Are we getting the leaders we deserve?

[CowboyTed]

Of course we're getting the leaders we deserve.

They're a reflection of our society, just as entertainment is.

And look at THAT.
.

There is a number of issues causing this, the order is opinion....

1. Money - US has by far the most money in there politics... If it happened in a tin pot country in Afirca you would call it corruption... The country is run by lobbying...

2. Election style - One Man One Vote has been dumped nearly everywhere in the world... It leads to partisan rants and base apeasing politicians... PR/Alernative vote make politicians more responsive and look for more compromise... They want solutions...

3. Media - US invented the News Media for profit... The US used to be never like this... News Dept used to loose money... Now we have if it bleeds it leads, partisan tv pundits telling the viewers what they want to hear ather than the truth...

4. Style of Government - US style of checks and balance has caused girdlock... No boidy has to take responsibility for anything... At least in the more Euorpean style they get elected form a government, write a plan, and implement a plan, couple of speedbumps along the way...
Don't like the result vote for someone else, you know who was in charge and what got done, simple job review...

The education is a misnomer as other countries have far less educated people and run perfectly functioning governments...

 

[Mac1958]

Of course we're getting the leaders we deserve.

They're a reflection of our society, just as entertainment is.

And look at THAT.
.

There is a number of issues causing this, the order is opinion....

1. Money - US has by far the most money in there politics... If it happened in a tin pot country in Afirca you would call it corruption... The country is run by lobbying...

2. Election style - One Man One Vote has been dumped nearly everywhere in the world... It leads to partisan rants and base apeasing politicians... PR/Alernative vote make politicians more responsive and look for more compromise... They want solutions...

3. Media - US invented the News Media for profit... The US used to be never like this... News Dept used to loose money... Now we have if it bleeds it leads, partisan tv pundits telling the viewers what they want to hear ather than the truth...

4. Style of Government - US style of checks and balance has caused girdlock... No boidy has to take responsibility for anything... At least in the more Euorpean style they get elected form a government, write a plan, and implement a plan, couple of speedbumps along the way...
Don't like the result vote for someone else, you know who was in charge and what got done, simple job review...

The education is a misnomer as other countries have far less educated people and run perfectly functioning governments...

Yeah, I think there are actually things we can do to change the system under which politicians operate, which would then change what the media can do.

Short, strict term limits, publicly-funded elections and a Balanced Budget Amendment would take away the power from those who abuse it the most.

When we allow this to continue, we are complicit.
.

 

[NightFox]

I think there are millions of us who have worked hard all our lives, kept ourselves out of trouble, raised good families who are doing the same. We deserve leaders who want to make America great again.

Well that is just it. You are working as hard as you can to survive. It's all you have time for and you certainly don't have the money to throw into the political arena.

All you are left with is a gut feeling or partisan ideology to help influence your vote. Like most, you are an uninformed voter, through no fault of your own.

I'm an elected party official.
I've run for office.
I've run campaigns for others to get elected.
My Congressman, who I helped get elected, has his District office one floor above mine.

I hardly think I'm uninformed.

I agree, based on all your partisan participation you're likely not uninformed, you're just completely misinformed, over exposure to partisan bullshit and the dickheads that shovel it will do that to an individual.

 

[NightFox]

Yeah, I think there are actually things we can do to change the system under which politicians operate, which would then change what the media can do.

Short, strict term limits, publicly-funded elections and a Balanced Budget Amendment would take away the power from those who abuse it the most.

When we allow this to continue, we are complicit.
.

Yeah that's all well and good Mac, now please list the politicians you think are going to vote to reduce their own power and kick the special interests and assorted cronies that support them square in the teeth. Let's face it, the system is too far out of control to be saved, welcome to the death spiral of the Republic, enjoy the ride.

 

[Mac1958]

Yeah, I think there are actually things we can do to change the system under which politicians operate, which would then change what the media can do.

Short, strict term limits, publicly-funded elections and a Balanced Budget Amendment would take away the power from those who abuse it the most.

When we allow this to continue, we are complicit.
.

Yeah that's all well and good Mac, now please list the politicians you think are going to vote to reduce their own power and kick the special interests and assorted cronies that support them square in the teeth. Let's face it, the system is too far out of control to be saved, welcome to the death spiral of the Republic, enjoy the ride.

Sure, can't argue. The only way this happens is if honest, serious people run for and win office, and then force the changes.

And no, I ain't holding my breath.
.

 

[frigidweirdo]

Are we getting the leaders we deserve?

Here is an article trying to come to terms with the circus of an election year. The attempt is to blame the press.

Who agrees?

You vote for them, and refuse to vote third party, you get what you deserve.

 

[CowboyTed]

Of course we're getting the leaders we deserve.

They're a reflection of our society, just as entertainment is.

And look at THAT.
.

There is a number of issues causing this, the order is opinion....

1. Money - US has by far the most money in there politics... If it happened in a tin pot country in Afirca you would call it corruption... The country is run by lobbying...

2. Election style - One Man One Vote has been dumped nearly everywhere in the world... It leads to partisan rants and base apeasing politicians... PR/Alernative vote make politicians more responsive and look for more compromise... They want solutions...

3. Media - US invented the News Media for profit... The US used to be never like this... News Dept used to loose money... Now we have if it bleeds it leads, partisan tv pundits telling the viewers what they want to hear ather than the truth...

4. Style of Government - US style of checks and balance has caused girdlock... No boidy has to take responsibility for anything... At least in the more Euorpean style they get elected form a government, write a plan, and implement a plan, couple of speedbumps along the way...
Don't like the result vote for someone else, you know who was in charge and what got done, simple job review...

The education is a misnomer as other countries have far less educated people and run perfectly functioning governments...

Yeah, I think there are actually things we can do to change the system under which politicians operate, which would then change what the media can do.

Short, strict term limits, publicly-funded elections and a Balanced Budget Amendment would take away the power from those who abuse it the most.

When we allow this to continue, we are complicit.
.

I agree with most of what you have said:

As for term limits, I don't think this helps all the time... You get very good politicians who do a great job there is no point of getting rid of them... PR STV voting systems really helps there... If a politician doesn't perform you have can get rid of them easily enough as the main competition can be in the party...
It is hard to explain without seeing it in action. But parties can gain what we call a 'quota' and will run knowing they can get one elected... But a area could have two quotas worth in an area... Example Republicans in West Texas... If you run unpopular candidate you could loose a second seat quit easily... It is kind of self policing by the grassroots and your appeal to other partys lower preferences...

This is an example of my local area:
Galway East (Dáil Éireann constituency) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

You vote by preference and appeasing just you base will not get you elected... Look at the Sinn Fein candidate he got a high 1st Preference but didn't appeal to many others, so he didn't get elected... Fine Gael got it right and with a lower 1st preference than Fianna Fail but got two candidates and Fianna Fail got one. Why? Fianna Fail ran a poor third candidate and got nailed for doing so, John Connelly got very little from Mary Hoade...

But the main thing you can take away is the choice 10 parties and a number of independents ran... Better choice means you can eliminate the ones you don't like...

I agree with your Balanced Budget Amendment as long as it is flexible to allow pumping money into a ailing economy and draw money from a overheating economy... Generally it should be balanced...

 

[CowboyTed]

Yeah, I think there are actually things we can do to change the system under which politicians operate, which would then change what the media can do.

Short, strict term limits, publicly-funded elections and a Balanced Budget Amendment would take away the power from those who abuse it the most.

When we allow this to continue, we are complicit.
.

Yeah that's all well and good Mac, now please list the politicians you think are going to vote to reduce their own power and kick the special interests and assorted cronies that support them square in the teeth. Let's face it, the system is too far out of control to be saved, welcome to the death spiral of the Republic, enjoy the ride.

Sure, can't argue. The only way this happens is if honest, serious people run for and win office, and then force the changes.

And no, I ain't holding my breath.
.

Only way you get that is more choice and the only way you get that is Proportional Representation (i.e. Multiseat areas) with Single Transfer voting (i.e. vote 1,2,3,4 in order of preference ). More choice means you are voting for who you want not against who you dislike most...

 

[Granny]

Haven't done much posting lately ... totally burned out on politics right now. The entire government needs to be fumigated from top to bottom. I keep turning the thought over and over in my mind whether to write to my one Senator who does actually respond to constituents and tell him what's on my mind ... but also wondering if my soul searching would land me in federal prison or on the desk of some death panel person.

 

[longknife]

I think there are millions of us who have worked hard all our lives, kept ourselves out of trouble, raised good families who are doing the same. We deserve leaders who want to make America great again.

Well that is just it. You are working as hard as you can to survive. It's all you have time for and you certainly don't have the money to throw into the political arena.

All you are left with is a gut feeling or partisan ideology to help influence your vote. Like most, you are an uninformed voter, through no fault of your own.

I'm an elected party official.
I've run for office.
I've run campaigns for others to get elected.
My Congressman, who I helped get elected, has his District office one floor above mine.

I hardly think I'm uninformed.

But, are you honest?
Do you represent you or the people who voted for you?
Care to tell us the office you hold and your registered party?

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

Are we getting the leaders we deserve?

Here is an article trying to come to terms with the circus of an election year. The attempt is to blame the press.

Who agrees?

Yes we do.

The chaos today is a result of Obama's yesterday's and the complete stupidity from those who elected him twice. They have ruined our nation as we knew it

Looking down the road...Trump, Shrillary, Cruz, Bernie....the voters decide....or the electoral College does...either way, it's what we asked for. Karma, go figure.

-Geaux

If you're going to drive in your rear view mirror, look at Shrub still in the ditch.

WTF does this even mean?

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

Good people DON'T get into politics. The worst among us get into politics. That has been the case for decades.

Well look at the likes of Thomas Jefferson and Ben Franklin. Both seemed to have been womanizers.

Should we give much consideration to these things?

Newt was fucking another woman while his wife was dying of cancer, at the same time he was impeaching Bubba for a blow job.

Uhm, that was John Edwards dum-dum.

 

[Defiant1]

I think there are millions of us who have worked hard all our lives, kept ourselves out of trouble, raised good families who are doing the same. We deserve leaders who want to make America great again.

Well that is just it. You are working as hard as you can to survive. It's all you have time for and you certainly don't have the money to throw into the political arena.

All you are left with is a gut feeling or partisan ideology to help influence your vote. Like most, you are an uninformed voter, through no fault of your own.

I'm an elected party official.
I've run for office.
I've run campaigns for others to get elected.
My Congressman, who I helped get elected, has his District office one floor above mine.

I hardly think I'm uninformed.

But, are you honest?
Do you represent you or the people who voted for you?
Care to tell us the office you hold and your registered party?

LK, I don't hold a public office. I'm a Republican party official.
I'm always honest. I'm a Republican.

 

[longknife]

I think there are millions of us who have worked hard all our lives, kept ourselves out of trouble, raised good families who are doing the same. We deserve leaders who want to make America great again.

Well that is just it. You are working as hard as you can to survive. It's all you have time for and you certainly don't have the money to throw into the political arena.

All you are left with is a gut feeling or partisan ideology to help influence your vote. Like most, you are an uninformed voter, through no fault of your own.

I'm an elected party official.
I've run for office.
I've run campaigns for others to get elected.
My Congressman, who I helped get elected, has his District office one floor above mine.

I hardly think I'm uninformed.

But, are you honest?
Do you represent you or the people who voted for you?
Care to tell us the office you hold and your registered party?

LK, I don't hold a public office. I'm a Republican party official.
I'm always honest. I'm a Republican.

In other words, you're a paid political hack that almost no one outside of your political circles knows. You are one of those who sits in smoke-filled back rooms and decides whom the unwashed masses are going to be able to vote for.

At least you admit it.

 

[Defiant1]

I think there are millions of us who have worked hard all our lives, kept ourselves out of trouble, raised good families who are doing the same. We deserve leaders who want to make America great again.

Well that is just it. You are working as hard as you can to survive. It's all you have time for and you certainly don't have the money to throw into the political arena.

All you are left with is a gut feeling or partisan ideology to help influence your vote. Like most, you are an uninformed voter, through no fault of your own.

I'm an elected party official.
I've run for office.
I've run campaigns for others to get elected.
My Congressman, who I helped get elected, has his District office one floor above mine.

I hardly think I'm uninformed.

But, are you honest?
Do you represent you or the people who voted for you?
Care to tell us the office you hold and your registered party?

LK, I don't hold a public office. I'm a Republican party official.
I'm always honest. I'm a Republican.

In other words, you're a paid political hack that almost no one outside of your political circles knows. You are one of those who sits in smoke-filled back rooms and decides whom the unwashed masses are going to be able to vote for.

At least you admit it.

No, i'm not a paid hack. I'm grass roots.

I'm for Trump. The vast majority of our county is for Trump.

 

[Agit8r]

People who look for someone to lead them always get what they deserve.

 

[RandallFlagg]

Are we getting the leaders we deserve?

Here is an article trying to come to terms with the circus of an election year. The attempt is to blame the press.

Who agrees?

Yes we do.

The chaos today is a result of Obama's yesterday's and the complete stupidity from those who elected him twice. They have ruined our nation as we knew it

-Geaux

Most definitely. This country gets the "leaders" it deserves. And the government it deserves.

That's why each day we grow closer to its demise.

 

[RandallFlagg]

We get what they tell us we get.

That's what happens when you have a "representative republic" instead of democracy.

Right. I could see a "mob rule" society. Talk about chaos.....

 

[g5000]

I've said it quite a few times over the years on this forum. "We get the government we deserve".

How's that whole "voting for the lesser of two evils" thing been working out for you, rubes?

 

[SwimExpert]

The vast majority of our county is for Trump.