Arming people in movie theaters

[WildBillKelsoe]

I'm not going to research stopped mass shootings to see if or how often a woman stopped one.

It is possible that that woman could have shoot the mass shooter if she had had her gun.

Without it, she certainly could not.

I don't know why you assume women are so incapable of armed resistance or force.

300 million fucking guns in this country

Where are all the gun owners to "keep us safe"

It is a myth

Non sequitur.

We were discussing your belief that a woman cannot use a gun effectively.

You called it a "NRA fantasy".

An aside: I want to go out on a limb here.


I want to predict, based on nothing but you being a liberal, that you

a. Do not believe that a woman can use a gun effectively.

AND

b. support women in combat.

Am I correct? Yes or no.

A. I don't believe most untrained women could handle an active shooter situation

B. I support trained women with demonstrated proficiency being in combat

LOL!

It doesn't take special training to deduce that a mass shooter needs to be stopped and to aim and shoot, for a man or a woman.

Ask our law enforcement about active shooter training and the confusion during the "fog of war"

Ask law enforcement how they react when arriving at a scene with multiple people shooting.

An armed civilian will bring the situation to a conclusion before the cops arrive.

 

[2aguy]

Yes....tell that to the woman you twits disarmed and who had to watch her parents die because you guys made it a felony to exercise her right.......then she had to go in, get elected to office and change your stupid law....

Tell this woman and her family she was shot in the theater because guns make us safer.

13 million people carry guns for self defense....this guy was not legally carrying that gun...so he isn't even in that 13 million.

Guns are used 1.5 million times a year to stop violent criminal attack and to save lives, according to bill clinton and barak obama.....

Guns are used by violent criminals 8,124 times a year in an illegal act to commit murder.......

So, 1.5 million defensive uses vs. 8,124 times to commit murder, the majority of which are criminals shooting other criminals....

you are wrong.

"""Guns are used 1.5 million times a year to stop violent criminal attack"

Prove that or STFU. Or else go Kleck and Gertz yourself. Those footnotes to these so-called facts are based on the authors' books, and the studies they site were no doubt funded by the NRA.

What a fucking joke: Fact Sheet: Guns Save Lives | Section 8: Arm Yourself With The Facts | Just For Skeptics

Twit...the 1.5 is from a study created for bill clinton through his Department of Justice by two rabidly anti gun researchers...moron......and obama had his CDC study all available data on guns in 2013...spent 10 million dollars doing it....I will also link to that study........

Here you go twit.....tell me which ones of these studies was funded by the NRA...twit.

I just averaged the studies......which were conducted by different researchers, from both private and public researchers, over a period of 40 years looking specifically at guns and self defense....the name of the researcher is first, then the year then the number of times they determined guns were used for self defense......notice how many of them there are and how many of them were done by gun grabbers like the clinton Justice Dept. and the obama CDC

And these aren't all of the studies either...there are more...and they support the ones below.....

A quick guide to the studies and the numbers.....the full lay out of what was studied by each study is in the links....
GunCite-Gun Control-How Often Are Guns Used in Self-Defense

GunCite Frequency of Defensive Gun Use in Previous Surveys

Field...1976....3,052,717 ( no cops, military)

DMIa 1978...2,141,512 ( no cops, military)

L.A. TIMES...1994...3,609,68 ( no cops, military)

Kleck......1994...2.5 million ( no cops, military)

Obama's CDC....2013....500,000--3million

--------------------


Bordua...1977...1,414,544

DMIb...1978...1,098,409 ( no cops, military)

Hart...1981...1.797,461 ( no cops, military)

Mauser...1990...1,487,342 ( no cops, military)

Gallup...1993...1,621,377 ( no cops, military)

DEPT. OF JUSTICE...1994...1.5 million ( the bill clinton study)

Journal of Quantitative Criminology--- 989,883 times per year."

(Based on survey data from a 2000 study published in the Journal of Quantitative Criminology,[17] U.S. civilians use guns to defend themselves and others from crime at least 989,883 times per year.[18])

Paper: "Measuring Civilian Defensive Firearm Use: A Methodological Experiment." By David McDowall and others. Journal of Quantitative Criminology, March 2000. http://www.springerlink.com/content/rngn3274255v6j67/

-------------------------------------------
Ohio...1982...771,043

Gallup...1991...777,152

Tarrance... 1994... 764,036 (no cops, military)

Lawerence Southwich Jr. 400,000 fewer violent crimes and at least 800,000 violent crimes deterred..

*****************************************

If you take the studies from that Kleck cites in his paper, 16 of them....and you only average the ones that exclude military and police shootings..the average becomes 2 million...I use those studies because I have the details on them...and they are still 10 studies (including Kleck's)....

The NCVS is by far the largest and estimates 108k.

And so defeated at every turn, as the actual, real world shows you are wrong you resort to lying......a very childlike behavior...

the National Crime Victimization Survey is the least accurate measure of even the crime it is supposed to be measuring.....it is not a gun self defense study....and does not even directly ask about gun use anywhere in the survey......

Only a child would think not asking about a topic is the best way to find out about that topic....

 

[2aguy]

What could make more sense than having armed people on a movie theater?

I TOLD you to stop talking!

You mean people simply watching a movie with a legally owned and carried gun on their hip that they never use to commit crimes or shoot people........?

 

[2aguy]

Another example of lack of training.

I am strongly pro-gun. But not without a substantial amount of training by gun-owners. Especially those who wish to move about in public while carrying a gun.

Then you support gun control where only those with money can exercise their right....since training requirements are one of the tools to keep people from owning guns...that is how they do it in Europe......

 

[2aguy]

I think it's in Texas where you can carry in bars.

Tennessee
Arizona
Georgia
Virginia

a bunch of other states allow cc in restaurants that serve alcohol

Yes.....wasn't it the Luby's Cafe shooting and Suzanah Gratia Hupp who lost her parent's in the shooting who lobbied the Texas legislature to change the concealed carry law?

She was required by law to leave her gun in her car because Luby's served alcohol.....making it one of the first big cases of a gun free zone becoming a killing zone, when the guy drove his truck through the window and came out of his truck murdering people....including her 2 parents....

She also said had she had her gun, she had a direct opportunity to shoot the guy, but couldn't because the gun free zone disarmed her.....

Lubys in Killeen did not serve alcohol

The fantasy that this woman could have stopped the massacre if only she had her trusty shoot'n iron is an NRA fantasy

Err, why do you assume that?

Show me an example where an armed woman stopped a mass killing

Otherwise, we are talking NRA fantasies

Suzanah Gratia Hubb, Luby's cafe....oh...that's right......she was disarmed because of the laws in the 1990s and was unable to stop the mass shooter who killed her parents....even though she had clear opportunities and actually had a gun...but was forced by you nutters to leave it in her car......

 

[2aguy]

Yes.....wasn't it the Luby's Cafe shooting and Suzanah Gratia Hupp who lost her parent's in the shooting who lobbied the Texas legislature to change the concealed carry law?

She was required by law to leave her gun in her car because Luby's served alcohol.....making it one of the first big cases of a gun free zone becoming a killing zone, when the guy drove his truck through the window and came out of his truck murdering people....including her 2 parents....

She also said had she had her gun, she had a direct opportunity to shoot the guy, but couldn't because the gun free zone disarmed her.....

Lubys in Killeen did not serve alcohol

The fantasy that this woman could have stopped the massacre if only she had her trusty shoot'n iron is an NRA fantasy

Err, why do you assume that?

Show me an example where an armed woman stopped a mass killing

Otherwise, we are talking NRA fantasies

I'm not going to research stopped mass shootings to see if or how often a woman stopped one.

It is possible that that woman could have shoot the mass shooter if she had had her gun.

Without it, she certainly could not.

I don't know why you assume women are so incapable of armed resistance or force.

300 million fucking guns in this country

Where are all the gun owners to "keep us safe"

It is a myth

Americans use guns to stop violent criminal attack 1.5 million times a year, according to bill clinton and barak obama.....

And we post story after story of armed americans stopping crimes and mass shootings....just check Thearmedcitizen, or any number of sites that collect these stories....

You are lying...you know you are lying, you should stop that childish behavior and grow up....be an adult...

 

[2aguy]

Yes.....wasn't it the Luby's Cafe shooting and Suzanah Gratia Hupp who lost her parent's in the shooting who lobbied the Texas legislature to change the concealed carry law?

She was required by law to leave her gun in her car because Luby's served alcohol.....making it one of the first big cases of a gun free zone becoming a killing zone, when the guy drove his truck through the window and came out of his truck murdering people....including her 2 parents....

She also said had she had her gun, she had a direct opportunity to shoot the guy, but couldn't because the gun free zone disarmed her.....

Lubys in Killeen did not serve alcohol

The fantasy that this woman could have stopped the massacre if only she had her trusty shoot'n iron is an NRA fantasy

Err, why do you assume that?

Show me an example where an armed woman stopped a mass killing

Otherwise, we are talking NRA fantasies

I'm not going to research stopped mass shootings to see if or how often a woman stopped one.

It is possible that that woman could have shoot the mass shooter if she had had her gun.

Without it, she certainly could not.

I don't know why you assume women are so incapable of armed resistance or force.

300 million fucking guns in this country

Where are all the gun owners to "keep us safe"

It is a myth

Here you go...just some of the stories...

Yes....this woman wakes up at 6.am. to be pistol whipped by 3 armed home invaders.....while her 2 children are sleeping. She manages to get to her pistol and shoots the a******s and they run. She manages to hit at least one them who apparently assumed room temperature.

Too bad she had that gun. Now that poor, violent sociopath was killed. It is really a shame when 3 gun toting, violent sociopaths can't enter a home at 6 a.m., pistol whip the woman in the home, and who knows what else they planned, and without getting shot at. Something really needs to be done....she should never have had that gun in the first place...I am sure had she not had that gun.....and other than the pistol whipping, these 3 violent sociopaths meant her no harm.....er.....other than the pistol whipping......

What kind of country do we live in when even violent sociopaths aren't safe from gun violence....?

DGU of the Day: Trotwood Ohio Woman Defeats Three Home Invaders - The Truth About Guns

Three men break into a home in Trotwood, Ohio. [Click here to watch the video.] They’re all armed. It is before 6 am, just three days after Christmas. One of the men is armed with a Tec-9 pistol. He enters last. The other two hold what appear to be conventional semi-auto pistols. They bypass two sleeping children to find the mother. The surveillance video shows the three following the mother after they pistol whipped her in the laundry room.

The man directly behind her has the Tec-9. Presumably holds her at gunpoint while the other two attempt to drag off a safe, in a room with two more children. While the two men are occupied with the safe, the woman breaks free from her captor, accesses a hidden pistol, and starts to fire.

All three run, but the Tec-9 gunman, Azikiwe Presley, is mortally wounded. His body is found 100 yards from the house. From wdtn.com:

“I got my gun and I started shooting and they ran,” the female caller told dispatchers. “They all three had guns, I’m confused … they must not have had bullets because after I pulled the trigger they just took off, instead of firing back. I don’t know if I hit one or not, I don’t see blood anywhere.”

In this case, the recipient of female dedication to protecting innocent life ran a hundred yards and died. It is not uncommon for a man who is fatally shot to run that far, even with a heart/lung shot. As he was likely the one holding the woman at gunpoint, and the closest, greatest, threat with the Tec-9, it is not surprising that he drew the lethal ticket. Whether through choice or happenstance, the mother made the right tactical decision.

Now....here is the thing.....the gun grabbers on U.S. will first tell us that this never happens.

Next they will tell us that the defender with a gun will never be able to actually use the gun because they aren't Navy Seals.

Next they will say, there is no way a good woman with a gun will ever win because she will be easily disarmed.

So......3 men with guns grab a woman with the element of surprise. They hit her, probably injuring her. She manages to get her gun and shoot the three of them out of her house killing one of the a******s in the process.........and I didn't see anywhere in the article where she was the first woman Navy Seal.

************************
Homeowner Stays Armed In The House — Finds Knife-Wielding Man Inside And It Turns Out Great!

WILLMAR, MINNESOTA — A Willmar homeowner returned home to find a man wielding a knife in the middle of his living room. Using his pistol, which he was licensed to carry, he held the suspect at gunpoint and called 911. During the encounter, he allowed the suspect to leave after putting his buck knife down. Police caught up to the suspect, 37-year-old by the name of Shane Fellers. He was found inside a vehicle being operated by an unknown woman. Both were taken into custody and, according to the West Central Tribune, Fellers was held on a $70,000 unconditional bail for first degree burglary and burglary with a dangerous weapon. He also allegedly supplied the police officer with an incorrect name when he was initially apprehended — tacking on an additional misdemeanor.**********************
Just saw this on the news....Predfan posted it in the firearms thread but this is about the owner of the store.....on the local news he thanked the new concealed carry law and the fact that his employee is a concealed carry permit holder.......I never thought I would see this in Chicago....

T-Mobile store employee shoots 2 armed robbery suspects near 95th, Jeffrey

The T-Mobile store in the 2000-block of East 95th St. was left riddled with bullet holes. If not for the employee carrying a weapon with a concealed carry license, the manager of the store says he might be telling a different story.

"I think concealed carry is a great opportunity for managers, workers, employees to protect themselves in these cases. And our employee did a great job to protect themselves and the other employee," said Neil Tadros, store manager.

He says two men entered the store and acted like they were shopping for phones for a few minutes, then pulled out guns.

One employee ran to the back to call for help while the other pulled out his own gun and fired at the two suspects. He hit one of them in the groin and the arm, and the other in the abdomen and the arm.

The men ran from the store with the employee chasing them, on the phone giving a description to police.

The suspects then drove to a nearby hospital where police took them into custody.

Neighbors say the cell phone store has been robbed several times in the last month. Ed Brown was working in the salon next door.


We need more of these stories and then the criminals will start breaking into stores when no one is in them...that way they won't get shot.....

--------------
Concealed Nation Fan Fends Off Three Home Invaders With M&P Shield

A father and son successfully fought off three home invaders in an early morning all-out fight for survival. Columbus police confirm that there was a home invasion in vicinity of 2:30 am where three suspected attackers kicked in the front door and immediately set to assaulting the son who was first to respond. Thankfully, his father was in the other room and able to flush out the attackers — using nothing less than his future everyday carry pistol, the M&P Shield.

“I come out and this one little one come tried to attack me and I took him out right away, one in the white shirt tried attacking me from the side, tried choking me and that kind of stuff,” says Shawn Howell, “Next thing you know he loses power and I jump up to get up and ready to start cleaning clocks but I just darted into my room… I come out and they were flying out the door so fast, I never seen anybody run so fast in my life… they knew what was coming,they knew I was going for a gun.”

According to both the victims’ testimony and police statements released through Channel 48 – Nebraska, the attackers fled before the future-concealed carrier could put bullets on target but he allegedly pursued them to their vehicle to “mark the truck”.

Both victims were transported to a nearby hospital where they were treated for superficial wounds sustained during the assault. Both the father and son were attending a concealed carry course to get their concealed carry permits and neither were expecting an attack of this magnitude to occur in their home.

---------


Burglars call 911 on themselves as homeowner holds them at gunpoint

A pair of men who were breaking into a Woodland, Washington, home Monday night got quite a scare when the owner of the house caught them redhanded.

Bill Lahti was surprised to find his home had been burglarized last week, partly because the home, which belonged to Lahti’s great-grandparents years ago and was handed down to him, isn’t exactly in an easy to get to location. The rural property has been dubbed by the Lahti family as “the hill,” and given the home’s history, Lahti was especially appalled at the break-in.

“I kept coming back periodically to check in,” Lahti told KATU. “So, Monday night, I roll up and there’s their truck backed up to the front door in the yard. (The) door was about – probably – four inches open. I could see the light through there. So, I came out there, jumped out of my truck, kicked the door open and there they were.”

Lahti told the two men to get down on their knees as he held them at gunpoint. He was going to call the police on them, but Lahti couldn’t get his phone to work. With his gun still trained on them, he instructed the crooks to make the call themselves. With few options, the suspects complied.

-----



Concealed Carrier Holds Burglar At Gunpoint With Her FNX .45

CLEVELAND, TENNESSEE — A woman successfully subdued a would-be burglar outside her home using her FNX .45. The suspect, James Jeffrey Dunn, was allegedly trying to break in through her front door late at night. She got her handgun and confronted the burglar, according to WRCB. Once at the doorway, she yelled through the door for him to stay put and not move. Moments later, she confronted him head-on — handgun drawn and ready to go.

via WRCB

“I tried to order him to stay right where he was at and I pointed the gun at him and I came running off the porch and I came within 10 feet of him and he laid the bicycle down and he crumpled on top of the bicycle,” she says.

She held him at gunpoint until Cleveland Police arrived and arrested Dunn, 35, on charges of aggravated burglary, theft, and burglary of a motor vehicle. Police note that Dunn had an arrest sheet tallying over 40 charges — the most recent being only 6 hours prior to his attempted burglary of this concealed carrier.

“We went over this when we got my concealed carry permit, these types of scenarios. But I had already put that gun up and ever taken it out since, you know?” she says. “Maybe to go the range once.”

When we talk about the new generation of concealed carriers, let’s take a good long look at the realities these people are facing: hardened, career criminals unafraid to bust through the door or do damage to private property and persons. It’s a good thing this woman had the proper training she needed and the right equipment.



---------------------------------

Lancaster Woman Scares Off Bat-Wielding Attackers By Pulling Gun On Them

LANCASTER, Ohio - It happened along a walking path in Lancaster.

Dinah Burns is licensed to carry a concealed gun, but she'd only recently started taking her weapon while walking her dog.

Based on what happened, it looks like she'll make a point of carrying from now on.

"I think if they'd gotten any closer, I probably would have fired,” said Burns.

It was Monday when Burns was on a footpath near Sanderson Elementary School.

"Two gentlemen came out of the woods, one holding a baseball bat, and said 'You're coming with us'."

The men weren't deterred by Dinah's dog Gracie.

"I said, 'Well, what do you want?,' and as I was saying that I reached in to my pocket and slipped my gun out, slipped the safety off as I pulled it out. As I was doing that the other gentleman came toward me and raised the baseball bat. And, I pointed the gun at them and said, 'I have this and I'm not afraid to use it.'"

The men took off and so far have eluded police. Dinah posted about the incident on Facebook to alert friends and neighbors, to criticism by some.

"Most of the males' opinion was, 'Why didn't you shoot them?'"

Easy to second-guess a decision made under pressure, based on her concealed carry training, and police agree.

"To get out of a situation, back out, get out of it as much as you can without having to discharge your firearm."

"I will say it's a good thing to go from a place of danger to a place of safety, however you get that done,” said Sgt. Matt Chambers, Lancaster Police.

"Very thankful that it turned out the way it did, and hope it doesn't happen again, but I will be prepared."

NRA-ILA | Armed homeowner scares off attacker, KTVA, Anchorage, Alaska 11/13/15

A homeowner was in their house in Anchorage, Alaska when they heard a knock at the door. The homeowner retrieved a gun and went to answer the door. Upon opening the door, an intruder pepper-sprayed the homeowner, prompting the homeowner to fire at the criminal. The attacker fled the scene. (KTVA, Anchorage, Alaska 11/13/15)

---------

NRA-ILA | Elderly couple fights off real monsters on Halloween, Helena-Arkansas.com, Helena, Ark. 11/01/15

An elderly couple were at home Halloween night, when the doorbell rang. Prepared to hand out candy to trick-or-treaters, the wife opened the door to find four armed robbers, at least two of whom were armed with guns.

The robbers forced their way inside the home, where the husband was sitting in a recliner. Upon learning of the home invasion, the husband retrieved a gun and fired at the criminals, prompting the home invaders to flee. (Helena-Arkansas.com, Helena, Ark. 11/01/15)

​

​

 

[2aguy]

Moron...

Regal theaters in my area are gun free. I will contact the national chain and ask them about the Renton one. And this guy was drunk, breaking the law by carrying a gun while drunk, drunk in public and who knows how he got to the theater and we don't even know if he was carrying the gun legally, originally before he started breaking the law

Like your average twit, you claim a gun free zone would keep this guy from bringing a gun into it.....only someone with a child like level of emotional and reasoning ability would believe that.

And this probable gun free zone didn't keep that woman safe....and the gun free zone at the Colorado theater didn't keep those people safe either....

So keep creating gun free killing zones...one day normal people may come to realize how stupid and un safe gun free zones are.

By voting in democrats, who then appoint soft on gun crime prosecutors and judges and by creating legal gun free zones you are doing far more to get innocent people killed ....and on top of that you and your allies in the gun control movement fight tooth and nail to keep gun safety education out of the schools where it might just save the lives of children....

Again, you think like a child.....try to grow up.

There's no way to legislate immaturity and irresponsibility until a crime is committed. Then the damage is done. Ergo the need to curtail the extensions of their irresponsibility: guns in places where they simply don't belong. You think like an NRA drone.

You think like a child. And this theater was a gun free zone, this guy was not allowed by law to carry a gun while intoxicated....how did those laws work to keep this from happening twit?

See, an adult realizes that the law is there to punish people who break it...and that is exactly what is going to happen here. No new laws are needed to deal with this, he was arrested, he will go to jail and his ability to carry a gun...if it wasn't already gone, will be taken, and he will be sued for damages

That is how every law works......if you speed 36 in a 35 zone, you get a ticket.......you don't get a ticket before you break the speed limit, twit.

And you simply cannot think. The NRA does it for you.

Look, I understand......you can't help thinking like a child....your brain just didn't develop properly......the part that handles the truth, facts, and reality as well as the difference between Right and Wrong and Good and Evil are still at the reasoning ability of a 12 year old...I get it....

Just don't post as if you know what you are talking about....

Take your own advice. You are posting opinions that favor your view, not objective data. Learn the difference.

Sorry, twit. This asshole is more biased than you are:

DEFENSIVE GUN USE: GARY KLECK MISFIRES AGAIN​

Defensive Gun Use: Gary Kleck Misfires Again

When Gary Kleck can’t defend, he attacks. Instead of offering new insight, Kleck instead baselessly speculates on our motives, suggesting we “hope that total gun prohibition will one day be politically achievable.”

To be clear: prohibition is not something we have ever suggested in any of our writing, all of which can be found at armedwithreason.com. Not that it should matter, but neither of us are merely “investment counselors” either, as Kleck suggests. In fact, DeFilippis spent most of last year helping design and analyze surveys much larger than Kleck’s.

The Florida State professor even goes so far as to describe Dr. David Hemenway, director of Harvard’s Injury Control Research Center and author of more than 130 articles and five books in Economics and Public Health (a total that includes two decisive rebuttals to Kleck and several surveys), as “a man named David Hemenway… who is also untrained in survey methods.”

Rather than confront the significant, multidisciplinary research showing that the false-positive problem is ubiquitous when measuring rare events, Kleck pretends the problem is negligible, and links us to a 1998 “rebuttal” where he references surveys that have nothing to do with rare events. As Dr. Hemenway has extensively detailed, suggesting that false negatives could somehow outweigh false positives is indulging in fantasy.

Yeah....seen this b.s. before and it was shown to be crap...hemenway used to work for Handguncontrol inc. he is a rabid, lying anti gunner.........his research has been shown to be crap.....

 

[2aguy]

Yes.....wasn't it the Luby's Cafe shooting and Suzanah Gratia Hupp who lost her parent's in the shooting who lobbied the Texas legislature to change the concealed carry law?

She was required by law to leave her gun in her car because Luby's served alcohol.....making it one of the first big cases of a gun free zone becoming a killing zone, when the guy drove his truck through the window and came out of his truck murdering people....including her 2 parents....

She also said had she had her gun, she had a direct opportunity to shoot the guy, but couldn't because the gun free zone disarmed her.....

Lubys in Killeen did not serve alcohol

The fantasy that this woman could have stopped the massacre if only she had her trusty shoot'n iron is an NRA fantasy

Err, why do you assume that?

Show me an example where an armed woman stopped a mass killing

Otherwise, we are talking NRA fantasies

I'm not going to research stopped mass shootings to see if or how often a woman stopped one.

It is possible that that woman could have shoot the mass shooter if she had had her gun.

Without it, she certainly could not.

I don't know why you assume women are so incapable of armed resistance or force.

300 million fucking guns in this country

Where are all the gun owners to "keep us safe"

It is a myth

And more...mass shooting events stopped by concealed carriers.....and one of them a woman...

Some details to help you make your guess....

Wisconsin Sikh temple shooting - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia ( 6 dead, 4 wounded)

Charleston church shooting - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia ( 9 dead)


vs.


Deputies Osceola pastor shot church janitor in self-defense ( 0 dead)

6 Shot At New Life Church Gunman 2 Churchgoers Dead - 7NEWS Denver TheDenverChannel.com ( 2 dead, 3 wounded)

Remember This SC Concealed Carrier Stops Mass Shooting During Church Service. No Casualties. ( 0 dead)
[FONT=Roboto, sans-serif][/FONT]
[FONT=Roboto, sans-serif]**********[/FONT]
[FONT=Roboto, sans-serif][/FONT]

No guns: 15 dead

Sikh temple ( 6 dead, 4 wounded)

Charleston ( 9 dead)


Parishioners with guns: 2 dead

Osceola ( 0 dead )

New life ( 2 dead, 3 wounded)

South Carolina shotgun guy ( 0 dead)


Temple massacre has some Sikhs mulling gun ownership

The president of the Sikh Temple of Wisconsin had only a butter knife on hand, which he used to fight the gunman. He was killed, but his heroic actions were credited for slowing the shooter. Guns were not allowed in the Sikh Temple of Wisconsin.

“No guns [were] allowed in the temple,” Kulbir Singh, an attendee of the Sikh Temple of Wisconsin, told FoxNews.com. “Everyone knows that it’s not allowed, anywhere in the temple.”​

 

[rightwinger]

What could make more sense than having armed people on a movie theater?

I TOLD you to stop talking!

You mean people simply watching a movie with a legally owned and carried gun on their hip that they never use to commit crimes or shoot people........?

Don't make me tell you to shut up again......and STOP KICKING MY FUCKING SEAT

 

[blackhawk]

Happened during a showing of 13 Hours....wonder what his political persuasion is?

Don't know but I saw 13 hours last Monday the theater was full and there was no gun incident. So if we go by the subtle implication that because he was in 13 hours he 's conservative then we have to believe the theater I was in was full of law abiding responsible gun owning conservatives.

 

[jon_berzerk]

Tennessee
Arizona
Georgia
Virginia

a bunch of other states allow cc in restaurants that serve alcohol

Yes.....wasn't it the Luby's Cafe shooting and Suzanah Gratia Hupp who lost her parent's in the shooting who lobbied the Texas legislature to change the concealed carry law?

She was required by law to leave her gun in her car because Luby's served alcohol.....making it one of the first big cases of a gun free zone becoming a killing zone, when the guy drove his truck through the window and came out of his truck murdering people....including her 2 parents....

She also said had she had her gun, she had a direct opportunity to shoot the guy, but couldn't because the gun free zone disarmed her.....

Lubys in Killeen did not serve alcohol

The fantasy that this woman could have stopped the massacre if only she had her trusty shoot'n iron is an NRA fantasy

Err, why do you assume that?

Show me an example where an armed woman stopped a mass killing

Otherwise, we are talking NRA fantasies

Suzanah Gratia Hubb, Luby's cafe....oh...that's right......she was disarmed because of the laws in the 1990s and was unable to stop the mass shooter who killed her parents....even though she had clear opportunities and actually had a gun...but was forced by you nutters to leave it in her car......

oh there are examples of women that have stopped mass shooters jean assam being among them

 

[Correll]

I'm not going to research stopped mass shootings to see if or how often a woman stopped one.

It is possible that that woman could have shoot the mass shooter if she had had her gun.

Without it, she certainly could not.

I don't know why you assume women are so incapable of armed resistance or force.

300 million fucking guns in this country

Where are all the gun owners to "keep us safe"

It is a myth

Non sequitur.

We were discussing your belief that a woman cannot use a gun effectively.

You called it a "NRA fantasy".

An aside: I want to go out on a limb here.


I want to predict, based on nothing but you being a liberal, that you

a. Do not believe that a woman can use a gun effectively.

AND

b. support women in combat.

Am I correct? Yes or no.

A. I don't believe most untrained women could handle an active shooter situation

B. I support trained women with demonstrated proficiency being in combat

LOL!

It doesn't take special training to deduce that a mass shooter needs to be stopped and to aim and shoot, for a man or a woman.

Ask our law enforcement about active shooter training and the confusion during the "fog of war"

Ask law enforcement how they react when arriving at a scene with multiple people shooting.

I've discussed it with law enforcement many times.

WHat's your point?

 

[Correll]

300 million fucking guns in this country

Where are all the gun owners to "keep us safe"

It is a myth

Non sequitur.

We were discussing your belief that a woman cannot use a gun effectively.

You called it a "NRA fantasy".

An aside: I want to go out on a limb here.


I want to predict, based on nothing but you being a liberal, that you

a. Do not believe that a woman can use a gun effectively.

AND

b. support women in combat.

Am I correct? Yes or no.

A. I don't believe most untrained women could handle an active shooter situation

B. I support trained women with demonstrated proficiency being in combat

Hopefully you don't believe most untrained men could handle an active shooter situation, either?

Most untrained men COULD handle an active shooter situation.

It does not take special training to deduce that the man shooting people at random needs to be stopped and to aim and shoot.

Could a woman, as well?

IMO, yes.

 

[MikeK]

Another example of lack of training.

I am strongly pro-gun. But not without a substantial amount of training by gun-owners. Especially those who wish to move about in public while carrying a gun.

Then you support gun control where only those with money can exercise their right....since training requirements are one of the tools to keep people from owning guns...that is how they do it in Europe......

You are assuming that firearms training will be costly but that is not necessarily so. In case you've never read any of my political comments it's important that you know I am a socialist. Where the Second Amendment is concerned I believe the money government spends on promoting and enforcing gun control measures would be better spent on subsidizing firearms training for citizens.

I don't know how old you are, but when I was a boy there were (government subsidized) marksmanship and firearms training sessions conducted twice each month in the gymnasium of PS 10 (grade school) in Brooklyn, NY. Boys from 13 and up learned about guns with the goal of become expert riflemen and once each month, accompanied by a parent, we brought our .22 rifles to the outdoor range in Canarsie or upstate in Nyack.

My first high-caliber rifle, an .03 Springfield, was bought by my father from the government for eleven dollars through the Director of Civilian Marksmanship, now the "Civilian Marksmanship Program (quietly modifed by Obama). Are you acquainted with it? Back then ('40s - '50s) the government wanted citizens to be armed and well-trained.

 

[Correll]

Another example of lack of training.

I am strongly pro-gun. But not without a substantial amount of training by gun-owners. Especially those who wish to move about in public while carrying a gun.

Then you support gun control where only those with money can exercise their right....since training requirements are one of the tools to keep people from owning guns...that is how they do it in Europe......

You are assuming that firearms training will be costly but that is not necessarily so. In case you've never read any of my political comments it's important that you know I am a socialist. Where the Second Amendment is concerned I believe the money government spends on promoting and enforcing gun control measures would be better spent on subsidizing firearms training for citizens.

I don't know how old you are, but when I was a boy there were (government subsidized) marksmanship and firearms training sessions conducted twice each month in the gymnasium of PS 10 (grade school) in Brooklyn, NY. Boys from 13 and up learned about guns with the goal of become expert riflemen and once each month we brought our .22 rifles to the outdoor range in Canarsie.

My first high-caliber rifle, an .03 Springfield, was bought by my father from the government for eleven dollars through the Civilian Marksmanship Program. (Are you acquainted with that?) Back then ('50s) the government wanted citizens to be armed and well-trained.

THE PURPOSE of proposed mandatory training is to raise the cost and difficulty of owning a firearm.

 

[couch protester]

Another example of lack of training.

I am strongly pro-gun. But not without a substantial amount of training by gun-owners. Especially those who wish to move about in public while carrying a gun.

Then you support gun control where only those with money can exercise their right....since training requirements are one of the tools to keep people from owning guns...that is how they do it in Europe......

You are assuming that firearms training will be costly but that is not necessarily so. In case you've never read any of my political comments it's important that you know I am a socialist. Where the Second Amendment is concerned I believe the money government spends on promoting and enforcing gun control measures would be better spent on subsidizing firearms training for citizens.

I don't know how old you are, but when I was a boy there were (government subsidized) marksmanship and firearms training sessions conducted twice each month in the gymnasium of PS 10 (grade school) in Brooklyn, NY. Boys from 13 and up learned about guns with the goal of become expert riflemen and once each month we brought our .22 rifles to the outdoor range in Canarsie.

My first high-caliber rifle, an .03 Springfield, was bought by my father from the government for eleven dollars through the Civilian Marksmanship Program. (Are you acquainted with that?) Back then ('50s) the government wanted citizens to be armed and well-trained.

Should we have sexual training on how to wear a condom to prevent being killed by aids also or defensive stunt driving classes to prevent car accidents and hitting civilians or drone workshops on how not to bomb children or any class to prevent deaths?

 

[MikeK]

Show me an example where an armed woman stopped a mass killing

Otherwise, we are talking NRA fantasies

In relative terms there are not that many mass killings, nor is there a proportionate number of armed women -- or armed citizens in the general sense for that matter.

 

[MikeK]

[...]

A. I don't believe most untrained women could handle an active shooter situation

[...]

Or untrained men.

Training and sensible gun laws are the keys to all the gun problems in America.

 

[MikeK]

Should we have sexual training on how to wear a condom to prevent being killed by aids[...]

Do you really think slipping a condom on your gadget and being adequately proficient in the use and handling of a modern firearm is a valid comparison?
If so, please be assured you are quite mistaken.

also or defensive stunt driving classes to prevent car accidents and hitting civilians

While defensive stunt driving classes would be constructive such an extreme isn't necessary to enable competent operation of ordinary automobiles. But a minimal level of training is necessary to obtain a license to drive.

Did someone teach you to drive? Or did you buy your first car without ever being in a driver-seat before, then just get in and drive away?

I once watched a woman buy a .38 revolver in a gun shop. She knew absolutely nothing about the weapon and had to be shown how to load it. But she did the paperwork and walked out with her gun and a free box of fifty.

Hopefully she has someone who will train her. But one can only wonder how many other similarly untrained individuals have guns at home or, worse, are walking around with one in a pocket, purse or concealed holster. These individuals are responsible for the vast majority of gun accidents and misuse.

Proper training would eliminate most gun accidents and misuse.