Taz
Gold Member
- Jul 8, 2014
- 22,876
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- #421
Created as in created by god? Because scientists don't say that, or if they do, they have no proof either, so they can bite me.Taz, why do you believe cosmologists believe the universe was created if science can't see to the Big Bang?Because you make no sense refusing to acknowledge that science can't actually see to BB.So in other words you don't understand what I am talking about.We still can't see the BB, everything is therefore speculation. Deal with it.What part of we know energy and matter cannot be eternal did you not understand?The universe had not yet formed so it's laws might not apply yet, like the BB expansion going faster than light.And we can know that energy and matter cannot be eternal. so energy and matter must have a beginning and our understanding of the big bang fits in perfectly with matter and energy being created according to the laws of conservation and quantum mechanics.We can see that shortly after the BB, but we're still a ways away from seeing the BB. It will be really existing if they ever get there. After millennia of everyone trying to guess what it it.Nope. Nearly equal amounts of matter and anti-matter.Sure, the universe started at some point, but how it started and from what is still not known.The scientific community admits that they can't see all the way back to the Big Bang, so that's why they call it a theory. That that's the leading theory of the day is pretty meaningless in the big picture. It'll be what it'll be when and if we ever discover what the BB actually was. dingbat's already made up his mind what it is because it fits his bible narrative, when if fact, he's wrong.
Your understanding of things is incomplete. Ultimately, whether our universe is the one and only to have ever existed is irrelevant. The physical world necessarily began to exist in the finite past. An actual infinite, on its very face, is an absurdity.
Science's purview is limited to the substances and processes of the physical world. Hence, no one can scientifically assert that our universe is the one and only to have ever existed. But whether our universe is the one and only to have ever existed, one large spacetime continuum, albeit, with localized areas of activity, one in a cyclical series of universes, or a multiverse: the cosmological configuration at large (the physical world) cannot be past eternal (an actual infinite).
In other words, we cannot scientifically preclude the former potentialities in bold, but we can logically, mathematically and scientifically preclude the possibility of the latter. Science has recently caught up with what logic and mathematics have told us all along about entities of space, time, matter and energy:
Our theorem shows that null and timelike geodesics are past-incomplete in inflationary models, whether or not energy conditions hold, provided only that the averaged expansion condition H av > 0 holds along these past-directed geodesics. This is a stronger conclusion than the one arrived at in previous work in that we have shown under reasonable assumptions that almost all causal geodesics [i.e., as distinguished from those of higher dimensions], when extended to the past of an arbitrary point, reach the boundary of the inflating region of spacetime in a finite proper time" ( Borde-Guth-Vilenkin).
This theorem extends to cyclical inflationary models and the inflationary models of multiverse as well. The physical universe at large, regardless of the chronological or the cosmological order of its structure, cannot overcome the thermodynamics of entropy.
Joined by others, Vilenkin summarizes the matter as follows:
It is said that an argument is what convinces reasonable men and a proof is what it takes to convince even an unreasonable man. With the proof now in place, cosmologists can no longer hide behind the possibility of a past eternal universe. There is no escape, they have to face the problem of a cosmic beginning (Many World in One; New York: Hill and Wang, 2006, pg. 176).