belief

[froggy]

do muslims believe in gods son jesus christ? and if not how do they expect to get to heaven.

 

[BigBarry]

They're going to kill everyone who stands in their way.

 

[Bill O'Olberman]

do muslims believe in gods son jesus christ? and if not how do they expect to get to heaven.

I think they view Jesus as a prophet in a line of prophets... but not the son of god.

And if heaven is occupied by some of you asshole christians and zealot asshole religious nuts I would rather be in hell.

 

[Mr Natural]

do muslims believe in gods son jesus christ? and if not how do they expect to get to heaven.

How about the Jews? They don't believe in Jesus, are they going to hell?


Or the Hindus, or the Buddhists, or the Shintos, or the Aztecs, or all the people who came before the year 0 A.D. Are they all going to hell?

 

[trueblue]

do muslims believe in gods son jesus christ? and if not how do they expect to get to heaven.

How about the Jews? They don't believe in Jesus, are they going to hell?


Or the Hindus, or the Buddhists, or the Shintos, or the Aztecs, or all the people who came before the year 0 A.D. Are they all going to hell?

The fast answer is "yes", in the sense that they are damned. That's no so terrible, really, since damnation only means a person cannot progress further. In other words, if Christianity has it right, they will be resurrected and end up in a place where they are happy but simply cannot go any farther. This is true for many Christians as well, by the way.

But the alternative is worth working for. Those who make and keep sacred covenants such as baptism can live forever with their families and with God and continue to make progress.

 

[gcomeau]

do muslims believe in gods son jesus christ? and if not how do they expect to get to heaven.

How about the Jews? They don't believe in Jesus, are they going to hell?


Or the Hindus, or the Buddhists, or the Shintos, or the Aztecs, or all the people who came before the year 0 A.D. Are they all going to hell?

The fast answer is "yes", in the sense that they are damned. That's no so terrible, really, since damnation only means a person cannot progress further.

Want to share where that idea came from? That's a bit of a new take on it to me, and I've heard a LOT of opinions on exactly what Christianity says will really occur to the 'unsaved'.

 

[froggy]

theres only one way in john 3:16-17 for god so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. for god sent not his son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

 

[trueblue]

How about the Jews? They don't believe in Jesus, are they going to hell?


Or the Hindus, or the Buddhists, or the Shintos, or the Aztecs, or all the people who came before the year 0 A.D. Are they all going to hell?

The fast answer is "yes", in the sense that they are damned. That's no so terrible, really, since damnation only means a person cannot progress further.

Want to share where that idea came from? That's a bit of a new take on it to me, and I've heard a LOT of opinions on exactly what Christianity says will really occur to the 'unsaved'.

Sure. It came from scripture. There are many to choose from, but John 3:5 is a good one for the first part of what I said and 1 Corinthians 15:40-41 is a good one for the second part.

 

[gcomeau]

After re-reading all of John 3 and Corinthians 15 I see nothing there that supports your particular claim about the specific fate of the unsaved. Could you elaborate what part of either one specifies that all those not saved are placed in some kind of neutral holding pattern forever living out perfectly happy lives?

 

[froggy]

try revelation 20:15 and whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

 

[BigBarry]

I found a bible in my house once, so I threw it out.

 

[froggy]

I found a bible in my house once, so I threw it out.

well are ya bragging or complaining?

 

[trueblue]

After re-reading all of John 3 and Corinthians 15 I see nothing there that supports your particular claim about the specific fate of the unsaved. Could you elaborate what part of either one specifies that all those not saved are placed in some kind of neutral holding pattern forever living out perfectly happy lives?

Sure. Scripture makes it clear that those who are not baptized are damned (try Mark 16:16 for another reference to this). What does that mean? Certainly not misery and woe forever (which would imply some awful harsh, nasty things about a God most Christians claim is our "Heavenly Father"). Nor is there scriptural support for that idea. Rather, it seems that people are the ones who insist someone has to be miserable. Consider instead a river dam, which stops forward progress. This seems more likely of the merciful God whose stated objectives for us include resurrection and eternal life.

If this is true, then it is no longer as black and white as heaven and hell (poor guys just south of that borderline). There must be more. Indeed, Paul assures us in Corinthians that there are at least three degrees of glorious resurrection: celestial like the sun, terrestrial like the moon and a degree for the stars. Why would we need three types of resurrection for only one heaven? And are there resurrections without glory?

There must be some wiggle room between simply passing or failing here. What about the excellent person who was never baptized? Would you cast him to hell? Or does it make sense that a just but loving God would prepare a place for him where he can be happy, even though he has not met the qualifications for eternal life?

It makes sense to me that there must be different levels of heaven; that it's not a system of acquiring so many good deeds or saying so many prayers to pass some arbitrary, unknown benchmark. A person who was resurrected terrestrially is damned in the sense that the moon cannot be as bright as the sun, but receives some glory (and is therefore happy to some degree) all the same.

 

[froggy]

After re-reading all of John 3 and Corinthians 15 I see nothing there that supports your particular claim about the specific fate of the unsaved. Could you elaborate what part of either one specifies that all those not saved are placed in some kind of neutral holding pattern forever living out perfectly happy lives?

Sure. Scripture makes it clear that those who are not baptized are damned (try Mark 16:16 for another reference to this). What does that mean? Certainly not misery and woe forever (which would imply some awful harsh, nasty things about a God most Christians claim is our "Heavenly Father"). Nor is there scriptural support for that idea. Rather, it seems that people are the ones who insist someone has to be miserable. Consider instead a river dam, which stops forward progress. This seems more likely of the merciful God whose stated objectives for us include resurrection and eternal life.

If this is true, then it is no longer as black and white as heaven and hell (poor guys just south of that borderline). There must be more. Indeed, Paul assures us in Corinthians that there are at least three degrees of glorious resurrection: celestial like the sun, terrestrial like the moon and a degree for the stars. Why would we need three types of resurrection for only one heaven? And are there resurrections without glory?

There must be some wiggle room between simply passing or failing here. What about the excellent person who was never baptized? Would you cast him to hell? Or does it make sense that a just but loving God would prepare a place for him where he can be happy, even though he has not met the qualifications for eternal life?

It makes sense to me that there must be different levels of heaven; that it's not a system of acquiring so many good deeds or saying so many prayers to pass some arbitrary, unknown benchmark. A person who was resurrected terrestrially is damned in the sense that the moon cannot be as bright as the sun, but receives some glory (and is therefore happy to some degree) all the same.

god lets you decide wheter you condem yourself or not remember if you turn down his offer to be saved it you doing the condemning you dont get there by works or good deeds either

 

[trueblue]

So how do you decide to condemn yourself or not?

 

[trueblue]

And why be good if it isn't necessary to go to heaven?

 

[JBeukema]

If jesus was perfect and sinless, why did he get baptized by a man?

 

[trueblue]

He says himself that he was baptized to fulfill all righteousness. I'm not sure where you're going with this...

 

[THE LIGHT]

I found a bible in my house once, so I threw it out.

mmm... yes...the TRUTH is a dangerous thing.

 

[THE LIGHT]

do muslims believe in gods son jesus christ? and if not how do they expect to get to heaven.

They get to heaven based on prophessing faith in Allah.