Arizona State House Republicans Expels Election Denier Liz Harris.

[pknopp]

AFAIK, Perjury is knowingly providing false testimony under oath, with the intent and purpose of altering the outcome of a trial or some other official proceeding.

Inducing someone else to commit perjury is a crime, sure. I haven't seen anything that makes me think this fits. Was the witness convicted of perjury for her statements? Was it even given under oath? Most witnesses are not sworn in.

If the Rep has committed a criminal act of some sort, that could be grounds for expulsion (imho)- but a mere accusation?

In a bipartisan manner, those with the insight saw it that way.

I wasn't there. If anything is done in a bipartisan manner today there has to be a there, there.

 

[para bellum]

In a bipartisan manner, those with the insight saw it that way.

I wasn't there. If anything is done in a bipartisan manner today there has to be a there, there.

Or maybe they just hated her guts- we don't know. The popularity contest is the election. She can be despised by every member of the AZ Legislature- it doesn't erase the votes of her constituents.

If expulsion is the only remedy for a rules violation, that's a process failure, if you ask me. Democracy is messy- not everyone is supposed to be in agreement all the time. The Rules of Order exist to preserve decorum- it doesn't sound to me like they were followed.

 

[pknopp]

Or maybe they just hated her guts- we don't know. The popularity contest is the election. She can be despised by every member of the AZ Legislature- it doesn't erase the votes of her constituents.

If expulsion is the only remedy for a rules violation, that's a process failure, if you ask me. Democracy is messy- not everyone is supposed to be in agreement all the time. The Rules of Order exist to preserve decorum- it doesn't sound to me like they were followed.

It was more than a rules violation. It was an illegal act.

Now if you want to argue that the proper reaction to that is to charge and arrest her, I will agree.

 

[para bellum]

It was more than a rules violation. It was an illegal act.

That's not what the OP said.

It said the Ethics Cmte. found her in violation of a rule that prohibits discrediting the House or other members, and that was the grounds for expulsion.

Now if you want to argue that the proper reaction to that is to charge and arrest her, I will agree.

And after she is convicted in a court of law, go ahead and expel her from the Legislature. I don't have any problem with that.

Is democracy so fragile that lawmakers have to cancel anyone that says something derogatory about them? What about just bringing a suit for defamation or libel?

 

[toobfreak]

I told you there would be no poll. A poll limits answers, the opposite of what I was going for.

A poll done properly would prove or disprove your claim. Having no poll at all FORCES everyone to give their own ad hoc replies, guaranteeing you get your 98 different arbitrary answers. A fraud.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

A poll done properly would prove or disprove your claim. Having no poll at all FORCES everyone to give their own ad hoc replies, guaranteeing you get your 98 different arbitrary answers. A fraud.

Then show me how it is done and prove me wrong.

Seems simple enough.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

Remember when our own members of The Cult were parroting her lies?

Sinaloa Cartel did all they could, short of killing people, to get their people: Biden and Hobbs, elected

The AZ politicans taking money from the Sinaloa cartel makes sense. It explains their actions with regards to the border.

You mess with the cartels and do not deliver, you could find yourself dead.

And she just might be linked to the Sinaloa cartel via cash payments and money laundering....

Is AZ dem party an arm of the cartels

https://thelibertydaily.com/bombshell-expert-witness-reveals-installed-az-governor-katie-hobbs-laundered-cartel-money-through-fake-deeds-and-mortgages-to-rig-elections-including-her-own/ Wouldn't surprise me. Think we can all agree we need an investigation. If govt funds can can chase Russia...

www.usmessageboard.com

 

[Rambunctious]

Remember when our own members of The Cult were parroting her lies?

Is AZ dem party an arm of the cartels

https://thelibertydaily.com/bombshell-expert-witness-reveals-installed-az-governor-katie-hobbs-laundered-cartel-money-through-fake-deeds-and-mortgages-to-rig-elections-including-her-own/ Wouldn't surprise me. Think we can all agree we need an investigation. If govt funds can can chase Russia...

www.usmessageboard.com

Just a couple of weeks ago a California elected official official was arrested for running a drug sales and transporting business in her city... no link was announced that she was working for the Cartel... but common sense says if she wasn't the Cartel would have killed her for invading their "turf".....
I think this runs deeper than anyone knows... hopefully our FBI and DEA is on top of it... but I'm doubtful and have little faith in our DOJ....

 

[pknopp]

That's not what the OP said.

It said the Ethics Cmte. found her in violation of a rule that prohibits discrediting the House or other members, and that was the grounds for expulsion.

And after she is convicted in a court of law, go ahead and expel her from the Legislature. I don't have any problem with that.

Is democracy so fragile that lawmakers have to cancel anyone that says something derogatory about them? What about just bringing a suit for defamation or libel?

Don't get me wrong. I think they should have arrested her.

Promoting someone you know is going to lie under oath undermines our entire system.

 

[my2¢]

If expulsion is the only remedy for a rules violation, that's a process failure, if you ask me. Democracy is messy- not everyone is supposed to be in agreement all the time. The Rules of Order exist to preserve decorum- it doesn't sound to me like they were followed.

They could have limited the punishment to removing Liz Harris from the legislature's elections committee, but it seems to me the Republicans were covering their ass by totally booting hers. Two months ago, Harris brought in election denier Jacqueline Breger to speak before a joint meeting of our Senate and House election committee which was considering new election laws. Breger's baseless claims of Democrats and Republican politicians taking Mexican drug cartel money and claiming the LDS church was laundering money led to an ethics violation.

I'm glad for Harris' departure. Republicans in this state did well before the likes of Liz Harris and Kari Lake.

From February:

 

[para bellum]

...Harris brought in election denier Jacqueline Breger to speak before a joint meeting of our Senate and House election committee which was considering new election laws. Breger's baseless claims of Democrats and Republican politicians taking Mexican drug cartel money and claiming the LDS church was laundering money led to an ethics violation.

Yes, I read the article and get what the fuss was over. Some Q-anon type made some loony-tune remarks in a hearing.

The AZ House was so deeply offended, that the only remedy they can come up with is to cancel the election of the person who invited the loon, and disenfranchise the voters who elected her.

Because apparently the Rules of the House are not adequate to maintain decorum in official proceedings.

Who fucking cares about some crazy person? Sue them for defamation, or whatever.

In our system, the voters choose the people who represent them. That has to be pretty fucking sacred, or the legislatures are just exclusive clubs that select their own members.

Yeah, she's a crappy choice. Everyone hates her guts. That sometimes happens. Neuter her under the rules of the House (committee assignments, etc), and let the voters of her district expel her.

What a bunch of snowflakes. Hell, Don Young once pulled a knife on John Boehner in the US House! Now we're talking, lol.

 

[para bellum]

Promoting someone you know is going to lie under oath undermines our entire system.

Not as much as cancelling out an election and disenfranchising voters does. That is the most extreme of all remedies.

 

[pknopp]

Not as much as cancelling out an election and disenfranchising voters does. That is the most extreme of all remedies.

When that happens, let us know.

 

[para bellum]

When that happens, let us know.

According to the OP, it just did.

The voters of the 13th District of the State of Arizona elected her as their representative. Their votes have been nullified by the AZ House on a 48-11 vote. Harris is no longer representing them in the State Legislature, she cannot cast her vote on proposed legislation.

The voters have been overruled by the Legislature. It happens from time to time, usually because of criminal behavior or corruption. This time they say it's because she violated one of their rules (basically insulting their dignity), which is super-important because it's "Rule 1"!

 

[pknopp]

According to the OP, it just did.

The voters of the 13th District of the State of Arizona elected her as their representative. Their votes have been nullified by the AZ House on a 48-11 vote. Harris is no longer representing them in the State Legislature, she cannot cast her vote on proposed legislation.

The voters have been overruled by the Legislature. It happens from time to time, usually because of criminal behavior or corruption. This time they say it's because she violated one of their rules (basically insulting their dignity), which is super-important because it's "Rule 1"!

Ok....misunderstood but I will argue undermining our legal system is bigger than one election IMO.

 

[para bellum]

Ok....misunderstood but I will argue undermining our legal system is bigger than one election IMO.

Well, she didn't undermine our legal system. She just offended her colleagues.

Our system has to be robust enough to handle a few moonbats without going all cancel culture.

There is a Constitutional remedy in Arizona that leaves it to the people.

Every public official in Arizona is subject to recall. They could have assigned her to the legislative equivalent of "cleaning the toilets", and then file a recall petition and gather signatures. If they get enough signatures, they can get a new election.

 

[pknopp]

Well, she didn't undermine our legal system. She just offended her colleagues.

Our system has to be robust enough to handle a few moonbats without going all cancel culture.

There is a Constitutional remedy in Arizona that leaves it to the people.

Every public official in Arizona is subject to recall. They could have assigned her to the legislative equivalent of "cleaning the toilets", and then file a recall petition and gather signatures. If they get enough signatures, they can get a new election.

Or they could have charged her.

 

[para bellum]

Or they could have charged her.

Exactly.

I haven't followed all the drama in Arizona, but I know there's some deep division in the Republican party in Maricopa Co.

Her replacement will be chosen by the Maricopa Co. Board of Supervisors, from a list provided by the party. The MCBOS are central figures in all the election controversies, so whoever they pick may not have an easy time of it...

 

[my2¢]

The AZ House was so deeply offended, that the only remedy they can come up with is to cancel the election of the person who invited the loon, and disenfranchise the voters who elected her.

Yep. That's it exactly. Heck even the liberal press after the February debacle only called for Harris to be censored and booted from the committee.

However, we have one of those "offended" at being accused of working with the Mexican drug cartel being the Speaker of the Arizona House of Representatives, Republican Ben Toma. I find it fun to see the reaction of those when this crap hits their side.

 

[EvilEyeFleegle]

Yep. That's it exactly. Heck even the liberal press after the February debacle only called for Harris to be censored and booted from the committee.

However, we have one of those "offended" at being accused of working with the Mexican drug cartel being the Speaker of the Arizona House of Representatives, Republican Ben Toma. I find it fun to see the reaction of those when this crap hits their side.

Yeah...don't piss off the Speaker~