cry me a river. Who corrupted the govt officials to play along? No higher govt position or salary is lucrative enough for any professional to take on such huge personal risk. It takes a system wide concerted effort by groups of private shitheads with deep, deep pockets and a common commitment to steal all they possibly can in order to keep gaining vastly more. We corrupted them and then they helped us. See? Their fault! We're victims!

First you get some money, then you corrupt some power, then you get boatloads more money! Want to know who's really to blame? Same as ever.. duh!.. follow the money! Proof that greed uber alles capitalism has been attempted enough and run its course. The supposed "free market" is and always was bullshit doomed to fail. Significant public transparency and oversight is absolutely required. Legal ability to hide and take zero responsibility is the problem.

Very nicely written with one caveat. Just because you are bribed does not excuse your dirty work.

 

[Flash]

Put your healthcare in the hands of government bueracrats that don't give a shit about you, whose bosses are corrupt politicians elected by special interest groups. It will also cause your taxes to sky rocket. What could possible go wrong?

Why should it cause taxes to skyrocket? Are we paying for things now?

If we don't have to raise taxes to pay for bombs and bail outs, why do we for health care?

When the hell has anything that the filthy government done that the cost didn't skyrocket? the government ***** up everything it touches. Just look at the corruption and mismanagement of the VA system, as an example. Trump had to go to the private sector to help fix that problem.

Their ain't no such thing as a free lunch. If you are going to give the stupid government control of your health care you are going to pay up the ass for it.

It is comical to see how naive you stupid Moon Bats are about the government. You dumb mutherfuckers think the government is your friend.

Everything has skyrocketed. Trucks are now $60-$80k in many cases. What do you consider that?

You are really dumb Moon Bat, aren't you? Either that or confused about everything, which is evident.

Of course pathetic little Moon Bats like you don't worry about cost because you want the government to control health care so you can get it for free. You are a greedy Moon Bat that thinks you are entitled to free health care simply because you are alive and the government will give it to you.

I have a much better idea than the ******* government doing health care. I'll provide for my own health care and you provide for yours and we leave the corrupt bloated oppressive government out of it. How does that sound Sport?

That's right, rather than address my point get triggered and call me names.

Typical.

You should be called names because you are confuses about this big time. You don't get a pass when you take idiotic positions. It doesn't get any more idiotic than advocating that the ******* government control our health care.

I did answer your confusion by saying that the right thing to do is for you pay for your health care and I pay for mine and we leave the worthless corrupt bloated oppressive government out of it.