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The AR 15 was NEVER a combat rifle it was always always always made for civilian use
That difference is more a reflection of the differences of the 2 societies and all the variables involved with those differences and not from gun laws alone as you say.
The AR 15 was NEVER a combat rifle it was always always always made for civilian useDon't expect me to believe 30 rounds is the normal standard capacity for rifles. Just because 30 rounds are available for some doesn't mean that is the defacto standard. Extremely high power scopes are available for most rifles, but I wouldn't say they are standard equipment. Try to maintain a little honesty for both our sakes. I have never even seen a 30 round clip on anything other than a military type weapon, other than in advertisements, and I have hunted and gone to gun ranges all my life.
I don't expect you to believe anything ... You can think whatever you like.
You can decide to accept or reject whatever suits your desires ... But that really doesn't mean crap.
I cannot be more honest about it ... A 30 round mag is a 30 round mag.
All the mags I own (for the AR-15) are 30 round mags ... None of them say "high capacity" on them.
Again ... I am not talking about hunting or going to the range ... And don't have a problem with you hunting nor going to the range.
I have already stated the AR-15 I own is identical to the firearm I was issued in the military minus the selector switch having a full-auto selection.
You are arguing with me about your desires ... To wit I can honestly say ... "So what"?
The best I can do for you here ... Is keep reminding you that you have nothing to offer ... We are allowed to own what we already do.
We aren't asking you for anything ... We don't need to convince you to do anything ... We don't need your permission nor agreement at all.
Call your Representatives ... It is that fricken simple ...
.
Who said specifically Ar-15? I was told that 30 rounds was standard for rifles. There as no brand or caliber mentioned. Of course an AR-15 was designed to have 30 rounds. It as specifically designed as a combat weapon, and only had the fully auto capability removed for civilian sale. Assuming that magazine capacity in a new rifle is totally random as you claim, and I highly doubt, That would mean that there is no standard. 30 rounds can't be standard if standard doesn't exist.
No....the standard for that rifle used to be 20 round magazines, till they came up with the 30, now the 30 is standard....and the AR-15 is a civilian rifle that has never been used in combat.
Saying 30 round magazines for rifles is standard is a lie. The AR-15 is a weapon that was specifically designed for combat with minor modifications for civilian sales. The extended capacity magazine is part of that combat specific design. Many rifles come with a 10 round magazine.
Australia didNo they don'tYes they areSemiautomatic rifles are not "assault weapons"
And no many of those countries with gun bans have higher incidences of crime than we do.
The UK in fact has 3 times as many crimes per capita than the US twice as many rapes and twice as many assaults
Try to buy an AR-15 in England or France
UK has a murder rate one quarter of ours, same as France
Criminals in France get fully automatic military rifles easily, they are a status symbol there. Terrorists, on government terrorist watch lists, many with criminal convictions for other crimes got fully automatic, military rifles, hand grenades and pistols....and murdered 142 people...that doesn't count the other murders with automatic weapons in France either....
French gunman's arsenal spotlights illegal arms trade
The size and nature of the arsenal amassed by Merah - who stockpiled at least eight guns including a Kalashnikov assault rifle and an Uzi machine pistol - has focused attention on the easy availability of illegal weapons in France and their growing use in ultra-violent crimes.
Paris attacks highlight France's gun control problems
But in recent years a black market has proliferated. The number of illegal weapons has risen at a rapid rate – double-digit percentages – for several years, according to the National Observatory for Delinquency, a body created in 2003.
“In Marseille and the surrounding area almost all the score settling is carried out using weapons used in wars,” a police spokesman told Reuters after the Toulouse attacks, adding that Kalashnikovs were the weapon of choice: “If you don’t have a ‘Kalash’ you’re a bit of a loser.”
============================
Paris attacks highlight France's gun control problems
The arsenal of weapons deployed by the eight attackers who terrorised Paris on Friday night underlined France’s gun control problems and raised the spectre of further attacks.
The country has extremely strict weapons laws, but Europe’s open borders and growing trade in illegal weapons means assault rifles are relatively easy to come by on the black market.
They have one fifth our murder rate
The joys of tough gun regulation
countries that have enacted those tough gun laws did not see their murder rates drop after those laws were passed.
we banned an entire class of semiautomatic rifles for 10 years and it didn't effect the murder rate in this country at all
The AR 15 was NEVER a combat rifle it was always always always made for civilian useI don't expect you to believe anything ... You can think whatever you like.
You can decide to accept or reject whatever suits your desires ... But that really doesn't mean crap.
I cannot be more honest about it ... A 30 round mag is a 30 round mag.
All the mags I own (for the AR-15) are 30 round mags ... None of them say "high capacity" on them.
Again ... I am not talking about hunting or going to the range ... And don't have a problem with you hunting nor going to the range.
I have already stated the AR-15 I own is identical to the firearm I was issued in the military minus the selector switch having a full-auto selection.
You are arguing with me about your desires ... To wit I can honestly say ... "So what"?
The best I can do for you here ... Is keep reminding you that you have nothing to offer ... We are allowed to own what we already do.
We aren't asking you for anything ... We don't need to convince you to do anything ... We don't need your permission nor agreement at all.
Call your Representatives ... It is that fricken simple ...
.
Who said specifically Ar-15? I was told that 30 rounds was standard for rifles. There as no brand or caliber mentioned. Of course an AR-15 was designed to have 30 rounds. It as specifically designed as a combat weapon, and only had the fully auto capability removed for civilian sale. Assuming that magazine capacity in a new rifle is totally random as you claim, and I highly doubt, That would mean that there is no standard. 30 rounds can't be standard if standard doesn't exist.
No....the standard for that rifle used to be 20 round magazines, till they came up with the 30, now the 30 is standard....and the AR-15 is a civilian rifle that has never been used in combat.
Saying 30 round magazines for rifles is standard is a lie. The AR-15 is a weapon that was specifically designed for combat with minor modifications for civilian sales. The extended capacity magazine is part of that combat specific design. Many rifles come with a 10 round magazine.
It was first designed as the M-16 military combat rifle, and later was slightly modified and called an AR-15 to sell to civilians.
The AR 15 was NEVER a combat rifle it was always always always made for civilian useWho said specifically Ar-15? I was told that 30 rounds was standard for rifles. There as no brand or caliber mentioned. Of course an AR-15 was designed to have 30 rounds. It as specifically designed as a combat weapon, and only had the fully auto capability removed for civilian sale. Assuming that magazine capacity in a new rifle is totally random as you claim, and I highly doubt, That would mean that there is no standard. 30 rounds can't be standard if standard doesn't exist.
No....the standard for that rifle used to be 20 round magazines, till they came up with the 30, now the 30 is standard....and the AR-15 is a civilian rifle that has never been used in combat.
Saying 30 round magazines for rifles is standard is a lie. The AR-15 is a weapon that was specifically designed for combat with minor modifications for civilian sales. The extended capacity magazine is part of that combat specific design. Many rifles come with a 10 round magazine.
It was first designed as the M-16 military combat rifle, and later was slightly modified and called an AR-15 to sell to civilians.
And the AR 15 never was and never will be anything but a civilian rifle that LOOKS LIKE a military rifle
And the .223 round was offered to the civilian market before it's use in the military. So it seems that the .223 caliber military rifle was an adaptation of a civilian rifle not the reverse as you say
.223 Remington - Wikipedia
The .223 Rem was first offered to the civilian sporting market in December 1963 in the Remington 760rifle. [4] In 1964 the .223 Rem cartridge was adopted for use in the Colt M16 rifle which became an alternate standard rifle of the U.S. Army.
The AR 15 was NEVER a combat rifle it was always always always made for civilian useNo....the standard for that rifle used to be 20 round magazines, till they came up with the 30, now the 30 is standard....and the AR-15 is a civilian rifle that has never been used in combat.
Saying 30 round magazines for rifles is standard is a lie. The AR-15 is a weapon that was specifically designed for combat with minor modifications for civilian sales. The extended capacity magazine is part of that combat specific design. Many rifles come with a 10 round magazine.
It was first designed as the M-16 military combat rifle, and later was slightly modified and called an AR-15 to sell to civilians.
And the AR 15 never was and never will be anything but a civilian rifle that LOOKS LIKE a military rifle
And the .223 round was offered to the civilian market before it's use in the military. So it seems that the .223 caliber military rifle was an adaptation of a civilian rifle not the reverse as you say
.223 Remington - Wikipedia
The .223 Rem was first offered to the civilian sporting market in December 1963 in the Remington 760rifle. [4] In 1964 the .223 Rem cartridge was adopted for use in the Colt M16 rifle which became an alternate standard rifle of the U.S. Army.
So the only defining characteristics of the M-16/Ar-15 is the caliber? You're trying really hard but failing miserably.
And the AR 15 never was and never will be anything but a civilian rifle that LOOKS LIKE a military rifle
And the .223 round was offered to the civilian market before it's use in the military. So it seems that the .223 caliber military rifle was an adaptation of a civilian rifle not the reverse as you say
.223 Remington - Wikipedia
The .223 Rem was first offered to the civilian sporting market in December 1963 in the Remington 760rifle. [4] In 1964 the .223 Rem cartridge was adopted for use in the Colt M16 rifle which became an alternate standard rifle of the U.S. Army.
The AR 15 was NEVER a combat rifle it was always always always made for civilian useSaying 30 round magazines for rifles is standard is a lie. The AR-15 is a weapon that was specifically designed for combat with minor modifications for civilian sales. The extended capacity magazine is part of that combat specific design. Many rifles come with a 10 round magazine.
It was first designed as the M-16 military combat rifle, and later was slightly modified and called an AR-15 to sell to civilians.
And the AR 15 never was and never will be anything but a civilian rifle that LOOKS LIKE a military rifle
And the .223 round was offered to the civilian market before it's use in the military. So it seems that the .223 caliber military rifle was an adaptation of a civilian rifle not the reverse as you say
.223 Remington - Wikipedia
The .223 Rem was first offered to the civilian sporting market in December 1963 in the Remington 760rifle. [4] In 1964 the .223 Rem cartridge was adopted for use in the Colt M16 rifle which became an alternate standard rifle of the U.S. Army.
So the only defining characteristics of the M-16/Ar-15 is the caliber? You're trying really hard but failing miserably.
The only defining characteristic of any civilian rifle that matters is the caliber.
You still have not realized that there is a difference between civilian and military rifles have you?
What problem exactly do you have with civilian rifles that look like military rifles?
Is my .223 ranch rifle with wood stock and a 20 round magazine somehow more acceptable than a .223 rifle with predominately plastic and polymer parts ?
Don't expect me to believe 30 rounds is the normal standard capacity for rifles. Just because 30 rounds are available for some doesn't mean that is the defacto standard. Extremely high power scopes are available for most rifles, but I wouldn't say they are standard equipment. Try to maintain a little honesty for both our sakes. I have never even seen a 30 round clip on anything other than a military type weapon, other than in advertisements, and I have hunted and gone to gun ranges all my life.
I don't expect you to believe anything ... You can think whatever you like.
You can decide to accept or reject whatever suits your desires ... But that really doesn't mean crap.
I cannot be more honest about it ... A 30 round mag is a 30 round mag.
All the mags I own (for the AR-15) are 30 round mags ... None of them say "high capacity" on them.
Again ... I am not talking about hunting or going to the range ... And don't have a problem with you hunting nor going to the range.
I have already stated the AR-15 I own is identical to the firearm I was issued in the military minus the selector switch having a full-auto selection.
You are arguing with me about your desires ... To wit I can honestly say ... "So what"?
The best I can do for you here ... Is keep reminding you that you have nothing to offer ... We are allowed to own what we already do.
We aren't asking you for anything ... We don't need to convince you to do anything ... We don't need your permission nor agreement at all.
Call your Representatives ... It is that fricken simple ...
.
Who said specifically Ar-15? I was told that 30 rounds was standard for rifles. There as no brand or caliber mentioned. Of course an AR-15 was designed to have 30 rounds. It as specifically designed as a combat weapon, and only had the fully auto capability removed for civilian sale. Assuming that magazine capacity in a new rifle is totally random as you claim, and I highly doubt, That would mean that there is no standard. 30 rounds can't be standard if standard doesn't exist.
No....the standard for that rifle used to be 20 round magazines, till they came up with the 30, now the 30 is standard....and the AR-15 is a civilian rifle that has never been used in combat.
Saying 30 round magazines for rifles is standard is a lie. The AR-15 is a weapon that was specifically designed for combat with minor modifications for civilian sales. The extended capacity magazine is part of that combat specific design. Many rifles come with a 10 round magazine.
The left always says they just want common sense gun control....and one of those measures they always want is a limit on 10 bullets for all magazines
Now, keep in mind, this will not limit the deaths in mass shootings, as actual research shows. The killers, like the guy in Texas had plenty of magazines and changed them 14 times while he was murdering those people.
And Criminals won't care about a 10 round limit because they will just get theirs illegally, and they can rape a woman just as easily with a 10 round magazine, murder a rival or rob someone.
The only people a 10 round magazine limit effects is the law abiding gun owner, who does not commit any crime or murder. People who have guns that take 15-19 rounds in their pistols...will now be criminals if they don't do something with their guns.....dittos rifles that will take 30 round magazines.....
I have listed the points made by David Kopel on why law abiding people need more than 10 rounds, in other places and would happily do so again. I have also posted the ruling by the California judge placing a hold on the new California magazine ban where he accurately takes apart all of the arguments made against 10 round magazines.
The question, however, is this.........if the anti gunners get all the 15-30 round magazines....will they leave the 10 round magazines alone?
Keep in mind, the Santa Barbara shooter used 10 round magazines to murder 6 people.......
Laws against murder do not stop murder. Murderers don't follow those laws, so lets just do away with those useless laws. That makes as much sense as the silly crap you keep repeating.
Except in the UK the murder rate is 1/4 the US murder rate, the US murder rate is 3/4 guns. The UK saw 23 gun murders in 2013, the US saw 11,208. Now, take that the UK is 5 times smaller, that's still 115 compared to 11,208. I mean, the laws don't work? Are you kidding me?
Australia didNo they don'tYes they areSemiautomatic rifles are not "assault weapons"
And no many of those countries with gun bans have higher incidences of crime than we do.
The UK in fact has 3 times as many crimes per capita than the US twice as many rapes and twice as many assaults
Try to buy an AR-15 in England or France
UK has a murder rate one quarter of ours, same as France
Criminals in France get fully automatic military rifles easily, they are a status symbol there. Terrorists, on government terrorist watch lists, many with criminal convictions for other crimes got fully automatic, military rifles, hand grenades and pistols....and murdered 142 people...that doesn't count the other murders with automatic weapons in France either....
French gunman's arsenal spotlights illegal arms trade
The size and nature of the arsenal amassed by Merah - who stockpiled at least eight guns including a Kalashnikov assault rifle and an Uzi machine pistol - has focused attention on the easy availability of illegal weapons in France and their growing use in ultra-violent crimes.
Paris attacks highlight France's gun control problems
But in recent years a black market has proliferated. The number of illegal weapons has risen at a rapid rate – double-digit percentages – for several years, according to the National Observatory for Delinquency, a body created in 2003.
“In Marseille and the surrounding area almost all the score settling is carried out using weapons used in wars,” a police spokesman told Reuters after the Toulouse attacks, adding that Kalashnikovs were the weapon of choice: “If you don’t have a ‘Kalash’ you’re a bit of a loser.”
============================
Paris attacks highlight France's gun control problems
The arsenal of weapons deployed by the eight attackers who terrorised Paris on Friday night underlined France’s gun control problems and raised the spectre of further attacks.
The country has extremely strict weapons laws, but Europe’s open borders and growing trade in illegal weapons means assault rifles are relatively easy to come by on the black market.
They have one fifth our murder rate
The joys of tough gun regulation
countries that have enacted those tough gun laws did not see their murder rates drop after those laws were passed.
we banned an entire class of semiautomatic rifles for 10 years and it didn't effect the murder rate in this country at all
The AR 15 was NEVER a combat rifle it was always always always made for civilian useI don't expect you to believe anything ... You can think whatever you like.
You can decide to accept or reject whatever suits your desires ... But that really doesn't mean crap.
I cannot be more honest about it ... A 30 round mag is a 30 round mag.
All the mags I own (for the AR-15) are 30 round mags ... None of them say "high capacity" on them.
Again ... I am not talking about hunting or going to the range ... And don't have a problem with you hunting nor going to the range.
I have already stated the AR-15 I own is identical to the firearm I was issued in the military minus the selector switch having a full-auto selection.
You are arguing with me about your desires ... To wit I can honestly say ... "So what"?
The best I can do for you here ... Is keep reminding you that you have nothing to offer ... We are allowed to own what we already do.
We aren't asking you for anything ... We don't need to convince you to do anything ... We don't need your permission nor agreement at all.
Call your Representatives ... It is that fricken simple ...
.
Who said specifically Ar-15? I was told that 30 rounds was standard for rifles. There as no brand or caliber mentioned. Of course an AR-15 was designed to have 30 rounds. It as specifically designed as a combat weapon, and only had the fully auto capability removed for civilian sale. Assuming that magazine capacity in a new rifle is totally random as you claim, and I highly doubt, That would mean that there is no standard. 30 rounds can't be standard if standard doesn't exist.
No....the standard for that rifle used to be 20 round magazines, till they came up with the 30, now the 30 is standard....and the AR-15 is a civilian rifle that has never been used in combat.
Saying 30 round magazines for rifles is standard is a lie. The AR-15 is a weapon that was specifically designed for combat with minor modifications for civilian sales. The extended capacity magazine is part of that combat specific design. Many rifles come with a 10 round magazine.
It was first designed as the M-16 military combat rifle, and later was slightly modified and called an AR-15 to sell to civilians.
Too funnyAustralia didNo they don'tYes they are
Try to buy an AR-15 in England or France
UK has a murder rate one quarter of ours, same as France
Criminals in France get fully automatic military rifles easily, they are a status symbol there. Terrorists, on government terrorist watch lists, many with criminal convictions for other crimes got fully automatic, military rifles, hand grenades and pistols....and murdered 142 people...that doesn't count the other murders with automatic weapons in France either....
French gunman's arsenal spotlights illegal arms trade
The size and nature of the arsenal amassed by Merah - who stockpiled at least eight guns including a Kalashnikov assault rifle and an Uzi machine pistol - has focused attention on the easy availability of illegal weapons in France and their growing use in ultra-violent crimes.
Paris attacks highlight France's gun control problems
But in recent years a black market has proliferated. The number of illegal weapons has risen at a rapid rate – double-digit percentages – for several years, according to the National Observatory for Delinquency, a body created in 2003.
“In Marseille and the surrounding area almost all the score settling is carried out using weapons used in wars,” a police spokesman told Reuters after the Toulouse attacks, adding that Kalashnikovs were the weapon of choice: “If you don’t have a ‘Kalash’ you’re a bit of a loser.”
============================
Paris attacks highlight France's gun control problems
The arsenal of weapons deployed by the eight attackers who terrorised Paris on Friday night underlined France’s gun control problems and raised the spectre of further attacks.
The country has extremely strict weapons laws, but Europe’s open borders and growing trade in illegal weapons means assault rifles are relatively easy to come by on the black market.
They have one fifth our murder rate
The joys of tough gun regulation
countries that have enacted those tough gun laws did not see their murder rates drop after those laws were passed.
we banned an entire class of semiautomatic rifles for 10 years and it didn't effect the murder rate in this country at all
so what?
The left always says they just want common sense gun control....and one of those measures they always want is a limit on 10 bullets for all magazines
Now, keep in mind, this will not limit the deaths in mass shootings, as actual research shows. The killers, like the guy in Texas had plenty of magazines and changed them 14 times while he was murdering those people.
And Criminals won't care about a 10 round limit because they will just get theirs illegally, and they can rape a woman just as easily with a 10 round magazine, murder a rival or rob someone.
The only people a 10 round magazine limit effects is the law abiding gun owner, who does not commit any crime or murder. People who have guns that take 15-19 rounds in their pistols...will now be criminals if they don't do something with their guns.....dittos rifles that will take 30 round magazines.....
I have listed the points made by David Kopel on why law abiding people need more than 10 rounds, in other places and would happily do so again. I have also posted the ruling by the California judge placing a hold on the new California magazine ban where he accurately takes apart all of the arguments made against 10 round magazines.
The question, however, is this.........if the anti gunners get all the 15-30 round magazines....will they leave the 10 round magazines alone?
Keep in mind, the Santa Barbara shooter used 10 round magazines to murder 6 people.......
Laws against murder do not stop murder. Murderers don't follow those laws, so lets just do away with those useless laws. That makes as much sense as the silly crap you keep repeating.
Except in the UK the murder rate is 1/4 the US murder rate, the US murder rate is 3/4 guns. The UK saw 23 gun murders in 2013, the US saw 11,208. Now, take that the UK is 5 times smaller, that's still 115 compared to 11,208. I mean, the laws don't work? Are you kidding me?
Yes....you keep repeating the murder rate......and you fail to say why the murder rate is low.....we have shown over and over that British criminals have guns...lots of guns....they use those guns for crime......so their access to guns isn't limited by their gun control laws....so their gun control laws have no effect on their gun murder rate since the gun murder rate was low before they banned guns....and after they banned guns their gun murder rate went up.
Their criminals have to this point not used murder to advance their criminal activity....and we keep telling you that is changing.....you don't want to admit the truth because you want to use Britain to ban guns here......
The AR 15 was NEVER a combat rifle it was always always always made for civilian useWho said specifically Ar-15? I was told that 30 rounds was standard for rifles. There as no brand or caliber mentioned. Of course an AR-15 was designed to have 30 rounds. It as specifically designed as a combat weapon, and only had the fully auto capability removed for civilian sale. Assuming that magazine capacity in a new rifle is totally random as you claim, and I highly doubt, That would mean that there is no standard. 30 rounds can't be standard if standard doesn't exist.
No....the standard for that rifle used to be 20 round magazines, till they came up with the 30, now the 30 is standard....and the AR-15 is a civilian rifle that has never been used in combat.
Saying 30 round magazines for rifles is standard is a lie. The AR-15 is a weapon that was specifically designed for combat with minor modifications for civilian sales. The extended capacity magazine is part of that combat specific design. Many rifles come with a 10 round magazine.
It was first designed as the M-16 military combat rifle, and later was slightly modified and called an AR-15 to sell to civilians.
Civilians have the civilian rifle as you just posted.....the AR-15 is not a military rifle, never has been....
No matter how many times you regurgitate that, it is still wrong.If Select fire and full auto is not the only difference between a designed for combat M-16, and an Ar-15 what is?
Depending on the make and model ... The caliber of the cartridge, basic operation, actual design and available attachment options.
The rounds aren't even the same for all models ... And can range from .223, NATO 5.56 x 45 to 7.62 x 39 (.308).
I am pretty sure this is why the argument is generally a bunch of minutia ... There are no absolutes.
The weapons can be confused ... Different manufacturers make them differently (they also don't all have the same name or nomenclature).
It would be tough to write legislation because it would also have to include firearms that don't necessarily meet all of those requirements.
It would be easier to write a law that simply stated ... No more "scary guns" because that is about the only thing they actually all have in common (to some people anyway).
.
Don't be ridiculous. A gun specifically designed for military use in combat has no reasonable purpose for civilian use, even if it is no longer full auto capable.
No matter how many times you regurgitate that, it is still wrong.
BULLSHIT! You were NOT issued anything in 7.62x39!The AR 15 was NEVER a combat rifle it was always always always made for civilian use
That's not exactly true ... The firearm I was issued in the military was a Colt Arms AR-15 (7.62 x 39).
There are several firearms with the AR-15 identifier ... And not all of them are standard military issue.
Not all military issue assault rifles are the Colt Arms AR-15.
.
